The Instigator
tvellalott
Pro (for)
Losing
11 Points
The Contender
annhasle
Con (against)
Winning
13 Points

PC gaming versus Console gaming

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 8 votes the winner is...
annhasle
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/5/2011 Category: Entertainment
Updated: 6 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 6,599 times Debate No: 14673
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (54)
Votes (8)

 

tvellalott

Pro

PC GAMING VERSUS CONSOLE GAMING

Ann and I were discussing doing a tech-related debate and this is what I came up with.

Pro: PC
Con: Console
(That works quite well, doesn't it.)

Standard rules; this first round is only for accepting the terms and to allow Ann to add anything she may want to add, rounds 2, 3 & 4 are for arguments and rebuttals and round 5 is final rebuttals and conclusion. No new arguments are to be made in round 5.

Please RFD when you vote and enjoy. ^_-

annhasle

Con

Thanks for the challenge! I'm looking forward to our debate. It's been awhile since I've argued about anything technological so this should be fun!

I accept the terms and have nothing further to add.

And once again, I urge all readers to RFD if they vote so both Tvellalott and I can improve as debaters and focus on areas where we might need a little more work. Thanks for reading!
Debate Round No. 1
tvellalott

Pro

INTRODUCTION
In this age of Xbox Live and Wii Store, the once epic gap between PC and console has all but closed. I believe them to be almost equal platforms and perhaps with just one or two more generations of consoles, that gap will be completely closed, perhaps with consoles finally outdoing the modest PC.

With that said, here are my arguments for why PC gaming is currently superior:



ARGUMENTS


The availability of third-party developed games:
We are only just now seeing any third-party presence on consoles, namely those provided by WiiWare (World of Goo is AWESOME and well worth the $15 dollars I paid for it).
However, the PC has a truly epic wealth of third-party developed games. Between Kongregate and Newgrounds, you have at least hundreds of excellent quality games, free, at your fingertips.

It will take consoles a quite a while to catch up to PC in this regard and it’s highly unlikely to ever be free.


Community modification:
PC is leaps and bounds ahead of consoles in this regard. Compare using map editing software or writing, testing and implementing modifications to games on PC to the Xbox 360.

There is simply no competition.


Games of the past:
Personal anecdote: I’ve recently been re-enjoying the Star Wars movies. At the end, I felt the desire to further immerse myself in the fictional universe.
What was my solution? Play Jedi Knight II: Jedi Outcast, released in 2002; a truly excellent game.


I purpose that playing the retro game of your fancy is exceedingly more difficult on a console than on a PC. Again, I know Nintendo are doing ground-breaking work bringing retro games to the most modern consoles, but they are still far behind PC.

Experiment to prove this contention:
Select a console game from the past that you loved and would play again.
How difficult would it be to set a friend up in another country so that they could play that game?

Console games: Even if they had the console required, you would still have to send the actual game. Add a level of risk, expense and difficulty if they don’t have the console and you want to ship yours to them.

PC games: If possible, they could directly download the game. If not, the disk could be sent via the post…

This is an excellent Segway to my next point…


Backwards compatibility:
I’m well aware that with changing operating systems, not all PC games are backwards compatible straight out of the box. However, our modern operating systems allow for the marvellous thing called VIRTUAL MACHINES. This practically ensures that any game ever released for the PC will work on your PC.

Consoles obviously don’t bode so well.
Between Sega, Nintendo, Sony and Microsoft you have at least a dozen different consoles. Even within the consoles released by the individual companies compatibility is limited.



CONCLUSION
  • One only needs a PC and an internet connection to have access to more games than they could ever finish in their lifetimes, completely free.
  • Third-party developers can much more easily produce new content for a game on the PC compared to a console. This adds significant replayability to the games you already own.
  • Games of the past are much more easily obtained on the PC compared to obsolete consoles.
  • Any game ever developed for PC can still be played on your new PC, often without any difficulty.

PC > CONSOLE

VOTE Pro.
annhasle

Con

Thanks for the fast reply and sorry for my own reluctance of posting my argument. I had a work related emergency but I'm here now! Let's begin!

> REBUTTALS <

The availability of third-party developed games:

I'm glad that my opponent bought his copy of World of Goo. It is an amazing indie title game but sadly, games of it's kind have become subject to high levels of piracy. My opponent's example, World of Goo, has a 90% piracy rate [1]. These risks within third-party development have led to a decreasing level of motivation to continue producing independent games for PC instead of joining forces with publishers.

However, since the mid-2000's experienced such an increase in attention on third party produced games, Microsoft began planning their line of attack. On November 19, 2008, Microsoft launched Xbox Community Games, later renamed as Xbox Live Indie Games, which allowed independent developers to create games for the Xbox 360 using XNA development tools and sell them on the Xbox Live Marketplace. Many of them were sold for free (due to developer's requesting no charge) although you must have a membership to access the games.[2] Although this may not seem like the better deal, please wait for my arguments as to why console gaming is still superior.

Community modification:

Although PC definitely has more ease when modding, it can be done on a console. For Half-Life, a mod called Counter-Strike was the sole reason for it's sales in the first year. [3] There are different types of modding which are used with consoles -- such as "soft-modding" and "hard-modding". The former is modifying the data in the hard drive (Xbox). And the latter is hacking to run different types of softwares through your console. The former is the most popular since it is cheaper but both are done. [3]

But I will concede that on the PC, it is much easier and more efficient to mod.


Games of the past:

No, developers for the main consoles have not yet caught up to the PC for retro-gaming. But the plans to re-produce have been the main buzz at the last E3 convention (a technology convention) and also at the video company my dad owns where they are currently producing a Zelda game for the Xbox 360. Of course, you will have to take my word for it since it hasn't been released yet.


Backwards compatibility:

Yes, you can run your old PC games on a new PC but this brings me to my first argument...




> CON ARGUMENTS <

1. To have a PC where running games would not only be easy but also enjoyable, you would need to spend up to thousands of dollars.

Here are the requirements for good game play:

- Motherboard: this connects everything (processor, video card, etc.) to make sure it works. But it can restrict the kind of processor you use based on the kinds of sockets.

- Processor (CPU): The processor is one of the main factors for gaming performance. The top PC's will have quad-core processors, which are expensive.

- Video Card: The graphics that your computer will be able to support will depend on your video care. For the optimal performance, you would want (this is based on what most gamers have for their PC) a nVidia 8 series video card or the ATI equivalent. Price? Around $200. You can get a Xbox 360 from Best buy for that price -- an elite refurbished one. [4] Pricey...

- Hard Disk: to ensure plenty of storage space.

- Case, fans and coolers: Serious gamers spend serious amounts of time on their computer. A case is probably not that high on the list, but if you are spending a lot of time on the computer it would be wise to pick up one. Fans and coolers are a MUST.

After all of that, good luck justifying the amount of time and money put into your computer -- you'll be playing ONLY free third party games since you blew all of your money on getting the PC ready for it!

2. Better Set-up: Look above and then think of a console. If you have a TV, chances are that you have a power supply and necessary ports for the cables. Once you buy the console, you unpack it and the cords. Plug it in. And GO! Much easier than a PC...

3. Playing on the TV: surround sound anyone? Playing Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 (which is epic) is even more amazing when it's stretched out on a plasma with bass that rattles your floor. Wimpy speakers sitting on the desk in front of you just doesn't cut it.

4. Constant Upgrades: You need to continue to keep your hardware up to date. You must also make sure your drivers are up to date to keep the games running as efficiently as possible. And it is expensive to continue buying the new video cards when they are released to keep your PC "high-end". Sure, you might now have an awesome computer. But good luck paying rent.

5. The Wait: Who gets priority? The first party developers. And they won't be focused on PC games when piracy is eroding the market. Microsoft won't be pushing out games for Windows when they can focus on Xbox which is a confirmed money maker. Which means that developers for consoles will continue to have the better software and overall technology for producing/developing the games. The games will be released months after the console versions are for the PC.

6. Comfort: I would say that most of us, myself included, have desk jobs. And when we come home, the idea of sitting at a desk for another three to four hours is not appealing -- even with a high end video card! I would prefer to kick back on the couch with a foot rest.


So, in conclusion:
  • to set up an efficient and high end PC (one that you would be willing to play every night) -- you would have to spend thousands of dollars
  • consoles -- you unpack them, plug them in and you are good to go.
  • Surround Sound > PC speakers
  • PC's require constant upgrading to keep the PC running efficiently
  • Game developers for consoles get first priority for technological equipment and financing which leads to finished and well made games. And the wait for the games to be released for PC is months...
  • Sprawling on the couch after work is much more appealing than sitting at the desk -- again.

Resolution Negated.

Vote Con.

Sources:
[1]: http://arstechnica.com...
[2]: http://en.wikipedia.org...
[3]: http://en.wikipedia.org...
[4]: http://www.bestbuy.com...||24313735202d20243139392e3939&list=y&nrp=15&sc=gameToySP&sp=-bestsellingsort+skuid&usc=abcat0700000



Debate Round No. 2
tvellalott

Pro

REBUTTALS

Price
I disagree to some extent on this point. While I concede that it’s true that setting up a computer capable of playing the latest games can cost you upwards of a thousand dollars, console gaming is not simply buying a console. In order to enjoy the experience my opponent describes here:

“Playing Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 (which is epic) is even more amazing when it's stretched out on a plasma with bass that rattles your floor.”

…One must possess a plasma TV and a surround sound system.
Therefore I propose that setting up a console gaming experience from scratch is more expensive than setting up a PC gaming experience from scratch.

For example, here is the computer I’m soon going to build entirely from parts bought from https://www.pcdiy.com.au...

CPU & MOTHERBOARD
Asus M4A88TD-M Motherboard AM3 880G HDMI SATA3 Raid VGA [M4A88TD-M] $96.00
AMD Athlon II X2 255 Dual Core 3.1GHz AM3 Socket [ADX255OCGQBOX] $63.00

VIDEO & SOUND
Gigabyte ATI Radeon HD 5570 1GB DDR3 Graphics R557OC-1GH [R557OC-1GI ] $88.00
Creative Sound Blaster Audigy Value - Retail 7.1 Channel [70SB057000005] $35.00

RAM
Kingston 2GB DDR3 1333MHz Non-ECC CL9 KVR1333D3N9/2G [KVR1333D3N9/2G ] $33.00 x2

CASE, HDD, POWER SUPPLY & BURNER
Cooler Master Extreme Power 500W RS-500-PCAR [RS-500-PCAR/PCAP-A3] $62.00
Pioneer 22X DVDRW Burner SATA DVR218L Black OEM [DVR218L] $30.00
Antec Three Hundred Gaming Tower Case without PSU Black 300 [Three Hundred] $55.00
Samsung EcoGreen 1.5TB 3.5" SATA 32MB 5400RPM HD154UI [HD154UI] $69.00

PERIPHIRALS

ASUS VE205T 20" Widescreen LCD 5ms 1600x900 20k:1 DVI SPK [VE205T] $119.00
Logitech Internet 350 Desktop - Keyboard Mouse USB [967972-0403] $24.00
Logitech LS21 2.1 Stereo Speakers [980-000059 ] $21.00


TOTAL $698.00

This system would play any game available on the market today and wouldn’t be obsolete for quite some time.

BETTER SET UP:

I concede that it is more difficult, skill wise to setup a PC than a console.

CONSTANT UPGRADES:

Again, I disagree with this point. Only rich people can afford to keep their systems high-end constantly and it’s utterly pointless anyway. The video card I mentioned is more than enough to play any of the most popular games out now. By the time some new game is released that my system wouldn’t play, the parts required to play it would be very affordable.

THE WAIT:

WHAT?! This is entirely untrue now and anything that might happen in the future is entirely speculative. COD: Black Ops for example was released simultaneously on PC and Console.
Piracy ISN’T eroding the market. We have internet verified CD-Keys. The most popular first-party developed games are very, very difficult to pirate at all and impossible to enjoy online, because of unique CD-keys.

PLAYING ON THE TV:
I’m sure my opponent is aware that you can buy surround sound systems with a subwoofer for the PC.
COMFORT:
Sitting at a desk isn’t so bad. A comfortable computer chair eliminates this problem. This leads me to…


MEDIA CENTRES:
A media centre (also known as a home-theatre PC) is a computer designed to be hooked up to a TV via a HDMI cable. Anything a console can do, a media centre can do better.


CONCLUSION:

My opponent has conceded most of the points I made in the second round, as they were basically beyond refutation. Her points are not so rock solid:

"to set up an efficient and high end PC (one that you would be willing to play every night) -- you would have to spend thousands of dollars."

False. I would go so far as to argue that setting up a console system you would want to play every night (one with a plasma and surround sound) is much more expensive than setting up a PC system you would want to play every night.

"Surround Sound > PC speakers
"
PC speakers = surround sound.

"PC's require constant upgrading to keep the PC running efficiently."
False. You might have to upgrade every 2-3 years, just like you would need to upgrade your console with every generation to stay on the cutting edge of console gaming.

"Game developers for consoles get first priority for technological equipment and financing which leads to finished and well made games. And the wait for the games to be released for PC is months..."

Prove it.

"Sprawling on the couch after work is much more appealing than sitting at the desk -- again."
That depends entirely on your taste. I personally have no problem sitting at a desk at home after sitting at a desk at work, since both a quite comfortable. I concede that a couch is more comfortable, which is why I mentioned Media Centres, negating my opponents points about Comfort and Playing on a TV.


VOTE Pro.
annhasle

Con

My computer erased my third round argument four times in a row so sorry for the delay... I nearly threw it out the window.

> Price
In order to enjoy the experience my opponent describes here:

“Playing Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 (which is epic) is even more amazing when it's stretched out on a plasma with bass that rattles your floor.”

…One must possess a plasma TV and a surround sound system.
Therefore I propose that setting up a console gaming experience from scratch is more expensive than setting up a PC gaming experience from scratch.


The components I listed for the PC are indeed necessary for the experience but a plasma and a surround system are not. And I never said they were so I'm unsure why my opponent would say that Console gaming is now more expensive. That is utterly false.

> TOTAL $698.00

This system would play any game available on the market today and wouldn’t be obsolete for quite some time.


I would hope that the readers know that even though you can go cheaper does not mean that you should go cheap. If you skimp on the quality of certain parts of your PC, you put at risk not only your gaming experience but also any business or social related date along with access to network connections and distractions. And even though it won't be obsolete, it will still need to be maintianed and upgraded regularly to perform at optimal levels for gaming -- a flaw that a Console does not share. I would also like to point out that Consoles do not become obsolete as long as you stil have a power supply, TV and game. I still take out my Sega Dreamcast from time to time -- and it's awesome.

> CONSTANT UPGRADES:
Again, I disagree with this point. Only rich people can afford to keep their systems high-end constantly and it’s utterly pointless anyway. The video card I mentioned is more than enough to play any of the most popular games out now. By the time some new game is released that my system wouldn’t play, the parts required to play it would be very affordable.


If I sounded snotty, I apologize but PC gamers are always concerned with their PC functioning at the optimal level. For it do so, constant screening for viruses (from downloading the games), upgrading drivers, uploading new alerts for security or efficiency, etc. is needed. And even if your video card may last for a couple years, the mere abundance of problems that can go wrong with the other hardware (motherboard, CPU, coolers, etc.) is still there -- along with the need to upgrade them. Also, even if they are "affordable" for you, that isn't to say that they will be affordable for all PC gamers and this is something they need to take into account -- can they truly afford the upgrades and maintanence of a PC or would they rather just plug in a Console to their existing TV? Simple as that.

> WAIT:
WHAT?! This is entirely untrue now and anything that might happen in the future is entirely speculative. COD: Black Ops for example was released simultaneously on PC and Console.


Gran Turismo 5 released Nov. 24 -- only PS3 version. Dance Central released Nov. 4 -- only XBOX 360. Halo Reach released September 24 -- only XBOX 360. Red Dead Remption released May 18 -- only PS3 and XBOX 360. God of War 3 released March 16 -- only PS3. Final Fantasy XII released March 9th -- only PS3 and XBOX 360. Halo 3ODST released September 22 -- only XBOX 360. Mortal Kombat to be released April 19th -- only PS3 and XBOX 360. Point is, it's not entirely untrue and Console games *do* get priority. [1]

>Piracy ISN’T eroding the market. We have internet verified CD-Keys. The most popular first-party developed games are very, very difficult to pirate at all and impossible to enjoy online, because of unique CD-keys.

It's not piracy itself which is eroding the market but the safeguards put in place due to piracy. This article's conclusion sums it up nicely:

Mac gaming is in serious trouble - people aren’t buying games like they used to... You might think that because the Mac game market is so much smaller than the PC game market, piracy isn’t as big a problem. Looking at the lost revenue dollar totals, you might be right, just because the Mac market can’t compare to PC gaming in terms of size. But, nevertheless, piracy has a profound effect on individual Mac game publishers’ profit and loss sheets. In many cases, it’s the difference between being in the black and winding up in the red....

When I asked [Mac developer] Tamte what game publishers can do to staunch the flow, he gave a telling answer: Shift development to platforms where piracy is less of a problem like game consoles.

The Mac example shows us that regardless of the platform you're on, if piracy is rampant enough it can affect the viability of the market to the point where developers and publishers will either shift to a less piracy-prone platform, or implement more intrusive copy protection/DRM. I'm sure most PC gamers don't want the PC to end up being similar to the Mac in terms of its gaming appeal. [2]


Have you ever played Mac games? If not, don't. The possibility of the PC market becoming like the Mac is frightening to many PC gamers who have noticed the increasingly intrusive protections on PC games which have lessened the amount of players and publishers. The amount of time needed to produce a game which can be saved from piracy is too substantial now -- and they don't guarantee a profit like the Console games.

> PLAYING ON THE TV:
I’m sure my opponent is aware that you can buy surround sound systems with a subwoofer for the PC.


Yes, you can. Should we add that to your already substantial list? They say you should expect to pay, for a surround system and subwoofer, at least $150-$400.[3] That would place your cost, if you chose to buy it, at least at $800 but more likely over $1,000 now. If a Console gamer chose to buy a surround system, it would most likely cost them $300-$400 [4] and if we add a console, like the XBOX 360, for $169.99 [5], they are now at least at $469.99. PC is still double the cost.

> COMFORT:
Sitting at a desk isn’t so bad. A comfortable computer chair eliminates this problem.


SItting at your desk all day can also cause: Deep vein thrombosis, obesity, increased risk of heart disease, risk of diabetes, raised cholesterol, herniated disk, poor posture, knee pain, muscle weakness, increased risk of depression, slowed metabolism, neck problems, back aches and pain, shorter life span [6].

Yes, some of this can also affect a Console gamer. But the most sold game console right now is the Wii which allows you to move and exercise while gaming [7]. Unlike the Pc which keeps you constrained to the chair of death.

> MEDIA CENTRES:
A media centre (also known as a home-theatre PC) is a computer designed to be hooked up to a TV via a HDMI cable. Anything a console can do, a media centre can do better.


Except that your Xbox 360 can also be used as a Media Center Extender. [8] So your console can still do this an your point is moot.

> False. I would go so far as to argue that setting up a console system you would want to play every night (one with a plasma and surround sound) is much more expensive than setting up a PC system you would want to play every night.

Surround sound and a plasma are not necessary though -- the PC components listed are. So this point is also moot.

> PC speakers = surround sound.

Standard TV speakers: [9]
Standard PC speakers: [10]

TV > PC

> False. You might have to upgrade every 2-3 years, just like you would need to upgrade your console with every generation to stay on the cutting edge of console gaming

False. Xbox 360 was launched in 2005 and is still cutting edge.

Since I have no more room, this is it folks. Sources will be in the Comments section.

Vote Con.
Debate Round No. 3
tvellalott

Pro

REBUTTALS

PRICE
I must concede that buying a PC is more expensive than buying a console. However, there are multiple things to take into account:
  • PC’s are not limited to gaming. The machine I purposed is capable of all kinds of tasks. This makes the increased cost more worthwhile.
  • I have included in my list everything you would need to start using the computer. Consoles need a TV and the quality of the TV obviously has a substantial effect on the gaming experience. Better TV’s cost more money. My purposed computer has a 20” Widescreen LCD Monitor.

“The components I listed for the PC are indeed necessary for the experience but a plasma and a surround system are not. And I never said they were so I'm unsure why my opponent would say that Console gaming is now more expensive. That is utterly false.”
“Surround sound and a plasma are not necessary though -- the PC components listed are. So this point is also moot.”

They are necessary for the gaming experience you described here:
“Playing Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 (which is epic) is even more amazing when it's stretched out on a plasma with bass that rattles your floor. Wimpy speakers sitting on the desk in front of you just doesn't cut it.”

…which is the point I was making. Not so amazing when you have a standard CRT TV.

CONSTANT UPGRADES
“If I sounded snotty, I apologize but PC gamers are always concerned with their PC functioning at the optimal level.”
You’re still making a generalisation here. Fine tuning your computer to its ‘optimal level’ only offers trivial improvements. I personally don’t give a hootenanny about optimal level. My machine would run new games and run them well!

“If you skimp on the quality of certain parts of your PC, you put at risk not only your gaming experience but also any business or social related date along with access to network connections and distractions.”
None of the parts I mentioned are “low quality”. They are simply not cutting-edge anymore and thus drastically reduced in price. This computer would easily run COD Black Ops.

“For it do so, constant screening for viruses (from downloading the games), upgrading drivers, uploading new alerts for security or efficiency, etc. is needed.”
Oh Ann. This is hardly an issue, but if it’s important to you I’ll concede this point too. Console software upgrades are completely automatic. PC software upgrades are almost completely automatic. Virus protection is also almost completely automatic.

I must add now that just having the ability to upgrade your hardware could be looked at as an advantage. My opponent keeps mentioning “cutting edge” technology. Surely COD: Black Ops is going to look better on a 'cutting edge' machine than your 6 year old Xbox360.

PRIORITY
“Point is, it's not entirely untrue and Console games *do* get priority.”
None of your examples prove that Console games get release priority, which was your original point. There are obviously titles that are exclusive to Consoles just as there are titles that are exclusive to PC…

PIRACY
First of all:
I don’t want to touch Macs with a ten foot pole. No right-minded gamer would ever buy one, for gaming anyway.
Second of all:
You seem to forget that consoles are hardly devoid of piracy. I just hacked my Wii to play games on a USB stick.

SURROUND SOUND
The fact of the matter is that console doesn’t have better sound than PC. It depends on the sound system. Let’s leave the price arguments to the appropriate section, shall we?

COMFORT

Erm, did you post the wrong source? Because this: http://health.yahoo.net... is about habits that slow your metabolism…
Those things you mentioned have a lot more to do with your lifestyle and diet than sitting at a desk. Of course sitting at a desk 16 hours a day playing WOW and eating corn chips is going to cause health problems, much like sitting on a couch 16 hours a day playing COD and eating corn chips.

MEDIA CENTRE
My only point in mentioning media centres is that there are PCs that makes use of your awesome Home Theatre setup.

I'll fully summorise in the last round.
annhasle

Con

This has turned out to be a fun and engaging debate. I would like to thank tvellalot again for the challenge. Now let's continue on!

PRICE

PC’s are not limited to gaming. The machine I purposed is capable of all kinds of tasks. This makes the increased cost more worthwhile.

-- We are only focusing on the gaming experience and what would affect that – the capabilities outside of that are not essential to the debate. But since that does affect that price, I will answer it. Even if that does justify the initial cost of the machine, you cannot deny that the extra costs of improvements and modifications also drive the cost up as well.


I have included in my list everything you would need to start using the computer. Consoles need a TV and the quality of the TV obviously has a substantial effect on the gaming experience. Better TV’s cost more money. My purposed computer has a 20” Wide screen LCD Monitor.

-- Yes, but that is simply for graphic capabilities. Those can be sacrificed with less of an impact in comparison to the modifications necessary for the PC such as the video card.


T
hey are necessary for the gaming experience you described here:
“Playing Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 (which is epic) is even more amazing when it's stretched out on a plasma with bass that rattles your floor. Wimpy speakers sitting on the desk in front of you just doesn't cut it.”

…which is the point I was making. Not so amazing when you have a standard CRT TV.

-- Yes, but for the general experience they are not necessary which is what we are trying to address here. Or at least what we should be addressing.

CONSTANT UPGRADES
You’re still making a generalization here. Fine tuning your computer to its ‘optimal level’ only offers trivial improvements. I personally don’t give a hootenanny about optimal level. My machine would run new games and run them well!

-- You’re telling me that if you had the money to upgrade your PC, you would turn it down? As a PC gamer, I would surely take that chance to upgrade since I spend a substantial amount of time on my PC – especially now that Cataclysm is out and Guild Wars II is about to be released. When you spend hours on end during the week or weekend gaming, like many do within the DDO community, upgrades are standard.



None of the parts I mentioned are “low quality”. They are simply not cutting-edge anymore and thus drastically reduced in price. This computer would easily run COD Black Ops.

-- And even your computer is double the price of my console, with a sound system.



Oh Ann. This is hardly an issue, but if it’s important to you I’ll concede this point too. Console software upgrades are completely automatic. PC software upgrades are almost completely automatic. Virus protection is also almost completely automatic.

-- Regardless, they are needed and not everyone is aware of their necessity when you are gaming. Especially when using patches. It’s not that it’s “important” to me, tvellalott. It’s merely a contention of mine that should be addressed.


I must add now that just having the ability to upgrade your hardware could be looked at as an advantage. My opponent keeps mentioning “cutting edge” technology. Surely COD: Black Ops is going to look better on a 'cutting edge' machine than your 6 year old Xbox360.

-- Except that Xbox 360 is still considered cutting edge since another console has not been released that can top it.



PRIORITY
None of your examples prove that Console games get release priority, which was your original point. There are obviously titles that are exclusive to Consoles just as there are titles that are exclusive to PC…

-- There was not only 16 games out of 200+ games (stretching back to 1990) out of the Major game released, which were released only with PC platform. Why? Because the desired platforms are Consoles. If it were the other way around, there would be a substantial amount of only PC game releases.



PIRACY
First of all:
I don’t want to touch Macs with a ten foot pole. No right-minded gamer would ever buy one, for gaming anyway.

-- That wasn’t the point.


Second of all:
You seem to forget that consoles are hardly devoid of piracy. I just hacked my Wii to play games on a USB stick.

-- First of all, I can hardly be convinced that you just did that since it’s only your word and no proof. Secondly, I never said that consoles were devoid of piracy. They are significantly less prone to piracy than PC’s though. If you would look here
"We still do PC, we love the PC," Capps says, before going on to say how the impact of piracy has "killed" many good developers, forcing them to change their business model.”[1]

COMFORT
Erm, did you post the wrong source? Because this:
http://health.yahoo.net...... is about habits that slow your metabolism…
Those things you mentioned have a lot more to do with your lifestyle and diet than sitting at a desk. Of course sitting at a desk 16 hours a day playing WOW and eating corn chips is going to cause health problems, much like sitting on a couch 16 hours a day playing COD and eating corn chips.

-- Wow, that was my fault. I meant to post this: http://www.nursingschools.net...

MEDIA CENTRE

My only point in mentioning media centres is that there are PCs that makes use of your awesome Home Theatre setup.

-- You do realize that you hook your Console up to your TV which uses the Home Theater setup, right?

Sources:
[1]
http://www.neowin.net...


Resolution negated.



Vote Con.

Debate Round No. 4
tvellalott

Pro

SUMMARY OF MY PREVIOUS ARGUMENTS

These were my initial arguments, which were mostly conceded by my opponent:

  • Third-party games
  • Community modification
  • Retro gaming
  • Backwards compatibility

FINAL REBUTTALS/COMMENTS

PRICE

This has been a major one, which I think I have sufficiently addressed. It is obvious that a PC is more expensive than a Console. However, I’ve shown that a decent PC is reasonably affordable. There is the obvious non-gaming aspects that add to the value.

Furthermore, I believe that because my system was a complete setup, requiring nothing but assembly and somewhere to plug it in and the console requires a TV, this point should be taken out of consideration.

It’s obvious that a crappy TV will make for a crappy gaming experience and any reasonable TV would cost more than my entire computer (including 20” LCD screen).

CONSTANT UPGRADES

Let’s be realistic. Though I concede that consoles don’t really need to be upgraded and maintaining a cutting-edge computer could be very expensive, how much of a disadvantage is this?

I can think of two ways to approach this point:

1) You could completely disregard upgrades. Build the computer you want, run it until it dies or is obsolete and build/buy another one. I’ve built two computers for myself and neither cost me more than a thousand dollars, both played online games extremely well and I never had to replace anything for the life of them.

2) You could stay on the cutting-edge of PC gaming. Your machine is going to cost you a whole lot of money, but it’s going to sh!t on any console on the market, since console specifications mirror cutting edge technology that their time of release which grows increasingly further into the past every day. It’s difficult for an Xbox 360 to become so affordable and stay on the cutting edge of actual technology.

PRIORITY & PIRACY

I’ve decided to combine these into one topic, since the first makes many references to the second. First of all, in regards to my anecdote about my Wii: do you believe that it can’t be done? [1]

The fact remains that although the piracy inherent in PC gaming might one day bring it to a point where it is no long convenient to play games on your computer, that day isn’t today. It isn’t next week. It’s not anywhere in the foreseeable future. First person shooters, Real-time strategies and MMORPG games at the very least are still going strong on the PC. Huge developers are still developing games for PC. Blizzard, anyone?

On a final note, did you read the source you posted? Here are some of my favourite quotes:

“However, the developer believes that the market could begin to move back towards PC development in the near future.”

“Despite this, Capps believes resurgence in the PC market may be coming.”

“According to Capps, publishers are starting to "think their money's going to be shifting back to PC" due to people wanting to spend less time playing games due to the amount of media competing for their attention.”

COMFORT

So your point began as being about comfort and ended up being about health, but in the end you’ve only proven that sitting is unhealthy. Ok, cool.

It is a matter of taste whether you find sitting upright at a desk or lounged on a couch as more comfortable. I’m quite tall, but I honestly find sitting at a desk to feel better for my back. I often hunch forward on the couch and end up with a sore back.

The whole point that your article was trying to make was to get active, especially if you sit in a desk all day. I suppose the Wii is the only form of gaming that achieves physical activity, so I concede that aspect of the argument.

The PS3 and the XBOX360 are equally unhealthy to PC gaming.

Whether you find a desk chair or a couch more comfortable is subjective.

SURROUND SOUND & MEDIA CENTRES

You do realize that you hook your Console up to your TV which uses the Home Theatre setup, right?"

Yes. Do you seriously not see the point I’m trying to make here? You argued that Console gaming has the advantage of being able to be hooked up to your home theatre system with your plasma and floor-rattling bass; I’m arguing that you can hook a PC up to the exact same system, therefore it isn’t an argument in favour of Consoles.

CONCLUSION

I’d first like to thank Ann for challenging me to this genre of debate and partaking in what has essentially been an exercise is self-hatred. I love all forms of gaming, but I’ve always preferred PC over Console.

For one, it’s a format with a lot more freedom. There are entire communities out there developing new content for games; content that really reflects what the people want, because the people are the ones creating it!

Furthermore there are entire communities developing games that they want you to play for free and they don’t skimp on quality; some of these games are amazing. Chronotron (a game where you play a time travelling robot) is nothing short of brilliant.

Second, it’s not so restricting with what games you can play on it. As I mentioned in my anecdote about Jedi Knight II, I may feel like playing a game for 10 years ago. With the PC I don’t have to keep my ancient consoles out and ready for action or drag them out of the cupboard when I want to play them. It has one source of truth.

I really think my opponent was clasping at straws with her arguments (sorry Ann). I mean sure, PC’s are more expensive than Consoles, but not like Gucci is more expensive than Target. Good PC’s are very affordable.

The ‘constant upgrades’ I showed to be an advantage, given that if you stay on the cutting edge of PC gaming, you’re likely to have a superior machine to even the latest console released, with the advantage of having a huge back catalogue of games.

Priority is a disadvantage, but the PC market seems to be splitting in two directions:

  • Serious gamers, who play FPS, RTS and MMORPGs: The PC market for these sorts of games is still very strong.
  • Amateur gamers, who play simple and quick games: The PC market will clearly dominate here because of the number of ideal and FREE games the PC offers.

In conclusion, I have slayed the naysayers and clearly shown that PC gaming is indeed superior to Console gaming.

VOTE PRO!

Sources

[1] http://www.instructables.com...

annhasle

Con

annhasle forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
54 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by tvellalott 4 years ago
tvellalott
Argh, this debate still haunts me. I should have won damn it.
Posted by akahdrin 4 years ago
akahdrin
And yes, tvellalott, your arguments were much better. You should have won.
Posted by akahdrin 4 years ago
akahdrin
This is about the quality of parts. The quality of parts you buy for a computer is not based on price. Example, you can buy EVGA boards and video cards that have a lifetime warranty, granted you won't use it that long. Thermaltake and Coolermaster have over 5 year warranties on their power supplies and fans. Western Digital and Seagate also have amazing warranties of around 5 years. Corsair and Kingston RAM will have a similar warranty.

When you buy say a, Dell Alienware you're not paying for quality parts, you're paying for a name and a false warranty. Their 1 year warranty doesn't mean anything because every piece in your computer already has a warranty. You're essentially paying double or more for everything.

I think you need to review up on how much pc gaming pounds console gaming into the ground. Mouse and keyboard vs. controller, see who wins. Mouse and keyboard EVERY time.
Posted by tvellalott 4 years ago
tvellalott
I should have won this, because ann dropped all my final arguments, rebuttals and conclusion by forfeiting the last round. I love ann, but the people who voted for her are suckholes...
Posted by jo291 4 years ago
jo291
I like how even though Con forfeited she still won the debate because this website is infested with console fan boys.
Posted by tvellalott 6 years ago
tvellalott
God damn it.
Posted by annhasle 6 years ago
annhasle
@ quarterexchange

RFD?
Posted by batman1200 6 years ago
batman1200
that is very possible
Posted by tvellalott 6 years ago
tvellalott
A LIKELY STORY! :P (nac)
Posted by annhasle 6 years ago
annhasle
OMFG, tv I'm so sorry! There was a giant snow storm the last two nights and we had no power.... Gah, I feel like an utter tool. Conduct points to you, man. I apologize profusely. >.<
8 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 8 records.
Vote Placed by quarterexchange 6 years ago
quarterexchange
tvellalottannhasleTied
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Reasons for voting decision: You forfeited the final round but you posted far more relevant sources and Pro's arguments regarding the fact that PC games are not restricted to various and specific consoles and the fact that while a PC may be more expensive, it is not just for playing games. And also Pro brought up the fact that consules go obsolete much quicker than a PC does and there is also the fact that PC games can be played on large TV screens and be hooked up to surround sound and have the same quality as a consule
Vote Placed by headphonegut 6 years ago
headphonegut
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Reasons for voting decision: It was close but I think con got this one
Vote Placed by Rockylightning 6 years ago
Rockylightning
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Reasons for voting decision: Conduct: Pro, con forfeited a round Spelling: Tie Arguments: On average I thought con has more concrete refutations Sources: About equal
Vote Placed by Ore_Ele 6 years ago
Ore_Ele
tvellalottannhasleTied
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Reasons for voting decision: I still contend that Atheism should provide some kind of RFD, but I'm not going to alter the entire outcome of the debate over it anymore.
Vote Placed by Atheism 6 years ago
Atheism
tvellalottannhasleTied
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Vote Placed by Cliff.Stamp 6 years ago
Cliff.Stamp
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Reasons for voting decision: Close but arguments to Pro, mainly due to comments such as "I would also like to point out that Consoles do not become obsolete as long as you stil have a power supply, TV and game. I still take out my Sega Dreamcast from time to time -- and it's awesome." well I can break out my vic-20 and play its games as well. Can the Dreamcast play the current games - no - then it is obsolete.
Vote Placed by socialpinko 6 years ago
socialpinko
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Reasons for voting decision: Pro gets conduct for Con's forfeit. Con gets sources as she had many reliable sources posted while Pro had only a few. Great arguments were brought by both sides but Con adequately defended consoles as a better medium than PC
Vote Placed by BlackVoid 6 years ago
BlackVoid
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