The Instigator
631300
Con (against)
Losing
3 Points
The Contender
bsh1
Pro (for)
Winning
8 Points

Obama is a quality President.

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 3 votes the winner is...
bsh1
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 9/9/2013 Category: Politics
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 784 times Debate No: 37531
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (4)
Votes (3)

 

631300

Con

First round acceptance, second round argument, third round rebuttal, fourth round closing. This is just a fun debate, I don't think that Obama is good at all, what is your opinion?
bsh1

Pro

I'm not Obama's biggest fan; however, I do think he's done a relatively good job. I accept this debate!
Debate Round No. 1
631300

Con

We see it all through history, Presidents that come into the White House and genuinely want to change the world. I believe that Mr. Obama had wondrous intentions when he entered office, the starry-eyed junior senator, but perhaps his intentions were to wondrous. He promised a 5% pecrcent unemployment rate, at it is currently at 7.3%, according to the Department of Labor Statistics. This is from CBS Washington:

WASHINGTON (CBSDC/AP) " Even though much has changed the past four years, President Barack Obama begins his second term with one thing that hasn"t: the unemployment rate.

When Obama first took office in January 2009, the unemployment rate was 7.8 percent. Today the unemployment rate is once again at 7.8 percent.

The unemployment rate rose as high as 10 percent during Obama"s first term before falling back down to 7.8 percent last November.

Unemployment rates fell in less than half of U.S. states last month, as steady but slow hiring is making only gradual improvement in the job market.

Lobbyists Displeased With Obama"s "Vilification" Of Them

The Labor Department said Friday that rates fell in 22 states in December and rose in 16. They were unchanged in 12.

The department"s monthly report also shows that steady hiring nationwide in the past two years has lowered the unemployment rate in many parts of the country. The rate is now below 7 percent in 25 states. And some of the states hardest hit in the recession have seen solid gains.

Obama has prepared a second inaugural address that broadly lays out his vision for the country"s future, setting the stage for looming debates over taxes, guns, immigration and other issues while leaving the details for another day.

The speech, slated right after Obama takes an oath to "faithfully execute the office of the president of the United States" Monday on the Capitol"s west front, includes no new policy, aides say. Rather, the president plans to use the moment as it traditionally has been in most of the 56 previous inaugurations " to talk about founding American values and their importance to the country"s success today.

He promised us Hope and Change, but he never said it would be for the worse. Obama had great potential when he entered office, he overcame many obstacles to get there, but when it came down to it, he just wasn't ready. Now that he is entrenched he believes that he is doing right for the country because he doesn't go out and look at the damage he's causing, and his his palace he's surrounded by "Yes Men" they agree with him and never tell him if something isn't right. That is why I think that Obama is ONE OF the worst president's in history.
bsh1

Pro

I have no intention of arguing that Obama was an amazing President, but he was a "quality" President. I thank Con once again for this debate.

C1: Economy

http://prideinutah.com...

http://thegatewaypundit.com...

Obama helped to stem the downward spiral of the economy and to begin to manage federal spending. He introduced wall street reform, brought 2 million jobs back to the economy, and passed the credit card bill of rights.

C2: Equality

Obama pushed for and passed the Lilly Ledbetter fair pair act, passed the Matthew Shepard Act, and repealed Don't Ask/Don't Tell. Now gays, women, and the disabled will be better treated.

C3: Foreign Policy

No troops in Iraq. Withdrawal from Afghanistan. Better relations with most of the world. Osama's dead.

I'm sorry for the brevity of my response. My rebuttal will be far more thorough.
Debate Round No. 2
631300

Con

My opponent makes some very good points, but I would like to point out many flaws in his thinking.
First: I would argue that his handling of the economy is almost a matter of opinion. From my point of view, he is doing anything but stemming the downward spiral of the economy, in many different aspects he is pushing it down farther. His jobs reports are anything but acceptable. My source is "http://www.speaker.gov...;.

Lowest Labor Force Participation Since 1978. [T]he participation rate -- the share of working-age Americans who either have a job or are looking for one -- dropped to its lowest level since August 1978. (Reuters, 9/6/13).

866,000 Out-of-Work Americans Given Up Looking for a Job. Fridays report showed there were 866,000 out-of-work people who have given up looking for a job, nearly the same number as a year ago. (The Wall Street Journal, 9/6/13)

No Change in the Proportion of Working Americans. The proportion of the U.S. population that had a job in August was 58.6 percent. Six months earlier, the number was a whopping " wait for it " 58.6 percent. The year is nearly three-quarters over, and the economy isn't growing fast enough to put a higher proportion of its citizens back to work. (The Washington Post, 9/6/13)

As for his federal spending, it is currently at 24 percent of the GDP, which is more than the last five presidents ever spent. and with a 16 trillion dollar debt that is steadily rising every second. If that is a regulated, balanced economy, then Obama is not a liberal.

As to Equality, you have no arguments here.

But, you do have one in Foreign Policy. Although the withdrawal of troops was a good step, that means very little in Obama's horrid policies. In terms of relations with other countries, he is doing anything but a good job. China still owns us, and Russia is starting to get a big head and we can see that if Obama doesn't get his head out of his backside than we'll have another problem on our hands, I can see Russia becoming the superpower if we don't do something.

Thank you to the Pro for participating in this debate.
bsh1

Pro

I'll rebut Con and then go on to defend my own case.

CON's CASE

Under Obama's administration, raw unemployment has dropped, as can be seen in my first contention. But, I also think that the economic situation would have been far better had the GOP been more cooperative. The House Republicans have held in excess of 40 votes to repeal ObamaCare, they have held the debt ceiling hostage (arguably causing our Moody's downgrade), and have refused to pass a comprehensive jobs bill. [1,2, and 3]

Con puts the blame squarely on Obama's shoulders for the 7.8% unemployment rate; yet, I don't think we can blame the President for this, when he's stymied by the right at every turn. Ultimately, when we ask whether we're better off, economically speaking, we are--housing markets are improving, [4] as is our GDP.

Con also asserts that unemployment was as high as 10% during Obama's first term--please refer to the chart I provided in my last speech. This shows that, yes, unemployment numbers were dismal when Obama assumed office, but that was because he inherited a bad situation, not because he made it worse. To blame him for what he inherited is ridiculous--it's not his fault.

Con also points out that hiring has improved in may states--this just makes the case for Obama.

I think Obama's inaugural address did layout important new national objectives--including immigration reform, in which the GOP continues to impede his efforts [5].

PRO's CASE

C1: Economy

The link Con provided did not work, but it appears that the link is from Speaker Boehner's office. Boehner is naturally going to slant his sources against Obama; they are political and ideological rivals. This source is therefore likely to be incredibly biased, and should be discounted.

And, despite the claims made by Con, economists observe that the jobs market is improving [6] and that jobless rates are falling [7]. Lastly, much of the loss in the labor force participation rate has been cyclical, and therefore not due to Obama. [8]

Finally, in general terms, much of the poor economic situation can be attributed to the GOP's lack of cooperation and their holding the economy hostage over less important social issues. Also, don't forget that Obama has brought 2 million jobs back!

C2: Equality

Con says I have no argument here, and so, fails to address the actual examples I cited. Extend these dropped examples:

1) Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act - this gives women more rights to equal pay, combatting the pay disparity that exists in the U.S. today

2) Matthew Shepard Act - this is tough hate crime legislation that works to deter and punish crimes motivated by bigotry and discrimination

3) Don't Ask/Don't Tell Repealed - obviously, this gives equal rights to members of the LGBTQ community serving in the military; Obama's even granted partners of gays in the armed forces spousal benefits.

These three examples ARE arguments--specifically, dropped arguments--for how Obama's promoted equality.

C3: Foreign Policy

Con acknowledges that Obama did make a good decision by moving troops out of combat zones in Iraq and Afghanistan--this argument flows Pro, then. Con's only disagreement with my C3 is that he's failing with regards to China and Russia. This is, firstly, too narrow and objection. ON the whole, Obama is better liked globally than his predecessor, making it easier to conduct business with other nations [9]. Additionally, U.S.-E.U. relations have improved, with the heralding of new economic ties and greater communication between both parties. Secondly, Con's objection about Russia is fallacious, insofar as Russia's military is not comparable to ours and because Russia's population is shrinking so rapidly that it simply won't have the population base to remain a power for much longer. As for China, if the GOP would agree to cut the defense budget, we might begin to cut down our "relationship of dependency" with them.

Sources:

1 - https://www.moodys.com...
2 - http://www.moneynews.com...
3 - http://thinkprogress.org...
4 - http://rismedia.com...
5 - http://www.latimes.com...
6 - http://www.bloomberg.com...
7 - http://money.cnn.com...
8 - http://www.macroadvisers.com...
9 - http://www.worldpublicopinion.org...

I also thank Con for this opportunity to debate, and, as promised, I have tried to be more substantive; my R2 speech was a bit rushed.
Debate Round No. 3
631300

Con

In closing, I believe that we agree that Obama is not the best President we have ever had, and we have once again proved that no president can please everyone in his decision-making. Now I address Pro directly, I have just joined a debate league and I am trying to sharpen my skills and take points from other debaters, and you have provided me with some solid examples of good debating, I thank Pro for a good debate.
bsh1

Pro

Con drops all of my arguments in his closing. Extend my points--Obama may not have been the best President, but he was a "quality" one. Thanks to Con for a nice discourse, and I urge a Pro ballot!
Debate Round No. 4
4 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Posted by bsh1 3 years ago
bsh1
PatriotPerson, why did you say you found Con more factual, yet give me sources? Just a bit confused...
Posted by anonymouse 3 years ago
anonymouse
obama is a quality president, if youre a corporate executive, but for everyone else, obama is an enemy of the people
Posted by tomuky 3 years ago
tomuky
Perhaps you'd like http://BanterMe.com... better.
Posted by leojm 3 years ago
leojm
Psh, you serious? I would debate you if I could. But there are just too many bias voters on here. You know I'm talking about. So it would be an unfairly voted debate.
3 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Vote Placed by funwiththoughts 3 years ago
funwiththoughts
631300bsh1Tied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: Have to give this to Pro due to his in the last round dropping his arguments and just asserting that they both agreed.
Vote Placed by thett3 3 years ago
thett3
631300bsh1Tied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: Simple. Pro gives arguments that Obama helped bring the US closer to equality, provides some kind of alternate causality to the economies ailments (the GOP and cyclical job market) along with showing recovery in other aspects like housing and even the job market, and he shows good foreign policy decisions under Obama. Con drops literally all his rebuttals and extensions of his arguments in R4, so it's clear who comes out on top.
Vote Placed by PatriotPerson 3 years ago
PatriotPerson
631300bsh1Tied
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Total points awarded:32 
Reasons for voting decision: I agreed with Con the whole time, but Conduct and S&G are tied because both debaters did fairly well on those subjects...arguments to Con, I found his more factual and convincing then Pro's. Sources to Pro because he used more than Con did.