The Instigator
stupidmidget
Con (against)
Losing
33 Points
The Contender
clsmooth
Pro (for)
Winning
68 Points

Rap music.

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 12/12/2007 Category: Arts
Updated: 9 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 6,523 times Debate No: 281
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (8)
Votes (33)

 

stupidmidget

Con

rap music degrades the woman and promotes violence against everything. such as these rappers. Onyx, Biggie, Geto Boys, Not-so-Young Hova they talk about killing people because of there race, gang, and gender. if that isnt violent and wrong, tell me what is.
clsmooth

Pro

1. Not all rap music degrades women. What about a song like "Ladies First" by Monie Love or "U.N.I.T.Y." by Queen Latifah? Not even a majority, or even close to that, of rap music degrades women, but you say it as a blanket statement, as if ALL rap music degrades women, and that's false. I've just proven it to be false.

2. Not all rap music promotes violence. Much of rap music is actually anti-violence. See the collaboration "Self Destruction" from the Stop the Violence project. I've never heard any violent content in any of the Christian rap I listen to. And just because violence may be depicted in some rap music, does not mean it is supported. Early gangster rappers depicted violence in cautionary tales that encouraged kids to NOT join gangs, do drugs, etc. Later gangster rappers did "promote violence," arguably, but that is a very small minority of all rappers.

3. You say Onyx, Biggie, Geto Boys, and Jay-Z ALL "talk about killing people because of their race, gang, and gender." I am not familiar with Onyx or Geto Boys, but I will talk about BIG and Jay-Z. To keep it simple, I will say with 100% certainty that your statement is wrong, because neither rapper ever "talked about killing people" because of their race. If I am wrong, show me where. Point to a song. Post the lyrics.

4. Regardless, even talking about hate crimes is not violent. Violence is the initiation of force against people. No words can be violent, no matter how disgusting they may be. What is violence? Prohibiting free speech by force. Laws regulating speech are premised on the government's ability to use guns on people who violate the speech laws. THAT is violent!
Debate Round No. 1
stupidmidget

Con

okay. well. i am sorry about the confusion. i searched violent rappers and found a site showing it. and just copied and pasted. but most music i hear is violent and promotes violence and racism.
clsmooth

Pro

You would have to define what "racism" means, and also define what "promoting violence" entails.

I will concede that most non-white rappers embrace "racial identity," which true individualists such as myself consider "racist." However, the more commonly accepted definition of "racism" is about racial superiority. I have heard some "black supremacist" rap in my day, but it is an extreme minority -- less than 1/10 of 1% of the rap I've heard (and I think that's being generous).

I started listening to gangsta rap in the fourth grade. Nearly twenty years later, I am completely committed to non-violence and true anti-racism (radical individualism). Therefore, if rap promotes violence and racism, it certainly did not do a good job with me.
Debate Round No. 2
stupidmidget

Con

okay. i see your point. im jsut saying that some rap promotes it. i cannot retaliate to your comment so i forfit.
clsmooth

Pro

Err... Okay. Jeez, I have to come up with 100 characters in response. I'll just say that it is wrong to try to characterize "all" of something based on the perceived sins of "some" of something, or to smear the "good" -- even if they are the minority -- with guilt-by-association to the "bad." There are Christian rappers, and there are pro-freedom Iranian rappers challenging their government in Tehran. Search YouTube!
Debate Round No. 3
8 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 8 records.
Posted by tbarber001 9 years ago
tbarber001
oh i thought you meant like we'll kill em...type songs...

not songs that remember how their country got to the point where it is now...or what ppl had to fight for...etc.

sorry...
Posted by AREA 9 years ago
AREA
tbarber001
Can think of a few off the top of my head, so I'll look up the lyrics for them:

"And the rockets' red glare, the bombs bursting in air,"
The Star-Spangled Banner (USA)

I'm no expert on national or patriotic songs, but I believe Biladi is considered to be the national anthem of Palestine? Here are some lines:

With my determination, my fire and the volcano of my revenge
I have climbed the mountains and fought the wars
With the resolve of the winds and the fire of the guns
And the determination of my nation in the land of struggle
Palestine is my home, Palestine is my fire, Palestine is my revenge and the land of endurance
- Biladi (Palestine)

Please correct me if I am wrong.

'Mid cannon's roar and rifles' peal
We'll chant a soldier's song
A Soldier's Song (Ireland)

Please correct me if I am wrong.

Is this surprising? How many nation states were formed via revolution or a battle against Imperialism? History is no stranger to violence, and the National Anthems we make to represent our nations are rooted in our histories. I Believe Vietnam has one like that too.
Even countries without violence in their official anthems probably have dozens of unofficial ones they call "patriotic songs". Whether their National Song has violence or not may depend on when they became independent, or how peaceful their conditions were from 1700-1960 when most of these songs were written...
Posted by tbarber001 9 years ago
tbarber001
really? what national anthems have violence in them>
Posted by AREA 9 years ago
AREA
Opera, and even some countries' national anthems promote violence, and yet I have never seen anyone debate those musical genres. Why must rap be singled out?
Posted by tbarber001 9 years ago
tbarber001
i dont like rap, not a lot of it anyway, but thats okay...this wasn't much of a debate because the pro side really dominated....

so good for you.
Posted by VaLoR 9 years ago
VaLoR
That number has now expanded to 3 now...
Posted by maddie_8 9 years ago
maddie_8
Because he voted for himself. Thats why.
Posted by VaLoR 9 years ago
VaLoR
How in the world did stupidmidget end up getting a vote in his favor?

It seems to me whomever did so didn't judge on the content and clarity of argument, but rather the premise itself, which is an irresponsible, dishonest way to go about voting on a winner of a debate.

If only there was a way to regulate dishonest voting...
33 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Vote Placed by GeoLaureate8 8 years ago
GeoLaureate8
stupidmidgetclsmoothTied
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Vote Placed by jamie_l_2oo6 9 years ago
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