The Instigator
esisCOA
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
aliasam1337
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

New York City should annex Nassau and Suffolk Counties.

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/5/2012 Category: Society
Updated: 5 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,178 times Debate No: 20229
Debate Rounds (5)
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esisCOA

Pro

first round acceptance and parameters.

Definitions - all words to be defined as they are in the Websters Dictionary.

no funny business such as changing variables or any of that, I'm looking for a good honest debate.
aliasam1337

Con

I accept this debate as the Con side. I assume by annex you mean making a 6th and 7th borough and not combining the two boroughs into one, declaring them non-boroughs, or dissolving Nassau into Queens for instance. Good luck!
Debate Round No. 1
esisCOA

Pro

It is my stance that both counties (Nassau and Suffolk) should be annexed by The City of New York, to become the 6th and 7th boros.

General Point - NYC should annex both counties as it would expand and further diversify an already great city, as well as increasing NYC's economic abilities. For Nassau and Suffolk it would remove the unorganized, haphazard individualized ruling bodies that favor themselves and would add professional unified management which would in turn save each county a lot of money, which can then be directed back into the city to serve greater purposes.

Also, by annexing these counties, the housing market in NYC would be affected in very positive ways. (to be outlined below)

Nassau county has been named the richest county in New York State, per capita, as well as the 11th richest county in America, per capita.[1] [2] It also has one of the highest tax rates, which for a long time has taken away from the desirability to live their from upper class NYC residents. If NYC annexed Nassau all the tax laws would be changed to match NYC's allowing for the desirability to live there to increase thus increasing land values. Once this has happened the housing market in the original five boros would open up and values would go down allowing for more affordable and low income housing, and allowing for people to live closer to their jobs with out the higher prices. This would also help the poor and low income families in Nassau as the rents in low income areas would go down due to tax's not being as high as they were.

Suffolk County, with proper management Suffolk county could become one of NYC's premier tourist spots bringing in much needed extra income as well as providing a lot of extra money for the City of New York in the long term via investments in infrastructure. This would be positive for both the city and the county. Also the change in ruling bodies would allow for changes to better public services, and allow the wages to be lowered, as Suffolk County has the highest paid public positions in America. I believe a lot of the counties money is wasted this way, and a unified ruling body would change that, bringing much needed money into the economic system.

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org...
[2]http://en.wikipedia.org...

due to time constraints I posted as much as I could, and will elaborate, bring up new points and do rebuttals in the next round, con is free to do the same.
aliasam1337

Con

1) Long Island is already the most racially segregated suburbs in America.(1) There are two scenarios. The annexation causes lower taxes as you stated, but leads to an increase in population density as well as "undesirables" or people from lower classes. A lot of people moved to LI for the exact reason of getting away from the diversity and crime of NYC. A lot if people simply wouldn't appreciate the possible depreciation of their neighborhood. Not to mention the 70s and 80s show that white flight can lead to race riots. The other scenario is the lowering of property taxes leads to real estate increases to NYC levels, thus leaving Nassau and Suffolk as mostly unattainable and continuously the most segregated suburbs in the U.S. The housing prices of the original five boros will not decrease because people will still not want to live all the way in Long Island, especially ones without cars, or money for the LIRR fares which would no doubt increase (my second point explains that). New York has enough of a class divide as is.

2) Adding Long Island would mean stretching an already thin police and fire department. Not to mention the creation of new jurisdictions and precincts which would also cost a lot of taxpayer money. Also, this isnt like back in the day when suburbs need to join cities in order to enjoy sewage systems, water, electricity, paved roads, and public universities. Long Island already has all of those. Building a subway system reaching all of Long Island is improbable, as not even Staten Island or Eastern Queens has subway service. The current LIRR system would also implode onto itself with the increase in customers and service. It is too small and lacks enough rail links. MTA bus also just cut numerous bus routes and although NICE picked them up, it is obvious that transport is expensive and lacking in "wealthy" Long Island. New York City doesn't need these problems and the taxpayers in today's failing economy will be unlikely to be willing to pay for this, especially non-LI residents. Building new rail links is an idea but would once again cost a lot of taxpayer money, and also probably increase the already expensive LIRR fares. More trains and quicker waiting times in between them would also have to be done to compensate for the increase in population and commuters. The new projects currently in construction are raising fares as we speak by 2013 (6). More projects like this would already leave Long Island with more accessibility to NYC without being part of it .The amount of maintenance would also increase leading to even more higher fares as we will have to pay more MTA employees, transit cops and construction workers. Therefore between point and two, the disadvantages outweigh the advantages to an increase in population density, costs, and territory that annexation would bring

3) New York City is currently the greatest or one of the greatest cities in the world. Why fix something that isn't broken. Most of Long Island excluding some of the Nassau border towns look nothing like NYC. It'd ruin the charm and feel of New York City, which admittedly is more of a personal reason but a reason that a lot of city people would probably agree with. Long Island losing its status as suburbs, would keep the kind of people from coming and make many people leave who basically financially sustain these counties.

4) Long Island cops are some of the highest paid in the world. Suffolk being the highest, with Nassau close behind. (2)(3)(4) Long Island teachers are some of the highest paid in the nation. These people would make substantially less working for the city, and I doubt they'd be too happy about that. The public schools are also some of the best in the nation WITHOUT NYC funding(5). High pay may and difference in city life as well as the segregation may be the reason for this. Annexing Long Island into NYC may destroy this.

Long Island could sustain itself and lessen the "brain drain" to NYC and stop the dependency on NYC for jobs if they built up their infrastructure and continued their commitment to huge projects such as the new Nassau Colliseum. Building more hospitals, and more buildings and basically jumpstarting its own economy would maintain Long Islanders way of life and keep more people there. NYC will not suffer because it will still recieve the influx of young Long Islanders who want to live the city life as well as the usual migrants and immigrants from all over the country and world. Long Island, especially Nassau County is going bankrupt(5), adding that burden to NYC would not benefit either party. Make Long Island more like NYC and keep its flavor and way of life, but don't make it become NYC.

(1) http://www.nytimes.com...
(2) http://online.wsj.com...
(3) http://www.nypost.com...
(4) http://jerseyprogressivenews.blogspot.com....
(5) http://www.nypost.com...
(6) http://www.longislandpress.com...
Debate Round No. 2
esisCOA

Pro

esisCOA forfeited this round.
aliasam1337

Con

My argument stands.
Debate Round No. 3
esisCOA

Pro

esisCOA forfeited this round.
aliasam1337

Con

Opponent has deleted his account.
Debate Round No. 4
esisCOA

Pro

esisCOA forfeited this round.
aliasam1337

Con

...Vote Con!
Debate Round No. 5
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