The Instigator
SevenWarriors1
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
ExiOrca
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

One piece is a better manga/anime than Naruto

Do you like this debate?NoYes+1
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 0 votes the winner is...
It's a Tie!
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/20/2013 Category: Miscellaneous
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 3,731 times Debate No: 31464
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (3)
Votes (0)

 

SevenWarriors1

Pro

One piece is a better manga/anime than Naruto.

I am basing this more on character development and plot buildups throughout each anime (as I shall call them from now on). I don't really care about the style or basic attacks of both sides although I will happily accept better action sequences as an argument. (which i will rebut)

No trolls please
I am new to this website so first to come is first served as long as are not a troll.
ExiOrca

Con

Welcome to DDO!

As con, I will debate one piece is not a better manga than naruto.

My first point, storyline. Though both mangas tells us a mainstream battle manga story. Naruto has more themes and depth to it. For example, the first few volumes of Naruto tells us the story of Naruto (the main character) has suffered from isolation and has managed to fit into the society whereas One Piece only tells us a story of a boy who has big dream and want to go on a journey which is pretty cliche in a mainstream battle manga.
My second point, theme. Naruto depicts a theme of hatred, revenge, friendship, and many thing else which has a depth to the story plot. Again, one piece, though has a theme of friendship or comradeship, the theme itself doesn't have much depth in it. So One Piece is just one of your cliche battle manga, whereas Naruto tells us a story along with it amazing plotline.
Third is character. Naruto has a more variety of characters from different factions that can be very important and has a lot of twist on whether they're the antagonist or not. This makes the plotline more unpredictable and fun to read, whereas, on One Piece, it is very defined on who's the antagonist and not very much twists. Readers can easily identify and predict what's going to happen on One Piece compare to that of Naruto.

I am not saying Naruto is better than One Piece. I'm saying One Piece is not better than Naruto.
Debate Round No. 1
SevenWarriors1

Pro

I thank my opponent for accepting this debate and his warm welcome to the DDO website :)

As pro, I will be debating that One Piece is a better manga/anime than Naruto.
Please note that I am solely lining out my arguments in this round and will not be rebutting. (in future i will make first round the acceptance round)

My first point of contention is storyline. Although One Piece and Naruto are similar in fashion and develop quite nicely, One Piece has several more grand story arcs that contain less filler chapters/episodes than Naruto. The inserting of minor story arcs such as the foxy pirates mini arc provides a basis to add depth and interconnected plot to the world of one piece. As an example, although Haki (an important power in the world of one piece) was not fully named and explained until around the 600'th chapter it appears in the very first chapter/episode of One Piece and makes appearances in some form in every other arc. Mini arcs such as Nico Robin's (a female protagonist in One Piece), Luffys (the male protagonist) and Zoro's (another male protagonist) contain background stories which provide depth and drive to the characters of One Piece. The main character of One Piece all have big dreams in One Piece and background stories. Characters such as Nico Robin, Zoro, Luffy, Ussop (male protagonist), Sanji (male protagonist and chef) and Nami (female protagonist... you get the picture i will only be talking about protagonists) all have backgroundstories that provide reasons for their drive in life. This drive comes in the form of dreams, Nami has always felt enclosed and trapped by pirates that stole her for her map making talents and killed her (adoptive) mother. This emotive tale explains to use that when Nami is freed by Luffy she wishes to help him and follow her dreams of making maps of the world (because her mother always complemented her maps). Sanji wishes to find the 'all blue' a sea filled with all the different fish of the world. He does this because his backstory is that he was once stranded with a pirate on an island, he finds out that he was the only one with food and both man and boy are dying of starvation. After they are saved Sanji vows to find the all blue to help cook the best meals in the world so that people can experience the pleasure of food. There are more developments for each of the characters but I will stick to these for time constraints. Although Naruto has character development for their main character Naruto it tends to lack in underlying plotlines for characters that are not as important including enemies. One Piece provides background to some (not-recurring) enemies such as Arlong the pirate (he was pushed around and people were racist to him because he's a fishman) and if no backstory is provided the character is usually utilized to further the plot. e.g a pirate named Krieg gives an explanation to how terrifying the Grand Line is, a sea the characters must travel to.

As my second point I will expand on the themes of One Piece. One Piece is a narrative that has many intricate themes within it. One Piece often uses respect, anger, vengeance, comradeship and even hatred. These themes often contribute to plot schemes within the manga. Anger at the government often leads to rebellion within a city and puts the country depicted in jeopardy. Respect is another theme which adds to the plot as some story arcs have respect as a sole motive for reason or as a means of saving the protagonists life. As an example I will reference a time when an enemy defeated the main protagonist Luffy and his friends. After this beating all were lying unconscious but before the enemy could kill Luffy, Zoro comes and despite his wounds asks to take in all the pain his friends have suffered (as the transferral of pain is a characteristic of this enemy) and he asks this despite being heavily wounded himself, fully expecting to die. This act of respect shows the depth that underlying themes can add to One Piece.

As for the third point, characters in One Piece. One Piece has a wide variety of characters that differ in every arc as to their motives and powers, much like Naruto. Unlike Naruto which I find predictable as either somebody starts losing and makes a comeback, another person interferes in the fight or the person that is no longer central to the plot is killed/beaten One Piece has a wide variety of plot twists that are fully utilized through characters personalities. When the previously mentioned pirate Don Krieg is about to be introduced he is followed by a pirate by the name of Gin. Gin initially appears to be a minor character and is starving, nice and respectful of the crew. Gin eventually betrays the protagonist Sanji and attacks him providing an unpredictability I do not see in Naruto. As a further unpredictability the fight is later interrupted by an even stronger man that is passing by and who nearly kills Zoro. (I know I mentioned people interfering as a cliche in Naruto but I mention this as it does not happen often in One Piece).

Thanks for reading, I look forward to your reply :)
ExiOrca

Con

Ok, next time if you make first round acceptance, you should have at least 4 rounds. Anyhow, if you want I can forfeit round 3.

---Refutation---

My opponent argues that one piece has more story arc which is also apply to Naruto. However, on Naruto's side, the arc contributes to the character growth whereas One Piece's several story arc is just for comedic or battle purpose, and does not have much correlation to the main plot line of the story.
"Haki" that is shown in the first part of One Piece is just a form of foreshadowing and it only occur again in the main plotline, not in any minor plotline until later.
My opponent's arguments of depth and background story of the characters also apply to Naruto. Naruto, Sasuke, Garaa, ... each has their own background story with touching theme of revenge, isolation, social outcast,... whereas One Piece's background story is more cliche as they're just normal revenge or a big dream. An example is the two main characters of the manga, Naruto and Luffy. Luffy's story is just simply a boy who got saved by Shank and want to be the King of the Pirates. The story does not contain complex plotline and very cliche just as you expect from a battlemanga. However, Naruto's story go back to the fact that he doesn't know he's the "Kyubii" (nine-tail fox) and he's hated by everyone in the village. Naruto has a hard time in fitting into the society. The first few chapters of Naruto tells us how the teacher has tried to help Naruto fitting into the society. Also, character development. Luffy is a natural strong main character just as you expected. His growth is only from strong to stronger and he himself doesn't have any rival or match unless the opponent is a really strong officials from the marines or pirates. However, in Naruto, you can clearly see how Naruto has growth from a weak ninja into a strong one through hardworking. His rival, Sasuke, also provide him with a strong competition and you can clearly see Naruto's growth.

The theme is One Piece as my opponent has said is "respect, anger, vengeance, comradeship and even hatred". These theme are much very normal in a battlemanga and each of them apply to Naruto as well. Teacher and student respect in Naruto, Sasuke's hatred and vengeance toward Itachi. The comradeship of fellow ninjas,... Thus none of his theme can proven One Piece to be superior to that of Naruto and it could might be the opposite.

His third point is characters.
"One Piece has a wide variety of characters that differ in every arc as to their motives and powers, much like Naruto"- he has conceded that Naruto also have much of the same characters to that of One Piece.

However, he said "Unlike Naruto which I find predictable as either somebody starts losing and makes a comeback, another person interferes in the fight or the person that is no longer central to the plot is killed/beaten One Piece has a wide variety of plot twists that are fully utilized through characters personalities." --This point is not true. On Naruto, there're not "one" main characters. Each factions and rivals can be considered to be a main character. For example, in the chunin exam, Lee (which we assumed to be a good guy since he's a Leaf village) is a very talented and hardworking man against Garaa (which we assumed that he was a bad guy with his killing intent) is just a cold blooded murderer who killed people in the exam. Lee try very hard in the exam but he was lost; and Garaa is also turned out to be one of the main character in the later arc. Also, Naruto wasn't promoted into a chunin but Shikamaru did. Furthermore, the story of Sasuke and Itachi. Itachi seem to be a very bad guy in the first arc of the story and hate Sasuke. However, he turned out to be a tragic hero who try to help Sasuke and save the Leaf Village.
My opponent point of the pirate Don Krieg and the chef pirate ship. The storyline of that story is very much predictable. It was said by a fellow chef that Don Krieg would betray Sanji, but Sanji(knowing this) still offer him food because he's a chef. Don Krieg was a infamous pirate well-known to everyone and no one on the ship would really expect him to not betray. Moreover, in the end of that one arc, Luffy win the fight just as expected.
"As a further unpredictability the fight is later interrupted by an even stronger man that is passing by and who nearly kills Zoro".
My opponent is referring to Mihawk, one of the legendary pirate. It was said by Don Krieg's crew that this man has cut down their ships and destroy a lot of them. It was also shown very clearly that this is a very strong character. Zoro, who is just a pirate hunter, fought head-on 1 v 1 against Mihawk and it was very easy to see that Zoro would lost. It was an event to contribute to Zoro's character growth and is very predictable.

Anyhow, all of my oponnent's point has failed to prove that One Piece is superior or better than Naruto as most of the characteristic he mentions also apply to that of Naruto.

Please tell me if you want me to forfeit round 3 since I had an extra argument in round 1.
Debate Round No. 2
SevenWarriors1

Pro

I thank my opponent for his advice. I do not request that you to forfeit round 3 although I do want any readers to know I have been asked this by my opponent due to a blunder on my part.
--Rebuttal"
1 " Storyline:
My opponent argues that the arcs of Naruto contribute to character growth as opposed to just being a "comedic" arc that is just for "battle purposes". The example he used was that the first few volumes of Naruto feature the titular characters background and growth. Although this is fine and enjoyable in a manga, it does not prove that Naruto is better than One Piece. As I stated in my arguments although story arcs may contribute to background stories and the aims and ambitions of the One Piece characters, the storyline is better because it does not focus on the here and now as Naruto does but instead focuses on the future as all arcs are linked in one fashion or another to each other.
The example I gave of interconnected storylines was of "haki". My opponent states that the introduction of haki in the primary chapter is "just a form of foreshadowing" and it only "occurs again in the main plotline, not in any minor plotlines until later". This is untrue although I do not wish to concentrate on examples haki appears in several story arcs ranging from the beginning of One Piece towards the middle and the end as is viewed by its use against the villain Hancock and its use by God Eneru and in early storyarcs. Haki appears frequently throughout the early chapters and the later chapters and although possibly a foreshadowing I am not denying it is, rather, I am stating that this foreshadowing aids in keeping the interest of the reader/viewer and makes a story arc a more interesting read than Naruto"s.
One Piece is interconnected in a variety of ways in which Naruto is not whilst still having a similar amount of character development. My opponent comments that Luffy is a "boy" with "big dreams" and remarks that this is "clich" for a battlemanga. I must note that this is not disproving my argument for One Piece being a better manga as I note that Naruto fulfills almost all of these clich"s as Naruto is simply a boy that wants to become Hokage just as Luffy wants to become king of the pirates. This would perhaps elevates Naruto to the same standing as One Piece has One Piece not had the high elements of interconnectedness that allow a reader to enjoy each new reading experience as they discover new connections from old chapters to new chapters. He states that Naruto"s aim is nobler because he has a sense of character growth and I will address this next.
My opponent has also said that Luffy"s goal and "the story does not contain complex plotline" because luffy is "just a boy that got saved by shanks" and "wants to be pirate king". To simplify Luffy"s dream to this extent is like me comparing Naruto"s aim to be Hokage due to his isolation as being a weak boys dream to become the leader of his village just because he wants to be better than everyone. Luffy carries the dream of becoming pirate king because in his childhood he and his friends made a dream to be the pirate king. This dream solidified itself in his heart due to the killing of one of these friends just as Naruto wants to become Hokage due to his "isolation". One Piece is then better than Naruto in this point because Luffy works towards his dream for another person whilst Naruto simply does it for himself.

2 " Themes
My opponent raised the point that Naruto depicts themes of "hatred, revenge, friendship, and many other things which add depth to the story plot" and then goes on to say that One Piece "has a theme of friendship or comradeship, the theme itself doesn't have much depth in it." Although I can see the themes of Naruto, I cannot agree that they make the manga superior to One Piece. I raised the point that as well as comradeship and friendship One Piece holds the themes of hatred, anger, respect and vengeance. He stated in his rebuttal that yes, these themes occur in both mangas but that does not mean One Piece is superior. He then states "it could be the opposite." But does not state why the two being similar makes Naruto better and it does not make One Piece worse to have the same themes.
My opponent mentions in his rebuttal the theme of revenge Sasuke has with his brother Itachi. Although this one point is indeed a critical one I would like to bring light to the fact that Sasuke disappears for most of the manga after leaving for revenge. His motives are there but not truly brought out in the manga as a main theme unless Sasuke is directly involved. One Piece has a rich history of revenge but the point that One Piece makes is that the characters are not consumed by it. Luffy has his own brother killed in front of his eyes after rescuing him and the shock is so great he loses consciousness. Luffy uses this as a motive to become stronger and to grow as a character both physically and mentally. Luffy is not consumed by revenge like Sasuke is not a negative because he used it as an excuse to move on with his life and still attempt to take revenge for his brother. This proves that One Piece is a better manga than Naruto.

3 " Characters

One piece characters have a variety of powers and uniqueness much like Naruto"s. The point of divergence is the originality of the characters and their predictability. My opponent went on to state in his rebuttal that each character can be considered a main character and that each can bring their own predictability. He states that Itachi turned out to be a hero instead of a villain. I myself brought in the argument that a pirate named "Gin" was a nice man who turned out to be a villain that betrays the people who save him. The reason I used this pirate as an example is because the villains in One Piece are too main characters in their own way as I have pointed out many times in my argument due to my constant use of both protagonists and antagonists as a way to further plotline and character growth. This nullifies my opponent"s arguments that One Piece does not have many plot twists although this does not acknowledge that this makes One Piece better than Naruto. What does make One Piece better than Naruto is that as I stated in my first argument "Unlike Naruto which I find predictable as either somebody starts losing and makes a comeback, another person interferes in the fight or the person that is no longer central to the plot is killed/beaten One Piece has a wide variety of plot twists that are fully utilized through characters personalities." I reiterate my previous statement because I have not been convinced by my opponent"s rebuttals, or rather, lack of them on this subject. My opponent quoted this section of my speech but then proceeded to talk about Naruto"s characters saying "there're not "one" main characters [in Naruto]" this does not rebut my argument of predictability. Although his rebuttal states new points of unpredictability with Itachi being a good guy I have equally used the argument that One Piece introduces characters such as "Gin" that turn out to be bad guys when thought good guys. Thus my opponent has perhaps stated that Naruto has the same types of twists as One Piece but fails to address my statement despite saying "this point is not true" without explaining why my point is not true and introducing a new one. The examples I used show different scenarios to those explained as rebuttal by my opponent and so I maintain my stance that One Piece is superior to Naruto in these respects.

My opponent also rebutted my argument about "don krieg" but was mistaken as although I referred to krieg the actual person that I used in my example was the pirate "Gin" who was a man that was good until he later turned on Sanji. This is a simple misread and I will not be expanding on it further as I have explained previously the relevance of this example.

I had a section on Mihawk but ran out of characters.
Thanks for your rebuttal and reading.
ExiOrca

Con

-Rebuttal-
My opponent argues that the arcs of Naruto contribute to character growth as opposed to just being a "comedic" arc that is just for "battle purposes". The example he used was that the first few volumes of Naruto feature the titular characters background and growth. Although this is fine and enjoyable in a manga, it does not prove that Naruto is better than One Piece. As I stated in my arguments although story arcs may contribute to background stories and the aims and ambitions of the One Piece characters, the storyline is better because it does not focus on the here and now as Naruto does but instead focuses on the future as all arcs are linked in one fashion or another to each other.
The example I gave of interconnected storylines was of "haki". My opponent states that the introduction of haki in the primary chapter is "just a form of foreshadowing" and it only "occurs again in the main plotline, not in any minor plotlines until later". This is untrue although I do not wish to concentrate on examples haki appears in several story arcs ranging from the beginning of One Piece towards the middle and the end as is viewed by its use against the villain Hancock and its use by God Eneru and in early storyarcs. Haki appears frequently throughout the early chapters and the later chapters and although possibly a foreshadowing I am not denying it is, rather, I am stating that this foreshadowing aids in keeping the interest of the reader/viewer and makes a story arc a more interesting read than Naruto"s.
First of all, to clarify, I'm debating that One Piece is not a better manga than Naruto not Naruto is a better manga than One Piece.
To rebuttal my opponent's point of "haki". Yes, "haki" interconnects the story arc and again as I said earlier, only the main story arc. God Eneru or Hancock are both important characters that served its purpose in the main storyline. For example, when Rayleigh teachs "haki" to Luffy, he used Eneru as an example. Most of the minor plotlines in One Piece like foxy pirate are just there for battlemanga purpose but not really connect in the main storyline.

"the storyline is better because it does not focus on the here and now as Naruto does but instead focuses on the future"
False, Naruto does not focus on here and now, throughout the story, the author has put together scene where past and present conflict against each other and make contradiction unlike what we would predict and that make the story very complex, unpredictable and fun to read. One Piece. on the other hand, does not focus on the future as much as so is Naruto. One Piece mainly focus on the present fighting scene between Luffy and another antagonist, though it keep referring about Luffy's dream of becoming the King of Pirate which is the same as Naruto's dream of becoming a Hokage. This does not prove that One Piece is superior to that of Naruto.

"Luffy carries the dream of becoming pirate king because in his childhood he and his friends made a dream to be the pirate king".
Luffy does not have the dream of becoming the pirate king because of his childhood. He simply want to become a pirate king to prove himself to Shank and his brother, Ace. Whereas Naruto, his dream indeed come from the isolation that he felt and wish to accepted by become Hokage, but he doesn't want to be better than everyone. His goal to be Hokage, simplify as he wants to be acknowledge and want to protect the village. He also wants to become Hokage so that he will become known for protection for his family (village) instead of a monster who kill his parents. He also works really hard to achieve his goal and learn a lot of lessons on his journey. Luffy, however, seems pretty straightforward and predictable. He wants to be the Pirate King because he want to prove himself, not to be acknowledge. His dream can be compare to a person saying they will become the President of a country. Throughout the story, Luffy growth can easily be seen and predict, as he only lose against strong and important characters like the admirals and he wins all his fight in the minor story arc as well as early arc.

"Although I can see the themes of Naruto, I cannot agree that they make the manga superior to One Piece."
Again, I'm debating that One Piece is not superior.

"Sasuke disappears for most of the manga after leaving for revenge".
I am not so sure about this point but anyhow, Sasuke's journey on revenge was easily seen and has been clearly plot out throughout the story. Even if he did disappear, the author did give flashback on his past and his journey to make clear to the reader.
"His motives are there but not truly brought out in the manga as a main theme unless Sasuke is directly involved". Yes, Sasuke is one of the main character and this theme is directly put on him. The theme itself show that a person will lead a dark life if they're consumed by revenge as is shown by Sasuke.
"Luffy is not consumed by revenge like Sasuke is not a negative because he used it as an excuse to move on with his life and still attempt to take revenge for his brother. This proves that One Piece is a better manga than Naruto."
Luffy doesn't get consume by revenge doesn't make One Piece a better manga than Naruto. It just two different stories. One get consume by revenge and lead a dark life whereas the other doesn't get consume. Both also use the revenge motive to get stronger.

"I myself brought in the argument that a pirate named "Gin" was a nice man who turned out to be a villain that betrays the people who save him"
1. Gin was never proven to be a good character at the start of that particular scene. He simply arouses sympathy due to his extreme hunger.
2. Gin was part of the Don Krieg pirate which is well known as "bad".
3. Gin was never proven to be a "nice person". At the last scene, he knocks Don Krieg unconscious because he felt they lost against Luffy and he also want to thanks for the food. This doesn't mean he's a good guy. He also did say he will come back one day.

My opponent want to put an emphasize on this particular point"Unlike Naruto which I find predictable as either somebody starts losing and makes a comeback, another person interferes in the fight or the person that is no longer central to the plot is killed/beaten One Piece has a wide variety of plot twists that are fully utilized through characters personalities." I did address this point in my earlier statement but apparently fail to convince my opponent. My point was Lee (a character that we assume a good guy since he's a Leaf Village) lost against Garaa (a character we assume to be a bad guy with his killing intent and hatred). And in the later arc, Garaa also turn out to be a good guy and aid the Leaf Village in time of emergency. This wasn't predictable as my opponent said. Another point of mine is Itachi, a tragic hero, who was a coldblood murderer and hate his brother as we assume in the earlier arc turn out to be a person who turn himself into a villain to protect his brother, which is not predictable. Anyhow, if my point fail to convince my opponent, this still doesn't mean One Piece is superior than Naruto.

I have finish rebut against all of my opponent's points.
I thanks my opponent for the debate.

Debate Round No. 3
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by ExiOrca 3 years ago
ExiOrca
Oh lol, I didn't notice, I was copy and paste it so I can read it easier but I forgot to delete. My bad! Doh
Posted by SevenWarriors1 3 years ago
SevenWarriors1
Actually when i look back you were rebutting it afterwards, sorry xD
Posted by SevenWarriors1 3 years ago
SevenWarriors1
It has been a good first debate :), thank you for introducing me to the DDO.
During your last rebuttal why did you copy and paste a whole section of my rebuttal as your start?
No votes have been placed for this debate.