The Instigator
MASTERY
Pro (for)
Winning
2 Points
The Contender
JasonMartin-327
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points

Opponent picks topic.

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
MASTERY
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/27/2014 Category: Miscellaneous
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 467 times Debate No: 50025
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (2)
Votes (2)

 

MASTERY

Pro


Welcome to the debate.

This is a special debate, with special formats as follows.

FORMAT

1st round-Pro Introduce the parameters
Self-explanatory
1st round-Con Provide the possible arguments
Provide ten possible arguments for me to choose from. Do NOT try to define or explain the arguments, as I can interpret the arguments any way I wish. Anything here should only be greetings or topics. I decide which side I wish to be, IGNORE the fact that debate.org says that I'm pro. The debate topics have to be somewhat different, to prevent ten rewording of a single topic. I can change the topic you provide slightly as well for the debate to be a fun experience. At the start of round 2 I will underline and bold the confirmed topic.
2nd round-Pro Argument & selection of topic.
I will provide a confirmed topic here, define the topic and supply my arguments as necessary. My side (pro/con) will also be clearly stated here. Please cite all research and arguments. Please provide evidence for all arguments.
2nd round-Con Argument & Rebuttal.
Provide your arguments and rebuttal in this round. Again, please cite research provide evidence for arguments.
3rd round-Pro Argument & Rebuttal.
Provide your arguments and rebuttal in this round. Again, please cite research provide evidence for arguments.
3rd round-Con Argument & Rebuttal.
Provide your arguments and rebuttal in this round. Again, please cite research provide evidence for arguments.
4th round-Pro Argument & Rebuttal.
Provide your arguments and rebuttal in this round. Again, please cite research provide evidence for arguments.
4th round-Con Argument & Rebuttal.
Provide your arguments and rebuttal in this round. Again, please cite research provide evidence for arguments. Pro Conclusion & Rebuttal.
5th round-Con Conclusion & Rebuttal.
Rebut arguments and provide a conclusion in this round. No new arguments.
5th round-Con Conclusion & Rebuttal.
Rebut arguments and provide a conclusion in this round. No new arguments.

No abusive language please. The topics that con picks should not be abusive. The topic has to be debatable worldwide. "My opponent picks the topic." is only a placeholder for real topic, so you may NOT post "I am not posting any topics, therefore I win" or something along those lines. Also, please post topics that are easy to debate on both sides. Topic should not be about religion or celebrities etc.

Failure to follow the rules and format stated above results in a full 7-point forfeit to the opposing team. Argument forfeitures also result in full 7-point forfeitures.

Rule breakage will result into a full 7 point loss unless forgiven by the opponent (special conditions such as debate topic chosen by opponent can be included if opponent broke rules). Also, justified rule breakage (including forfeiture due to previous opponent forfeiture) does not count as rule breakage.

PLEASE READ THE FORMAT AND RULES.

I hope we have a good debate.

Time limit for each argument: 3 days.
Character limit: 5000

Thank you.
JasonMartin-327

Con

Right, I'm not too sure if I can come up with up to TEN different arguments, but I know I must try, so here goes.

Here are all the arguments I can think of:

Aviators is the best MLP artist
Bronism is the true religion
MLP: FiM is the best show ever
Portal is the best game series
Bronies are the most important people in society
People with autism are extremely important in society
Equestria and the MLP society exists (and so does the fourth wall)
"My Little Portal" is the worst fanfic ever
What defines the characteristics of a true Brony?
What is the best song by Aviators?

Hey, what do you know? I should probably be pretty smart and determined to actually come up with TEN different arguments. BTW, sorry that most of them are kindaof the same topic, I'm a huge Brony and really want to let the world know exactly what I believe in and what I think of the universe. Take all the time you need, I shall be waiting patiently. Thank you.
Debate Round No. 1
MASTERY

Pro

I would like to thank my opponent for accepting my debate and providing me with ten topics. While I won't give you a 7-point forfeit because of this, you need to read my first round rules carefully (Bronism is the true religion & 'Also, please post topics that are easy to debate on both sides. Topic should not be about religion or celebrities etc.')

I have chosen the topic 'Most people with autism are extremely important in society'. I am con for this topic. I have inserted a most to avoid confusion.

Most: 'to the greatest extent.' (In this case, above 80%)

Autism: 'a mental condition, present from early childhood, characterized by difficulty in communicating and forming relationships with other people and in using language and abstract concepts.'

Extremely: 'to a very great degree; very.'

Importa
nt: 'of great significance or value; likely to have a profound effect on success, survival, or well-being.'


Society: 'the aggregate of people living together in a more or less ordered community.'

All definitions are from Google search (type in define 'replace this with the word you wish to get a definition').

I need not argue that people with autism are not important in society; but I need to argue that they are of average or above average (but not too much) importance. While not needed, I can still argue they are not important in society.

ARGUMENT
So, how are people with autism extremely important? They are simply people of average or slightly above average importance in the community. They may have been some famous and important austic people such as Albeit Einstein, but they are definitely NOT common. Austic people general belong as a member of they community, but on rare occasions like normal people they may become famous. If we removed austic people from this world, the world would certainly not be much worse off. Everything would be normal. Simply, how are MOST austic people EXTREMELY IMPORTANT to the world? I will assume most as at least 80%. Has 80% of austic people contributed to something EXTREMELY IMPORTANT to society? Of course not. Only a few have become extremely important to society such as Edison, who invented the light bulb. Have you ever seen a news article highlighting that most austic people are extremely important to society?

I await my opponent's response.

Thank you.

JasonMartin-327

Con

JasonMartin-327 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2
MASTERY

Pro

My opponent has forfeited the previous round, thus obtaining a 7 point forfeit. I extend arguments. Simply, people with autism are not EXTREMELY important to soceity.

Thank you.
JasonMartin-327

Con

I most sincerely apologize for forfeiting this round, I actually thought that I had posted my argument. :/

Okay, then. Now the reason that I have chosen what I have chosen, and the reason that I think that autistic people are the most important people is because, well, I have it, as well as many other people that I have no knowledge of. Autistic people in general are not uncommon; about 1 in 11 people in the world have it, and you'd be surprised how many of them live in Utah, the state where I have slowly and idly spent my almost 14 years of existence and have spent most of my life in a school for autistic people. ALTHOUGH I would have to say, the school has really opened my eyes about how extremely DIFFERENT autistic people are. And, yes, I can most definitely compare that they are quite more different than average people. Only rarely is it kinda below average; e.g. "Radio", "A Mile in His Shoes", and even then the guy was able to show that he was WAY above the average person in that particular area/category. Actually, honestly I have spent most of my time with a lot of the other 20% of those people, with just a little bit of the 80%. THOSE people are, I guess, good, fine enough to do something to society, I mean, I've been friends with some of them and then had a weird relationship with them for almost four years.

Usually friendship is just a basic thing, just a little thing to keep you going on in life, but that's just one of the many things that people without autism MISS. And with my extremely unique sort of autism and my somewhat exotic and sad friendship (AND my being of a Brony, and a huge one at that), I have been taught that friendship is actually a LOT more than what anyone ever would've thought. And again, that's just one of the many things that normal people tend to miss a lot!

Almost all people with autism are a lot more aware of their surroundings, a state in which I and a certain someone else likes to call "Pinkie Keen". This term has been derived from the popular MLP: FiM character Pinkie Pie, whom I can relate to in a lot of ways. What am I saying? I can relate to ALL of the Mane Six in more ways than one. But that's not the point. The point is, the state of feeling "Pinkie Keen" is a term in which I guess means that you have the opportunity to dig deeper into your autism and history and purpose, and if all that is at least the tiniest bit unusual, BREAK the fourth wall!

Now, honestly, I have no idea whatsoever exactly what the fourth wall is, but I guess you don't really know until you break it yourself. But my theory is that the fourth wall is this abstract thing that connects people with disorders such as autism, and possibly somewhat lucky Bronies (in which I theoretically fit both of those things), to a different universe, which I guess by theory is different for everyone. For Bronies, it's the MLP world...That's all I can think of at this time. And only the person themself can find a possible way to somehow "break" it and become one with their channeled universe. So far, no one has ever been able to do that, but there is ALWAYS a first time for everything. Everyone with this state has a chance, always, even non-autistic Bronies who can at least BEAR the thought of turning into a pony. Now, a lot of people can't, but I can, and I'm sure a lot of autistic people could probably bear something like that.

Now all of this just goes to show that if, and much possible WHEN, any person with autism has the ability to do things like this; like I said, anyone in this 80% has the opportunity; they can definitely show that people with autism should most definitely be treated like an important part of society, because, the way I see it, they most definitely have the opportunity to become so. Not that I am saying that they aren't already, just saying the process that all shall take to become so.

Just in case you were wondering, that special someone who created the term "Pinkie Keen" is a man named Tyler Shaw and called Aviators, who is a really awesome and inspiring indie electronic musician who is huge on the MLP fan side. He doesn't have autism, but that's just the thing. It's become clearer now that Bronies and people with autism are more connected to each other than any other types of people. And let's not forget, it's the connections that people have with each other that can make anything truly important. And the contributions they have all made to society! Man, I had never wanted a normal life, and this is just what I need to get what I do want, which is to break the fourth wall and live in Equestria with the cute ponies!!!!!!! (No one without autism could ever in a million years want anything like that so badly, THAT's just how special we are).

Oy, I'm running out of characters. I'd tell you a little bit more, but I guess I will have to finish up my argument. So my conclusion is that there is so much more to autistic people than most anyone thinks, and the same just applies to Bronies.
Debate Round No. 3
MASTERY

Pro

REBUTTAL

Autistic people in general are not uncommon; about 1 in 11 people in the world have it, and you'd be surprised how many of them live in Utah, the state where I have slowly and idly spent my almost 14 years of existence and have spent most of my life in a school for autistic people.

This does nothing to prove your case. The amount of people that are autistic does not affect they are extremely important. Even if 100% of the world was autistic, if 80% were extremely important, that wouldn't be true as they'd be in the MAJORITY of people.

ALTHOUGH I would have to say, the school has really opened my eyes about how extremely DIFFERENT autistic people are. And, yes, I can most definitely compare that they are quite more different than average people.

This also does nothing to prove your case, they might be different but that doesn't mean they're important.

Only rarely is it kinda below average; e.g. "Radio", "A Mile in His Shoes", and even then the guy was able to show that he was WAY above the average person in that particular area/category.

It's importance not smartness/giftness in an area.

Actually, honestly I have spent most of my time with a lot of the other 20% of those people, with just a little bit of the 80%. THOSE people are, I guess, good, fine enough to do something to society, I mean, I've been friends with some of them and then had a weird relationship with them for almost four years.

You have NOT proved why the 80% are of very great value to the community, proving the 20% aren't bad doesn't mean the 80% are of EXTREME IMPORTANCE to society.

Usually friendship is just a basic thing, just a little thing to keep you going on in life, but that's just one of the many things that people without autism MISS. And with my extremely unique sort of autism and my somewhat exotic and sad friendship (AND my being of a Brony, and a huge one at that), I have been taught that friendship is actually a LOT more than what anyone ever would've thought. And again, that's just one of the many things that normal people tend to miss a lot!

So, how do people without autism miss friendship? Even if they did, that doesn't make people with autism extremely important to society.

Almost all people with autism are a lot more aware of their surroundings, a state in which I and a certain someone else likes to call "Pinkie Keen". This term has been derived from the popular MLP: FiM character Pinkie Pie, whom I can relate to in a lot of ways. What am I saying? I can relate to ALL of the Mane Six in more ways than one. But that's not the point. The point is, the state of feeling "Pinkie Keen" is a term in which I guess means that you have the opportunity to dig deeper into your autism and history and purpose, and if all that is at least the tiniest bit unusual, BREAK the fourth wall!

How does being aware of their surroundings make them EXTREMELY IMPORTANT to society?

Now, honestly, I have no idea whatsoever exactly what the fourth wall is...

Prove that it makes people with autism EXTREMELY IMPORTANT.

Now all of this just goes to show that if, and much possible WHEN, any person with autism has the ability to do things like this; like I said, anyone in this 80% has the opportunity; they can definitely show that people with autism should most definitely be treated like an important part of society, because, the way I see it, they most definitely have the opportunity to become so. Not that I am saying that they aren't already, just saying the process that all shall take to become so.

So, they should be treated like an important part of society. But are they already?

Just in case you were wondering, that special someone who created the term "Pinkie Keen" is a man named Tyler Shaw and called Aviators, who is a really awesome and inspiring indie electronic musician who is huge on the MLP fan side. He doesn't have autism, but that's just the thing. It's become clearer now that Bronies and people with autism are more connected to each other than any other types of people. And let's not forget, it's the connections that people have with each other that can make anything truly important. And the contributions they have all made to society! Man, I had never wanted a normal life, and this is just what I need to get what I do want, which is to break the fourth wall and live in Equestria with the cute ponies!!!!!!! (No one without autism could ever in a million years want anything like that so badly, THAT's just how special we are).

And how does that connection relate to people with autism being an important part of society.

Overall, you have just argued the benefits of autism, NOT why people with autism are EXTREMELY IMPORTANT to society. These two things are very different.

Thank you.

JasonMartin-327

Con

JasonMartin-327 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
MASTERY

Pro

Oh well, another forfeit.
JasonMartin-327

Con

Once again, I am terribly sorry for the inconvenience; time just wasn't on my side. Well, really nothing was on my side for the past couple days, except maybe regret and defeat, and possibly "too much". But I believe I can still continue on with this.

Now, going back to the debate, I do very much believe I have made my point here. What you're doing here is just looking at the cover of my arguments, a very common mistake that most people so often make. What I usually do when I am reading and listening to arguments is I actually think about them a lot more deeper and actually THINK about exactly which part of society the arguments would affect. Yes, I believe that I have stated some of the biggest benefits of having autism, but you see, that's just the thing.

In order to determine whether or not autistic people are important to society, you need to think about all the benefits and differences that I have stated in my arguments, because in my mind, because some autistic people see the world in a whole different way, they have the opportunity to teach and let the other people know how they see so, so that maybe at least some other people can have a good idea how their views on the world can have possible effects to society and the general community, therefore making them quite important to so, if only they would just give us more CHANCES!

I mean, LOOK at me! I've been stuck in the same school for the past eight and a half years, and I have absolutely no honest idea exactly how autistic people are treated and looked at in society, but I do know that right now, it's not good. Only in the movies are we treated in the good, most important way possible. And right now, I've been going through a few really horrible emotions, unable to recover from the quite drastic effects of cold, hard reality. If only people could appreciate us for who we are and just try to understand JUST how important we could be to this world. After all, it's the only world we have.

By the way, that was mainly directed towards our viewers looking at this right now, who could maybe try to understand what I'm going through as an imaginative, out-of-mind autistic Brony. So, basically what I'm trying to say is that some things in this world require much more than thought of facts and history and all that. Sometimes, just SOMETIMES, it's the feelings inside, the personal opinions that we all have, and all that stuff. Also, sorry if I am not putting down too important things, Right now I am at a loss because of my emotions and my slight illness over these past couple days. You know, I guess I should probably just let the people think about this. I do very much believe I have made a few excellent points here, and I really can't do any more here right now. I just really wish that all the viewers here can try to understand the point I'm trying to make here.

So to wrap up all that I have said throughout this debate, there's a lot more to autistic people than most people think. I just don't know if I can explain everything in words as to why and how they are quite important to society. To all the people out here seeing this right now, I really hope that you can somehow get the kind of vibe I am trying to create here. I will be waiting, slowly recovering from all of this hardship.

Thank you.
Debate Round No. 5
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by JasonMartin-327 2 years ago
JasonMartin-327
Seriously? There has to be more than just that to define the rightness and heart of a debater. Next voters, please don't use a horrible reason like that.
Posted by MASTERY 2 years ago
MASTERY
Woah...that's a hard list to be choosing from. I'll reply about half a day later.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by 9spaceking 2 years ago
9spaceking
MASTERYJasonMartin-327Tied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
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Total points awarded:10 
Reasons for voting decision: ff
Vote Placed by Ameliamk1 2 years ago
Ameliamk1
MASTERYJasonMartin-327Tied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
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Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
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Total points awarded:10 
Reasons for voting decision: Con forfeited two rounds, and so the debate.