More People Should Fat-Shame Women
Debate Rounds (5)
Hello, I hope to have a serious and interesting debate about obesity, I will be arguing why more people should fat-shame women while my opponent (Con) must explain why less people should fat-shame women.
Fat-shaming = "The action or practice of humiliating someone judged to be fat or overweight by making mocking or critical comments about their size" - OxfordDictionaries.com
Structure of debate:
R5 conclusion - no new points
Good luck Con!
Obesity is a subject I have spend copious time researching.
My position is that both morbid obesity and obesity are complex biological subjects that have many causes. Fat-shaming is both cruel and counterproductive. Say no to fat shaming.
I have spent time thinking about this, and time researching, I will now present some of my arguements to support my position.
“This study demonstrates that the weight gain in the American population seems to be virtually all explained by eating more calories. It appears that changes in physical activity played a minimal role.” 
"It turns out, overeating sugar and carbohydrates is what’s causing obesity, not a sedentary lifestyle, according to the researchers’ findings published in the Journal of Sports Medicine."
The vast majority of people who are fat are fat by choice, and not a medical condition, their genes, or their job etc.
"In a study of 93 women, exposure to weight stigmatizing information made overweight women, but not normal weight women, eat more calories and feel less in control of their eating" 
Fat shaming only affects people's eating behaviour if they are overweight! Women were not born fat, therefore fat shaming is not the reason why women are fat. Feminism is. So, fat shaming does not lead to MORE women being fat, because fat shaming only affects women's behaviour if they are fat. Although less women might get into shape due to fat shaming, fat shaming actually deters women from getting fat in the first place and helps motivate people to lose weight.
Should more people fat-shame?
There will be women who after being fat shamed will feel depressed and think "I'm fat, that's just who I am, there's nothing I can do about it". They may gain much more weight, but should people feel pity and give them a card saying how beautiful they are? Or say nothing i.e. agree with feminist movements such as 'fat acceptance' which degrade men and make more women fat? What is wrong with telling someone they're not attractive anyway? Or expressing their anger in a non-physical way.
"Britain spending £47bn a year dealing with the healthcare and social costs of an increasingly overweight population, study finds" 
Why should people stay silent? It is wrong for fat women to be happy about their body while damaging the health of everyone else. If more people fat shamed they will feel more confident.
Obesity should never be accepted! It is unhealthy and if nothing is said, more women will believe the lies that fat feminists/man haters spread about men causing more women to become fat like them, presumably so the fat women feel better about themselves as they want fat manequins which would stop younger women aspiring to fit into a smaller dress etc. Men should not stop fat shaming women because of what biased studies say. Appealing to the other sex is a motivator. By accepting obesity, people will be demotivated to be healthy and not respect other people's opinions, and then eat themselves to an early grave.
Fat feminists often threaten people by saying that if they are fat-shamed they will eat more. Any reason is good enough for them to eat more food. Most people are in fact against fat-shaming yet that doesn't stop fat feminists blaming fat-shamers for their eating habbits. If there were no fat shamers though, they would still gain pounds. If they were told they are beautiful on a regular basis they would still get larger and larger because they have a negative attitude towards other people and wish to express their hate by being fat. Caring will just make them take less responsibility for their health. We should think about the health of the younger generation instead.
II. Main argument
I will not address any of my opponent's points this round. Instead, I will make my argument this round and address my opponent's in round three. First, lets establish that obesity is a major problem. Obesity is a risk factor for cancer, diabetes, and heart disease.
Cancer "Obesity is associated with increased risks of the following cancer types, and possibly others as well:
Colon and rectum
Breast (after menopause)
Endometrium (lining of the uterus)
Diabetes "Obesity or being overweight. Research shows this is a top reason for type 2 diabetes. Because of the rise in obesity among U.S. children, this type is affecting more teenagers." 
Heart disease "Coronary Heart Disease
As your body mass index rises, so does your risk for coronary heart disease (CHD). CHD is a condition in which a waxy substance called plaque (plak) builds up inside the coronary arteries. These arteries supply oxygen-rich blood to your heart." 
The real question is does fat shaming work? I contend tat fat shaming in an ineffective method of reducing obesity. In fact, fat shaming have the opposite effect. I will also give an alternative to fat shaming.
II. Main argument
Fat shaming has been proven to be ineffective. Both through scientific and anecdotal evidence. I know plenty of obese people in my life that have been fat shamed. They are still obese. Here's some scientific evidence
Our results indicate that rather than encouraging people to lose weight, weight discrimination promotes weight gain and the onset of obesity. Implementing effective interventions to combat weight stigma and discrimination at the population level could reduce the burden of obesity." 
Instead, people need to be educated on the causes of obesity. Overeating is one cause but there are many others. Also, there are dietary tricks like eating high fiber foods to help curve appetite.
Fiber "It has been suggested that sufficient fiber in the diet will tend to prevent excessive food intake" 
Sleep "Thus, rodent obesity models also support an association between sleep and obesity.
Improving sleep quality may be a clinical tool to treat obese individuals." .
Not exercising in a given week was associated with a 35% incidence of obesity.
Exercising for 30 minutes, 1-2 days a week, was associated with a 28% incidence of obesity
However, the survey also showed that those who exercised every day were slightly more likely to be obese (20%) than those who say they exercised five or six days (19%)." 
In lieu of fat shaming education needs to be provided to everyone. Not just obese people. This way no discrimination takes place. Furthermore, many people I know that were young and normal weight are now extremely overweight. By taking a preemptive strike against obesity via education for normal weight people we eliminate shame.
I agree that obesity is associated with greater risks of cancer, and other health problems which is why something should be done. I think that if more people fat shame women then obesity will be decreased. There will be less television programs which promote fat acceptance, see link below and Roosh's reaction to appearing on the show
Con asserts that fat shaming is not only an ineffective method of reducing obesity, but that it actually increases obesity. He says "Fat shaming has been proven to be ineffective both through scientific and anecdotal evidence". There are numerous studies including my third source which show that exposure to weight stigmatizing information make overweight women, but not normal weight women, eat more calories and feel less in control of their eating behaviour. However this doesn't prove that fat shaming is ineffective though. Such studies only focus on comfort eating when people are depressed, rather than the bigger picture e.g. they don't mention the people who choose not to overeat and be fat due to fat being deemed unattractive. When someone is fat, they are not depressed simply because people fat shame them, it is their attitude which depresses them and that is something everyone has control of.
Here is video revealing a fat woman's views
She chooses to believe in thin privilege, blames anything just to feel better about not taking any resposnibility for her health.
My opponent blames fat shaming for causing obesity too by saying "I know plenty of obese people in my life that have been fat shamed. They are still obese" when fat shaming is not the cause of obesity.
Here is another video below, this time showing some views from feminists
Fat people should not be pitied, they do not deserve to be loved. See video below:
Men have to love theirself to deserve love, and women should too. Pitying them just makes them feel depressed and less motivated to lose weight. Fat women need to accept that men find fat ugly, and they need to stop believing in fat acceptance movements. Once they can accept that fat is ugly and learn that they need to earn love, then they will be motivated to lose weight. Telling them to blame fat shamers who represent a tiny minority, and allowing them believe that fat is beatiful i.e. not respect men's opinion, is not going to help them, quite the opposite.
Con says 'overeating is one cause but there are many others'. I've provided sources in the previous round showing that overeating can explain almost every case of obesity. He even shows that a small amount of excercise makes a big difference, so obese people are not trying to lose weight. Fat shaming them though can encourage them to seek a doctor and other professionals about their problem.
Educating people about obesity is a waste of money and gives people more reason to hate fat people. Everyone is taught at school that to be healthy we must excercise, sleep well, and eat well e.g. eat vegetables and have a balanced diet, not too much sugar etc. What more do people need to learn? Should fat people blame everything like their lack of education about fibre? Surely that would cause women to take even less responsibility for their health
Rebuttal of my opponent mostlogical's round 2 argument
I will devote this entire round to attacking my opponent mostlogical's argument.
"Although less women might get into shape due to fat shaming, fat shaming actually deters women from getting fat in the first place and helps motivate people to lose weight. " mostlogical
This is an unsubstantiated claim. There appears to be no evidence to back up that fat shaming deters women from getting fat in the first place. Thus this is a bare assertion fallacy. Only true because mostlogical states that it is true. 
All evidence seems to predict the contrary. That fat shaming only causes harm. Even if you fat shame a skinny or normal weight person, the conversation may be overheard by an obese person. That obese person may in turn suffer mentally from fat shaming.
"Controlling for BMI did not diminish the associations, indicating that perceived weight discrimination is potentially harmful to mental health regardless of weight. ." 
I'm confident I've won the debate at this point, so expect further rounds to be brief.
Oddly my opponent expresses his confidence despite making no effort to convince me that less women should be fat-shamed. He does not tell me how educating people can stop obesity, nor make it clear how fat-shaming makes more people fat. He has provided one source which concludes that "weight discrimination promotes weight gain", which claims without any explanation that "combating weight stigma and discrimination at the population level could reduce the burden of obesity."
Here is that link:http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...;
You will only read about sophisicated statistical techniques used, it is unclear how the conclusion is reached. The research doesn't look at the bigger picture either or say much.
My opponent seems to think that because women eat more comfort food after being fat-shamed, and since being fat is obviously unhealthy then they should not be fat-shamed. However I could do an experiment whereby I get a group of fat people to sit in front of a television with food in front of them and another group of normal weight women in the same situation, and I bet you more food would be eaten in the fat group, especially if they watched lots of skinny people n television, but does that mean skinny people are causing them to be fat? No, of course not, fat feminists blame anything and anyone to feel better about their eating habbit, so there is no reason to think fat-shaming is causing them to be fat either.
If depression is the cause of obesity, then teaching people to not fat-shame and to just tip toe around fat people, or keep their feelings and opinions quiet is going to lead to even more people being depressed and fat. Everyone's opinion's and feelings are equally important. This is the great message that should be taught! We shouldn't think that a fat feminist's feelings are more important than everyone elses especially when they have harmed their self by putting food in their own mouth, and don't respect other people. £47 billion pound is spent on obesity which should be spent elsewhere, NHS hospitals are already going bust unfairly affecting the health of normal weight people, yet fat feminists and feminist researchers are saying that people shouldn't be angry. Fat-shamers are even called cowards when they are actually paying the cost of obesity.
Nobody should be afraid to tell someone to lose weight. Imagine the guilt of not telling someone close. People need to hit rock bottom for a beautiful thing called change to occur. Even if nobody says anything bad about fat, fat people will still hate their body, as people generally don't find fat attractive, finishing last in races etc affects confidence too. Without negative motivation, fat people will just get fatter as they won't do something due to thinking it's not a problem.
Fat-shaming discourages people from being fat in the first place by showing that fat acceptance movements are liars who want more people to be fat like them so that fat women can feel better about theirself.
If most people fat-shamed women, or less people complimented fat women on their body, then I believe women will do something about their weight a lot sooner, less women would wait until they have a 1 year to live before deciding they need to do something like have a gastric band.
My response to:
"Even if you fat shame a skinny or normal weight person, the conversation may be overheard by an obese person. That obese person may in turn suffer mentally from fat shaming."
Obese women do not deserve to be loved, love is something which has to be earned. You have to respect other people to gain respect, so I don't care whether they suffer mentally. It is wrong for them to be happy about damaging the health of others due to overeating.
My response to his source: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com...
"perceived weight discrimination is potentially harmful to mental health regardless of weight"
When someone is fat and unhealthy, they will be depressed, perceived weight discrimination is associated with low self-esteem. It is natural and thus nothing should be done to change this. Someone who is depressed will naturally feel they are treated unfairly, and if they don't change their way of thinking it is harmful. Everyone has to deal with depression and anxiety though. Fat women should too!
My opponent's round three argument revolves around broken youtube links. My opponent round's four argument tries to question the legitimacy of a scholarly peer reviewed source.
Here's an example of how education helps "People are just drinking less and less soda.
There really isn't much mystery to it. Some of it probably has to do with the well-known awareness about sugar and its health affects. And some of it has to do with the rise of alternatives, like energy drinks." 
As you can see education or awareness of the detrimental effects of soda helps reduce soda intake.
Here's another source verifying that education is key to reducing obesity "The industry's decline comes amid several prominent efforts to reduce soda consumption, including New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg's attempt to limit soda sizes and first lady Michelle Obama's "Let's Move" program that encourages children to pass on soda. " 
The evidence is clear, my opponent has provided no evidence that fat shaming is effective at reducing obesity. Meanwhile I have provided evidence that fat shaming increases obesity. Not only that but I have provided a viable alternative of education.
Finally to illustrate the importance of education, diet soda does not help with obesity, in fact there is evidence that diet soda increases risk for obesity.
"Diet soda, it turns out, may not be the panacea for weight loss that we all thought — and many of us hoped — it was.
In fact, a Purdue University study has found that diet sodas may be linked to a number of health problems from obesity to diabetes to heart disease, just like their more sugary counterparts." 
Obesity is much more complicated then simply over eating and calories in versus calories out. Diet soda increasing risk for obesity proves that the idea of energy balance is only a small part of the equation.
I have checked all of my links and they work perfectly fine including my youtube links which show the irresponsible negative attitude fat women have.
No new arguments will be made during this final round, however I'd just like to point out that my opponent has cherry picked quotes from his round 4 sources probably to fool readers. When you read his sources e.g. his source 11 , and what its actual findings are, it is clear that efforts to reduce soda intake have resulted in a larger intake of energy drinks. And energy drinks may have adverse health effects! See his source 11 = http://www.cnbc.com...
"The soda decline moved in tandem with a rise in energy drink consumption last year. Monster Beverage volume rose 19.1 percent while Red Bull's surged 17 percent and sales of Rockstar jumped 8 percent despite concerns about adverse health effects from energy drinks" -(opponents source 11)
"Are diet sodas worse for you than regular sodas? I think that's the wrong question, said Swithers, who is also a member of Purdue's Ingestive Behavior Research Center. It's, 'What good are sodas for you in the first place?' "
-(opponents source 12)
I'll just try to sum up some of my points I've made now
Thanks for having this debate, hope you have enjoyed it too
The youtube links now work. No idea why they didn't work before. Ultimately Pro has failed to provide evidence that fat shaming does any good whatsoever. Meanwhile I have shown that fat shaming causes obese people to become depressed and more obese.
What both Pro and Con agree on.
Both Pro and Con agree that obesity and morbid obesity are unhealthy. We both seem to have the same goal to reduce obesity.
What Pro and Con disagree on.
Method of reducing obesity. Pro argues that fat shaming is the correct angle of attack. I argue that education is the correct angle of attack.
One issue that my opponent brought up is the idea of fat acceptance. I never seriously addressed the issue, because I know almost nothing about the subject. That somehow fat shaming will destroy fat acceptance. My opponent also implies that fat acceptance leads to obesity.
Yet, my opponent never shows the link between fat acceptance and obesity risk. Nor does my opponent provide evidence that fat shaming reduces fat acceptance.
My opponent's arguments are almost entirely speculative. My opponent implies that fat shaming is helpful, fat shaming reduces fat acceptance, and fat acceptance leads to obesity. Yet, fails to back up these claims with proof. Meanwhile I show that fat shaming causes greater obesity in already obese people.
Finally, I offer evidence that education helps reduce obesity.
"In 2007-2010, higher levels of education among the head of household resulted in lower rates of obesity among boys and girls 2-19 years of age. In households where the head of household had less than a high school education, 24 percent of boys and 22 percent of girls were obese. In households where the head had a bachelor’s degree or higher, obesity prevalence was 11 percent for males aged 2-19 years and 7 percent for females." 
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