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PC's are superior to Macs

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/18/2013 Category: Technology
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,362 times Debate No: 30379
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (2)
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Resolved, that PC's are superior to Macs.
Mac - Any x86-Based (to exclude mobile devices) computing device created by apple
PC - Any Non-GSM (to exclude mobile devices) capable devices, that are not embedded devices, that have unlocked bootloaders, that are not created by apple.

Regardless of poor wording, the intent of the above is to exclude all phones, and tablets (with locked bootloaders) as well as embedded devices. I am open to suggestions in definition changes.

I look forward to arguing.


I look forward to arguing I have had this argument with my brother many times.
Debate Round No. 1


Over the course of this debate I will be sticking to 3 major contentions.

But first in addition to the aforementioned definitions I will be providing "assumptions" that I propose simply for the purpose of argument.

The first is that the targeted audience that we are speaking of, in terms of "superiority, is the low-high-end user, low being Chromebooks or other UMPC's such as the Nokia N900 or the raspberry pi, the high end being enthusiast PC's with latest generation i7's and SLI/Crossfire, that is made from parts. In addition to that audience, I assume we are also targeting the server audience, from the low-end to the enterprise-end user. Low end, being a home DNS server running on a raspberry pi, High end being whole floors filled with racks of high-end servers, used to serve thousands-millions-billions of customers/consumers around the world.

For fairness to my opponent, I will assume that a "hackintosh" PC does not count as a "Mac" or as a "PC" and is irrelevant to this argument. In response I ask that the equivalent, Linux on a Mac, does not count as a "Mac" or a "pc" and is just as irrelevant. Seeing as both are "exploits/(I hate to use this word but...)hacks"

Now on to my contentions.

My first contention is that PC's are a better value than Macs.
See my first piece of evidence:
And my second:
As is clear, for the even LESS than the Mac I, I got a PC that was FAR superior in power to that Mac, packaged with 680 bags of cookies, (my favorite cookies too :D ), 7,200 pop tarts, 1,450 bags of hot cheetos, 2250 bags of lays, and 1300 bags of regular cheetos. I believe my point has been made.

My second contention is that PC's are more freedom-respecting, than macs.

Macs, are locked down. On a Mac, I cannot access the EFI. My inability to access the EFI leads to:

My inability to overclock my CPU.

My inability to change the boot order of a mac.

My inability to boot from a live cd/usb/removable storage.

My inability to ... (the following are inabilites related to RAID
Put my computer in Raid 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 10, 0+1 and pretty much every other minor raid level except for the major
levels, 0 and 1, and the minor JBOD raid.

In the original RAID specification if you attempt to put two disks of different sizes into a RAID, rather than raid
being impossible, I am supposed to be able to still setup my RAID but only be able to use the amount of space
equivalent to my smallest drive, on a Mac, if I have two different sized drives, I am simply not allowed to put
them into RAID

My inability to enter a RAID, or configure a RAID, without having to boot into the OS.

My inability to overclock my ram.

My inability to overclock my GPU.

Most importantly, my inability to install a new OS. (We'll get to BootCamp later)

Seeing as OSX is inescapable on a Mac (you have to use it) any lack of freedom in OSX applies to the entire Category of Mac, whereas any lack of freedoms, on PC are due to the user's choice of OS.
I will now move on to freedom violations of the OS.

It is proprietary software. (This is the largest violation, yet the most self-explanatory, so I won't delve into that too much)

Launchpad, the mac's "magical update everything button" only updates applications from the App Store, thus creating a monopoly, where only Apple-approved applications, can be conveniently updated at once.

App, store is in every fashion, an Apple controlled monopoly.

Now I willl follow up, on what I said about BootCamp earlier, BootCamp costs money, it literally costs money, to do something that is the equivalent of just giving you a key to resize partitions, create a partition, and install an OS in that additional partition.

You may have noticed that I said "create a partition" rather than "create partitions", this is because BootCamp limits you to a total of 3 partitions. But, oh wait, OSX takes up one, oh wait, the recovery partition for OSX takes up another, that leaves you with a gob-smacking, finger-licking, total of ONE PARTITION! Why?!?!?! There are no actual physical/software limitations to Mac HDD's (unless they have some magical Steve Jobs pixie dust that creates thos limitations) that limits your system to THREE partitions, this is just apple, attempting to make the Windows experience for Mac users, unpleasant, so that they switch back to OSX. Now, I can't create a backup partition, a recovery partition, a swap partition, a second install of Windows, etc, because of an arbitrary limit set by Apple, to restrict it's users.

In addition, Apple restricts you, to ONLY using Windows 7, it is not possible to install Windows XP, Windows Vista, Windows 2000, or ANY other older versions of windows, as well as it not being possible to install the Microsoft's latest version of Windows, Windows 8, worst of all, I cannot install any of my other favorite OS's. You are literally restricted to only being able to use ONE OS, other than OSX and that is Windows 7. No XP, no DOS, no Windows 8,no Windows 2000, no Fedora, no Ubuntu, no CentOS, no RHEL, no FreeBSD, no PCBSD, no Linux Mint, No Unix, No Plan 9, no FreeNAS, I could go on for days, weeks, months, years about what I CANNOT due on a Mac, that I can do on a PC.

I now move on to my 3rd contention that OSX, the operating system preinstalled on Macs, is inferior to all PC Operating Systems. This is the fun part.

No middle mouse button/wheel.

No maximizing windows.

No windows snapping.

Arbitrary, reordering of minimize, maximize, close, simply to be unique. There is an actual reason for the menubar being in the top right of every major OS's windows, other than OSX, the fact that the Menubar is on the top left of the windows Whereas, OSX devs, were just like "EVERYTHING GOES IN THE TOP LEFT"

Clock doesn't have date...

No right click without finger gymnastics.

Ctrl-key is literally useless in exchange for command key. Why in the hell is this?

Close button doesn't actually close anything

Too many command keys, option, ctrl, command, alt..... whereas on windows you only have ctrl and alt are your only command keys.

Having the menu on the top bar is stupid, and brings us back to the 1960's when you could only be doing ONE THING AT A TIME, because there's only one upper bar if I want to say, save a document I have open on the right half of my screen while I have my web browser on the left side selected, I have to move to the right, selcet that window, then move to the top right. I will not even get into how terrible this is if you have a multi-monitor setup.

No cut-paste???

Finder is useless because I have to move my mouse all the way to the top right, whereas in every other OS, it's just push Super key, type in program, usually first choice, so push enter, if not move arrow keys down to choice.

Programs can not use Function keys, as they are reserved for things that would usually be reserved to Alt+Function keys in other OS's.

Finder makes me read every program, or analyze every icon, because they all look identical, because apple refuses to add color to them...

I will move on to my 4th contention, showing that the other OS'es are superior to OSX, in my next argument, I look forward to that, as well as that I would like to respond to a few common arguments made by "Apple"/"Mac" users that make me irate, so that I don't waste time in the next argument talking about them.

The first being "Macs have no viruses"
Nope. This is a joke:
The situations has gotten even worse then it was at the writing of that article, OSX is filled with vulnerabilities, exploits, viruses, and malware. In fact, if you have physical access to someone's Mac, it is childishly easy to gain admin access:

I would've talked about more but I'm out of char


Cera_MSHS forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2


davidgumberg forfeited this round.


Cera_MSHS forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3


davidgumberg forfeited this round.


Cera_MSHS forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4


davidgumberg forfeited this round.


Cera_MSHS forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by davidgumberg 3 years ago
the windows/start key is not a command key, but rather a "function key" , it only has one or two actual uses, and these are all operating system related, rather than program related, afik there are no programs that use the windows key for anything, but the three windows uses I know are: win+e opens explorer, win+r opens run... menu, and the windows key brings up the start menu, I believe the start key goes in the same category as f1-f12 on a mac do

Also shift is obviously not a command key, but rather a modifier key
Posted by alpha3031 3 years ago
for PRO
a)wow, you sure know a lot
b) technically there are 4 command keys, Shift, Ctrl, Alt and Start. i say these are command keys because they are the only modifier keys for the windows "StickyKeys" function, another useful function of windows
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