The Instigator
MrBurns2017
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
somerandomvideocreator
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

Only important subjects should be mandatory and choice of subjects should be at maximum

Do you like this debate?NoYes+2
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 0 votes the winner is...
It's a Tie!
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 9/2/2017 Category: Education
Updated: 10 months ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 481 times Debate No: 103769
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (3)
Votes (0)

 

MrBurns2017

Pro

I think that important subjects should exist in the system, but only to a certain time.

Here is how I see the ideal education system.

Primary School
============
No homework.
No foreign language course unless you are in a non-english speaking country or in a country where it is highly desirable to know an additional language (like in Canada which has many French speakers and recognizes French as their second official language).
3 subjects at most.
Maths should be compulsory and the other subjects should be a choice.

Middle School
============
No compulsory subjects.
Homework should exist.
The student will choose to learn between any 5-12 subjects he wants.
The aim is to broaden the students knowledge of different subjects and get rid of any spelling and grammar mistakes he has that remained since primary school.

High School
==========
A choice of between 3-4 subjects.
Homework should exist.
The school should pay for an educational adviser to advise the student on what he wants to do at uni. And according to that, advise him what subjects to choose.

In my opinion the school systems that match my model the most are the Finnish and British systems. And they do very well, above most of other educational systems in the world.
The finish educational system of primary schools doesnt give homework and invests more in classes, including computerized technology and the British system has a good middle school and high school systems that rely on GCSE's and A-Levels.

A background about myself. I went through an Israeli educational system which was horrible and looked like that.

Primary school
============
All subjects were compulsory.
Homework existed.
Subjects (I can remember most of them and not all).
Hebrew
English
Maths
Biology
Torah
Art
Computer studies
Sports

Middle School
============
All compulsory.
Homework existed.
One big coursework.

Maths
Biology
Chemistry
Physics
Literature
Arabic
English
Arabic history
Geography
History
Torah
Sports

High School
==========
Homework existed.

Compulsory subjects:
English
Literature
History
Maths (at this level you are classified into 3 tiers from most to least advanced)
Civil studies
Sports

Choice of subjects:
If you belonged to the more advanced tiers of maths, those subjects were available to you.
Biology
Chemistry
Computer Science
Physics

If you belonged to the lowest tier of maths (like me), this is what was available.
Geography
Art
(other schools might have a wider choice of subjects that are not math related such as psychology, sociology, politics, foreign language etc).

Another point, I was assessed through a constant assessment. That means 3 tests every week on the material you studied last week.

I moved to UK at 11 grade (there are total of 12 grades in the Israeli system and an option to continue to grade 14 if you want to specialize in some subjects) to finish my studies and started with the GCSE's. UK system assesses your progress like in university, which is at the end of year.

So who can argue against my ideal educational system that I proposed?
somerandomvideocreator

Con

Your education system would be a bit too broad. While it is certainly good to have more freedom when it comes to courses, here are some courses that are minimum:

Mathematics
Science
Language
Reading Comprehension

Basically, the core subjects. Also, to ensure that students get a broad view of all different aspects of education, here are courses that should be required for at least one semester:

Art
Music
PE
Debate Round No. 1
MrBurns2017

Pro

Could you specify your perfect educational system? and you didnt specify when a student should learn what subjects.
somerandomvideocreator

Con

Here would be my education system:

Elementary School:
Math (every year)
LA + Reading (every year)
Science (every year)

Middle School:
Math (every year)
LA + Reading (every year)
Science (every year)
1 Semester of Art and Music

High School:
Math (every year)
LA + Reading (every year)
Science (every year)
1 Semester of Computer Science and PE
Debate Round No. 2
MrBurns2017

Pro

I guess all the subjects that you have listed are compulsory.

Well, with the elementary school system, I dont disagree so much.. It could be made to a decent system.

But with the middle school, what makes your system better than mine?
Why to waste energy on music and art. That wasted effort and money could go on maths, and why science is compulsory?
What if a person doesnt like biology and likes physics? or hates all sciences altogether, can he choose?
I did science in the middles school in Israel, and it gave me nothing. All that biology, chemistry and physics havent changed me a bit. I then repeated middle school in UK and chose Geography and Business instead. I enjoyed myself more and did learn quite interesting facts.. it was fun. Again, you dont try to justify the subjects in your system. Why to force the students study music, arts and sciences (apart from maths)?

Your high school system is just absurd.
somerandomvideocreator

Con

I think that it is important that everyone should get a high school level of language, mathematics, and reading. Science, while it may be not interesting to many people, is an important part of education. While a high school level might be too much, an elementary school level seems too low. Do you think that this system would be decent?

Elementary School: Math, LA, Science (required)
Middle School: Math, LA, Science (required)
High School: Math and LA (required)
Debate Round No. 3
MrBurns2017

Pro

Elementary School: Math, LA, Science (required) -> This is sort of okay. I would reduce the emphasis on science.

Middle School: Math, LA, Science (required) -> Again okay. I would eliminate science at all.

High School: Math and LA (required) -> I would make the system based on choice. No compulsory subjects.

You present your system..and dont justify, nor argue against my system. - Thats not much of a debate.

Here is why my system works.

Lets do some maths.

Lets take 10 random people.

I believe that there are 2 things that drives success: Discipline and Motivation.
If you dont have both, you really got nothing. Think about it! and you will see that I am right.

Because you deal with people who have different levels of motivations and disciplines, and you force them to study what they dont want.. You get students with low scores and you get drop outs.
There arent many reasons to have a lot of students with low scores. But you do get them. Why?

Because..

If you take the 10 random people, and you teach them maths, you get 3 people who are good at maths, and 1 of them continues the full academic route (a first degree, if you are really really lucky a phd, and if you are really really lucky a good/great scientist).

What happens to the other 9 people?!? They get their school diploma, and attend a university that is below what they could have been accepted for. That is because of their grades. A lot of them wont do well in maths like they would do for example in psychology (or any other subject they like).

Your system creates waste in the system. Waste of money, energy and potentially good human capital.

All lead to worse economy at the end.
somerandomvideocreator

Con

1. You did not list Language Arts as a compulsory subject. How can students get rid of mistakes in LA in middle school without having even gone through LA in elementary school.
2. People need at least an elementary-school level science. Otherwise, people would graduate not even knowing what gravity is.

This is why your educational system is not ideal.
Debate Round No. 4
MrBurns2017

Pro

I think this debate needed to have 3 rounds alone. You cant put any strong argument against me.

Language Arts, lolz.. what is that anyway?

And btw, I graduated from universtiy and I dont know what gravity is.
somerandomvideocreator

Con

Conclusion: Overall, your final round argument was rather insufficient. It is necessary to have language arts to ensure that students know grammar (sO they dont right like dis) And it is rather sad to me that you don't know what gravity is. It is something that everyone should know.
Debate Round No. 5
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by MrBurns2017 10 months ago
MrBurns2017
Only with 3 documentaries on astro physics, I will know more than you about gravity and physics, somerandomvideocreator.
Posted by MrBurns2017 10 months ago
MrBurns2017
Only with 3 documentaries on astro physics, I will know more than you about gravity and physics, somerandomvideocreator.
Posted by MrBurns2017 10 months ago
MrBurns2017
I forgot to add a point.

Even if you take a high school student and make him learn all the subjects that you mentioned (including physics).

I would still do better!
Because I would pick up the books that I am interested and read them one after the other (e.g. I am reading now, a Brief History of Time by Stephan Hawkins).

And about spelling/grammar mistakes. I could simply use this forum to improve them, or write my own book and distribute it online...

But there is no need to..not even competing with a high school student.. cause all what they teach you there doesnt apply to real life.. and you mostly never need it, all which refutes your conclusion and makes this conclusion valid:
"Just learn what you want to know in high school, and enjoy yourself"

Dont spend your life pleasing other people.
No votes have been placed for this debate.