The Instigator
artC
Pro (for)
Losing
65 Points
The Contender
advidiun
Con (against)
Winning
66 Points

My presidential candidate of choice MUST believe in evolution.

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 12/22/2007 Category: Politics
Updated: 6 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 2,008 times Debate No: 828
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (25)
Votes (41)

 

artC

Pro

When choosing a candidate to support, I first discard the ones who don't believe in evolution. If you believe the universe was created six thousand years ago, I can not possibly take you seriously.

I think it's important to vote for someone who believes AT LEAST in evolution. How can we have someone lead our country in a fair, logical and reasonable mannor when they don't use logic to come to a reasonable conclusion on the origin of our world?

I am not debating about a belief in god or the existence of a god.

I would really like to learn from this debate so if you don't have any really strong facts to bring to the table, or if you're not open-minded, don't accept this debate.
advidiun

Con

the asumption that any candidate who does not believe in evolution cannot be logical is not fair.perhaps not all people who do not believe in evolution belive the world was formed 6,000 years ago. you assume too much about people. your argument has too many broad ill-based generalizations.
Debate Round No. 1
artC

Pro

Okay, that's fair. You're right. My argument was broad and it did generalize.

I am speaking specifically of people who believe the world was formed six thousand years ago and that we popped up on the planet as we are today.

A person who believes this is not fit to be president in my opinion. As long as we all agree that it is a presidents job the represent the people and that the job should come before his/her personal beliefs.

I believe somone of the this opinion can not put aside their personal beliefs and represent the country fairly. I believe, and Prez Bush provide evidence, that someone who believes only what they read from the bible can not lead tis country well, or represent it's people fairly. A little over half of the country does believe we evolved and that our earth is about 4.5 billion years old.

The reason I made the comment about logic is because I don't understand how someone can take in all the scientific knowledge we have on this topic and still deny it all solely on the basis of their belief.
advidiun

Con

okay i understand better now. i still do not believe however that a candidate who did not believe in evolution could not be a good pres. this does not mean that it COULD NOT effect his presidency only that would not definitely.

PS. sry about the first argument after re reading it i realized it sounded a little too mean
Debate Round No. 2
artC

Pro

I still believe strongy that it will. Mitt Romney for instance just gave a speech, not about how his Mormon religion will NOT affect his presidentcy, but how the fact that it's a Christian religion WILL.

They seem to not have ay interest in saying at any point that their religion will be seperate from their decisions as president. Our own president got us into a war with a coutry most of the population couldn't locate on a map. He tricked us and it is because he thinks he has some bigger Christian purpose that no one else was aware of.

All the pentacostals are voting for someone based on faith, why is it unreasonable for me to vote based on belief as well? Especially when BY belief, happens to be one supported by the scientific community. All people look to science for answers but when there's one that rivals a 2,000 year old book, then it can't be true. I can't support someone of that mindset. If you can deny a world of scientists, most of whom are devouted to finding the truth, every day of their lives, then how can you be trusted to make a decision about war, or the world?

I guess this debate has evolved to include the denial of any scientific theory.

I hope I'm not coming off as offensive. Thank you for reconsidering your earlier statement. I found no offense in it.
advidiun

Con

If Bush's religious beliefs got in the way of his presidency that in no way means all other candidates would have the same problem. every president we've ever had has been christian and not every one of them has had a conflict.

many presidents we've had have been creationists.

-George Washington - Set an excellent standard for future presidents
-John Adams - wrote the federalist papers and fought for a U.S. declaration of independence
-James Madison - Father of the constitution, "The Great Comprimiser"
-Abraham Lincoln - Held our nation together in time of civil war
-John F. Kennedy - Advanced cause of civil rights in U.S., resolved many conflicts with soviet union (cuban missile crisis esp.)
-Ronald Reagan - financially rebuilt this country, restored faith in american political system
-George H.W. Bush - Bolstered economy, advanced the cause of freedom abroad.

all these creationists were great leaders who helped forge us into the great nation we are today. You can cannot argue that a creationist is unfit to preside over this country, because many have and many have done incredible things for this country.
Debate Round No. 3
25 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Novan_Leon 6 years ago
Novan_Leon
artC,

You got royally PWNED!!11 in advidiun's last post, to use a little "net lingo". How you can claim that creationist are illogical and make terrible leaders is beyond me and runs counter to two hundred years of evidence.
Posted by Yraelz 6 years ago
Yraelz
Going to have to vote for ArtC on content. I would have voted Con on the last round but it was all new points and no chance for Pro to defend.

Advice: Expound on points more.
Posted by artC 6 years ago
artC
daxitarian, did you read any of the debate? I already explained what believing in evolution has to do with being a good president.
Posted by arrivaltime 6 years ago
arrivaltime
Yeah and that's why we'd never elect an Atheist.
Posted by Daxitarian 6 years ago
Daxitarian
What does evolution have to do with being a good president? I would rather have a president who was wrong on evolution, as embarrassing as it might be, but right on policy issues than have someone with the most profound understanding of biology, yet can't grasp the concept of supply and demand. The founders wanted the candidate to be judge on their policy issues, not on other personnel beliefs. That's why there is no test about religion you have to take to run for public office.
Posted by artC 6 years ago
artC
I thought I made it clear that I was not debating against religion, although I would like to, I am not. You can be religious and belive in evolution at the same time, look the people running, I believe all the Democrats do and even some of the Republicans.

About atheists not having a central code of morals, just because they are not written, repeated over and over, and recited to us every Sunday does not mean they do not exist.

And just because it is not common knowledge that atheists are moral does not make it an excuse for ignorance. If you can not make an informed decision about an atheist because it isn't popular belief that we have morals, then you shouldn't be voting for anything.
Posted by Leonitus_Trujillo 6 years ago
Leonitus_Trujillo
For atheist morals are subjective and there is barely if any central code of morals, which would lead to distrust. Christians have a set of morals that anybody can read about-and if they don't follow those morals and call themselves Christians they are opening themselves to a lot of criticism. It's about knowing whats coming in the package.

Secondly most Americans are religious and Christians are the religious majority. If a President is to be elected in office he is suppose to represent the people. And historically he has at least in that regard because every single president has been from some protestant denomination or catholic(JFK).

But I think even Christians are fair enough to look at a persons political career and positions to make their decision. I think artC you are doing what many of us Christian's get accused of and that is voting based upon a candidates religious beliefs. Becuase you say the first thing you do is filter out any candidate who believes in creationism or an alternative to evolution.

How about we be fair minded and look at Hucakbee's record instead of just a hand motion one night. If your a logical person it doesn't mean your going to arrive to the same conclusion as another logical person. Why not instead look at how a person uses logical in his daily life to decide if he posses the ability to make logical decisions.

Everyone of us posses a bit of logic. When we are hungry we can deduce that we need to eat. We decide becuase in the past when our parents made us eat we weren't hungry anymore. So it's even hard to call someone completely illogical. Maybe the proper accusation would be to say that people use logic backwards to support their premise instead of using logic the other way and arriving to a conclusion.
Posted by artC 6 years ago
artC
No, I took it as an actual inquiry. Obama's a good man.
Posted by mv 6 years ago
mv
that's a powerful statement he made. and i hope you don't think i was being sarcastic when asking that question, i really didn't know if he believed in it or not.
Posted by artC 6 years ago
artC
In The Audacity of Hope, on page 10, Obama states, "I believe in evolution, scientific inquiry, and global warming; I believe in free speech, whether politically correct or politically incorrect, and I am suspicious of using government to impose anybody's religious beliefs---including my own---on nonbelievers."

Barack Obama is an openly Christian man, I believe he has real faith and not just the kind you need to get elected in this country, yet he does not deny science.
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Vote Placed by artC 5 years ago
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