The Instigator
Grayneer
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
kbub
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

Modern-Day Feminism could very well be a lost cause. (No order of argument/ freestyle debate)

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Voting Style: Open Point System: Select Winner
Started: 5/21/2014 Category: Society
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,584 times Debate No: 55159
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (5)
Votes (0)

 

Grayneer

Pro

I'm just sick of it. I've been researching feminism for a solid year now and have come upon both pros and cons of the subject. In pure honesty I think that there are portions of Feminist Theory that we could implement into modern society. Feminism is not all that bad. However, the problem with Feminism and especially Modern-Day Feminism, is that feminists cannot expect to change these highly socialized, and maybe even sexist values anytime soon. A large amount of Americans don't even know that Modern-Day Feminism is as big as it is. It's my total opinion but I just think it's a lost cause.
kbub

Con

My opponent has started her/his arguments in round 1 (R1); therefore, it seems that arguments are acceptable in R1.

Resolution analysis
My opponent did not clarify much of the resolution (such as through the use of definitions), so the burden to do so falls on me.

Definitions
Feminism: "the theory of the political, economic, and social equality of the sexes" [1].
Lost cause: "a person or thing that can no longer hope to succeed or be changed for the better." [2]

Types of "Modern-Day Feminism"
However, although Pro argues against feminism in general, the resolution only addresses "Modern-Day" Feminism. Pro has been researching feminism for over a year, and thus probably knows that there are many contemporary feminist positions. Although the resolution is likely referring to all of these positions collectively, I recommend limiting the number of contemporary feminist positions to make it easier on Pro:

Third wave feminism
Standpoint feminism
Ecofeminism
Conservative feminism
Anarca-feminism
Libertarian feminism
Socialist feminism
Marxist feminism
Postcolonial feminism
Post structural feminism
Postmodern feminism
Lipstick feminism
And both positions of the Feminist Sex Wars

All of these positions are a small piece of a much longer list that comprise modern day feminist movements. I will allow the debate to be focused on only these movements, even though doing so is to my disadvantage.

Resolution interpretation
Thus, the resolution "Modern-Day Feminism could very well be a lost cause" indicates that Pro ought to defend that Modern-day feminism is a lost cause, whereas Con may attack that position. Although taken on its own the resolution might be said to have Pro show a mere possibility of Modern-Day feminism being a lost cause; however, in the context of the debate it seems that the resolution is merely clarifying that there is a possibility that Modern Day feminism could be a lost cause and that therefore the debate is on whether or not it is the case that modern day feminism is a lost cause. Furthermore, the resolution also states that this is a "freestyle debate," which seems to suggest that a contextual rather than merely literal interpretation of the resolution should be preferred. Furthermore, Pro's first argument seems to support and clarify the context of the resolution; s/he finishes R1 with her/his position in the debate: "It's my total opinion but I just think it's [sic.] [Modern-day feminism] a lost cause."

Thus, it seems clear from the wording and context of the debate that Pro is obligating with defending the assertion that Modern-Day feminism (limited to the list I provided) is a lost cause.

Burden of Proof
Because s/he is Pro, is a challenger, and is making a counter-cultural claim, it would seem that Pro also has the Burden of Proof (BoP) to demonstrate that Modern-Day feminism is a lost cause.

-----

Short rebuttal:

Pro listed exactly two reasons why Modern-Day feminism is a lost cause:

1. Values won't change quickly: "feminists cannot expect to change these highly socialized, and maybe even sexist values anytime soon."

2. Many Americans are ignorant of feminist theory: "A large amount of Americans don't even know that Modern-Day Feminism is as big as it is."

Neither of these points indicate that Modern-Day feminism is a lost cause at all.

The first point (1) suggests that change will happen slowly. Sometimes change does happen slowly, but that doesn't make it a "lost cause."

The second point (1) suggests that because many Americans don't know about feminism, that it is a lost cause. In fact, the fact that many Americans do not understand feminism is a great explanation for why sexism still occurs in America. This means that through feminist education, America has a good shot of fighting sexism.

My opponent also gave no sources regarding America's understanding of feminism in point two.

Furthermore, my opponent's second point is limited to America. Feminism is a global movement with global implications (see especially postcolonial feminism). Thus, any negative attitude in America toward feminism or women in no way indicates that Modern-Day feminism is a lost cause.

[1] http://tinyurl.com...
[2] http://tinyurl.com...
Debate Round No. 1
Grayneer

Pro

There is no way I can argue this, impeccable job. I must do more research. I apologize for my ignorance.
kbub

Con

Well, thanks for the great debate topic and the compliment! I definitely didn't mean to make you feel bad, but if I did I'm quite sorry. Feel free to message me for a debate anytime!
Debate Round No. 2
Grayneer

Pro

Grayneer forfeited this round.
kbub

Con

Please extend.
Debate Round No. 3
Grayneer

Pro

Grayneer forfeited this round.
kbub

Con

An ancient Roman walked into a bar, held up two fingers and said "I'd like five beers."
Debate Round No. 4
Grayneer

Pro

Grayneer forfeited this round.
kbub

Con

Thanks for the debate!
Debate Round No. 5
5 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Posted by CirticalLucas 1 year ago
CirticalLucas
So con instantly started off by twisting the definition oh so slightly. Textbook stuff.
Posted by kbub 2 years ago
kbub
I must admit I was surprised too.

But, don't you think that would be a bit inefficient for me to create a second profile, fill out the BIG issues, vote on 62 polls, keep it active for over 10 months, and do 9 debates, only one of which was with me?
Posted by Logicalled 2 years ago
Logicalled
Haha:

"There is no way I can argue this, impeccable job. I must do more research. I apologize for my ignorance."

Said no debater ever.
Posted by kbub 2 years ago
kbub
Haha, I've never had one of my debates called fake before! But no, this wasn't faked.
Posted by Logicalled 2 years ago
Logicalled
This wasn't a debate, this was a feminist posing as both sides, with a premeditated plan.

I call BS.
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