The Instigator
EpicWizard1313
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
PowerPikachu21
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

Pokemon-Mamoswine should not have been made UU

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/6/2015 Category: Games
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 377 times Debate No: 82151
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (3)
Votes (0)

 

EpicWizard1313

Pro

I would like to argue the fact that Smogon's decision to make the Pokemon Mamoswine a member of the UU tier was not a good decision; the pokemon should have remained a member of the OU tier. I wish the best of luck to the con.
PowerPikachu21

Con

I am a fan of the Pokemon franchise, and have an account on Smogon. I will be arguing that Mamoswine should stay in the UU tier. I'll give definitions just in case people don't play Pokemon nor heard of Smogon, and don't know what we're talking about.

UU: Under Used; Lesser used pokemon from the main games fall in this tier. The pokemon in UU aren't as good as pokemon in the OU tier.

OU: Over Used; pokemon that most players use in their pokemon teams in the main games go here. These pokemon are more powerful than the UU pokemon.

Smogon: A company who is associated with pokemon. They own a virtual pokemon battling site known as "Pokemon Showdown", where you make pokemon teams for a chosen tier, such as Over Used, Under Used, Rarely Used, and Uber. (Uber tier pokemon are mainly legendary pokemon.)

And with that out of the way, let's begin!
Debate Round No. 1
EpicWizard1313

Pro

I thank the con for accepting the debate and for posting those definitions. I look forward to a good debate.

I have a few reasons for why Mamoswine should not be allowed in the UU tier.

Also, I will not define all of the pokemon terminology I am using; as it would take a lot of time and characters. You can find the defenition of anything you don't know at http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net...

Firstly, mamoswine gets an amazing dual STAB combination in ground ice. (STAB moves are moves that get powered up because they are the same type as the pokemon). Ground and ice are extremely good offensive types. Ground hits fire, poison, electric, rock, and steel for super effective damage, while ice hits grass, dragon, flying, and ground types for super effective damage. This allows mamoswine to hit, essentially, half of the pokemon types for super effective damage, which is fairly uncommon and extremely powerful.

A second reason for why mamoswine should not be UU is its extreme movepool. First off, it gets powerful STAB moves in earthquake and icicle crash, which, coupled with mamoswine's high attack stat of 130, enable it to hit very hard, especially if the moves are super effective. Mamoswine also gets access to knock off, one of the best moves in the game, as a way to hit psychics and ghosts for super effective damage while removing items, which is a huge benefit on every team. Icy wind is another ice move that is useful if you want to slow your opponent down. Mamoswine also gets access to priority STAB ice shard, which is an extremely good move when many dragons and flying types are roaming the tier. Superpower is another strong move that gives mamoswine fighting type coverage with its massive 120 base power. Rock type coverage is there as well, with rock slide and stone edge. Mamoswine also gets several lead moves, such as stealth rocks and endeavor. Mamoswine gets such a diverse movepool that it is too overpowered in the UU tier.

Thirdly, mamoswine is not limited to one role. There is no way of predicting mamowine's role, moveset, or item based solely on the team preview. Lead mamoswine is a very popular set, using stealth rock equipped with a focus sash, combined with endeavor to secure the setup rocks and the severe weakening of your opponent's lead. Mamoswine can also function well with two choice items, the band and scarf, depending on which stat you want to increase. The life orb increases the power off all of its attacks, which makes mamoswine extremely hard to switch into. Mamoswine can run a defensive role as well, using leftovers and running moves such as toxic and knock off. There are really infinitely different ways you can run mamoswine, and, with its amazing movepool and powerful stats, it is too big of a threat to be used in UU.

Finally, to show how big of a threat mamoswine is to other pokemon in the tier, here are some damage calculations to show how much damage life orb mamoswine, the most common set, does to the most common UU pokemon, according to smogon's UU viability thread.

252 Atk Life Orb Mamoswine Icicle Crash vs. 0 HP / 44 Def Mega Aerodactyl: 398-468 (132.2 - 155.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
-1 252 Atk Life Orb Mamoswine Icicle Crash vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Salamence: 582-691 (175.8 - 208.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Life Orb Mamoswine Icicle Crash vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Crobat: 437-515 (140.5 - 165.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Life Orb Mamoswine Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Entei: 484-572 (130.4 - 154.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Life Orb Mamoswine Icicle Crash vs. 0 HP / 0- Def Hydreigon: 439-523 (135 - 160.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Life Orb Mamoswine Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 80 Def Mega Beedrill: 368-434 (135.7 - 160.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
-1 252 Atk Life Orb Mamoswine Icicle Crash vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Krookodile: 289-343 (87.3 - 103.6%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Life Orb Mamoswine Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Lucario: 572-673 (203.5 - 239.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Life Orb Mamoswine Earthquake vs. 40 HP / 0 Def Nidoqueen: 478-564 (144.4 - 170.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Life Orb Mamoswine Earthquake vs. 240 HP / 244+ Def Tentacruel: 406-478 (112.4 - 132.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Life Orb Mamoswine Icicle Crash vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Shaymin: 361-429 (105.8 - 125.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Life Orb Mamoswine Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Sceptile: 437-515 (155.5 - 183.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Life Orb Mamoswine Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mienshao: 321-380 (118.4 - 140.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

These are all pokemon that are ranked in the top 20 or so in smogon's UU viability rankings. Mamoswine, if it outspeeds, is capable of OHKOing all of the above. These calcuations are another proof that mamoswine is too good in the UU tier.

I wish good luck to the con and look forward to seeing their debate.
PowerPikachu21

Con

PowerPikachu21 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2
EpicWizard1313

Pro

EpicWizard1313 forfeited this round.
PowerPikachu21

Con

PowerPikachu21 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
EpicWizard1313

Pro

EpicWizard1313 forfeited this round.
PowerPikachu21

Con

PowerPikachu21 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by PowerPikachu21 1 year ago
PowerPikachu21
Good news, everybody! The glitch has been fixed! I'm going to see why Mamoswine is in the UU tier, and post that for round 3.
Posted by PowerPikachu21 1 year ago
PowerPikachu21
Of course, logging out and back in did nothing.
Posted by PowerPikachu21 1 year ago
PowerPikachu21
Did something happen? It's been 48 hours since I forfeited Round 2, yet it hasn't been updated. (same with my "2+2" debate.) I'll see if logging out will fix it.
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