The Instigator
JohnnyC
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
LucaliCole
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

Nazism is racism

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/11/2013 Category: Politics
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,209 times Debate No: 28889
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (5)
Votes (0)

 

JohnnyC

Pro

Nazism is defined as "the ideology and practice of the Nazis, especially the policy of racist nationalism, national expansion, and state control of the economy." I believe that the Nazis unfairly discriminated against disadvantaged groups (Jews, homosexuals, handicapped etc.) in 1930-40s Germany and neo-Nazis still do. Being a Nazi means that one is fascist, authoritarian, racist and nationalist. My belief is based on what I have seen of Nazism from it's inception to the modern day.

We don't need to have certain rounds for different things - let's just have an ongoing debate until we get to round 5 where we will present our overall final argument.
LucaliCole

Con

First and foremost, I would like to point out that the term, "Nazi," has taken on many different forms since the days of Adolph Hitler, mostly within prison gangs. To date, there are the Nazi Lowriders, the Aryan Brotherhood, and the Skinheads. While these groups have fronted as white-supremacists, most sources would tell you that they are -in fact- drug trafficking organizations with little regard for issues regarding race. creed, religion, or anything besides loyalty to said gang. With that said, I believe that the term, "Nazi," has not only evolved, but is also alive and well in the form of a new definition.

With that said. I accept this debate, and hope to reach a common understanding of the term, "Nazi," for the modern era. May the best debater win.
Debate Round No. 1
JohnnyC

Pro

All of the forms of modern day Nazism that you have mentioned fall under neo-Nazism. Neo-Nazism borrows elements from Nazi doctrine, including militant nationalism, racism, xenophobia, homophobia and antisemitism.

Racism is defined as "a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to rule others." The Nazi doctrine is based on religious and national superiority. The term Nazi may have brought on new ideas over time but it is still based around the ideology of hatred and racism. All of these Nazi groups now would still be characterized as racist.
LucaliCole

Con

I acted partly out of hubris in accepting this debate (partly because I was rather drunk at the time), only to realize that I was about to debate a completely different point! What you are arguing is that Nazism is -in essence racism- is and is not true. What I was about to argue was that many of those who classify themselves as Nazis are not necessarily racists, on account of the fact that they do not necessarily adhere to the ideologies of Nazism. For example, one of the founding members and leaders of the Aryan Brotherhood, Michael Thompson, was primarily Native American; he and other, "higher up," members of the group have admitted that the group only pretended to be white supremacists in order to distract from the fact that they were actually a drug smuggling syndicate. This is why I was ready to claim that not all, "Nazis" are necessarily racist.

However, what you have claimed is that Nazism is racism. This is fairly debatable, but it would get very boring very quickly. I have the answer already. Nazism is a sufficient condition for racism, but not a necessary one: i.e if you subscribe to Nazism, then you are a racist. But if you are a racist, then that doesn't mean that you subscribe to Nazism. I think this is what you meant anyways, so how about we just let this one slide.

Perhaps we should have talked about this before debating. I really can't argue against you at this point. So I ask that you be a gentleman and let us call it a draw. I have a feeling that I wasn't what you were looking for, and you weren't what I was looking for. Sound good?
Debate Round No. 2
JohnnyC

Pro

I understand that you were talking about people who claim to be Nazis rather than the ideology of Nazism. If you can no longer debate because of this then I don't mind if we both forfeit the rest of our rounds.
LucaliCole

Con

LucaliCole forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
JohnnyC

Pro

JohnnyC forfeited this round.
LucaliCole

Con

LucaliCole forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
JohnnyC

Pro

JohnnyC forfeited this round.
LucaliCole

Con

LucaliCole forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
5 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Posted by LucaliCole 3 years ago
LucaliCole
To follow up: I was talking about guys who call themselves, "Nazis," which is not the same as, "Nazism." Are we clear on this?
Posted by JohnnyC 3 years ago
JohnnyC
I was thinking that someone might argue that either the racism is justified or that it is not the core belief.
Posted by Zaradi 3 years ago
Zaradi
It's kinda hard to debate nazism when you define it as racism....
Posted by JohnnyC 3 years ago
JohnnyC
I had originally challenged someone who claimed to be a Nazi to this debate but they didn't accept it so I made it public.
Posted by bladerunner060 3 years ago
bladerunner060
Is "Nazism isn't racist" really something people think?
No votes have been placed for this debate.