The Instigator
KingYosef
Pro (for)
Losing
6 Points
The Contender
Raisor
Con (against)
Winning
46 Points

"Nothing I see means anything"

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/1/2008 Category: Religion
Updated: 9 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 1,524 times Debate No: 1222
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (1)
Votes (17)

 

KingYosef

Pro

One of the greatest philsopihcal Debates that has been going on since the beginning of philosophy. Appearance vs. Reality.

You may debate this topic from one of two perspectives:

1) Religiously

2) Philosophically

It will be four rounds.

The idea is simple, Our perception of the world is based on our senses. Our senses tell our brain what we see, smell, taste, feel, and hear. All of this is done by, in universal terms, an abstract array of molecules working together in alien fashion. What we see is what this form of molecule compostion interperts, not what is really there.

i am in a rush so sorry for not spell checking
Raisor

Con

In order for me to win this round, I must demonstrate that that the statement "nothing I see means anything" is false.

Unfortunately, this is a poorly worded resolution, so I will make the following assumptions about the resolution:

1)The "I" is meant to be a generalization of any individual and not a specific referent to KingYosef.
2)The verb "see" is meant to represent all the senses and not just the particular sense of sight

These assumptions are fair and make sense. Furthermore, I have the right to make theses assumptions because KingYosef created the resolution and did not clarify his exact intent, leaving me with muddy water. I have thus taken the initiative to clear the water by defining the terms. KingYosef has no right to object to these assumptions as he had the opportunity to be clear in his intent but instead created a confusing resolution.

Thus the clarified topic of debate can be understood to mean, "Human perception of the world does not mean anything."

Now I am left to interpret what KingYosef intended when he uses the term "means."

In this context, "means" could signify two things.
1)signification, the conveying of information
2)to have importance or value (as in "the poem means a lot to me)

I will demonstrate that human perception meets both interpretations. However, in order to win this debate I only need to show that human perception meets ONE of these interpretations, for reasons of competitive equity. It would be unfair for KingYosef to claim that I must prove my point with relation to a specific interpretation, because he could simply choose whichever definition my argument was weaker on or an entirely new definition I didn't address, making my response a waste of time. Disallowing the option for me to win on either interpretation would be punishing me for KingYosef's lack of clarity.

Now, my arguments:

1)i. Human perception at least lets us know that we exist. Through input from our senses, we are aware of ourselves. Perception gives us an idea of "self." It allows us to see the apparent distinction between "something else" and "myself," the receiver of information. Perceptions allow us to understand that we are a "perceiver," and in that way we understand the self.

ii. While what is perceived may be necessarily different than what exists in the outside world, that does not mean that perceptions cannot convey any information at all. For instance, when we stand near a fire, we feel warmth. While what we perceive is fundamentally different from the actual chemical reactions and energy transfers occurring because of the fire, our perceptions still convey the information that energy is being released. On an even more primitive level, our perceptions of pain give us the information that something is damaging our bodies. Even though pain is a perception totally unrelated to "the way reality is," it still conveys information, and thus has meaning.

2)Human perception has meaning to many people. For anyone who has a favorite poem, painting, or song, perception means something. The beauty of a sunset means something to a transcendentalist that sees it. Billions of people have strong emotional attachments to their senses-indication that "seeing" has meaning to these people.
Debate Round No. 1
KingYosef

Pro

Raisor, I see my haste in creating this argument has lead to confusion, which is my fault. The Reason the topic is in parentheses is because it is the title of a book which reviews Sigmund Freud's application of quantum physics in relation to reality. I meant "means" as value in relation to trying to interpret what reality is. I do agree it was my fault. I originally created this debate to see others perspectives, and hopefully learn from that. clearly though winning seems more important to you, so since this was my fault, I will forfeit the rest of the rounds and essentially hand you the win. I will also recreate the argument with a more sound resolution.
Raisor

Con

Its not so much that winning is more important as an issue of enjoying the strategic aspect of argumentation.

But yes, my main goal in a debate is to win.
Debate Round No. 2
KingYosef

Pro

KingYosef forfeited this round.
Raisor

Con

Vote Con because Pro forfeitted......

100 characters........

and.........................done.
Debate Round No. 3
KingYosef

Pro

KingYosef forfeited this round.
Raisor

Con

My opponent conceded the debate, so you should vote for me.

Thank you for your time. I appreciate your vote.
Debate Round No. 4
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
Posted by mmadderom 9 years ago
mmadderom
Pro's entire argument is "Perception=personal reality".

Well, no kidding.

Yet in an attempt to sound intelligent he completely went off from his main argument then refused to argue at all.

Vote con.
17 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Vote Placed by U.n 11 months ago
U.n
KingYosefRaisorTied
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Reasons for voting decision: Forfeiture.
Vote Placed by 9spaceking 2 years ago
9spaceking
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Reasons for voting decision: ff
Vote Placed by Crede 5 years ago
Crede
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Reasons for voting decision: Um yeah...pretty obvious on this one. More of a lesson on resolution structure than anything else. Good job Raisor.
Vote Placed by LakevilleNorthJT 8 years ago
LakevilleNorthJT
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Vote Placed by solo 9 years ago
solo
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Vote Placed by hark 9 years ago
hark
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Vote Placed by sheepgotoheaven 9 years ago
sheepgotoheaven
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Vote Placed by beem0r 9 years ago
beem0r
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Vote Placed by johnwooding1 9 years ago
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Vote Placed by SportsGuru 9 years ago
SportsGuru
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