The Instigator
Rockylightning
Con (against)
Losing
54 Points
The Contender
Livebriand
Pro (for)
Winning
99 Points

Pc's are better than macs

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/8/2010 Category: Technology
Updated: 7 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 9,375 times Debate No: 11370
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (26)
Votes (28)

 

Rockylightning

Con

Resolved that Pc's are better than macs
I am against this motion.

PC: A computer running windows
Mac: A macintosh computer: does not include devices such as the iphone!
Livebriand

Pro

Firstly I would like to start by thanking the judge(s), and my opponent Rockylightning.

Here is my first point: compatibility. If you want to run Mac OS X, you can only run it on an overpriced Mac. If you want to run Windows, you can run it on any computer you like. And far more programs are available for Windows than for Mac. Now my opponents may argue that you can always run Windows using Bootcamp, but that basically means that there wasn't a version of that program for the Mac, thus making it less convenient for the end user.

And here is my second point: cost. If I wanted a Mac and a PC that both had similar specs, I'd probably end up spending several hundred dollars for the Mac. My opponent may also argue that the Mac comes with more programs such as GarageBand, but how many people actually use it anyway? So in the end, it is a waste. Windows allows you to easily get programs for email (Windows Live Mail), messaging (Windows Live Messenger), web browsing (Internet Explorer), TV recording (Windows Media Center), music playing (Windows Media Player, Windows Media Center, or Zune), photo editing and organization (Windows Live Photo Gallery), a drawing tool (paint), and movie editing (Windows Live Movie Maker), as well as countless others, including games. How well do Macs compare to that?

So for all these reasons and many more, PCs are CLEARLY better than Macs.
Debate Round No. 1
Rockylightning

Con

Refutes:

1) ///If you want to run Mac OS X, you can only run it on an overpriced Mac. If you want to run Windows, you can run it on any computer you like/// This is my point, this shows that Mac computers are more compatible! A PC CANNOT RUN MAC OSX! On the other hand a macintosh computer CAN run windows! This point is mine.
2) ///If I wanted a Mac and a PC that both had similar specs, I'd probably end up spending several hundred dollars for the Mac./// Yes this is because macs are built with quality parts. Look at the computer you're using right now. It's made out of flimsy plastic, while a Mac is made out of high quality metal! You get what you pay for, so obviously, a PC is lower quality.
3) Yes a Mac comes with garageband, if you wanted to buy the Microsoft equivilant, which is 100-200 dollars, then you're pretty much spending the money you "save".
4)///Windows allows you to easily get programs for email (Windows Live Mail), messaging (Windows Live Messenger), web browsing (Internet Explorer), TV recording (Windows Media Center), music playing (Windows Media Player, Windows Media Center, or Zune), photo editing and organization (Windows Live Photo Gallery), a drawing tool (paint), and movie editing (Windows Live Movie Maker), as well as countless others, including games. How well do Macs compare to that?///

mac comes with Mail for email, Ichat for messaging, safari for internet, quicktime 7 for tv recording, itunes, quicktime for music playing, preview and iphoto for photo editing and organization, paintbrush is drawing tool, movie editing is Imovie and Idvd, as well as countless others including games such as marble blast gold, nanosaur, and island racer.
----------Points

1. Macs are higher quality
As I have stated before mac are made out of metal, unlike the plasticy windows PC, not only is this easily breakable, but worse for the enviroment!
2. Macs have dashboard.
When on a Mac you always have the option of opening the dashboard (F12) You can download games, music players, widgets, news providers, and countless others! Can a Windows machine do this? NO! They have the ones you can have on your desktop such as the speedometer that measures CPU usage and other things, but they are lower quality and slow down the machine.

I will expand on my points next round.

Thank you and I urge a Con Vote

VOTE CON
Livebriand

Pro

Firstly I would like to start off by refuting some of my opponents' points:
Firstly, they stated that Macs are higher quality. However, you can also get Windows PCs that have the same metal quality as a Mac. However, many people do not do this, and the reason is likely cost. Second, they stated that the Mac has a dashboard activated by pressing F12. However, Windows has Gadgets that stay on your desktop, and, unlike what my opponent said, DO NOT NOTICABLY SLOW DOWN THE MACHINE. However, you can look at then WHILE YOU ARE DOING YOUR WORK. Can a Mac do this? No. So in the end, whatever minimal impact they may have in performance is worth it. You can get gadgets for things like weather, a Calendar, a CPU usage/temperature monitor, RSS Feeds, a Slide show, even a Picture Puzzle if you are bored. You can also get gadgets for things like your average WPM if you want.

Now I would like to go into some of my own points.
Firstly, Macs are not always as cutting edge as Windows PCs. Do you see any Macs with new processors such as the Intel Core i3, i5, or i7? No. They also do not have Blu-ray drives. Those new Intel processors are becoming common on new Windows PCs, and you can get Blu-ray if you want. In fact, the PC I am typing this on has an Intel Core i5 processor and cost just $700, yet doesn't slow down with the 9 gadgets I have running on my desktop. Even in the past, for example (and I mean just a few years ago), when Macs FINALLY started getting SD card readers, Apple was advertising it with the rest of the specs (ex. CPU, RAM, HDD, etc) as if it was some new feature that was unusual. Meanwhile, it had been common in Windows PCs for years, and nothing unusual.

Second, they are not available in as many form factors. As far as desktops go, you can either get a Mac Mini (which has limited power and upgrading options), an iMac with the screen integrated (which also has limited upgrading options), or a high-end (and expensive) Mac Pro. What if, for example, you need a mid-range desktop ($600-$800 perhaps), but are a photographer and have a really expensive, color accurate monitor (or plan to buy one). If you got a Mac Mini, it is rather limited, in both power and upgrading options. If you got an iMac, you'd either have to use your nice display as a second one, or it wouldn't really work. And calibration can't fix everything. And a Mac Pro would be WAY out of the price range. So in the end, Macs really aren't for everyone. If I got a Windows PC, there are all sorts of form factors avalible, and many won't break the bank, unlike Macs.

So for these reasons and many, many more, Windows PCs are CLEARLY better than Macs.
Debate Round No. 2
Rockylightning

Con

\\\you can also get Windows PCs that have the same metal quality as a Mac/// If you are using a windows PC right now, look at the tower, or the monitor... plastic right? If you're using a mac, look at the monitor, metal... Windows have just started using more metal to build their computers, but macs have been doing this all along!

\\\Windows has Gadgets that stay on your desktop-you can look at then WHILE YOU ARE DOING YOUR WORK. Can a Mac do this? No./// On you're desktop, you have icons, pictures, a backround... it's already cluttered! Why do you need huge gadgets that you can't hide on-demand? It is physically impossible to be using a gadget while working at the same time, so with the quick action of hitting F12 you can simply pull out your dashboard where all your widgets are. (By the way, gadgets are a COMPLETE copy of Mac "widgets" gadgets came out on vista, while widgets came out years before that)

\\\not always as cutting edge as Windows PCs///

I never said that, I meant better as all around computers.

\\\Do you see any Macs with new processors such as the Intel Core i3, i5, or i7? No.///

Obviously a mac doesn't NEED those fancy processors because they do not crash as much.
According to PC mag, for every 30 blue screens of death for a windows computer, there is ONLY 1 MAC CRASH of the equivalent magnitude!!! (This has also been stated by other sources such as genius bar and CNN.)

\\\an Intel Core i5 processor and cost just $700, yet doesn't slow down with the 9 gadgets I have running on my desktop.///

Ok so that's one of the best processors for windows right? Here's the deal, I have a relatively bad processor for my mac. Yet, I can run about 19 copies of paradise paintball before it even STARTS to slow down!
(Here's paradise paintball)

http://crenk.com...

\\\If you got a Mac Mini, it is rather limited, in both power and upgrading options. If you got an iMac, you'd either have to use your nice display as a second one, or it wouldn't really work. And calibration can't fix everything. And a Mac Pro would be WAY out of the price range.///

You cannot rule out the only option for this photographer by saying "Its way out of the price range" if that photographer really wanted a quality computer to do work on, he WOULD pay the extra price. Here the think livebriand, Macs ARENT overpriced because the creaters feel like doing that, their over priced because they cost more to make, (the metal parts, the high quality screen etc.)

\\\many won't break the bank, unlike Macs.///

Example: You have the choice of buying a 700 dollar Windows machine OR a 1000 dollar Mac
With the 700 dollar PC, you might have to buy: Extra RAM, software that dosn't come with the computer, hardware, and not to mention maintenance costs! With the mac, maybe you would have to buy a printer... but that's it, maintenance is pretty much free, as long as you're not buying a whole new part.

Now onto my NEW points

1. Service
Ever tried calling support over the phone about your PC screwing up? This is one of the most painful experience one can go through. For the sake of a debate, I used a problem with my broken windows PC and called support. Here's the chain of events.

*Picks up
"Custumer support."
Hi I'm having a problem with my computer
"Yes what type of problem"
Well, first of all, whenever I try to run any type of .exe file, my computer blue screens
"Oh yes, let me connect you with tech support, one moment please"
Ok thanks...

*I'm on hold for about 5 minutes*
"Tech Support."
Hi, I've got a problem with my PC, every time I run exe files, the computer blue screens
"yes well, first would you mind telling what it says on the blue screen?"
Oh yes let me try..
*I run .exe files, this time it dosn't blue screen, it just dies*
It just died, it didn't blue screen...
"Well, do you remember WHAT it said on the blue screen?"
Um no, I can't recall
"Are you sure?"
Uh yeah
"Ok well, I'm going to send you over to another guy I think can help, hold please..."

*I hold for another 5 hours, YES 5 HOURS!!! Finally, someone picks up*
Hello, tech support"
Hi I have a problem, every time I have an exe file it blue screens
"Have you scanned for viruses"
Yes actually, using Mcaffee, norton, and the built in ones.
"Well, have you tried restarting your computer"
yes...
"I would advise getting a new hard drive..."
But I have a lot of important stuff on there
"I'm sorry, I have never had this problem before..."
Well is there ANYTHING ELSE?
"I can't think of anything off the top of my head, but I'll talk with the other tech guys and call you if I find an answer, Ok?"
yeah sure, thanks for you're time
"My Pleasure"

*Hangs up*

THE CONVERSATION SPEAKS FOR ITSELF!

REFUTE THAT LIVEBRIAND!

I await my opponent's rebuttal
Livebriand

Pro

Firstly I would like to start off by refuting my opponents' points.

"If you are using a windows PC right now, look at the tower, or the monitor... plastic right? If you're using a mac, look at the monitor, metal... Windows have just started using more metal to build their computers, but macs have been doing this all along!"
Look, not everyone is willing to pay extra for a PC made of Metal, OK. However, if the user wants one of metal, they can certainly spend more and get a PC of metal, WHICH COULD STILL COST LESS THAN A MAC (my $700 desktop PC with Windows 7 has a metal case). However, with Macs you don't have a choice - you have to get the more expensive computer.

"Obviously a mac doesn't NEED those fancy processors because they do not crash as much."
If you do things such as gaming (and few gamers get a Mac, most get a PC), video editing, etc, then you really do need a powerful processor. Sure, you could get away with a slow processor on a Mac (ex. a PowerPC G4), but it would be slow. And besides, with the PowerPC ones, you can't even run OS X 10.6 anyway since they lack a Intel processor. If I got a PC, I could certainly get one with a processor like the Intel Pentium 4 and run Windows 7 with all the aero effects.

"You cannot rule out the only option for this photographer by saying "Its way out of the price range" if that photographer really wanted a quality computer to do work on, he WOULD pay the extra price. Here the think livebriand, Macs ARENT overpriced because the creaters feel like doing that, their over priced because they cost more to make, (the metal parts, the high quality screen etc.)"
I said that the photographer would need a nice, accurate display and already has one (or has set aside the money for one), but simply needs an inexpensive computer that won't break the bank. For example, I have a fairly nice monitor and I calibrate it (as I do photo work sometimes), but I DIDN'T SPEND LOTS on the PC that I'm using. So in some cases, the photographer might not have the budget for such an expensive PC. So what should he do in that case? The answer is simple: GET A PC!!!

"Example: You have the choice of buying a 700 dollar Windows machine OR a 1000 dollar Mac
With the 700 dollar PC, you might have to buy: Extra RAM, software that dosn't come with the computer, hardware, and not to mention maintenance costs! With the mac, maybe you would have to buy a printer... but that's it, maintenance is pretty much free, as long as you're not buying a whole new part."
Here are the things that a PC user would likely buy (monitor excluded): maybe Microsoft Office (though many include Microsoft Works), a printer (if they don't already have one), and that's just about it, as many include a mouse, keyboard, and speakers, and they can download free AV software, rather than paying for software like Norton. You would have no need for extra RAM since many PCs have 4GB or more, and that is more than enough for most people (including me). On a Mac, you likely would also buy an office suite (which is commonly Microsoft Office on both platforms) since even if Macs include one it likely isn't very good (like, admittedly, Microsoft Works).

"Ever tried calling support over the phone about your PC screwing up? This is one of the most painful experience one can go through. For the sake of a debate, I used a problem with my broken windows PC and called support."
It seems that you haven't heard of things like online forums or asking others. Who needs support from the manufacturer? At most, you'd probably need to just reinstall Windows.

Also, it appears that my opponent never refuted my point about the gadgets. They also did a poor refutation of my points of Macs not being as cutting edge or having new processors.

So as you can clearly see with the points I have stated, PCs are CLEARLY better than Macs. I strongly urge you to vote Pro.

***************
By the way, in case you were wondering, my PC is a self-built one with Intel Core i5, 4GB RAM, 640GB HDD, NVidia GeForce 210 (512MB)
Debate Round No. 3
26 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Zerglingleader 6 years ago
Zerglingleader
This debate was laughably one sided. Why is it that I have a notion about Mac users? Oh, it's because they constantly prove their own stereotype. With an argument like "They don't need those fancy processors because they don't crash as much," I couldn't believe briand had the decency to be civil. I have an i5 as well man, their sweet. even though mine is simply a laptop, I can still play Starcraft 2 on ultra settings. Even if they didn't "need" them, it's irrelevant. COMPLETELY. Rocky debated with hot-headed laughable ignorance and it showed. I go to Art School, and I am completely surrounded by Mac users. I take great pride in the fact that my computer is superior than almost all of them in just about every way, and I paid hundreds less. And the costumer support was a RED HERRING. All Points---> LiveBraind
Posted by SuperRobotWars 6 years ago
SuperRobotWars
P.C.'s actually can run MAC OS X.
Posted by Livebriand 6 years ago
Livebriand
It's DDR3, 1333. 2x2GB.
Posted by MayTheFarceBeWithYou 6 years ago
MayTheFarceBeWithYou
You didn't specify if your 4 GB of RAM was DDR2 or DDR3. I am dissapoint, son.
Posted by FranklinR 7 years ago
FranklinR
Agree with serp772. The definitions were not clear, first and foremost; are we talking hardware or OS?

CPU: Agreed Apple uses Intel 64bit chips like PCs that run Windows. No more RISC chips for Apple. Tie.

Physical form factor: Apple computers have reputation of being well built and having higher level of asthetics. However, there are PCs that do rival Apple in terms of form factor and "style" such as Adamo, Sony Vaios, and etc. There are also many new desktop cases that look nothing like traditional cases (Thermaltake Level 10, Antec Mini Skeleton-90, etc.) This also bring up another point: There are hundreds of cases PC enthusiasts can choose to build a PC. Tie.

OS: Apple OS can be deemed better based on Apple's vertical integration of software and hardware. However, it is not immune to other operating systems. Apple releases updates for new features, bug fixes, security updates like other software companies. One recent post dated April 12, 2010 was 785.29 MB in size. One visiting OSX support forum will see thousands of pages of support questions and issues. Win also has its share of problems; security and compatibility being two most notable. MSFT claims Win7 addressed many of those issues, and based on press feedback (along with my anecdotal experience based on 25 years of using Windows), user experience has improved. Apple (barely.)

Cost: Apple computers cost more. Looking at any on retail shop that sells PCs and Apple computers will show PCs cost hundreds if not thousand less than comparable Apple. The arguement that Apple computers come with more software is moot as there are many free or inexpensive alternatives for typical computer user (surf the web, email, store music and photos, word processing, etc.) Microsoft recently announced a free version of Office 2010 in response to other free applications like Google Docs. PC.

Software: PC app devs have more tools. There are more PC apps and games and more free apps. PC.
Posted by Rockylightning 7 years ago
Rockylightning
pro=mean
Posted by Rodriguez47 7 years ago
Rodriguez47
I wish i had a Mac but when i weighed my OWN pro's and cons, PC stood up most.
I Agree with Pro, i wanted a Mac Pro but even the ugliest (by ugliest i meant dirty i was willing to fix it up my self) and low grade intel based MacPro i could find was still out of my price range, i'm not rich but i still need a good cheap computer.

Moreover its not customizable. I wanted a good graphics card and more space for movies. I Download movies u the bulk, i would've ran out and i didn't want to get an external hard drive that cost more than an internal one depending on size. And i have a lot more reasons. But i know have a a 2.00GHz Quad Core laptop with to hard drives inside yes internal, Dv7-2185dx and i am very happy with my 400$ purchase.
Posted by Livebriand 7 years ago
Livebriand
You mean your cruddy mac right? After all, the reason you lost is simply because PCs are FAR BETTER than Macs!
Posted by Rockylightning 7 years ago
Rockylightning
You win brian, but this dosn't change my opinion on ma cruddy computer
Posted by Livebriand 7 years ago
Livebriand
Yes - this is about computer hardware and software.
28 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Vote Placed by TheFreeThinker 5 years ago
TheFreeThinker
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Vote Placed by cjlopez213 6 years ago
cjlopez213
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