The Instigator
QMZP2190
Con (against)
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The Contender
retrovision
Pro (for)
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Morality: is the foundation of morality supernatural?

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/1/2015 Category: Philosophy
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 287 times Debate No: 81888
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (5)
Votes (0)

 

QMZP2190

Con

I'm taking the con side, arguing that the foundation of morality is completely natural and doesn't need a moral lawgiver
retrovision

Pro

You are really trying to argue that the consequences of having a lot of people believing in an absolute lawgiver are worse than the consequences of them believing in nothing. Please proceed.
Debate Round No. 1
QMZP2190

Con

I never said that the consequences of people believing in a lawgiver are worse than non believers!
No this is not the subject of this debate.
Im arguing whether morality came from a moral law giver or naturally. I never said that non believers are more moral than believers
retrovision

Pro

You are framing this question as to whether man "needs" a supernatural lawgiver. Your headline isn't asking the same question.

Question 1

Is morality supernatural or is it natural?

Protestants mostly don't think so. Catholics go with St. Paul and think it is. Either our western traditions are based on Roman law and biblical morality or as Christians think they are inspired by God. Either way, the adoption of this philosophy changed the world from a bunch of pagans eating their own children to viable, if imperfect, societies. Slavery was ended in churches. The civil rights movement was fought as much from the pulpit as in the street.

Question 2

Does man need a supernatural lawgiver?

In the absence of one of those, people usually choose a natural authoritarian lawgiver that has a funny mustache and puts people in a gas chamber.
Debate Round No. 2
QMZP2190

Con

What I mean by "is morality supernatural"is whether a moral lawgiver exists or not.
I think you miss understand the title, the title can also be "is god necessary for morality"
The points you made are irrelevant.
retrovision

Pro

I think everyone needs some external influence to measure what moral is. God has served that role. If you'd like to switch to logic, progressive values don't meet the burden of logic. You'd be required to abide a code even stricter than God's law. There is no "turn the other cheek" or "you are blessed to help the poor" in logic. There is no "Do unto others" in logic. There is no charity in logic.

That's why mass killing communists prefer atheism in a blind taste test. It's nice just to be able to make up what moral is as you go along.
Debate Round No. 3
QMZP2190

Con

QMZP2190 forfeited this round.
retrovision

Pro

retrovision forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
5 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Posted by retrovision 1 year ago
retrovision
As far as I can tell, anything God has made taboo (according to modern, mainstream, Christians) is also illogical and anti-social. You can point out that believing in God is illogical and upon examination we'll usually figure out what anti-social and illogical thing you want to do that makes people frown.
Posted by dsjpk5 1 year ago
dsjpk5
I would argue that OBJECTIVE morality requires a law giver.
Posted by GoOrDin 1 year ago
GoOrDin
I argue Con does not know the meaning of Supernatural, the state of Supernatural, or have an understanding of the discussion. Con is not qualified to have this debate. IN fact Con is searching in the most arrogant manner possible, by taking of the apposing side. Con looses an eternity over.
Posted by retrovision 1 year ago
retrovision
Everyone is given to irrationality in some way. Other people being irrational doesn't let you point at them to cover up your own irrationality.
Posted by vi_spex 1 year ago
vi_spex
there is no logic in fantasy
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