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Rap Debates are Trolls

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/13/2012 Category: Miscellaneous
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 694 times Debate No: 21130
Debate Rounds (4)
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1: First round is for acceptance.
2: Pro has the BOP.
3: Con has to counter Pro's arguments, but has no BOP.


I accept.
Debate Round No. 1


Before I start my arguments, let me give you my definition of a troll on this site.

A Troll Debate: A debate that is pointless, unintelligent, too opinionated (as in song debate opinions), forfeit debates (only by the forfeiter), or debates where rules are broken.

Point 1: Rap Debates usually involve profanity.


At least 16 profanity words used in this debate.[1]
At least 27 profanity words used in this debate.[2]
At least 5 profanity words used in this debate (and it isn't over yet).[3]
At least 16 profanity words used in this debate.[4]
At least 10 profanity words used in this debate.[5]


Why is the use of profanity bad? Because it lowers the quality of this site. This site is designed for intelligent debates. Not these kind of debates. And it's not that other debates don't use any profanity, but it is the amount of profanity in just one argument in these debates. These profanity heavy debates are not intelligent.


The use of profanity is rampant in rap debates, and at least violates the intelligence of these debates.

Point 2: Rap Debates always involve bad Spelling and Grammar.


I extend sources 1-5 into this argument and include the new sources 6-8.


Why is the use of bad Spelling and Grammar bad? Well one, it is one of the voting points voters are asked. Pretty much every single rap debate is full of spelling and grammar mistakes. And again, the frequency of them makes it ten times worse. All the Spelling and Grammar mistakes make the debate unintelligent.


The use of Spelling and Grammar mistakes are rampant in rap debates, and at least violates the intelligence of these debates.

Point 3: Rap Debates are too highly opinionated.


Sources 2, 5, 7, and 8.


What do I mean by too highly opinionated? Well one, it is like a song debate where the two debaters post songs to their arguments and ask the voters to vote on which ones they like better. These debates are useless. They aren't a real win for the winner. It is just the right voters voting at the right time. Now you may ask "well rap debates require creativity, they vote on the creativity". I counter this by advancing source 5. Look at the voting for this debate. Completely split on reasons of likeness of one rap or the other.


Rap debates are rather useless, and so break rules by being pointless and too opinionated.

Point 4: Rap debates lower the quality of this site by making unintelligent debates.


All Rap debates on this site.


These debates are not the debates supposed to be on this site. Debates like sources 9 and 10 do belong on this site.


These debates at least violate the first three rules of trolling and can violate the last two. Therefore, these debates are most certainly trolls.


Final Conclusions:

These debates are useless because there is nothing learned from Rap Debates, and the voting is usually partial to one debater or the other based solely on opinion. These debates are unintelligent because nothing is learned from them and the profanity and Spelling & Grammar mistakes are so rampant that it shouldn't even be considered a debate, where it is more or less just a dumb argument. These debates are too opinionated because again, the voting is partial, and therefore, even if one debater wins, it isn't really a real win for the debater.

These debates should therefore be considered trolls for the reasons mentioned above, but especially the unintelligence of these debates.




1: Many rap battles, do, indeed, involve profanity. I cannot say "most" because I have yet to see a study that has looked at every rap battle on DDO and calculated the percentage of them which involves profanity.

The opponent has not sufficiently proven that profanity takes away from intelligent debate. Profanity does not necessarily take away from the intellectual quality of a debate, and the opponent fails to substantiate his claims that state otherwise. A counterexample is "On Bulls--t," an academic paper written by Harry Frankfurter, a professor of philosophy at Princeton University. [1] This paper is viewed as an insightful philosophical piece, despite the use of a curse word. The use of curse words does not necessarily "violate the intelligence of debates."

2: The opponent claims that rap debates "always" involve bad spelling and grammar.

If one were to read through this rap battle [2], for example, one can see that spelling and grammar in a rap battle debate do not have to be poor. Through the use of this example, I have deemed the opponent's extreme claim null. Rap debates do not "always" involve bad spelling and grammar.

Moreover, plenty of regular debates on DDO involve more spelling and grammar, too. I do not see how the nature of a debate (i.e., its being a rap debate) would encourage such mistakes.

3: Although judgment is subjective, rap debates do involve talent and are not detrimental to the quality of this site. When you watch Iron Chef, although the judges make decisions based on opinions, a general strong talent is required to fare well in the competition.

Also, all of the debate judgments on this site are subjective. There is no such thing as a clear-cut view of any debate. Even on the most objective issues, debates can end up being closely scored. The foundation of this site is community voting and, if anything, rap-style debates celebrate that.

4: The idea that the debates are "unintelligent" is completely the opponent's opinion. I can just as easily say tat they are "brilliant" and their authors should receive Pulitzer Prizes for their work.


I would like to add that the opponent simply put his own definition on the term "Troll Debate." This does not appear to be an accepted definition, from what I can tell (which could be reinforced with a dictionary source.) And if the opponent does not find a definition that is supported by evidence, we will have to use my definition for future rounds, which would probably not work in the opponent's favor.

The opponent has yet to provide a valid definition for a key term in this debate, and he has no adequately defended his resolution.

Thank you.

Debate Round No. 2


Point 1: Of the 15 I have seen, all of them had profanity. Now this is just a speculation, but I bet that almost all of them have profanity. I challenge you to find a rap battle that does not use profanity. Or better yet, find 5.

The use of curse words does in fact lower the quality of a debate because it is degrading. And it is not so much the use of profanity so much as it is the frequency of profanity. The debates I looked at, almost all had at least 10 profanity words. These words preach the wrong message.

Point 2: Ok. You found one example.

What I find so amusing is that debaters are partially judged based on how the Spelling and Grammar is. That is the whole point of that voting point. So that debaters would have their arguments with fewer spelling and grammar mistakes.

The spelling and grammar mistakes made in other debates are not intentional or wanted (I hope). In Rap Debates, they are either wanted or not cared about. They encourage misspelling through it's nature.

Point 3: Rap debates involve little talent because it isn't really music. I mean anyone can become a rap artist. And the debaters don't even have to sing! Debates shouldn't be judged on opinions, they should be judged on the quality of a person's arguments and the reliability of the sources.

I wish to refute my opponent's claim that all debate judgments are subjective. It is a lot times clear when one debater's argument is better than the other's. There are many debates where there should only be one clear-cut view of a debate. Rap debates usually depend solely on the voter's opinion. It is like saying there is a debate on abortion and the voters all vote based on their beliefs. Sound wrong? Rap debates are too highly opinionated.

Point 4: These debates are useless. They basically preach profanity and incorrect spelling and grammar, they teach nothing and do not allow the viewer of the debate to learn anything, and they just flood this website with useless debates.

Final Conclusion Arguments: I can't find a definition of a troll debate. We'll use your definition of a troll debate and I will argue against it in Round 4. My definition I have heard from several other people and I have heard no other definition.


Point 1: The opponent believes that curse words lower the quality of a debate because they are degrading. That's just the opponent's opinion.

2: My opponent states that spelling and grammar mistakes are "wanted or not cared about." He is making assumptions about the motives of debaters on here without a valid basis.

3: The opponent states that rap debates involve little talent... and that rap is not music... These are just opinions. Anyone can become a rap artist? What about someone in a vegetative state?

4: More of the opponent's opinions...

Okay. Here's my definition:

"Troll Debate": Debates about trolls, the mythological beings.

Thank you.
Debate Round No. 3


TheTrollHater forfeited this round.


Extend all arguments.
Debate Round No. 4
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