The Instigator
socialpinko
Pro (for)
Winning
1 Points
The Contender
kimjohnny13
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points

One should not be forced to say the pledge of allegience in school.

Do you like this debate?NoYes-2
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
socialpinko
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/1/2011 Category: Education
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,277 times Debate No: 15051
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (0)
Votes (1)

 

socialpinko

Pro

I will take the pro position that it is wrong to force a student or child to recite the pledge of allegience.

Forced: enforced or compulsory
http://dictionary.reference.com...
kimjohnny13

Con

I believe that one should force students to say the pledge of allegiance in schools. If student is forced to say the pledge of allegiance student he/she will feel prod for their country. If school does not force students to say the pledge of allegiance, they will not feel prod of themselves and their country

So therefore, school should force students to say the pledge of allegiance in schools
Debate Round No. 1
socialpinko

Pro

"If student is forced to say the pledge of allegiance student he/she will feel prod for their country."

Please show why taking away a student's freedom of speech should will make him/her more proud of his/her country?

"If school does not force students to say the pledge of allegiance, they will not feel prod of themselves and their country"

I think that allowing student's to exercise their freedom's outlined in the Bill of Rights will do much more to make them proud of their country then doing something as authoritarian as forced speech.

And who says that the point of school is to make students nationalistic? Isn't the right to dissent and the freedom of speech what would make a child proud of his/her country? I would be much more proud of a country where I am not forced to recite something that I might not believe. This is not North Korea. You always hear people saying America is the freest nation on earth. Well not with authoritative laws like forced reciting of the pledge of allegience.
kimjohnny13

Con

Thank you for speaking,

First of all, I did not say that schools are made to make us nationalistic.
I did say that if they say the pledge of allegiance in schools they will be proud of their country.
Not all of them would feel proud however, there must be few people who do make them selves proud.
I do not understand why you were saying something about "Freedom of speech" because this issue does not take the freedom of speech away.

I won't say that schools are forcing anyone to say that. I think it is one of the school rules they made.
I cannot say why they did that because I am not a principle of any schools.
There are people who like this and there must be people who don't
But school rules are schools rules.
They did not make rules to bother the fellow students
No one might think that it is taking the freedom of speech away.
Don't you think that there are students who just got used to it?

Sir, can you explain more about "Freedom of speech"
And how it is taking away the freedom of speech?
Debate Round No. 2
socialpinko

Pro

"I did not say that schools are made to make us nationalistic."

You did say that saying the pledge of allegiance at school will make students proud of their country. Why do they have to say it at school? Why not at home or somewhere else?

"I do not understand why you were saying something about "Freedom of speech" because this issue does not take the freedom of speech away."

You really do not understand how forcing someone to say something that they may not believe is taking away their freedom of speech? Think about it this way. Would you think your rights were being taken away if the government forced you to admit to crimes you didn't commit or forced you to recite a pledge of allegiance to a political figure or a religion?

"Free speech in this case meant the right not to say something, in this case, the Pledge of Allegiance."
http://www.enotes.com...

This is from the landmark case of West Virginia State Board of Education vs. Barnette. In the case it was decided that the freedom of speech also applied to the right not to say something.

Freedom of religion

Students should also not be forced to recite the pledge of allegiance because of the first ammendment right of freedom of religion. This is because of the phrase in the pledge, "one nation under god". This would force atheists, agnostics, and nonreligious students to accept the existence of a deity. How can a nation be "under god" if there is no god. This phrase is clearly unconstitutional but that is subject for another debate.

The freedom of religion is also taken away when Jehovah's Witnesses are forced to recite the pledge. Jehovah's Witnesses object to pledging allegiance to anything besides god, including country. These students had their freedom of religion taken away by a rule that was supposed to make them proud of their country. I am certainly not proud of a country that starts taking away rights so early in one's life.

"I won't say that schools are forcing anyone to say that. "
"I believe that one should force students to say the pledge of allegiance in schools."

Please stick to a position.

"But school rules are schools rules."

You provide no argument, you merely state that it is a rule without providing justification.

"They did not make rules to bother the fellow students"

It does not matter why the rule was made, it matters that it takes away student's rights.

"No one might think that it is taking the freedom of speech away."

Again, no argument. Even if no one thought this rule was wrong, that would not mean it's not taking away precious first ammendment rights.

"Don't you think that there are students who just got used to it?"

Still no arument. Do I have to repeat myself?

"And how it is taking away the freedom of speech?"

I adequately explained this with the case of West Virginia State Board of Education vs. Barnette.

You have also not provided any reasons why being forced to recite something you may not believe makes a student proud of his/her country.
kimjohnny13

Con

kimjohnny13 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
No comments have been posted on this debate.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by Cliff.Stamp 3 years ago
Cliff.Stamp
socialpinkokimjohnny13Tied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:--Vote Checkmark3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:10 
Reasons for voting decision: Forfeit.