The Instigator
EliasL
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
AbandonedSpring
Con (against)
Winning
5 Points

People are too hard on illegal immigrants.

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
AbandonedSpring
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 10/20/2014 Category: Society
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 700 times Debate No: 63604
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (4)
Votes (1)

 

EliasL

Pro

There are many social media posts that are very anti-immigrant when it comes to the United States. I am very against this for reasons that will be listed in this argument.

We are all immigrants. No matter how you look at it, the British immigrated here, the Spanish, Portuguese, even the Native Americans. The idea that someone, in an attempt to get away from a lesser country, should not be allowed to try to have a better life is asinine.

Please feel free to argue in your first post. :)
AbandonedSpring

Con

Hello, and thanks for starting this debate!

Ill start off with a couple basic points.

Point A. As shown here, http://www.breitbart.com..., there are issues when illegal immigrants come over that pose a threat to our society.

Point B. Next, drug cartels are given an all-access pass to America. Through loop holes, drug cartels come here to break the law.

Point C.Illegal immigrants are also prone to gangs. Gangs, as we all know, are never a good thing.

Later in the debate, I will go deeper into these points! Thanks!
Debate Round No. 1
EliasL

Pro

It is my pleasure!

In response to the video, they would not have been in a high speed chase if they were accepted and given the job opportunities you and I are.

"Next, drug cartels are given an all-access pass to America."

I'll just say this. Drug dealing is a quick way to make a LOT of money. The problem is...it is illegal. For good reason. Let me back up. Illegal immigrancy is illegal for NO reason. Anyone who is here on behalf of a drug cartel is breaking the law in a different way. They can be arrested for being part of a drug cartel, not immigrating.

The majority of gang members are gang members because they are out of options. That or they are ignorant enough to kill people in the name of "West Coast Represent!". Either way, I say again, immigrants would not join gangs if they had more job options! No one hires them because it is illegal! If it were not illegal, then there would not be a problem and the immigrant would be hired based on their capability to do the job, not their citizenship.

Even still, most people immigrate to the US so they can have opportunity. Who are we to rip that away from them because a few of them join a gang? Nationality has nothing to do with crime rate.

Speaking of crime, the United States is NUMERO UNO when it comes to incarcerated citizens! It's not like we're pure and must keep all crime out. So maybe if we allowed them all in, then people who have all the money (criminals) won't be the only ones to come in.

Thanks :)
AbandonedSpring

Con

1: You can say that, but that doesn't make it true. If they came here, and payed the money to become a citizen, that would not have happened.

"I'll just say this. Drug dealing is a quick way to make a LOT of money. The problem is...it is illegal. For good reason. Let me back up. Illegal immigrancy is illegal for NO reason. Anyone who is here on behalf of a drug cartel is breaking the law in a different way. They can be arrested for being part of a drug cartel, not immigrating. "

Like stated in my argument. It is illegal. If millions of people flooded into our nation, we would hurt economically. I am all for making it easier to immigrate legally. However, when people are here illegal they pose a danger to society. there are several reasons pecan pie immigration, without paying the fee, is illegal. as shown here:
http://www.independent.org...

"The majority of gang members are gang members because they are out of options. That or they are ignorant enough to kill people in the name of "West Coast Represent!". Either way, I say again, immigrants would not join gangs if they had more job options! No one hires them because it is illegal! If it were not illegal, then there would not be a problem and the immigrant would be hired based on their capability to do the job, not their citizenship."

next, They cannot get jobs, because they are illegally here. If they were here legally, than a couple more jobs would be available. And also, to say they wouldn't join gangs is ignorant. my point is that a lot of the time gangs are brought from Mexica to the US, often which are associated with drug cartels. Even if they were granted legal citizenships, there are a lot of Americans who just join gangs because they are tight on money. Therefore, your argument does not pertain to the issue because it is not unique to immigrants.

"Even still, most people immigrate to the US so they can have opportunity. Who are we to rip that away from them because a few of them join a gang? Nationality has nothing to do with crime rate. "

We are Americans. The people who are currently residing in America. And of course, I never said it did! However, people faced in this situation often use gangs to get across the border.

"peaking of crime, the United States is NUMERO UNO when it comes to incarcerated citizens! It's not like we're pure and must keep all crime out. So maybe if we allowed them all in, then people who have all the money (criminals) won't be the only ones to come in."

Also, you may or may not be familiar with this issue, so I'll enlighten you. America, a while ago adopted the phrase, "tough on crime". This originally was used as code for, "black people will be treated unfairly", and this still has truth today, as the majority of prisons have a mainly black populous. Also, many of these African Americans do commit crimes, but it's because of the unfair advantage that they were BORN into. Also I'd like to point out that criminals do not own "all the money", otherwise the majority of them would stop committing crime, and seek citizenship.

Thank you.
Debate Round No. 2
EliasL

Pro

Before I go into my arguments, let me be clear that anyone who is coming to the US for the simple reason of doing crime are not who I am referring to. I am referring to the people who comer here to 'start over', or to get away from poverty.

I don't believe you understood me correctly. I don't need an explanation on WHY they have a hard time finding jobs, I am saying that they SHOULD be hired.

There are social media posts that deny immigrants the right to marry here, the right to have a drivers' license, school, etc.

I say again, we as Americans are immigrants. Formerly illegal ones at that. We illegally seceded from Britain, which started the American Revolution.

What about the organizations who, in the name of the Republican party, complain about the jobs being given to illegal immigrants when, just as your statistics say, most of them are forced to join crime.

37$ of all Americans are not white, meaning that they have come here at some point in history, and I'm sure some illegal.

What about blacks? During the time of slavery, blacks illegally entered the north and yet were accepted unless brought before the supreme court.

With so many things being accepted in today's society, illegal immigrants should be too. Anyone who is in the situation that many people in Mexico are being born into would want to escape. Therefore, we shouldn't morally be able to shun them from society.


AbandonedSpring

Con

Seeing as to how this is the final round, and you brought up new argument, I will begin with rebuttals, then do the same.

"Before I go into my arguments, let me be clear that anyone who is coming to the US for the simple reason of doing crime are not who I am referring to. I am referring to the people who comer here to 'start over', or to get away from poverty."

No, you are referring to "illegal immigrants". A term you have used several times. Illegal immigrant applies to everyone who, Immigrated, illegally. Period, end of story. Whether they come with good intent or bad, they are illegal immigrants.

"I don't believe you understood me correctly. I don't need an explanation on WHY they have a hard time finding jobs, I am saying that they SHOULD be hired."

You don't want to get me started on entitlement. I did not "misunderstand" you. There are hard working Americans who are unemployed, and/or underpaid. People who came here, might I add Illegally, have no more reason to be hired than someone who is here legally, and has more experience. Nobody "SHOULD" be hired simply because they are not here legally. That make no sense.

"What about the organizations who, in the name of the Republican party, complain about the jobs being given to illegal immigrants when, just as your statistics say, most of them are forced to join crime."

I don't really understand pecan pie republican were generalized, considering I am independent, which can also be seen in my bio. Also, I'm not sure I understand you sentence structure. Your using a political party, which I am not a part of, to prove me wrong?

"37$ of all Americans are not white, meaning that they have come here at some point in history, and I'm sure some illegal."

Im assuming you meant 37%. This was pretty funny to me, as this is a testament to "proof-reading". You also really have this screwed up. Assuming you don't consider the original Europeans illegals, which I will, considering that before we came, American was not a unified nation, the majority of us are here legally. Just because there is a minority population, does not mean that they are here illegally. That is illogical.

"What about blacks? During the time of slavery, blacks illegally entered the north and yet were accepted unless brought before the supreme court. "

Honey, have you ever picked up an American history text book? Black never migrated illegally. They were forced here, against there free will. They are here legally, just despite their wants. Also, you obviously were not big into geography. Seeing as to how there are no black people in Canada, who has ancestors their for thousands of years.

"With so many things being accepted in today's society, illegal immigrants should be too. Anyone who is in the situation that many people in Mexico are being born into would want to escape. Therefore, we shouldn't morally be able to shun them from society."

Also, I resent the first statement. Not that many more things are accepted then there were 50 years ago. I'm not saying Latinos can't be accepted, I'm just saying to earn that respect, they need to be here legally. Honestly though, there are a lot of countries that have it worse then Mexico. I get life isn't amazing for some people by any means, but does there exist a nation that has no suffering? Of course not. Honestly, you paint the picture as if it would be worse here than it would be back in Mexico. If this is your argument, then why don't illegal immigrants stay in Mexico?

Thank you, I have finished.
Debate Round No. 3
4 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Posted by cheyennebodie 2 years ago
cheyennebodie
Why is America the only place where opportunity exists. If it does not exist in say,Mexico, then they should stay there and get rid of the government they have that stifles opportunity, not come here and be a burden on us.

You go into almost any emergency room in Los Angelos and most people there cannot speak English. Why is that?
Posted by EliasL 3 years ago
EliasL
I meant 37%, sorry for the random dollar sign.
Posted by cheyennebodie 3 years ago
cheyennebodie
It is not them coming here that is a problem. But them coming here and being a burden on America. It used to be those who came here loved the freedom of being their own boss. And doing whatever they chose to do for themselves. Now, too many of them are here to freeload off the rest of us.
Posted by cwt002 3 years ago
cwt002
I think there is something important to note. Pro agrees that the immigrants they are referring to are illegal. Although yes we are all technically immigrants however like myself immigrated legally. There is a huge difference between the two.

Also, from your comments it would seem you would be for open borders.....which is extremely asinine to think that America would have a sustainable economy after 5 years. America does not want to prevent others from having a better life but we have to protect current Americans first. I mean in the past 3-4 years we have allowed 2.8 million people to enter legally and have better lives.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by QTAY21 2 years ago
QTAY21
EliasLAbandonedSpringTied
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Total points awarded:05 
Reasons for voting decision: Con had more convincing arguments. Letting anyone become a legal citizen without proper procedures can lead to the wrong kinds of people coming into the country. I'm not against immigrants coming into America (legally), but to let anyone just wander over here is very ignorant. Sources to con.