The Instigator
PonticGreekMacedonian
Con (against)
Winning
1 Points
The Contender
V5RED
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points

People criticizing Christians because of what they believe in.

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
PonticGreekMacedonian
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/1/2015 Category: Religion
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 720 times Debate No: 81902
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (31)
Votes (1)

 

PonticGreekMacedonian

Con

People have been criticizing Christians because of their beliefs in God and people say it isn't wrong because their beliefs are ridiculous. How can they be ridiculous when everyone has a belief!!!?
V5RED

Pro

You are a Christian based on your profile. Thus you believe in the values of Christianity such as the idea that belief in Jesus gets you into heaven. You also believe that your god is good, thus you believe that his choices are good.

He is choosing to sentence me to hell because I am an atheist. Add any bells and whistles you want, in the end the net is that I do not believe in ridiculous nonsense and you think I will go to hell for it. not only that, but you think this is a good thing since you think your god is good.

Putting all of this together, you think it would be good for me to be tortured, and you have the gall to whine like a little baby about being told that you are an immoral sack of dirt? Go cry into a cup of milk as I don't care that a person who thinks I deserve torture has himself a cry.
Debate Round No. 1
PonticGreekMacedonian

Con

As you see Pro is accusing me of saying he/she will go to hell which is unacceptable. I didn't say anyone would go to hell. If Pro is going to do nothing but insult me then Pro's argument is worthless. He/she then states that the belief is ridiculous which is an insult when this is supposed to be a debate, not an invitation to insult.
V5RED

Pro

It looks like my opponent is not able to counter my criticism of Christians without whining. Too bad, you brought it on yourself by your beliefs. Maybe my opponent does not understand Christianity, but I do on account of being a Christian for longer than my opponent has been alive and having studied it deeply. If my opponent can get over its feelings and try to counter my argument that Christians essentially approve of torturing me, then maybe we can have a discussion.
Debate Round No. 2
PonticGreekMacedonian

Con

Yes there are Christians that say you will go to hell for this and go to hell for that but those are the strict ones. You must understand that not all Christians are like that. I am a Greek Orthodox Christian but I do not believe that everyone will go to hell. It is written that God still loves and forgives you but you must ask him for forgiveness. My religion is beautiful because it gives us a glimpse of another point of view on how the Earth formed. Here is a website tat shows interesting scientific reason why God exists: http://www.everystudent.com...
V5RED

Pro

"Yes there are Christians that say you will go to hell for this and go to hell for that but those are the strict ones. You must understand that not all Christians are like that. I am a Greek Orthodox Christian but I do not believe that everyone will go to hell. It is written that God still loves and forgives you but you must ask him for forgiveness."

Read your own words. You believe that one must ask your particular version of a particular god for forgiveness for particular crimes that he finds particularly offensive or else he will roast you.

It is dishonest to refuse to admit that that your beliefs necessarily mean that you believe that some people will be sent to hell and that you think it is a good thing. Every branch of Christianity would say that if I were killed in the next 5 minutes I would go to hell and deserve it while the Catholic pedophile priests get to go to heaven if they say sorry to God. Note, they need to apologize to an imaginary god to get forgiven, not to the actual victims.

Your beliefs are based on a morally bankrupt ideology. Now, I doubt most Christians actually consider the fact that they think it is good for people to burn forever for not believing in an almighty wizard playing a neverending game of hide and seek, but now you have been exposed to this fact about your religion and you can no longer accept your religion without accepting you would support me being tortured.

As to your link, this is just awful. I will rebut each point made, in order.

Flaw that they all fall under: Even if all of the arguments given worked, they only get you to the point of having a hypothesis. You still need to prove that a god is possible and that it created anything. On the assumption that I have an angry and violent roommate, the bruise on my face is much more likely to have occurred. Without that roommate it is odd for a grown man who doesn't get in fights to have a bruise like that. Does that tell you anything about whether I actually have a roommate? No.

1) Most of the universe, and even the earth, is uninhabitable. The tiny bit we are able to live in is not designed for us, rather we evolved to survive it. This argument would be like a puddle remarking how the pothole it is in was clearly designed to fit the puddle since the puddle fit in the pothole perfectly.

2) This is simply false. There are current models about how the universe came into being from "nothing".

3) Pure argument from ignorance fallacy. The author doesn't understand how something works, so god.

4) More argument from ignorance. Additionally, that only a small number of building blocks exist actually makes sense in a naturalistic sense since it is difficult to get any made at all, so a simpler system fits reality better.

5) This one had to be a joke, it is just so bad. He knows because he knows that he knows that he knows that god exists.

6) This is almost as bad as 5. The proof is the stuff written in a book. That does not prove miracles happened any more than comic books prove Spider Man was real.
Debate Round No. 3
PonticGreekMacedonian

Con

Yes but my Church is all about love and forgiveness. As you see people my opponent is looking at the negative sides of Christianity because he/she obviously had something bad happened to him/her which is causing him/her to hate religion. It seems nothing has positive things to negative people.
V5RED

Pro

Ad hominem in response to logic. I think the rest of the rounds will basically be busywork since I have already won.

By the by, based on the logic my opponent presented in his last post, only Holocaust survivors could hate the Nazis. Christianity is a bunch of fairy tails that were useful in scaring people into building societies, but it is now a burden on society. That, however, is not the point. The point is that the doctrine requires bigotry as I clearly pointed out.
Debate Round No. 4
PonticGreekMacedonian

Con

My opponent basically is saying that all Atheists will to hell but it is not about being a really big believer of our Lord and savior, it is based on being a good person and doing good deeds. This has been confirmed in many churches including the Greek Orthodox Church I attend. Most Christians believe that good people who do good deeds will earn a place in God's Kingdom but in the olden days people were taught to fear God and if they do not believe then they will go to hell when in reality we must not fear him. If you are a good person and do good deeds then good things shall happen to you but some people try to deny that and say that Christianity is evil and all Christian religions believe that non-believers will go to hell. NOT TRUE. But we will never know for sure until we go ourselves but at least I have chosen to believe in God like my Family from the very beginning.
V5RED

Pro

"Most Christians believe that good people who do good deeds will earn a place in God's Kingdom"

This is a flat lie. I was a Christian for 27 years and I bloody well know the faith. My opponent is basically just making things up and pretending that his faith is not the morally bankrupt thing that it is.

http://www.christianpost.com...
http://www.catholicvote.org...
https://www.facebook.com...
http://www.patheos.com...
https://en.wikipedia.org...

" If you are a good person and do good deeds then good things shall happen to you " Lies. *putting my Christian hat on again* You cannot buy your way into heaven with works. If you could, then the sacrifice of Jesus was pointless. He had to die for sins to be forgiven, but you need to accept that sacrifice.

Look at your own arguments. YOu have flip flopped on this issue from the start and now that you can clearly see that it is morally bankrupt, you are forced to deny that one must accept the grace of god to go to heaven.

I suggest my opponent come to the side he really supports which is atheism. Sure, it is scary to die, but making up stories won't change that and my opponent has clearly realized that his religion's position makes no sense and is immoral.
Debate Round No. 5
31 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by V5RED 1 year ago
V5RED
I do not believe that you have read the Bible. It is full of divine orders to murder, rape, and divine permission to own slaves.Read it again, you missed a lot. It is not just creation and Jesus, who by the by was not a good character.

http://www.evilbible.com...
This website is run by people who have actually read the bible and have posted some of the horrors that the god in it supports.

Here is just one example: "Thus says the Lord: 'I will bring evil upon you out of your own house. I will take your wives [plural] while you live to see it, and will give them to your neighbor. He shall lie with your wives in broad daylight. You have done this deed in secret, but I will bring it about in the presence of all Israel, and with the sun looking down.'"
(2 Samuel 12:11-14 NAB)

As to deeds he did himself, according to your myths, God committed genocide in the flood. Do not try to justify it. There is no justification for drowning everyone on earth including babies. If you think this is alright you have allowed yourself to be so deluded that you are now morally bankrupt.

He also murdered innocent Egyptian Children as punishment for Pharaoh not letting the Hebrews go, but had you actually read the bible you would know that the God character "hardened Pharaoh's heart" so that Pharaoh could not let the Hebrews go. He basically forced Pharaoh to disobey so he could punish Pharaoh for it.

Here is another one, he murders a man for refusing to impregnate his dead brother's wife. The brother that your god had already murdered. Genesis 38:8-10 "8 And Judah said unto Onan, Go in unto thy brother's wife, and marry her, and raise up seed to thy brother.9 And Onan knew that the seed should not be his; and it came to pass, when he went in unto his brother's wife, that he spilled it on the ground, lest that he should give seed to his brother.10 And the thing which he did displeased the Lord: wherefore he slew him also."
Posted by PonticGreekMacedonian 1 year ago
PonticGreekMacedonian
Yes but it's not what God wants. The Bible refers to God creating the Earth and of Jesus Christ coming to Earth. I have read the Bible and have seen nothing about rape. Those people who say they rape and kill for God are not doing the right thing!!!
Posted by V5RED 1 year ago
V5RED
@Pontic, God is clearly the evil one in the bible given his massive genocides, condoning of slavery, condoning of rape, and slaughters of children, but let's park that for a minute

"The Muslims that murder think they are Muslims because they think they are doing God's work when God is not about death." These are your words when I pointed out evils done in the name of god.

"Yes I have and it doesn't say anything about God being evil. The only death that was involved with God were the enemies of God who were on the evil side" These are your words when defending the exact same kind of evils when people do them in the name of your god.

You can't have it both ways. You can't condemn Muslims by saying that god is not about death and then condone the murders your god does in your book and that your fellow Christians do in his name by saying it is okay if the people he kills or you kill are your god's enemies. The muslims say that those they killed were their god's enemy.
Posted by PonticGreekMacedonian 1 year ago
PonticGreekMacedonian
Yes I have and it doesn't say anything about God being evil. The only death that was involved with God were the enemies of God who were on the evil side
Posted by PonticGreekMacedonian 1 year ago
PonticGreekMacedonian
Yes I have and it doesn't say anything about God being evil. The only death that was involved with God were the enemies of God who were on the evil side
Posted by V5RED 1 year ago
V5RED
@Pontic
"God is not about death." Have you ever read your bible?
Posted by PonticGreekMacedonian 1 year ago
PonticGreekMacedonian
The Muslims that murder think they are Muslims because they think they are doing God's work when God is not about death. The reason why Religions are against abortions is because aborting child is like murdering a child who is being born to have a life. Children are there to be born and have a life, not to be wasted away. But with the Gay thing, I just say let them be in love but in order to create and conceive a child, it needs to be done with a man and a woman. If a woman gets sperm inserted in her from a clinic and she is homosexual then technically she got it from a man because you can not have a child by blood with a man and man or a woman and woman, it needs to be done with a man and a woman. I have nothing against homosexuals but it is the way we are made. Our bodies were made to prepare for these things. A Woman's body is prepared to get pregnant with a child and then have it. A man's body is prepared to give the woman a child. But if you are homosexual then it is like wasting the preparation your body has prepared you for.
Posted by V5RED 1 year ago
V5RED
@Pontic, there are many reasons for an atheist to talk about why religious belief is irrational and even harmful.

-Religious belief is based on things that are not true, many people care about the truth and want to promote it
-Religious people often try to oppress the rights of others, look at the anti-gay movements, the anti-abortion movements, and many countries have, in the past, banned divorce on religious grounds
-Religion manipulates good people into doing wicked things in the attempt to be moral. For example, Muslims have murdered people over cartoons because they thought they had god on their side
Posted by palmertio0 1 year ago
palmertio0
No, atheists oppose Christianity because they have a "lack of belief in gods":

https://atheists.org...
Posted by PonticGreekMacedonian 1 year ago
PonticGreekMacedonian
Actually there is a different kind of group that believe in nothing. Atheists are people who are against Christianity
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by johnlubba 1 year ago
johnlubba
PonticGreekMacedonianV5REDTied
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Total points awarded:10 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro's conduct was awful and couldn't contain himself for insults.