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The Contender
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Monkeys Need To Learn Math Before They Throw What They Shat

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 8/9/2014 Category: Miscellaneous
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 426 times Debate No: 60236
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (2)
Votes (1)




Monkeys should learn math, so when they throw their fecal matter, it will actually matter.



Nice topic.

1) Whenever a person throws an object at an intended target, (s)he simply aims and fires. No knowledge of trigonometry or any other branch of mathematics is applied here. The prevalent situation often is that the math wiz can't throw a ball to save his life, while the expert pitcher is on the verge of flunking in maths.

2) Our subconscious has the necessary knowledge for intuitively throwing things accurately. This is genetically transferred from ancestor to descendant, and need not be 'learnt'. Our subconscious also has the ability to calculate, at great speed, everything necessary for throwing projectiles.

3)From this one might infer that monkeys actually do need to know mathematics albeit subconsciously to throw poo around, but your topic clearly says 'learn'.
Debate Round No. 1


"Do need to know subconsciously", is saying "Do need to learn subconsciously" - if they don't know, then they must learn.

Why am I surrounded by idiots...


With advanced motor functions such as throwing, genetic programming cannot be substituted for conscious learning. You 'know' that if you throw a ball in a certain way, it will reach a certain point (give or take some).

To throw a ball, a monkey would first need to know how to aim, compensating for gravity and wind, and then how to use this information obtained to throw the object properly, including posture and mechanics.

For aiming, you would generally need to know the rate of decrease in altitude for a given direction and magnitude + you would have to calculate the deflection due to wind.

Then you would have to calculate the required posture and action for throwing.

These things sound simple but only because you know this intuitively and genetically. Try consciously calculating the deflection due to wind and and the effect of gravity on a ball, calculate the path of your arm AND THEN TRY TO APPLY THIS and you will understand. If you succeed, it would be slower by orders of magnitude compared to 'just doing it'.

By then, the poo would have rotten.

Our brain, however, hops, skips and jumps through these hoops because it's got intuition. Its genetic programming enables it to approximate to satisfactory levels and solve these conundrums faster than any supercomputer we have right now (I can't speak for IBM's new silicon brain, however).

Monkeys also possess this intuition, but your argument states that they need to learn this maths , but this intuition for this task simply can't be learnt and applied. It must exist at some primal level. You can improve on this intuition through analysis of technique, but not program an entirely new task. An anology for this would be how some people have a knack for something from birth.

When was the last time you calculated the exact path of a ball (in real life, not in a physics exam) before throwing it?

P.S: You don't have to insult people left, right and center to get ahead in life. Use the mantra of etiquette.
Debate Round No. 2


This is to say that math is not only in this Universe, it's in Us. Interesting.

How about this - can math heighten the senses of trajectory-knowledge?

P.S You can't insult intelligence; you can only insult ignorance. Don't be insulted, and my words will mean only to those that mean nothing to themselves.


As far as I know, not with the usage you have in mind (throwing poo), but it makes you appreciate what goes into actions we assume to be simple. This knowledge has plenty of other practical applications like teaching a robot how to go about it, controlling a NASA probe or aiming more advanced projectile weapons (cannons, missiles etc).

Trigonometry is also used in construction and other fields.

PS: Nice disarming spell. I can practically hear 'Expelliarmus'.
Debate Round No. 3
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by Aerogant 2 years ago
This debate is not about jets - it's about the success monkeys can have when throwing their poo after learning trigonometry.
Posted by saboosa 2 years ago
i dont understand the subjet
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by Theunkown 2 years ago
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro made ad hominem attacks so conduct to con. Pro's arguments were terrible to say the least. Con proved that monkeys already know how to throw something since it is a [overly] simple motor function passed down through the generations. Pro may have made an argument saying that Math can help with the trajectory but a monkey does not NEED that to throw. Even if the throw is inaccurate, it is still a throw nonetheless. Arguments to Con