The Instigator
DebateBehemoth
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
SarcasticIndeed
Con (against)
Winning
8 Points

OdinForce Thor vs Goku

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
SarcasticIndeed
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/31/2012 Category: Entertainment
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 6,671 times Debate No: 23965
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (5)
Votes (2)

 

DebateBehemoth

Pro

I think thor has enough magic tricks and is durable enog\ugh to beat goku and before that I would like to point out supersaiyan 4 is not canon so you cannot use supersaiyan 4 and the GT series
SarcasticIndeed

Con

The first round is for acceptance, so I will not pose any arguments. Also, no semantics or trolling please. I'm content with the rules and will use Goku and his powers at he end of DBZ.

Your turn.
Debate Round No. 1
DebateBehemoth

Pro

First of all I would like to thank you for accepting this debate
ODIN FORCE THOR IS CURRENTLY THE STRONGEST INCARNATION THOR HAS AND THIS ARE THOR'S POWERS

Like all Asgardians, Thor is not truly immortal but relies upon periodic consumption of the Golden Apples of Idunn to sustain his extended lifespan, which to date has lasted many millennia. Being the son of Odin and the elder goddess Gaea, Thor is physically the strongest of the Asgardians. If pressed in battle, Thor is also capable of entering into a state known as the "Warrior's Madness" ("berserkergang" in Norwegian), which will temporarily increase his strength and stamina tenfold, although in this state he attacks friend and foe alike.

Thor possesses a very high resistance to physical injury that approaches invulnerability. Thor also possesses keen senses that allows him to track objects traveling faster than lightand hear cries from the other side of the planet. Thor has the ability to travel through time. His stamina allowed him to battle the entire Frost Giant army for nine months without any sustenance or rest; Thor has also shown the ability to regenerate wounded portions of his body, including entire limbs or organs, with the aid of magical forces like Mjolnir, Thor has superhuman speed, agility, and reflexes, enabling him to deflect bullets with his hammer. Like all Asgardians he has immunity to all Earthly diseases and some resistance to magic. However, exceptionally powerful magic can overwhelm Odin's enchantment that transforms him between Asgardian and mortal forms.

As the Norse god of Thunder, Thor can summon the elements of the storm (lightning; rain; wind; snow) and uses Mjolnir as a tool to focus this ability, although the hammer cannot command artificial weather, only natural. He can cause these weather effects all over the world and destroy entire buildings; by whirling his hammer he can also lift entire buildings with the wind. As the son of the Earth goddess Gaea, Thor has shown some control over the Earth.

Thor is a superb hand-to-hand combatant, and also skilled in armed combat, excelling in the use of the war hammer, sword, axe and mace. Thor possesses two items which assist him in combat: the enchanted Belt of Strength, and his mystical hammer Mjolnir. The first item doubles Thor's strength and endurance while the second is used to control his weather abilities; flight; energy projection and absorption; dimensional travel; matter manipulation and the most powerful of his offensives, the God Blast (which taps into Thor's life force), the Thermo-blast, and the Anti-Force (which counteracts another force). Using Mjolnir by throwing in the desired direction and then holding on to the handle's leather loop, Thor can also fly at supersonic speeds in Earth's atmosphere and travel faster than light in space. When Thor has to transport companions and/or objects to a destination by himself, he has a chariot drawn by two huge mystical goats called Toothgnasher and Toothgrinder that can fly nearly anywhere he desires almost as easily as with Mjolnir.[89] He can throw an object out of Earth's atmosphere using his strength, and throw his hammer to Asgard from where it will return.[162]

When Mjolnir was damaged, Doctor Strange bound Thor's soul into Mjolnir, meaning that if the hammer were to be broken again, Thor may also die.
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I WILL SHOW FEATS OF THOR NEXT TIME

SarcasticIndeed

Con

Okay, first I want to mention that the whole text Pro posted was from Wikipedia, specifically this page: http://en.wikipedia.org...
We can see that Pro tried to erase the references from the text, but he missed two, meaning that he wanted to plagiarise the content on purpose and try to get away with it. I already urge others to vote for me since he plagiarised without even sourcing the text. I will still argue for my point, however.

Second, I want to note that Pro didn't pose any arguments in this round, he simply listed Thor's powers (and a weakness, even). Therefore, the only thing I have to do is show my arguments this round, since I have no need to refute anything.

Goku is more than a planet buster

I'm sure Thor is a very durable person, but has he ever fought with someone in Goku's tier and won?

In the original Dragon Ball, Master Roshi destroyed the Moon [1]. Later in the DBZ, it was noted his power level was merely 139. Vegeta, with a power level around 18000 [2], he could easily destroy the Earth. Now here's the thing. Throughout the series, characters jumped so unimaginably high in their power it is unimaginable. Goku's base (untransformed) strength by the end of DBZ should be 300 000 000+ Too much? Well, not really. His power as a Super Saiyan when fighting Frieza was 150 000 000. [2] He has surely surpassed that in his base by the end of DBZ.

With this power level, Goku is far stronger than a planet buster. Even more than a system buster (Cell said his Kamehameha would destroy the Solar System in the Cell saga). If Goku charged a beam so strong, it would easily pulverize Thor, even with his extreme durability. If he wants to make sure Thor doesn't dodge the energy blast, he could simply kick him a few times and attack while he is flying in mid-air.

Even, in the end, if Thor does dodge such a blast, Goku could fire several such blasts from different angles and confuse his opponent. If he is hit, he is dead. I don't even want to mention that Goku's punches can as well hold such devastating capabilities.

More fighting experience

Goku is a master of martial arts, more experienced than Thor. He has fought against many people who utilize different styles from the whole Earth and Galaxy. That's why he has more fighting experience which would gain him the edge in battle.

Sure, you could say Thor is a very experienced fighter as well, but he hasn't met nearly as much different styles of fighting, so he definitely has a disadvantage when it comes to fighting Goku.

Goku is faster

Raditz, at the start of DBZ, who had a power level about a thousand, could catch a bullet and throw it back at quite a high speed. Bullets fly at different speed, but they are generally close to the speed of sound, meaning he is more or less fighting at sound speed. Goku, at the end of DBZ, even in his base, has his power level in millions, and his speed definitely scales with his power level, meaning his speed is definitely over the speed of sound, perhaps even near light speed. In his Super Saiyan form, his power is increased fifty times, and we cannot know how much more his power increases in SS2 and SS3, but obviously a lot. He will probably reach light speed in SS2/SS3 and probably surpass it. This means he will obviously outspeed Thor in the athmosphere and possibly in space. But, hey, they would surely start their fight at Earth, so it doesn't matter. Goku's Super Saiyan faster than light forms would totally outmach Thor's supersonic speed.

So, if Goku is this much faster than Thor, he could simply kill him before he even knows it. I mean, he can track object travelling faster than light, but he cannot react fast enough to stop them.

Thor cannot do anything against Goku

Thor is superstrong, but would he be able to actually hurt Goku? I don't think so. Goku has blocked punches from the strongest beings in the universe. He has been thrown through mountain and continued fighting as if it was nothing. Thor's attacks won't pose a threat to him at all. And, even if they do pose a threat, Goku can just dodge them with his superhuman speed.

If Thor decides to use one of his beam attacks, Goku can simply dodge or counterattack. Either way, Thor cannot hurt Goku enough to beat him
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To conclude, I've shown many reasons why Goku would beat Thor. He has a superior fighting style, he is faster and can use a galaxy-busting move against Thor, whereas Thor can do little to harm Goku.

My opponent, on the other hand, made no arguments, but posted a Wikipedia text without sourcing it. This text wasn't an argument at all, but a list of Thor's powers. That's why I urge you to vote CON.

Sources:

1. http://www.dragonballencyclopedia.com...
2. http://www.dragonballencyclopedia.com...

Debate Round No. 2
DebateBehemoth

Pro

OK first I will counter than show feats of thor's powers
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Okay, first I want to mention that the whole text Pro posted was from Wikipedia, specifically this page:http://en.wikipedia.org......
We can see that Pro tried to erase the references from the text, but he missed two, meaning that he wanted to plagiarise the content on purpose and try to get away with it. I already urge others to vote for me since he plagiarised without even sourcing the text. I will still argue for my point, however.

Second, I want to note that Pro didn't pose any arguments in this round, he simply listed Thor's powers (and a weakness, even). Therefore, the only thing I have to do is show my arguments this round, since I have no need to refute anything.
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First I by no means planned or even had the intention of plagarizing my post I did what I said I will post Thor's powers
1st I do not know what those numbers are
2nd I erased them to save on space
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Goku is more than a planet buster

I'm sure Thor is a very durable person, but has he ever fought with someone in Goku's tier and won?

In the original Dragon Ball, Master Roshi destroyed the Moon [1]. Later in the DBZ, it was noted his power level was merely 139. Vegeta, with a power level around 18000 [2], he could easily destroy the Earth. Now here's the thing. Throughout the series, characters jumped so unimaginably high in their power it is unimaginable. Goku's base (untransformed) strength by the end of DBZ should be 300 000 000+ Too much? Well, not really. His power as a Super Saiyan when fighting Frieza was 150 000 000. [2] He has surely surpassed that in his base by the end of DBZ.

With this power level, Goku is far stronger than a planet buster. Even more than a system buster (Cell said his Kamehameha would destroy the Solar System in the Cell saga). If Goku charged a beam so strong, it would easily pulverize Thor, even with his extreme durability. If he wants to make sure Thor doesn't dodge the energy blast, he could simply kick him a few times and attack while he is flying in mid-air.

Even, in the end, if Thor does dodge such a blast, Goku could fire several such blasts from different angles and confuse his opponent. If he is hit, he is dead. I don't even want to mention that Goku's punches can as well hold such devastating capabilities.
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Thor has fought Thanos without the infinty gauntlet he almost killed Thanos by only his punches and a hit from his hammer
http://t2.gstatic.com...
Vegeta only stated that his attack will destroy a planet but has not shown it .
Frieza has done it but he was able to acomplish it by destroying the core .
Goku does not have such an attack his best chance is a long charged kamehameha to destroy a planet and it may even take a longer time to charge a kamehameha that will destory a galaxy which Goku does not have enough time he is not fighting a snail here.
Goku's punches go no where near to planet busting strength he needs super saiyan 1 form and still struggle to lift 40 tons.
Thor can easily go to another dimension if he wanted and suddenly return and shoot Goku with a lightning blast which Goku will not see coming
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More fighting experience

Goku is a master of martial arts, more experienced than Thor. He has fought against many people who utilize different styles from the whole Earth and Galaxy. That's why he has more fighting experience which would gain him the edge in battle.

Sure, you could say Thor is a very experienced fighter as well, but he hasn't met nearly as much different styles of fighting, so he definitely has a disadvantage when it comes to fighting Goku.
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I disagree being a viking god and living for many millenia's surely surpasses a person that has not even lived a century
Thor has fought frost giants for 9 months which gives you more endurance and experience which clearly surpasses Goku
Goku gets tired less than 12 hours which I dont understand he always needed help in defeating opponents but still he easily gets tired does not show endurance at all another advantage for Thor
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Goku is faster

Raditz, at the start of DBZ, who had a power level about a thousand, could catch a bullet and throw it back at quite a high speed. Bullets fly at different speed, but they are generally close to the speed of sound, meaning he is more or less fighting at sound speed. Goku, at the end of DBZ, even in his base, has his power level in millions, and his speed definitely scales with his power level, meaning his speed is definitely over the speed of sound, perhaps even near light speed. In his Super Saiyan form, his power is increased fifty times, and we cannot know how much more his power increases in SS2 and SS3, but obviously a lot. He will probably reach light speed in SS2/SS3 and probably surpass it. This means he will obviously outspeed Thor in the athmosphere and possibly in space. But, hey, they would surely start their fight at Earth, so it doesn't matter. Goku's Super Saiyan faster than light forms would totally outmach Thor's supersonic speed.

So, if Goku is this much faster than Thor, he could simply kill him before he even knows it. I mean, he can track object travelling faster than light, but he cannot react fast enough to stop them.
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First the buu saga Gotenks a very fast character does not even reach a quarter of light speed
to prove this lets I will just show you a mathematical equation
For reference Goku was about .002% the speed of light when he traveled across snake way.
Read more: http://wiki.answers.com...
so he is cleary less than hyper sonic speed.Thor's max record was mach 32 he cannot do more on earth as it would harm other humans.That is the reason why he can only travel light speed in space so Goku's speed would not affect this match so muc
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Thor cannot do anything against Goku

Thor is superstrong, but would he be able to actually hurt Goku? I don't think so. Goku has blocked punches from the strongest beings in the universe. He has been thrown through mountain and continued fighting as if it was nothing. Thor's attacks won't pose a threat to him at all. And, even if they do pose a threat, Goku can just dodge them with his superhuman speed.

If Thor decides to use one of his beam attacks, Goku can simply dodge or counterattack. Either way, Thor cannot hurt Goku enough to beat him
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Thor can hurt Galactus and Thanos including silver surfer I am pretty sure he can hurt Goku
Thor can expand earthquakes that expand continents because his mother is gaea he has some control of earth so another downside for goku
Thor can move through dimension and come out whenever he wanted he can shoot goku with a GODBLAST
GODBLASThttp://forums.comicbookresources.com...;
Odin had plucked ONE eye out to drink from the well of M wirmir, THOR had to pluck out BOTH eyes! Then Odin Hung himself sacrificing himself to himself, not quite entering death's door. THOR had to stand in the doorway.
By topping both of Odin's Trials, Thor, according to the ODIN-FORCE, had become more powerful than Odin himself! At the end of Vol. 2 Thor had also known Rune Magic which he has yet to use, so he may not have ALL his knowledge he gained during the trials. This could be a good thing because Thor was pretty much unstoppable with the limited display of the rune magic.
lesser feats
Thor typically uses the godblast as a last resort "Hail Mary" type attack after everything else fails. It is the most powerful attack in his arsenal. In over forty years he has only used it about half a dozen times. It also seems to be able to vary in power. A few instances of it being used besides that mentioned above includ driving a weakened Galactus away, momentarily stopping the Juggernaut when he was in motion (back when he was still unstoppable), and destroying the Dark gods after their leader, an Odin-level being, merged all of them together to create one entity combining all of their power.







SarcasticIndeed

Con

Pro says he by no means wanted to plagiarize, but in any case, he should've sourced the thing he posts, or it is simply plagiarizing.

And Pro still hasn't posted arguments for why would Thor beat Goku, he just tried to refute mine, so he has not met his burden of proof. My job will now be to refute the refutations of my arguments, and advise Pro to post his arguments the next round.

Goku is more than a planet buster

Pro here starts an argument by saying something about Thor vs. Thanos. It by no means has relevance to this debate. If he wishes to expand on it, he can do it in the next round.

Now, Pro states I'm wrong by saying that Vegeta could destroy the Earth since he only stated it, but I've shown why this is wrong. In the Dragon Ball series, Master Roshi destroyed the Moon with a mere power level of 140. Vegeta's power level in his saga is 18000, which is nearly 129 times larger than Roshi's. Earth's radius is about 3.7 times larger than Moon's. Vegeta could obviously destroy something that is this many times larger than the Moon. Additionally, if Vegeta was only bluffing, then Goku wouldn't have been so worried about his statement, considering the fact that Goku knows to sense the amount of energy exerted from people. Therefore, Goku with his power in millions is easily more than a planet buster. (The Earth and Moon details can be found on the Internet, if Pro wants, I can source it)

How Frieza has done it is irrelevant since I used the logic above.

Now Pro says that Goku's best chance is charging up an attack, and I agreed that it will take Goku some time, although not really much to charge a system-busting energy blast. If he wants to make sure Thor doesn't dodge it, he could kick him a few times and hit him in mid-air. Or he could crash him into a mountain and charge the attack to the stunned Thor. If even that doesn't work, he can use the Instant Transmission Kamehameha as he did with Cell and turn Thor into ashes.

And about Goku's punches, Pro mixes lifting and punching strength, which are by no means related. And Goku does not get most of his punching power by pure strength, but combining velocity with it. It gives much more devastating results than simply punching.

Even boxing sites agree with me: http://www.expertboxing.com...

Pro might note that Goku's punches cannot destroy a planet, but it's because DBZ has better physics when it comes to this than comics. Goku's attacks are concentrated, and he can put the same amount of Ki he uses in his Kamehameha in his punches. If Goku wanted to punch hard enough, he would simply go deeper down the planet, and not make it explode. How comic characters do this, I have no idea, but Goku's punches and kicks can have the same amount of energy as his energy blasts.

More fighting experience

This point was not about endurance, but about experience with different styles of fighting. I'm saying Goku's technique is better than Thor's, since he has fought tons of different styles through the both Earth and Otherworld tournaments. By fighting with frost giants for 9 months, Thor has fought only one fighting style, the ones frost giants utilize, so it means nothing to this.

Then Pro makes a logical fallacy saying that Goku is weaker since he always needs help in defeating his opponents. It is simply like that since the enemies he fought were stronger. Most of them could regenerate from the largest injuries and had massive supplies of raw power. Besides, at the end of DBZ, ten years from fighting Buu, Goku is surely stronger than even his last opponent.

Goku is faster

To prove that Goku goes lower than Light Speed, he uses a Wiki answers, which is by no means a credible source. Besides, in the answers, there are no "equations", but simply use assumptions. The part about the snake way are back when Goku was much slower, so it makes no difference. Back in DB, Goku could move at speed humans cannot see. In DBZ, he could move at a speed Piccolo could barely keep track of (Cell Games). Therefore, he is at least supersonic. This argument is left unchallenged.

Thor cannot do anything against Goku

The earthquake sand continents expanding would mean nothing to Goku since he can fly the whole time.

Oh, and, Thor can move through dimensions? So can Goku, using Instant Transmission. He can teleport instantly to another dimension with it, or anywhere on Earth. And, since Instant Transmission is instant, he can move faster than light with it, so he can use it to move behind Thor and totally surprise him. And Goku has used Instant Transmission in battles, both during his battle with Cell and throughout the Buu saga. Therefore, Goku certainly is faster than Thor.

Besides, he has dropped the part where I say Goku could dodge all of his attacks.
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In the last part of his argument, Pro talks about how Thor is stronger than Odin, which makes no relevance to this debate. He also links a forum from which he took the whole last portion of his text. It, again makes no relevance to this debate, since feats mean nothing unless they can be used against Goku here (which he hasn't used in such a manner).

I, however, explained how Goku is certainly faster than Thor, the fact that he has a better fighting technique and that his galaxy-busting attacks would totally pulverize Thor. I hope my opponent tries to make some arguments for Thor the next round. This time he just showed feats, which are not arguments.



Debate Round No. 3
DebateBehemoth

Pro

I will still counter but with my counter's give arguments I will not copy paste his posts to save on space for my arguments I will answer his posts at the same way he does
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Thanos is an enitity which power expands universes he killed millions of his own kind
Thanos is a solar sytem buster and can withstand planet buster but almost died from Thor's punches which proves that Goku will get hurt by Thor's punches Thor's punches will hit Goku because Thor has enough speed to do so he was even shown passing new york with a heart beat and I do agree that goku is a planet buster but he needs to become a supersaiyan first reasons why
Vegeta's attack is called *final flash* am I right he has two beams in his hands you cannot be sure that it will destroy earth just by the power Goku is feeling from Vegeta Goku turning ss3 shook earth but it did not destroy it Goku's spirit bomb did nothing but make a crater and the spirit bomb is the strongest attack in his arsenal With goku's speed and the time it takes to charge just a simple planet buster in ss1 mode is not fast enough to hit thor and you say Goku is going to kick him or throw him to a mountain Thor gets up from getting hit from Hulk's punches faster than most people Hulk's punches demonstrate 11 million pounds of pressure so a few kicks and throwing thor to a mountain is not long enough to charge such an attack and *hit thor for all angles*
Goku's punches in ss3 mode has been shown to chip mountains even if he puts all of his energy in his punches it will not destroy a planet While thor in the other hand can destroy solar systems by going inside the sun and ripping the core apart
Thor can cause huge storm surronding Goku so Goku already will have trouble trying to get away from the lightning than trying to avoid Thor Thor then hits Goku with a god blast THE END
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Goku in his matches always loses the only reason he wins is by the aid of friends if piccolo did not block freiza and freiza reached Goku the whole story line will change if gohan piccolo vegeta and some more did not help fighting cell a Goku would have died Even in the radditz's saga Goku already had help from piccolo but still died in order to defeat radditz your are talknig about experience right not styles which Thor clearly has more experience than Goku fighting Galactus Thanos Hulk Silver surfer and many other feared heroes of marvel clearly gives you experince living for millenia's gives you plenty of this
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Though it was only answered by unknown people it gives mathematical result on how fast Goku is with the exact time the series or akira is showing on the distance gotenks is traveling
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Goku is a hand to hand fighter he rarely stays up the whole time for 2 reasons
1.he does not fight the way
2.It also drains his energy
Instant transmission can only be done by locking on a ki signature which goku would not find in battlefield the earth they are fighting on is not from marvel or dbz so no ki locks here he can only use unmastered transmission like what he does in battles and it does not reach far enough to escpe from a storm pls show my proof that he can go to other dimensions with it and how would goku know which dimension thor is in
I did not drop anything the reason to why I only refuted your points was because I did not have muchn characters remaining Goku cannot dodge lightning if thor makes a storm and standing in the middle thor ahs done this and no gap was left infront or behind him plus he can see objects or being moving faster than light he will see goku going behind him and will be able to react
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I put odin here because of the power odin has and to put that with thor's powers results to a person beyond skyfather level
http://en.wikipedia.org...(comics)

As King of the Norse Gods, Odin possesses vast strength and durability far greater than a normal Asgardian, along with resistance to all Earthly diseases and toxins, incredible resistance to magic, and courtesy of the Golden Apples of Idunn, a greatly extended lifespan. Odin has all the abilities of his son Thor, but to a much greater degree. Odin is capable of manipulating the Odin Force - a powerful source of energy - for a number of purposes, including energy projection; creation of illusions and force fields; levitation; molecular manipulation, communicating telepathically with other Asgardians even if they be on Earth and he in Asgard,[33] hypnotizing humans;[9] channelling lightning to Earth from Asgard,[33] controlling the lifeforces of all Asgardians, and teleportation. The character has also used the Odinpower for greater feats such as transporting the entire human race to an alternate dimension;[9] stopping time;[9] pulling remains of distant planets towards Earth,[1] compressing the population of an entire planet into a single being, the Mangog and then recreating the race[34] and taking a soul away from the arch-demon Mephisto.[35] The Odinforce extends Odin's power to a galactic level.[36]

In battles against opponents of similar power, Odin carries the magical spear Gungnir ("The Spear of Heaven"), an artifact made of the metal uru, that can be used to channel the Odin Force. Even without the Odinforce it can still match Thor's hammer in battle. Once a year, during the Asgardian winter, Odin must undertake the Odinsleep for 24 hours to regenerate (and is closely guarded as he is vulnerable during this period), although he can be wakened by potent spells, such as those of Karnilla the Norn Queen.[37]

Odin is also a master tactician and schemer, and has prevented Ragnarok,[38] and planned for centuries for the coming of the Celestial Fourth Host.[39][40] The character also on occasion uses the eight-legged steed Sleipnirthe and the enchanted ship Skipbladnir, which can navigate the "sea of space" and be shrunk to the size of a toy.
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I argue that thor is faster and has stronger powers than goku much more durable and can last longer in this fight





SarcasticIndeed

Con

Well, let's refute this thing.
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"Thanos is a solar system buster"

I would like this to be sourced or proved by logic. I am by no means a comic expert but I don't remember him busting systems. The strongest feat I could find is him busting a planet. (http://marvel.com...) Besides, as much as I could find out, Thanos can use some gems to amplify his strength. Did Thor fight Thanos in this mode? Beside, this point doesn't mean much. Goku could easily pass the New York in a heart beat as well, and I proved he is faster than Thor at least in Earth's Atmosphere, so this point doesn't stand, and Goku is definitely faster than Thor there.

Anyway, then Pro shows that Goku is planet buster only in his Super Saiyan form, which is wrong. He babbles something about Vegeta's final flash, which I don't see making a connection here. Vegeta could destroy the Earth in his base form back in the Vegeta Saga, so I don't see how Goku, who is much stronger, wouldn't. My proof of planet busting is left totally untouched. The name for the attack Vegeta used against Goku in Vegeta saga is "Galick Gun".

Goku didn't destroy the Earth when transforming, I agree. But why would he have to? Transforming isn't releasing all your power at once.

The spirit bomb point is totally wrong as well. The strongest spirit bomb used against Buu exploded, it did not continue to push deeper into the planet, so it did not destroy it. Besides, it lost a lot of its energy by killing Buu and then continuing to travel across the surface of the planet. It's final explosion was in a weakened state. (First video) Spirit bomb isn't meant to be a planet busting move. The one against Frieza was much weaker and as well exploded in a limited range . (Second Video)

Pro constantly tries to prove that Goku is not a planet buster in his base, but I've shown enough evidence to prove otherwise.

Goku's power in base is enough to make a planet buster. Frieza charged a planet buster in seconds when destroying Planet Vegeta, whose gravity is 10x stronger than Earth's (suggesting it is denser or massively bigger). Not to mention this was in his first form, where his power level is about 500 000, and he had no intention to destroy the planet in a second. (3rd video) This event is canon, which I can explain why if Pro wants (unless he already knows that).

Since Frieza could charge a planet buster so fast, so could Goku charge a Solar System buster. Therefore, he could easily obliterate Thor. If Thor tries to attack him, he could use the same thing he did with Cell, Instant Transmission. Thor will be sent flying by Goku's attacks for at least seconds, which is totally enough for Goku. If not, Goku could simply weaken him over time by planet-busting attacks.

I already noted that Goku has more concentrated attacks than Marvel characters. If Goku wanted to use a punch strong enough and punched the planet, he would just go deeper and deeper. What kind of physics allow the Marvel characters to destroy a planet by a punch, I don't know.

And, then Pro says Goku wins by causing a massive storm which will cause lightning that will kill Goku. Well, not really... Goku could simply push the clouds away from him by his own ki. And, in reality, lightning wouldn't do anything to him. Back in Dragon Ball, when he climbed up the pole to Kami's Lookout, Goku had to go through a storm. He survived barely hurt. (http://www.dbz.tv...) When he's grown up, I don't even want to mention how much more durable would he be. Lightning would hardly hurt him. If he had to, he could create a Ki shield. In the end, he wouldn't even have to do this. He learned to be faster than lightning during his training with Popo (http://www.mangareader.net...)

Note: He didn't learn it exactly in that chapter, but he completed the training, thus learning to be faster than lightning.

Thus, Thor's lightning would do nothing against Goku. God Blast would do nothing as well, he can simply counter it or dodge it.

Pro then talks about the help Goku needs to beat villains, which means nothing, as I've mentioned. I'm talking about styles and experience, as well. Goku, has a better technique of hand to hand fighting than Thor is what I've wanted to say by my point.

The speed argument doesn't matter, as Gotenks didn't have to use his full speed when travelling around the world (In fact, I don't even remember him doing it, and I don't think it is canon). Besides, light travels the Earth 7 times a second, not 9 (http://answers.yahoo.com...). The only reason I'm linking an answers site is because its math is right.

Durability means nothing if Goku simply destroys Thor in the start. And he could destroy him even in a stronger fight.

"Instant transmission can only be done by locking on a ki signature which goku would not find in battlefield the earth they are fighting on is not from marvel or dbz so no ki locks here he can only use unmastered transmission like what he does in battles and it does not reach far enough to escpe from a storm pls show my proof that he can go to other dimensions with it and how would goku know which dimension thor is in"

This whole paragraph is a bunch of fail, and here's how:

1st. Pro never specified the Earth they are fighting on, now he's just twisting the rules in his favor. That's just bad conduct. Besides, if Earth they are fighting is not from Marvel or DBZ, Thor couldn't control it because he can only control his Earth (He's the son of Gaea in his Earth). And I'm pretty sure he won't be able to control the weather on an alien Earth.
2nd. Ki is life energy, something all life radiates. This surely exists in both of the universes, however you name it. Chakra, Ki, life energy.
3rd. Goku can still use his Instant Transmission to travel distances he can see. He can lock on Thor, if he wants.
4th. He won't need to travel large distances, he's fighting on a small area.
5th. He could travel between the Earth and Afterlife (King Kai's dimension). Those are two different dimensions.
6th. He doesn't need to learn where Thor is. I'm just saying both can travel between dimensions.

Pro didn't have enough characters, I understand, but I'm not the one to blame for that. He didn't have to quote me the whole time. And the storm argument he mentioned for the last time doesn't work. He cannot make a gap-less cage of lightning, I'd love to see him do that. And he cannot see something that is behind this, so this argument fails. He cannot react faster than right if he doesn't know he's attacked from behind.

In the end, Pro pasted Odin's powers. I don't see how this makes relevance to the fight between Thor and Goku. Thor many be stronger than Odin, but he doesn't have his powers, but a different set of them. Therefore, this has no relevance to the post.
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In this round, Pro has dropped many of my points, and unsuccessfully refuted mine, while I refuted his. I've shown that Goku can quickly destroy Thor in a flash, he is faster than Thor (at least on Earth) and that his fighting technique is better than Thor's. That's why I met my burden of proof and Pro hasn't. I await for our last round.
Debate Round No. 4
DebateBehemoth

Pro

Sorry was not able to answer for 2 days my comp keeps on lagging
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Since the thanos thing does not mean much I will continue
First Thor's speed has been calculated to be mach 32 as his record best while Goku has only been shown to move at fast speed but we really do not know how fast he is since all the other speed feats are all hyperbole you also cannot prove that Goku can move a quater of a second while I can Thor passed new york in a heart a healthy man's hearth beats 3 times a second which Thor did Goku has not reached past sonic speed yet which Thor can Thor can even move in the speed of light if he spins his hammer enough He can also throw his hammer twice the speed of light which will catch goku even if goku is using instant transmission since instant transmitting is light speed Thor will see Goku going behind him And Thor can goto space if he wants while shooting Goku from there Goku will then get tired dodging and Thor finishes him off
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used Final Flash for Galick Gun sorry way Frieza was able to destroy that planet was with the kind of attack he had if Goku uses a simple ki blast he will not be able to destroy it kamehameha will take 15 seconds to destroy a planet for it will still need to drill to the core if he charges that at Thor it will be to late and if he does pull it off Thor will survive it
Durability Thor survived blasts from celestials and he is not even OdinForce Thor yet here he can also regenerate if he gets injured which happens in rare occasions
http://marvel.wikia.com...(Earth-616)
Godlike Invulnerability: Being a god whose heritage is half-Asgardian & half-Elder God affords Thor absolute invulnerability and immunity to such human ailments as diseases, toxins, poisons, corrosives, fire, electrocution, asphyxiation, lead, and radiation poisoning.[58][59][60][61] Thor can drink mead all day long and not get drunk. He has withstood direct blows from beings with vast superhuman strength such as the Hulk, Hercules, Gladiator, Silver Surfer, Thanos, and the Red hulk. Thor can survive in the heart of the Sun with no discomfort,[62] has flown through the heart of stars,[63] and survived point blank range energy explosions capable of destroying entire planets.[64] He has survived a supernova blast of an exploding star unharmed,[24] the gravity of a Neutron Star,[64] and withstood the weight of a score of entire planets.[65] Thor was able to survive direct multiple blasts from the Asgardian Destroyer (the weapon created by Odin and the gods from multiple pantheons to battle the Celestials).[66] Thor also once took a glancing hit by a Doomsday Bomb that was capable of destroying an entire planet, and soon after that explosion he fell from space (leaving a crater miles wide) to a planet called Pangoria.[64] He has withstood a blast from Odin (who is far more powerful than Thor),[67] attacks from Celestials,[25] and even withstood attacks from the leader of the Celestials.[68] With his powers reduced in half, Thor was able to withstand a blow from the Executioners axe (a weapon that wields the energy of an exploding star).[69] Thor is extremely difficult to kill as his life force is considerably augmented by his godlike heritage, powers, Mjolnir, and the Odin Force - even if it is only relegated within Mjolnir as a smaller portion at the moment.[70]
And if you wanna know how strong the celestials are here(They can destroy solar systems and universes
I will try to find the leader of the celestials which did the blow
http://marvel.wikia.com...
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One fact about supersaiyan 3 ir drains Goku's ki faster than any other from it wont take him an hour before he turns into ss2s since he will see that his attacks will not harm Thor's thoughness
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Right on the spot 10 times the gravity of earth which pulls the huge ball even dipper in it's core
I would like to know why the 3rd video is canon because I do not remember a bardock saga
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Charging a kamehameha is different from the ball Frieza did Frieza can easily launch that from the start but waited Goku if he said kamehameha to fast he would not be able to charge a strong enough kamehameha and even if he ahs the time As my pas posts said Thor>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.Human's durability since he is a God
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This is false Take Hulk for example his punches are powered by gamma energy make him mad enough he can destroy solar systems and make a chain reaction Goku has not been shown to put his ki in his fists he strongest punching feat was to chip a mountain while Hulk can do that while jumping and Thor can use his hammer and his fists to break mountains
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1st video I am still watching it but if its a storm that is perfectly normal that's nothing compared to what Thor can do he can make does lightning stronger he was born to control lightning he can destroy mountains with it like zeus he can also make which he can do a hailstorm which would irritate Goku since a simple rock throw from krillin hurt him and if you have read my past post OdinForse Thor>>>Odin and if you read Odin's powers you will see that odin can move molecules and Thor has the same abiltiy only to a much lower degree that is thor this is OdinForce Thor and a God blast can kill immortals A god blast is not lightning it is all of asgards powers in one attack Goku is not immortal A god blast will kill him plus Thor can make his god blast as Big as he wanted he can trap Goku first with a lightning sphere which is in thor's capabilities I have finished you have complete lies Goku got hit by lightning and almost fell of the stick and he has full of bruises if this was ss3 Goku he will still get hurt but not as much as this Thor can make lightning blasts from asgard he can make does strikes as big as houses if he wanted he has the power and endurance to and can Goku escape from being frozen once Thor's freezes him with a very cold hail storm
2nd comic Why do you not show me the exact comic and Goku does not move at the speed of lightning what he did was move a few inches as fast is lightning while lighnting take about 50 miles to reach earth at the same speed so Thor would dodge this
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As I have said Thor a God and has traveled all over the universe fighting opponents with different fighting styles and has won he has been alive before Goku was born Thor can also travel through time so he could do something that I will not mention for the fairness of this fight
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Again no proof to back this up first off God durabiltiy is far beyond the opponents Goku has fought Thor even has regen if ever he mystically injures Thor and much more if it is a stronger fight
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1st.I am not twisting the fight in my favor to be fair the earth battlefield is both not in the dbz universe and not in the marvel universe How are you sure he cannot since evaporation happens in that earth to support the organisms so he will still make rain hail or lightning
2nd.Why will goku use instant transmission if his opponent is a few miles away and Thor does not train his ki so he ahs no ki only saiyan in the dbz universe have ki
3rd.Why will he lock on opponents near him he will only use unmastered transmission if he can goto lands he can see he can see a star why not drag his opponent there to finish him since instant transmission is as fast as light Thor will see Goku moving even in instant transmission mode
4th.exactly
5th.Which will take a lot of ki if he keeps on repeating this
6th.exactly
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Thor can make a gapless cage of lightnnig if he wanted it is one of the many abilities of being able to control lighting
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Again you did not read it Thor has the same abilities but to a much smaller degree OdinForce thor has same abilites but to a much much more higher and faster degree than Odin
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Wrong oh and yea Odin's power allows him to do this stuff OdinForce has more power which mean he can do this abilities but in a much better degree than Odin
SarcasticIndeed

Con

Thor's speed is fast, but he can merely go super-sonic in the Earth's atmosphere, and I've shown that Raditz is faster than Super-Sonic in the start of DBZ. By the end of the show, Goku's speed will be much, much, much larger. And I cannot even explain how much Goku's power skyrockets through all the Saga. By the end. His base is 300 000 000+, as I showed. Super Saiyan is 50 times the base. Therefore, his power level is at least 15 000 000 000 in SS form. Raditz at the start of DBZ was 1500 and he was moving at least at the speed of sound (343 m/s). That means Goku is 10 000 000 times stronger than Raditz in SS. And since speed scales with power level, Goku's speed by the end of series is 10 000 000 x 343, his speed is 3 430 000 000 m/s. Speed of light is 299 792 458. Therefore, not only is Goku faster than light, but surpasses it by an incredible amount. Not to mention that is
the minimal speed since Raditz could probably travel faster than the speed of sound (considering he could catch a bullet flying at the
speed sount with no effort.

Pro could now argue that speed doesn't directly scale with power level. But even if it does scale by a far smaller level, it surely does
enough to break the sped of light (at least 30 times multiplier would make Goku faster than light). Not to mention that there is the
SS2 which boosts Goku's speed and strenght by another great amount. So it would be silly to say Goku is not faster than light,
in fact, he surpasses it by such a large level even Thor couldn't see him. Since Thor can move only super sonic on Earth, it would be
a peace of cake for Goku to kill him before he knows it. This faster than light travel probably can't be done on large scales, but it can
be done on smaller, enough for Goku to reach Thor and punch/kick him before he even knows it. The strenght of the punch will be
amplified by his speed and will produce a punch that could severely hurt Thor.

On another note, Instant Transmisson is instant. Goku stated it is light speed in the Funimation Dub, which is not canon and has made
many mistakes during the series. If Thor goes to space, so can Goku. And I'm pretty sure Thor won't aim perfectly from the outer space,
so yeah.

Pro still doesn't believe me about planet busting and says it is only done by detroying the core. Well, I'll let him watch the third video
again. I don't thing the core has been destroyed. In fact, the ball of energy can still be seen when the Earth is destroyed. And a ki blast
can destroy Earth, if not, Goku can make a ball like Frieza's. Piccolo destroyed the Moon with a ki blast like a kamehameha. Thus, Pro's
planet busting argument fails.

Pro now lists another set of Thor's power. And I'm not arguing his not vulnerable, but he can and is hurt on many occasions. He is immune
to many things Goku isn't (electricity, heat, poison), but because Thor doesn't use any but electricity, which can't hurt Goku much,
his immunities don't play a large role in this battle.
His bones and skin are only several times denser than human's, so he is not incredibly
resistant to the damage Goku's strength provides (http://marvel.com...). Thor can lift 100 tons,
but Goku can lift 40 tons with ease in SS. By the end of DBZ, he can lift 100 tons in SS and a lot more in SS2. Therefore, I can even
argue that Goku is stronger than Thor.

Oh, and, Thor can survive planet-busting blasts, but Goku can conter them with several times stronger blasts. Thor may have survived
hits from Celestials, but he has not been able to defeat them. Celestials haven't been using their full strength (since Thor survived,
and they are universe busters, of course).

With this durability, Goku can easily destroy Thor, whose skin/bones are several times toughethan a human's. Bullets did nothing to
Goku when he was a kid. His durability has skyrocketed through the series, therefore, Goku is easily more resistant to damage than
Thor.

3rd video's canonicity is proven by Akira as he watched the special and liked it so much he mentioned Bardock in the manga and Bardock
was in the Dragon Ball Z's Daizenshuu, which is a DBZ encyclopedia (video shows the manga and Daizenshuu pages).

Pro seems to think that pronouncing a kamehameha or not affects its power, which is simply not true. Besides, it doesn't matter how
an attack looks, it can be charged in the same time. Therefore, Goku can charge a system busting blast with ease.

Oh, and, while I cannot find proof of using Ki in his punches, I'm sure Goku does that. Either way, Goku can destroy mountains with ease
with his punches. I've already explained why he cannot do this to planets. Either way, his punches have enough energy to hurt
Thor a lot.

The storm Goku faced was strong and Goku endured it with ease. I've already explained how lightning won't do anything to Goku,
and neither would a hlstorm. Goku creates hailstorms with his Ki pressure... The hit and hurt by rock scene was merely comedy and
I'm not sure it is canon.

Thor's lightning, I already explained, cannot do anything to Goku. I don't think it can form cages, and if he does, he can instant
transmission out of the cage. Goku when he was a kid fell of the stick but quickly got back to it. And when he reached the Kami's
Lookout, he was undamaged and ready to fight. I don't see how I need proof for Goku's faster than lightning travel since he finished
the training at Kami, whch means he is faster thn lightning. Popo could move faster than lightning and Goku surpasses Popo in every
way by the end of DBZ.

Also, God Blast may be incredibly strong, but Goku can easily evade it, both with his superhuman speed and Instant Transmission.
When he survives it, Thor is weakened (God Blast saps his life force) and Goku will easily destroy him

Thor may have fought many different styles, but the way he fights isn't very advanced, more like a brawl style. Goku is a master of
martial arts and as such, his technique is better than Thor's.

I've already shown that Thor's endurance is not majestically large when compared to Goku. Goku's opponents had so advanced
regeneration it wasn't even funy. And yes, Goku's opponents were more durable than Thor as well, and Goku couldn't beat him
because he wasn't as strong as them at the time.

Instant Transmission Points:

1st. Pro never specified the Earth they are fighting, and he does in later rounds. I'm just poiting out this is bad conduct.
2nd. Goku can use instant transmission to evade the strongest attacks at point blank range. And Ki is life energy which is exerted
by all beings, it isn't used only by those who train it. Grass has Ki, all life has Ki in them. Ki is just a fancy name for life energy, whic
Thor sure has.
3rd. Goku can use istant transmission in cases he is inevitably going to be hit, as I said. And it is instant, not light speed as said in dub.
He would lock on Thor to go behind him without noticing.
4th. Okay.
5th. Uh, no. Goku has been using instant Transmission and it doesn't use a lot of Ki at all. It is not a ki-exhausting ability at all.
6th. Uh, okay. Pro misinterpret this point. I meant to say Goku has the same ability as Thor, dimension-trav.
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A gapless age of lightning won't do anything, as I said. A blast would go through lightning. Lightning isn't an impenetrable barrier...
Besides, instant transmission and Goku's out of the cage.

Pro confuses me here. He has clearly listed Thor's powers and Odin's powers. i've read numerous pages listing Thor's power and it
never said Thor is capable of doing what Thor is. Since Pro didn't source this, and I've never found it, this point by Pro doesn't stand.
He might be stronger than Odin but he doesn't have his abilites, as it was never noted.

No, Odin Force is some energy available to Asgardians and such. Having it does not give you Odin's powers. Pro hasn't sourced this.
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VOTE CON!

(I've met some problems with the coding during this round. I hope the text is readable and intact when I post this round)


Debate Round No. 5
5 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Posted by Gamerfreak1313 4 years ago
Gamerfreak1313
I'm pretty sure that Rune King Thor stomps Odinforce Thor
Posted by DebateBehemoth 4 years ago
DebateBehemoth
Gt aint canon so technically ss4 is not allowed to be called a form
Posted by akahdrin 4 years ago
akahdrin
Curious to why you used the strongest form of Thor, but not the strongest form of Goku.
Posted by SarcasticIndeed 4 years ago
SarcasticIndeed
Rofl. Haven't noticed that.
Posted by HonestDiscussioner 4 years ago
HonestDiscussioner
Quote of the debate:

"characters jumped so unimaginably high in their power it is unimaginable"

Tautological statements are tautological.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by TheOrator 4 years ago
TheOrator
DebateBehemothSarcasticIndeedTied
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: I gave conduct to con because pro plaguarized without citing. Con proved that, next to Goku, Thor isn't that great, especially when looking at the planet-destroying aspect of Goku. Plus, Pro did a poor job of rebuttals.
Vote Placed by TUF 4 years ago
TUF
DebateBehemothSarcasticIndeedTied
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: First of all, the whole thing with the copy and paste was messed up. You cite sources and you make arguments from them in your own words. With 8000 characters there was no way you were "saving space". Also most of your rebuttals were vague responses to text you copied and pasted from the con. I give arguments con as well. Goku can destroy planets at smaller power levels then you will ever see in the series. Thor cannot. Con did a fantastic job exploiting this in the debate.