The Instigator
Krazzy_Player
Pro (for)
Losing
4 Points
The Contender
Mikal
Con (against)
Winning
13 Points

Moderator Replacement

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 6 votes the winner is...
Mikal
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/29/2014 Category: Miscellaneous
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 4,346 times Debate No: 51139
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (92)
Votes (6)

 

Krazzy_Player

Pro

Resolution: Ore- ele should be replaced as moderator.

I shall be arguing for the above resolution. The BOP shall be shared. My opponent shall argue against the resolution.

Rules

R1 is for Acceptance.
R2 is for Arguments and Rebuttals.
R3 is for Rebuttals.

No new arguments in R3.

A forfeit shall result in a full 7-point loss.

Thank you!

Any one interested shall post comments and I'll pick my opponent.
Mikal

Con

I accept and will defend ore
Debate Round No. 1
Krazzy_Player

Pro

Introduction

This is in concern with the recent events which occurred in Miscellaneous forum. I created a thread 100th comment wins, this thread was created as a fun game. In this game some players took interest especially Zmikecuber. This player counted the number of posts till the 100th post, unfortunately he wasn't the winner. The user named KC applied some brilliant tactics and won. Ore-Ele who is said to be this sites moderator behaved inappropriately, deleted some posts using his moderator privileges and his/her post became 100th. I was offended by this act and asked Airmax for justice, Airmax who is another moderator of this site is well known to solve any kind of complex issues didn't act in appropriate manner this case. My thread was deleted without any pre-intimation. I was outraged by this act and created member attacking thread which included the sites moderator. This was unfortunate.

Why Ore_Ele should be replaced?

1. Airmax is mature and handles the case in a best possible manner always but mistakes do happen. However, Ore-ele is different he/she is immature. Most people don't even know he is moderator of DDO.

2. Ore_Ele is fake.

Most users confirmed Ore_Ele is a man but his profile gives wrong information to users which says Ore_Ele is female. Moderators should be faithful and should create a sign of trust among users.

3. Ore_Ele doesn't work.

I have never seen Ore_Ele working as moderator, Most of the mod work is done by Airmax. Ore_ele just comes here for fun which is confirmed by himself.

4. There are other users who can be moderator.

DDO has some best debaters. Some may be interested in becoming moderator. Roylatham, Ragnar, Whiteflame, Wylted and many more may suit for the role.

5. Many other users demand for change

"Ore_ele abused her privileges. It's not up to the moderators to decide which thread is "more important" than other threads. Even if Ore_ele considered Krazzy_Player's thread to be unimportant, she clearly was using her moderator abilities as a form of trolling. Moderators shouldn't do this. Period. It's unprofessional. They should moderate, not troll.

I don't know about what happened with airmax. I'm assuming that he was just trying to keep a big fight from erupting. I don't necessarily think that was the right way to go about it though.

So I can understand Krazzy_Player's anger. While I think he may have over-reacted, I do think that Ore_ele acted inappropriately, and that she abused her powers."

The above words is said by Zmikecuber and few other users have the same opinion and you can check here if it's not been removed. http://www.debate.org...


Conclusion

Moderator's job is to ensure the smooth running of any site. If any problem persists, Mod's should solve. Mod's should help other users. Airmax does this pretty goood but not Ore_Ele, Ore-ele trolls other users for his/her personal fun and doen't work as moderator at all. http://www.debate.org...

Users like Roylatham,Ragnar etc best suit as moderators and there is a hope that if these users becomes moderaotor, they may handle the issues like Airmax. For all the above reasons change is necessary, even if Ore-ele can't be replaced, he/she should be brought down as a modertor and his/her moderator previlages should be withdrawn.

These are some words by another user
Ore_ele abused her privileges. It's not up to the moderators to decide which thread is "more important" than other threads. Even if Ore_ele considered Krazzy_Player's thread to be unimportant, she clearly was using her moderator abilities as a form of trolling. Moderators shouldn't do this. Period. It's unprofessional. They should moderate, not troll.

I don't know about what happened with airmax. I'm assuming that he was just trying to keep a big fight from erupting. I don't necessarily think that was the right way to go about it though.

So I can understand Krazzy_Player's anger. While I think he may have over-reacted, I do think that Ore_ele acted inappropriately, and that she abused her powers.

I like the cut of your jib. The problem is Krazzy is deliberately attempting to provide further moderator action which undercuts the issue here. This is also provoking other players to respond by feeding the trolling behavior or otherwise mock or attack Krazzy, which also undercuts the issue. Outrage and hyperbole can be an effective tool, but it seems that Krazzy either has no specific goal in mind, or that goal is to get himself banned, neither of which are effective to addressing the issue here. Regardless, I offer my thanks to this post of yours.

At 3/27/2014 8:30:51 PM, airmax1227 wrote:

Ore and I have talked about this at length. I take a very professional attitude towards being the sites moderator (though I wouldn't say Ore is the opposite exactly in his role, because his activities of this sort are pretty harmless) and I expressed my concern with his joke in the 100 post thing before it was even an issue. While I don't think it was as big of a deal as has been expressed in this thread, these types of things concern me and Ore appreciates the position I have stated about it.

With that said, the reaction in this thread is extremely inappropriate. Ore's fun may not have been done with the best wisdom, but I wouldn't call it a misuse to the extent warranting this thread or in questioning his professionalism as a moderator in general. Ore is a valuable asset to the site and I'm personally happy to have him continue to be, but it's clear that things got a bit blown out of proportion here.

I find issue with Krazzy being labeled as inappropriate but Ore being labeled as "harmless fun." Your use of euphamisms to downplay what happened here is disturbing, frankly. It's not up to you, or any moderator, to dictate to other people whether the threads they create are not a big deal. Ore used his moderator powers not to moderate, but to win a game. That's abuse. It isn't harmless. And it isn't appropriate.

At 3/27/2014 7:16:19 PM, Ore_Ele wrote:
Moderating is something we do to help out since when Juggle tried to do it themselves, it did not go well. As people, we enjoy playing and having fun. Sometimes that means playing harmless jokes.

Explain how your moderation of this thread in this manner was in the vein of helping out juggle? I get that you like playing jokes as much as the next person but it's not appropriate to use moderation powers, deleting people's posts just to win a game. Would you do that in a Mafia game?

At 3/27/2014 12:17:03 PM, SPENCERJOYAGE14 wrote:
this is a silly thing to get mad over.

Perhaps. The problem is, if you don't cause a fuss over the small things, it can just give the impression that the behavior, in general, is allowable. It's a slippery slope and I'd rather have a large reaction over something small that forces the moderators to think twice when they try to do it again, than to ignore such behavior until it is a not-silly thing and try and argue it then. In my opinion, the *best* time to talk about these issues is in cases like these because you are afforded a better opportunity to talk about the behavior itself, rather than its effects. I disagree that we should wait, silently, until the misuse of power because gross and overt to discuss whether moderators should be engaging in it.


Mikal

Con

Alright I guess I am going to jump straight into this

The first thing I want to note is that Krazy has the BOP on this, because he is trying to change the status quo. Yes this is the status quo, and yes this is his Bop.

We are discussing whether or not Ore_Ele, should remain a moderator on the site.

You can find his profile here >>>>> http://www.debate.org...


As Krazy said this all stems from a recent forum post which shall be addressed as this debate continues. I will jump straight into some contentions and offer up a few things Ore has done to help the site


Excellent Debater/ Frequent Forum User/ Long Term User

While this is not mutually exclusive with a moderator, Ore is a long standing member of this site and a excellent debater. He has been on the site for nearly 5 years, and has racked up 174 debates and 20k posts. He is very familiar with the site and users. This is a great benefit as far as moderation goes. This goes without saying but this is a debate site. Achieving over 5k elo and having over 170 debates, helps him understand what this site needs in terms of debating. Also being a frequent debater, his input is quiet valuable.

Also as I stated earlier, he has achieved over 20k forum posts and is very active in the forums. This is also a trait a moderator needs. They need the ability to dedicate a lot of time to the site and keep up with forum activity and act accordingly. Ore has invested countless hours of his own time into this site, which is another reason he makes a great moderator. Someone who just logs on every once in a while would not be able to moderate properly

(a) He has been around long enough, to know how he site works and what it needs
(b) He has been around long enough to know when to discuss banning people with airmax (If you were to bring in a new person, they may try and get ban happy). Both Max and Ore , are extremely fair with their judgments in whom they ban. They usually give people multiple attempts to improve their behavior before they implement a ban.

The amount of time and energy Ore has put into this site makes him a qualified moderator.


Elo System

This was Ores project as well. While I do not have all the details to this, I know most members acknowledge that Ore was a vital part in implementing this system on the site. It was largely thanks to his efforts and formula that we have the elo system at all

Great Down to Earth Guy

I think this a key factor in being a moderator. One in which both Max an Ore share in common. You can go to them with problems you are having, and they will try their best to fix it in a fair way while remaining easy to talk too. You don't want a moderator who is out of reach, but an active people person. This is most certainly ore. With his forum activity, you can tell how much of an active user he is. He has lots of friends on this is site, and is very well respected. He possess all the qualities that a moderator should


He genuinely cares for the site

He is also trying to find ways to improve site quality. Just recently he has taken it upon himself to try and find a way to update the voting system because everyone has been asking for it.

This is a message I received from him a day or two ago, where he chained some members who were very interested in trying to change the current system. Throughout the messages, he listened and worked with other members to come up with a viable idea. This is also a key trait for a moderator. The ability to be able to work with other members.


" Posted by:
Profile CardOre_Ele

Hey everyone, I wanted to get together and go over a potential change to the voting style. I'm hoping we can work together the get any kinks out and get a unified proposition or maybe two or three different ones. From there, we can work on trying to convince the community to build support so that we can convince TUF and Juggle that this is what the community wants.

It is going to take more than just some threads on the topic as that is a hard gauge to over-all popularity vs a vocal minority."


At the end of this message it lead to posting threads and polls to try and get community support for a change in the voting system

http://www.debate.org...


This was started by Ore as well. He took the initiative to message all of us and get everyone together to try and find a valid idea for a voting system.When we came up with one that we agreed upon, we posted it in the forums to get community feedback. All this started because he cared enough to do it.


Rebuttals

Ore_Ele is immature and people are not aware he is a mod

Krazy claims that Ore_ele is not mature, and that most people are not even aware he is a moderator. This is a non sequitur to the actual contention that is presented. Just because Ore tends to "troll", in his own way on a rare occasion, it is not breaching site conduct in any way at all. Also just because people are not aware he is a moderator, this is in no way reflective of his actions as a person. For this contention to even be viable krazy would have to show that because Ore "trolls", people do not acknowledge him as a moderator. Other wise we can dismiss this because it is irrelevant and backed with no evidence to support it.

Ore_Ele is fake

This is such a lose contention that it almost does not even need to be addressed. What is fake? Is Ore fake himself? Is his profile fake (this is what he is saying). All this has to be considered. Just because someone sticks false profile information on their profile, does not mean they are not qualified to be a moderator.

For all we know , he has no desire to give out his real information online for personal reasons. People often do this as a safety precaution. There is no way to try and build a case against him because he chooses to remain unanimous to people he doesn't know. This also does not impact his ability to be "faithful" to users, this contention is invalid.


Ore_Ele does not work

If you read above, he implemented an elo system and is always trying to get ideas pushed through to better improve site quality. This contention is entirely invalid and is based on my adversaries personal opinion of Ore. There is no evidence to support this, nor is it viable or true.

Other Users

This does not mean that Ore should be removed. Just because others could be qualified , that does not mean that Ore should be replaced. My adversary must show why he must be replaced, and up to this point he has failed to do so.

Users Demand a Change

This is also invalid. He cites 2 people in a attempt to show the community does not like Ore. This could even fall into an ad populum under the right conditions. I could find more members than you could, that want ore to remain a moderator. In no way is there opinion related to whether or not he is qualified to be a moderator. His qualifications are separate from personal opinion.

Forum Drama

I am running short on characters but will keep this short. Krazy explained this above and I will not go into great detail due to character limits. Basically Ore "Trolled", a post krazy made for fun. It may have been in bad taste but Ore apologized for doing this.

"To reiterate, I am genuinely sorry that I offended anyone. I will not do it to them again."

http://www.debate.org...

In addition to this Ore agreed to go back and name the correct person the winner and said he was wrong about the matter and was sorry if he offended anyone. In addition to this both Ore and Max forgave personal attacks from krazy against them

These are some of the insults Krazy laid out

" Listen Airmax u fuker ban me permanently for this fuking post. I going to Larzthlooser's site edeb8. "

" That fuking bitc*(Ore) cheated and my thread is gone."

" Be the moderator soon and kill that bitc* Ore-ele and rape her i'll be waiting to hear this"

Both Max and Ore forgave krazy and gave him a chance to improve his conduct due to the situation.

Conclussion

The resoultion does not stand



Debate Round No. 2
Krazzy_Player

Pro

Ore_Ele is immature and people are not aware he is a mod

"Moderators" work is a serious job,It is no fun, they have to deal with millions of users of a particular site. If Mod's are themselves trolls, users only option will be to leave the site.


Ore_Ele is fake

Mod's must create a sign of trust among users. Fake profiles will result in lack of trust among users on the site. Airmax is the best example for "Moderator."

Ore_Ele does not work

Just because Ore-ele is one of the lead member in bringing ELO system doesn't mean he/she works all the time. Airmax does most of the mod work as seen and known by many users here.

Other Users

Ore-ele may be doing mod work from long time and no one can continue a job for life long period. If users believe "Moderator" isn't doing the job appropriately, then the site and it's users have every right for demanding change. Users like Roylatham, Ragnar, Whiteflame, Wylted etc suits for the job best. I believe this is the right time for demanding change over.

Uusers Demand a Change

Change is necessary everywhere and users have every right to demand change. It brings refreshment to the site and its going on work.

Forum Drama

Now this is very important as it brings the clear picture what happened? This may be initiative bringing the necessary change and to implementing it.

Rebuttals

Excellent Debater/ Frequent Forum User/ Long Term User

All the above qualities doesn't match for a person to be qualified as "Moderator." Roylatham is excellent debater too also a long term user and he is been before Ore-Ele in addition to that he is also frequent forum user (which is not necessary).

Elo System

As said earlier, just because he was the lead member in bringing this system doesn't mean he can be a "Mod".

Great Down to Earth Guy

This doesn't need to be addressed at all. "Moderator" job is sensitive and a troll & childish behavioral person cannot handle it.


He genuinely cares for the site

This statement is totally false. He himself said that," He is here just for fun and continue trolling for his personal fun in the recent thread I provided.


Conclusion

My opponent tries to shift the BOP on me but the Rules clearly says BOP is shared. Ore_Ele is not serious about his job at all and is not the right person as "Mod". If "Moderator" job is taken from Ore_ele and is given to better and serious users like Roy, Ragnar etc, this site can flourish even longer with proper administration.

Final Words

This debate is no fun and I request voters to vote in dignity as this issue is about "Moderator Replacement". There are users who really care for this site but some trolls is bringing a bad image to this site. Please think over the issue seriously.

Thank you Mikal for accepting and presenting your case.


Mikal

Con

There is hardly anything left to refute. I am going to go through some of the contentions, but Krazy dropped or did not respond to almost all of them. The ones he did respond to were not accurate rebuttals.

Immature/ Not aware he is a Mod

The entire point that I made was dropped. Krazy failed to show how people not being aware that he is a moderator, actually effects his ability to moderate. I addressed the immature aspect of this in the last round which was no touched. He fails to make this contention solid and does not meet his BOP

Ore Ele is Fake

The point about security was completely dropped, thus this contention is invalid. For all we know Ore Ele wishes to not diverge his personal information to the public for safety/security reasons. Krazy fails to show the correlation in trust in a moderator and this point. Thus his BOP is not fulfilled and was refuted with privacy concerns which Krazy failed to address.

Ore Ele does not Work

Krazy acknowledges Ore Ele was a vital part in the Elo System and implemented it. This confirms the point that Ore Ele does not work. By acknowledging this Krazy refutes his own premise.

Other Users

Krazy drops yet another point. He fails to show why Ore ele should be replaced. He lists off a group of people whom he feels would be better moderators without giving any reasons as to why. He also fails to show why other members being able to moderate would mean that Ore Ele should be replaced. We could simply add another Mod and not replace him. This point is invalid

User Demand a Change

He committed an Add populum in the first round and drops everything behind this contention and my rebuttal. It does not stand and is invalid.



Rebuilding Contentions

I really do not need to address each of my contentions in turn. Krazy did not refute any of them and merely asserted personal assumptions as to why he feels Ore is a bad moderator. None of this is backed with fact other than the forum issue that occurred, which Ore apologized for. In addition to this remember Krazy went on rants calling Airmax and Ore things like "stupid fuk", and saying "he hopes they are raped", and calling them a "btch". This is a blatant violation of the TOS and can result in a temp ban, but due to the issue that occurred both Ore and Max offered Krazy another chance because they somewhat under stood his anger.



Conclusion

Krazy has failed to address how and why Ore is a Bad moderator and should be replaced. I have shown that he has played a vital roll in site updates, that he cares for the site, that he really active and a great debater who understands site etiquette. He is even willing to admit when he does something wrong. Krazy is letting a little joke get way out of hand, and taking his personal feelings out on Ore

In the end this boils down to the BOP. I have refuted all of Krazys contention and he has failed to refute any of mine. He has also failed to solidify any solid reasons as to why Ore should be replaced.

He has failed to meet the BOP and uphold the resolution.
Debate Round No. 3
92 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by wrichcirw 2 years ago
wrichcirw
"I don't see how anyone can view this as close in all honest."

I agree, but in the exact opposite direction. This debate wasn't close because IMHO CON's arguments were largely irrelevant to the resolution or to PRO's case, and PRO did meet minimal BoP.

Most people voted the way they did because their stance on the resolution didn't change. But, that's not the point of scoring arguments. It's not what convinced you, but what you found to be more convincing.
Posted by Mikal 2 years ago
Mikal
I don't see how anyone can view this as close in all honest. It was krazy btchign about ore playing a joke while not bothering to refute any necessary points.

There are different types of debaters on this site to me

People who will give me a run for my money. Bluesteel, raisor, roy, thett3 , etc

There are people that I know I will beat, but it requires to much work. I am to lazy to put a lot of effort into a debate that i know I will win.

Then there are easy debates.

I only take the first and last. The second is just bothersome. I hate investing countless amounts of times into a debate that I know I will win. This debate was def the latter
Posted by Wylted 2 years ago
Wylted
I agree. There is an inherent bias towards high elo debaters such as Mikal. That's exactly why you need to win convincingly against them. The bias is really only a factor in close debates. I didn't really view this as close.
Posted by zmikecuber 2 years ago
zmikecuber
In my opinion, most people are biased towards voting for Mikal because of his prestige as a debater.
Posted by zmikecuber 2 years ago
zmikecuber
Imhellspawn obviously votebombed on this debate. He just copied and pasted from SeventhProfessor's vote. You can even see the comma at the end of the sentence where he copied from... Just take a look...

Imhellspawn2: Con showed that Ore has plenty to offer the site,

SeventhProfessor: Con showed that Ore has plenty to offer the site, such as the elo system, that he couldn't offer as an average user, and his positives outweigh his very minor negatives. Pro's grammar was just abysmal overall.
Posted by wrichcirw 2 years ago
wrichcirw
"I mean if you someone says "The Sky is Pink", that is their BOP on a positive claim. All you have to do is point out that it is blue"

Actually no, "the sky is blue" is a baseless, unsubstantiated assertion in that case. It does not refute "the sky is pink because I say so". A refutation would be "PRO is not a proper authority on the subject, so 'the sky is pink' remains a baseless assertion".

You can bring out your own counter-case about the sky being blue, but maybe the sky is pink AND blue, and that would affirm that "the sky is pink" and PRO would win the debate.

For this debate, given how arguments went, someone who did not know ore_ele could come to the conclusion that ore_ele is a great user that shouldn't be a moderator.
Posted by wrichcirw 2 years ago
wrichcirw
I really do not think you refuted his arguments, and the arguments were not just specific to just that thread. Talking about how great a user ore_ele is is not relevant to ore_ele's moderator duties, the latter of which was the bulk of PRO's case (ore_ele trolls about his gender, and does not really moderate, for example).
Posted by Mikal 2 years ago
Mikal
I know it was shared, but i built a case by refuting his arguments lol. Without any arguments the few points i made stood. I am just saying there was really no need to be in-depth or proper with this. He said "I hate ore because he trolled my thread" , you shoot down his few contentions and that leaves mine to stand. he did not refute anything at all and by the end of the debate all of his points are left dead.
Posted by wrichcirw 2 years ago
wrichcirw
"Ore is fuking retard and need to be replaced. He requires mental treatment."

"Hey this is Krazzy, Why did they ban me? I created another a/c they are really idiots."

lol, I sense some causality here...(http://www.debate.org...)

---

@mikal, I understand and most of what you said made sense...I just think the debate had a bit more in it just that, and will note that BoP was shared.
Posted by Speakerfrthedead 2 years ago
Speakerfrthedead
Hi Krazzy, I know what you mean. And the anger you feel is justified. What Ore_el did is wrong and he shouldn't have done that as a moderator. But what I'm asking is, why don't you give him another chance? Why does he NOT deserve another chance? Mikal can be viewed as Ore_el's lawyer or trade union because he is protecting ore from unfair judgements. Just because he did something wrong doesn't mean you can just fire him from his job. It's like a waiter who steals money from a customer. It is wrong for him to do that, but in this world, his boss can't just say, "You're fired". He has to warn him not to do it again and if the waiter does steal again, then perhaps the boss can fire him. If the boss chooses to just kick the waiter out, the waiter will hire a lawyer and the whole matter goes to court until eventually the boss has to pay the worker a monthly wage before kicking him out of the business. I'm just trying to convince you to give him another chance and let the matter go. Is it not stressful being mad at someone for a long time? Those people that you say should be moderator might not even want to be moderators. And if Ore misuses his moderator abilities again, THEN we or a group of people can start seriously discussing having a new moderator. I know it's frustrating, it's unfair, it's injustice, but can't you find it in yourself to forgive this ore whatever the heck guy? I wish you good luck whether or not you stay or leave DDO and whether or not you let this matter go.
6 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Vote Placed by wrichcirw 2 years ago
wrichcirw
Krazzy_PlayerMikalTied
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Reasons for voting decision: Hmmm...IMHO this topic is too insignificant to merit a change in moderators. Ore_ele apologized for offending anyone, and given the triviality of the issue, that should be enough. Overall, regardless of my stance being unchanged, I did find PRO to be more convincing. I do not understand why ore_ele lies about his gender, and this is not trolling on a "rare occasion", but on EVERY occasion that anyone has to talk to ore_ele about anything. I agree it's inappropriate for someone in a position of responsibility to do. Most of CON's case described a great user which makes sense as a prerequisite for being a mod, but was almost wholly irrelevant to moderation duties proper. In this sense, I found CON's case to be almost wholly irrelevant to the matter at hand. Finally, I did not see CON proffering any sort of convincing rebuttal to PRO's case, but rather trusted that his case would be more convincing than PRO's. It was not.
Vote Placed by kbub 2 years ago
kbub
Krazzy_PlayerMikalTied
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Reasons for voting decision: Odd debate. Very little evidence, besides anecdotal, could be provided for either side. From what I can tell, Krazzy doesn't advocate winning arguments that shows that Ore_Ele has a negative effect on DDO, but only an insufficient good effect . Con has some evidence that shows that Ore_Ele has contributed a lot. Krazzy seems to mistakenly portray a small net benefit as a negative. Here's why I'm confused: Both a little net benefit and a lot of net benefit show that Ore_Ele should remain as moderator. Even given that other debaters might make better moderators, Krazzy doesn't show why this is mutually-exclusive: Krazzy does not show that Ore_Ele's prevents Whiteflame's becoming a moderator. Thus, it seems a clear victory for Con, but a nice debate on both sides.
Vote Placed by zmikecuber 2 years ago
zmikecuber
Krazzy_PlayerMikalTied
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Reasons for voting decision: I'm giving conduct to Pro, since Con accepted but then tried to force the burden onto Pro. Spelling and grammar was equally bad. Pro didn't use good grammar, but Con kept making spelling mistakes, especially his opponent's name. Also lots of misuses of ' by both. Now for arguments. I don't agree with Krazzy that Ore should be replaced. However, the burden of proof is shared in this case. Con sufficiently showed that Ore_ele is a valuable member who has contributed much to DDO, but he didn't demonstrate that Ore_ele should remain, or even be, a moderator. Con rebutted many of Pro's arguments, but he dealt lightly with Pro's example of Ore's misuse of mod powers, which was the main thrust. Once again, I don't think Ore_ele should be replaced. But when it comes down to it, Pro has an argument that Ore_ele should be replaced as moderator (even if it's weak), while Con really doesn't. So even if Con rebuts Pro's weak argument (like I said, he dealt lightly), Pro still wins arguments.
Vote Placed by Relativist 2 years ago
Relativist
Krazzy_PlayerMikalTied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro's contention was a heated disagreement in the forum and a simple background check of Ore Ele's profile as well as a 'blank' claim that Ore Ele was slacking off. the debate turns into more like a Q & A. The majority of pro's point have been successfully refuted and Pro came with only a reassertion in the last round. Con rightfully answers this through the amount of posts Ore Ele made in the forums, the importance of privacy and the implementation of the elo system. All of Con's contention were related into Ore Ele's job as a moderator and his contribution. Whereas Pro's rebuttal was just 'Moderator should be serious' and a reassertion of previous points which was already brought down by Con. I find Con to be more convincing even in the 'change' point, as it revolves under a forum topic which Pro was clearly contesting. Con is right, '2' users cannot represent the whole community of DDO. That is simply stereotypical. Therefore, 3 points to Con.
Vote Placed by Wylted 2 years ago
Wylted
Krazzy_PlayerMikalTied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro's argument can be summed up with the phrase: Mods should be serious and not have fun. Con showed effectively took away all of pro's arguments. On another note it's unfair to ask the mods to not have fun or to be serious. It's not a job that pays. They are doing the site a favor by being mods and we should expect them to be human and thank them for their sacrifices.
Vote Placed by SeventhProfessor 2 years ago
SeventhProfessor
Krazzy_PlayerMikalTied
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: Con showed that Ore has plenty to offer the site, such as the elo system, that he couldn't offer as an average user, and his positives outweigh his very minor negatives. Pro's grammar was just abysmal overall.