The Instigator
RyozoTabikashi
Pro (for)
Losing
7 Points
The Contender
TUF
Con (against)
Winning
25 Points

Naruto is better than DragonBallz

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 8 votes the winner is...
TUF
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 4/23/2012 Category: Entertainment
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 10,660 times Debate No: 23093
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (3)
Votes (8)

 

RyozoTabikashi

Pro

first round is acceptance. i am going for naruto
TUF

Con


I accept your challenge! DragonBall Z being my favorite Anime cartoon saga, I feel I am pretty qualified! :D

Good Luck, friend!



Debate Round No. 1
RyozoTabikashi

Pro

i say Naruto is better than DragonBall Z because in Naruto they have a lot more action and a more diverse range of attacks. for example, whenever a fight starts you never know who will use what Jutsu, but in DragonBall Z its always Goku's Kamehameha wave or spirit bomb. no differential in attacks. i know Naruto uses Shadow Clones and Rasengan, but he had developed it and changed it greatly. same for Sasukes Chidori.
Next reason the villain's are a lot more powerful and more strategist more. for example, Pein. he didn't just charge into Konoha, he looked for Naruto and destroyed the village at the same time. for this reason he is different from Brolly and Frezia.
Next the good guys die and stay dead. Goku dies and come back to life over and over. In Naruto the only good guys to do this was Kakashi, (through Pein's change of heart,) The 1st and 2nd Hokage, (due to Orchimaru's dead soul Jutsu,) and Itachi, (due to Kabuto's dead soul Jutsu.)
TUF

Con



I thank my opponent for instigating this debate.

**********
FRAMEWORK
**********

1st: I will go over my opponents arguments.

2nd: I will make my own case against my opponent.

3rd: I will Rehash it all in a conclusion.




*****
REBUTTALS
*****

LIMITED ATTACKS

"I say Naruto is better than DragonBall Z because in Naruto they have a lot more action and a more diverse range of attacks. for example, whenever a fight starts you never know who will use what Jutsu, but in DragonBall Z its always Goku's Kamehameha wave or spirit bomb. "

First off I would like to make a list off all of Goku's Techniques.

Ki blast
Invisible Eye Blast
Destructo Disk
Kamehameha
Continuous kemeya
Solar Flare
Spirit Bomb
After image Technique
Dragonthrow
Full Nelson
Crazy Fist
Rock Paper N scissors
Hasshu-ken
Instant transmission
Kaio-Ken
Helicopter Tail
Blast Fist
Zanku Fist
Dragon Fist
Warp Kamehameha
Fusion Dance
Kaioken finish
Meteor Blast
Meteor Combination
Spirit Shot
Ki Sense
Telepathy
TeleKinesis
Energy barrier
Mimicry
Meteor Impact
Transform into Great Ape
SuperSayain transformation
Ascended sayain transformation
Super Saiyan 3 transformation
Super saiyan 4 transformation
Ultra super saiyan transformation
Full-Power Transformation

These are all the techniques used by Goku in the TV series. Limited? I think not.

http://dragonball.wikia.com...





Nnow let's look at naruto's move list.

Actually rather than moves, The characters in Naruto use styles of fighting.

Jutsu
Ninjutsu
Genjutsu
Taijutsu
Kekkei genkai
Fuuinjutsu
Senjutsu

http://en.wikipedia.org...(Naruto)

As you can see, The dragon ball Z attacks are definitely not limited. Let's keep in mind that the list I provided was Goku's list of attacks. There is still about 50 other characters with another hundred or so moves we could add to the list of many moves that are implemented in the Dragon ball Z saga.

POWERFUL VILLAINS

"Next reason the villain's are a lot more powerful and more strategist more. for example, Pein. he didn't just charge into Konoha, he looked for Naruto and destroyed the village at the same time. for this reason he is different from Brolly and Frezia."

First off I am mildly confused as to whether or not my opponent has seen the DragonBall Z saga in it's entirety.

The characters in Naruto are mere mortals. Mortals rely tactics, and strategy. When you have characters like Goku and Frieza, there is totally a different playing field.

When you have the two most powerful beings in the universe against each other, they rely on Full out attacks to destroy each other.

However this doesn't go to say that there are no tactics used within the Dragonball Z saga. Let us look at the fight with Frieza.

In the episode Embodiment of Fire (episode 91), Goku is badly damaged by Frieza. He is then thrown into a lake. Goku then has to use a tactic to fool Frieza while he has the chance. So he shoots a distraction kemeya wave from the lake, Frieza falls for it, and Goku attacks, taking advantage once again.
http://dragonball.wikia.com...

There are plenty of other Tactics used as well.

Vegeta also uses a tactic when he makes Krillin defeat him so he can gain a higher power level, only to have Dende come and heal him.
Immortality denied episode 87.

There are lists of other tactics used and implemented by the characters as well.

Anyways, the Villains are definitely powerful. It took about 40 episodes for Goku to finally defeat Frieza. Not one of the villains in Naruto were that Powerful.

Then Cell, and Buu. Each villain is just so much more powerful than the last.

Powerful characters definitely is not an issue.

SNOW WHITE SYNDROM

"Next the good guys die and stay dead. Goku dies and come back to life over and over. In Naruto the only good guys to do this was Kakashi, (through Pein's change of heart,) The 1st and 2nd Hokage, (due to Orchimaru's dead soul Jutsu,) and Itachi, (due to Kabuto's dead soul Jutsu.)"


My opponent now brings up that the characters in this series have a sense of snow white syndrom, as the main characters are brought back many times.
For those who know who don't know what that is, SWS is basically when a character doesn't have problems, and it carries on too much with only good things happening.
This is certainly not the case with the DBZ saga.
Sure characters can be brought back to life from the dead. But there is always catches. Goku had to run for miles on snake way, and train with King Kai for an entire year, before being let back. Also once you are let back, you are back for good. When you die the second time, the hero is bound to other place forever. Goku was brought back shortly in his human form, but only for the amount of 1 day. There are rules and restrictions that even he must follow. After defeating Buu, he was rewarded with more time on earth anyway.
http://movienewsmakers.blogspot.com...

The point is, even though he was brought back, it was always just in the nick of time, and after most of his friends have been defeated or killed. He is always forced with confronting the problems last minute.

Again, these aren't all humans, so can we really be surprised at them being able to live twice? These are supernatural beings, and humans who have learned to master and control the Ki. Even Videll is able to learn Ki, from Gohan, but holds no other powers. These are characters from other races around the universe, with unbelievable and great powers. But as is evidenced, they can always be defeated.

*****
MY CASE
*****
C1: Dragon ball Z keeps people's interest.

The show brings a new sense of empowerment to it's watchers. It's that same feeling that you get when you watch a movie with your favorite super hero in it. Naruto is a show based around mortal characters.
Dragon ball Z takes this a step beyond, though. When a character can fly, and send blasts of energy from their palms, and are impervious to most human things, you are confronted with a new taste of power and establish a better grounding of interest.

The show allows for people to live in the situation. They can imagine bigger and better. The show appeals to the audience mainly of testosterone filled boys. Action is what most thirst for, and Dragon ball z provides it, arguably better than any anime show in existence. The action is non-stop, and high calibre. It leaves the audience thirsting for more with each episode.

C2: Attachment to the characters.

The producers of the show Dragon ball Z (Toei Animation) had such success with the show because of the many elements they include in it. There is always a new twist, or plot to keep the audience's thirst quenched. They build and develop characters heavily in the show, so that attachment is not an issue. In Dragonball, we get to see Goku's life as he grows up, and the friends he encounters (krillin, Bulma, Roshi, etc). all of their characters are developed deeply as you see them grow up through life.
Gohan develops his character in the Z series, as he trains and becomes attached with Piccolo. Piccolo changes, as he is first a 'bad' character, but we get to see his morality change slowly throughout the episodes, until he is basically a full out good guy.

Same with Vegeta, though on an even more intensive level, as his character is Prideful, and arrogant, yet his sense of morality hardens.

Comparing to Naruto (trust me it has character development as well) but not nearly to the same level as those of the ones in Dragonball z.


CONCLUSION:

So I have refuted all of my opponents main point. I have proven that the moves in the Dragonball Z saga are seriously not limited, that there are powerful villains and tactics implemented and also that there is no snow white syndrom introduced in the series. I have also provided my own case proving that the dragonball Z saga carries a considerable amount of more interest than that of Naruto's. I feel I have both upheld my BOP, and added to the substance of my arguments. I hope all the views enjoy this!

Good luck to my opponent in the following round.
Debate Round No. 2
RyozoTabikashi

Pro

first i would like to rebuttal my opponent.

C1: Dragon ball Z keeps people's interest.

it does but so does Naruto. if you look at Naruto's ranking, it is within the top 3 of the most popular list. so as for keeping the readers attention, Naruto beats DragonBall Z. Also DragonBall Z is older, therefore it is getting less interesting to the older generation, (me being 19 see's this everyday,) and Naruto is a new thing that has become popular.

C2: Attachment to the characters.

really can't say much other than the fact that we have seen naruto through all of his hardships and lonlyness.

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

also let me now list naruto's moves if i may:
All Directions Shuriken
Big Ball Rasengan
Big Ball Spiralling Serial Zone Spheres (Manga only)
Clone Body Blow
Clone Spinning Heel Drop (Anime only)
Combination Transformation
Fire Release: Toad Oil Flame Bullet (Anime only)
Frog Kata
Frog Strike (Manga only)
Harem Technique
Mini-Rasenshuriken (Manga only)
Multiple Shadow Clone Technique
Negative Emotions Sensing
New Sexy Technique
One Thousand Years of Death
Pachinko Technique (Anime only)
Planetary Rasengan (Manga only)
Rasengan
Sage Art: Big Ball Rasengan
Sage Art: Many Ultra-Big Ball Spiralling Serial Spheres
Sage Art: Ultra-Big Ball Rasengan
Sage Mode
Sage Technique: Spiralling Serial Spheres
Sexy Technique
Shadow Clone Technique
Shadow Shuriken Technique
Spiralling Absorption Sphere (Manga only)
Spiralling Strife Spheres (Manga only)
Summoning Technique (Toads)
Summoning: Food Cart Destroyer Technique (Manga only)
Tailed Beast Ball (Manga only)
Tailed Beast Chakra Arms
Tailed Beast Rasengan (Manga only)
Tailed Beast Sonic Roar
Tailed Beast Sonic Roar
Torii Seal
Twin Rasengan (Manga only)
Typhoon Water Vortex Technique
Ultra-Big Ball Rasengan
Ultra-Many Spiralling Serial Spheres
Uzumaki Formation (Anime only)
Uzumaki Naruto Combo
Uzumaki Naruto Two Thousand Combo
Wind Release: Rasengan
Wind Release: Rasenshuriken
Wind Release: Toad Gun (Anime only)
Wind Release: Toad Oil Bullet (Anime only)
Wind Release: Toad Oil Flame Bullet (Anime only)

[hide]Tools

F��ma Shuriken
Hidden Kunai Mechanism
Scalpel (Anime only)
Scroll of Seals
Shadow Clone Summoning Scroll

.....and for the sake of my argument....

Amaterasu
Binding Snake Glare Spell
Blaze Release Magatama (Manga only)
Blaze Release: Kagutsuchi
Body Flame Technique
Body Shedding
Chidori
Chidori Current
Chidori Senbon
Chidori Sharp Spear
Cursed Seal of Heaven
Demonic Illusion: Shackling Stakes Technique
Fire Release: Dragon Fire Technique
Fire Release: Great Dragon Fire Technique
Fire Release: Great Fireball Technique
Fire Release: Phoenix Sage Fire Technique
Hidden Shadow Snake Hands
Kirin
Lion Combo
Manipulated Shuriken Technique
Manipulating Windmill Triple Blades
Pachinko Technique (Anime only)
Peregrine Falcon Drop (Anime only)
Shadow Shuriken Technique
Shadow of the Dancing Leaf
Shield of Black Flames
Strong Fist
Summoning Technique (Hawks, Snakes)
Summoning: Lightning Flash Blade Creation
Susanoo
Susanoo Genjutsu
Sword of Kusanagi: Chidori Katana
Tsukuyomi

so as you can see Naruto has a much more diverse range of attacks, just by using only two of the many characters. so if i may as to be so bold, i believe that Nauruto is more modern age, more better, and more popular than DragonBall Z
TUF

Con


*****
FRAMEWORK
*****

Same as last time.

I will go over rebuttals, then go over my case, before wrapping it up in the conclusion.



*****
REBUTTALS
*****
LIMITED ATTACKS

Oh wait a second... My opponent didn't refute ANY of the points he originally made. Interesting. Looks like he just made a list of attacks that are made by his characters. But if I am not mistaken, that wasn't the issue. The issue was whether or not dragon ball z specifically had more than just the moves that Pro stated it did.

So please EXTEND all arguments made by the Pro originally.

POWERFUL VILLAINS

All arguments dropped, please extend.

SNOW WHITE SYNDROM

All Arguments Dropped, please extend.



*****
MY CASE
*****

C1: Dragon ball Z keeps people's interest.

"it does but so does Naruto. if you look at Naruto's ranking, it is within the top 3 of the most popular list. so as for keeping the readers attention, Naruto beats DragonBall Z. Also DragonBall Z is older, therefore it is getting less interesting to the older generation, (me being 19 sees this everyday,) and Naruto is a new thing that has become popular."

So since you did not pull up a source for this, I took it upon myself do the research to see if you claim was true.

DragonBall Z got an 8.8 viewer rating on IMDB With 19,337 raters, 102 reviews, and 12 paid critics.

http://www.imdb.com...

Now let's look at Naruto.

Naruto got a 7.9 viewer rating on IMDB from 12,317, with 85 reviews, and 10 paid critics.

http://www.imdb.com...

I think it is safe to say that dragon ball Zs Rating are considerably better given the statistics.

C2: Attachment to characters

"really can't say much other than the fact that we have seen naruto through all of his hardships and loneliness."

This is literally all my opponent said in response to my contention.

So we are still left with the fact that characters in this show are built up from over 2-4 hundred episodes. These characters all play major parts in the dragon ball Z saga. The character build up in Naruto does not even come close to this. Hardships and loneliness? The characters in Dragonball Z have to go through hard ships practically all the time as they are on the brink of defeat with only strands of hope left with each new villain.

They rely on each other every bit as much, and viewers are able to keep more interest knowing this because they know literally everything about each one of these characters and their past. When the hero's take damage, the viewers feel it as well. Dragonball Z thus is able to attach itself to the emotional Outlet for the characters as well.


*****
CONCLUSION
*****

To Conclude, I will give voters.

I believe I should win this debate for the following reasons.

1. My opponent has dropped every single one of the rebuttals made against his case.

2. My opponent has barely made an attack on any of my contentions.

3. My opponent has not provided any sources for his claims, while I have provided several. I have thus upheld the BOP, while the instigator of the debate has not.


Please Vote CON!

Thankyou.
Debate Round No. 3
RyozoTabikashi

Pro

What i meant was you had a point in Dragon ball Z building attachments to the character. that is true. as for the good guy coming to life. Even if i dd rebuttal it my point still stands. Goku the main character always comes back to life after or before every big fight. it doesn't happen i Naruto. Just saying.

Next, as for the powerful villain's. come on, i just meant more strategist more than Dragon ball Z's. Dragon-ball Z villain;s rush in, because they are too cocky, Naruto gets the schematics before starting a fight.

At www.mangafox.com, Naruto is he top read manga, also at www.mangareader.net.

Now as for his attacks, Goku only uses Instant Transmission, Kamehameha wave, Ki blast, Spirit Bomb, and punches in the newer series.

Therefore Naruto is still a better show than Dragon ball Z.

here is what some people had to say about the shows:
Which is the better series for you?

Horvath:
"I personally think Naruto. I think it's much more entertaining and has a deeper plot. Also, when a timeskip occurs, you can see it.

At the start of Shippuden, you observe how everyone's changed outwardly and inwardly. Post Android-Training, everyone looks the same, albeit stronger.

The character roster is also superior in Naruto in my opinion. Characters like Neji and Kakashi are much more relatable to the viewer than Vegeta or Goku, which I find to be nice because the viewer can become more engaged into the character development and story."

Copy_Ninja:

"Yeah, I prefer Naruto as well. Partly because DBZ is finished and i've seen the whole thing many times, while Naruto is still ongoing. It's also partly because there's a bit more of a story to it. DB/Z just kind of drifts from one villain to next. Naruto had an overarching story, with each new major villain linking to the last until finally revealing a main guy who's behind it all. There's also the fact of the younger characters, the more heartfelt moments, the fact that there are multiple characters who can make a difference. I think I also prefer Naruto's drawing style as well."

Cal:

"Naruto (imo) was better because of the hardships in my opinion. I like a shounen anime/manga with tear jerking moments as well as awesome fights and I saw that from episode 1 of Naruto, and still see it today.

Plus in Naruto everyone is useful, dbz gets to where it's all about PL and who has a more speed etc. DB was adventure, DBZ was PL, Naruto is in the middle of that to me.

That being said I'm nowhere near as hardcore as 99% of people are on this board when it comes to db/z/gt."
http://dbzf.co.uk...
Vote Pro!!!!1
TUF

Con

I am going to go over this argument piece by piece.

"What i meant was you had a point in Dragon ball Z building attachments to the character. that is true. as for the good guy coming to life. Even if i dd rebuttal it my point still stands. Goku the main character always comes back to life after or before every big fight. it doesn't happen i Naruto. Just saying."

And you have failed to point out to me where this is a bad thing. So you are saying that because the protagonist of the series fights the bad guys even after death, that the show is crappier than Naruto? What you needed to do was prove to me how this was a bad thing. You have not done that. Thus this point just floats around not really meaning anything.

"Next, as for the powerful villain's. come on, i just meant more strategist more than Dragon ball Z's. Dragon-ball Z villain;s rush in, because they are too cocky, Naruto gets the schematics before starting a fight."

I have addressed this. What does strategy matter when Both fighters can destroy planets with the raising of a finger? Strategy is a human tactic. These characters in dragonball Z are not human. They give the viewers exactly what they want; Action.

Now as for his attacks, Goku only uses Instant Transmission, Kamehameha wave, Ki blast, Spirit Bomb, and punches in the newer series.

Really this argument again? See above list.

Next you go on to provide a list of people who liked the show naruto better.

First of all, as admitted to in your quote, these people are die hard naruto fans who don't know nearly as much about Dragonball Z.

"That being said I'm nowhere near as hardcore as 99% of people are on this board when it comes to db/z/gt."

So these quoted are from people who have not actively watched dragonball Z nearly enough as they had Naruto. Thus this is mildly irrelevant.



*****
CONCLUSION
*****


Along with the many dropped arguments, and the poorly structured rebuttals, the conduct point should be easy on this debate. Also if you haven't noticed by now, my opponents spelling and grammar was rather poor as well, so there is another point. Sources were used mainly by me, until the last round, where my opponent post some random source with a million Japanese posts in it that does not make sense. And finally the convincing arguments point I feel is mine as well. My opponent has not upheld his BOP. He has not proven that NARUTO is better the DBZ. I have shown that statistics on DBZ are much higher than those of Naruto, and that DBZ is much better in it's character development and storyline. I have successfully refuted my opponents points, while he has dropped several of mine; the one he did bring back up in the last rounds, not even really being arguments. Just failed attempts at least trying to touch on them. Thus for all the reasons explained in this debate, I strongly urge that you vote in favor of the CON.

Thankyou.
Debate Round No. 4
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by Hunter_X_Hunter_Ben 3 years ago
Hunter_X_Hunter_Ben
Clearly Pro doesn't understand the meaning of diversity... Look at that attack techniques list. And repeating the same technique doesn't count either, for example Rasengan and Wind Style: Rasengan...
Posted by renji_abarai 4 years ago
renji_abarai
@kyro, I like Dragon Ball Z too -_-. I have watched a bunch of Anime and Dragon Ball Z is my second favorite and Naruto is my fourth
Posted by kyro90 4 years ago
kyro90
LOL
Im not going to vote for this cause I dont vote on debates between friends but this was a pretty obvious debate.
8 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 8 records.
Vote Placed by SuperRobotWars 4 years ago
SuperRobotWars
RyozoTabikashiTUFTied
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro's grammar was poor and dropped several arguments. Con FTW.
Vote Placed by kyro90 4 years ago
kyro90
RyozoTabikashiTUFTied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: Renji's reason is because he likes Naruto. Horrible Troll voting.
Vote Placed by imabench 4 years ago
imabench
RyozoTabikashiTUFTied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: The only reasons pro says naruto is better is because of more attacks and that people who die stay dead.... That isnt nearly enough to justify why one is "better" than the other at all menaing pro in my opinion did not meet his burden of proof. Arguments to the con
Vote Placed by royalpaladin 4 years ago
royalpaladin
RyozoTabikashiTUFTied
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Total points awarded:34 
Reasons for voting decision: Countering Renji.
Vote Placed by renji_abarai 4 years ago
renji_abarai
RyozoTabikashiTUFTied
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Total points awarded:43 
Reasons for voting decision: obvious reasons
Vote Placed by Multi_Pyrocytophage 4 years ago
Multi_Pyrocytophage
RyozoTabikashiTUFTied
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: Con effectively rebutted Pro's arguments more, and Pro did not spell very well in some cases.
Vote Placed by 1dustpelt 4 years ago
1dustpelt
RyozoTabikashiTUFTied
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Reasons for voting decision: I do not know what a Naruto or a Dragon Ball is, but all I know is Pro spelled terrible.
Vote Placed by 16kadams 4 years ago
16kadams
RyozoTabikashiTUFTied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: All of pros points where limited and refuted, TUF showed dragonballZ is not limited etc etc. TUF wins