The Instigator
RapeAdvocate
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
Actions_Speak
Con (against)
Winning
1 Points

Rape is not wrong. You are.

Do you like this debate?NoYes+0
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Vote Here
Pro Tied Con
Who did you agree with before the debate?
Who did you agree with after the debate?
Who had better conduct?
Who had better spelling and grammar?
Who made more convincing arguments?
Who used the most reliable sources?
Reasons for your voting decision - Required
1,000 Characters Remaining
The Voting Period Ends In
171days00hours04minutes03seconds
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/3/2018 Category: Politics
Updated: 1 week ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 476 times Debate No: 107532
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (11)
Votes (1)

 

RapeAdvocate

Pro

You must have heard and used those following phrases : "Rape is wrong." or, "Rape is bad". And you have never doubted the truth of such sayings, haven't you?

These are thrown around as if they meant something important, and worse, as if they were founded on some solid premise that is incontrovertible. However, is it actually true that rape is bad? Or, are these just empty mantra of unthinking, irrational people that shout baseless words while pretending it had any substance that has been brainwashed into the unconscious of the mass public? I argue that the correct answer is the latter.

Before we get into the question of rape honestly and earnestly, I would like to make the following three central points clear: A) There are numerous types of rape - virginal, oral, anal, etc. B) a rape is not only male-on-female; there are homosexual rapes and pedophila too. C) However, let us focus on the vast majority of rape that has endured its popularity universally and timelessly: the good ol' classic forcible male-on-female penetrative rape.

Rape is only an act. It is an act in which a male forces a female to have sex with him, in spite of her rejection or regardless of whatever she may utter. In and by itself, the act has no intrinsic moral value attached to it; rather, it is just another way people obtain and perform sex. Even the activity of "forcing" her or disregarding what she says itself is just an act without any inherent moral value attached to it. To put it very simply, it is just what people do and how people do it, and that is what all activities just are. There is nothing more or less to rape than that point.

Whereas the notion of "good" or "bad"; "right" or "wrong" are value judgements that are assigned to activities by people(aka society) so as for people to categorize and judge those acts. In simpler terms, it is only what we call as "social construction"; meaning that it is not at all some absolute, physical feature of rape; rather, it is just another human invention that is subject to change or modification as the people in society change. So anyone talking about as if rape was without a doubt wrong or bad is just being completely dishonest or pretending, without any historical knowledge about how values have so often changed in our relatively short human history.

In fact, value judgements are so fluid and immutable that we can assign new values to rape. Thus, I propose a new value assigned to rape in order to perceive and judge the act as "a passionate, direct, intimate and unforgettable connection established deeply between people, with the result of tremendous sexual gratification and pleasure." Now does rape seem like a crime to you? No, because it is an act valued as above. It is perfectly one of the viable manners of how people achieve sex in their life. So should anyone be imprisoned for rape? No, why should anyone be? And most importantly should any female feel traumatized, hurt and miserable about having experienced raped? No, they went through nothing bad or wrong.

Society has brainwashed individuals with the notion that rape only has the negative aspect, while blocking the diverse, creative perspective on the issue. When you said or heard that "Rape is bad" or "Rape is wrong", you or anyone who uttered that do not mean that. What happens to you or to the person is just an automated response that is merely repeated because of the social conditioning(indoctrination to be more precise) on its individual members. It matters not you are an anti-rape activist, a liberal(or pseudo-progressive) follower in feminism, a conservative who wants their daughter or female spouse against rape or a religious member that does not believe in so-called "dirty sex". All of them are merely repeating the socially-constructed idea that has been repeatedly shoved down to their throats for so long that they even have forgotten that it was never their original, authentic idea. Please do not lie by saying that you really think rape is wrong or bad, because chances are, you have never deeply and earnestly thought about it. Also, please do not pretend that you have done so, as it is just your false-consciousness deluding you.

Of course, you may still agree with all my points above and still say "So what? Suppose our judgement of rape is just a product of massive social construction and indoctrination, and it is never what we truly believe in. Still, If such thing can reduce or prevent rape, wouldn't it be still worthwhile?" Nice sophistry there. However, does it really help anyone? As soon as we activate the brainwashed, negative idea of rape, both sides of rape participants are rendered negative. The rapist suddenly is judged as no longer a human being but an evil incarnate or a monster, which is clearly dehumanization of a human being. The raped female gets further victimized because her internal knowledge that she has experienced something horrific, a realization stemming from the social indoctrination, is confirmed, reinforced and perpetuated by the people around her who send the message containing the same knowledge that she already holds. After all, to tell her "Hey, you have been through some very nasty stuff" doesn't help at all, but makes her more miserable, when she already knows it more than others. That is not helping; that is microaggression aiming to drive her to further depression, trauma and eventually, suicide. Well, considering how many raped females do kill themselves, the result so far seems quite unsuccessful.

Now is the time for us to open our thinking to new, diverse, creative judgment and value assignment to rape. We must discard the conservative, narrow-minded, negative value assignment on rape that has been forced into the consciousness of the public, and start assigning ourselves to the novel, diverse, progressive and positive value to it, not just for the fun of it, but to help the people involved in it " both the rapist and the raped females for justice and equality. And it is not at all hard " unlike other crimes, such as murder, arson, fraud, or theft, there is little to no physical loss in rape. Both the penis and the vagina are intact before, during and after rape. No one loses their money, limb or life just from rape, unless they decide to kill themselves afterwards, which is a wholly separate act. We do not need to accept values that society forces us to mindlessly pretend to follow; we can be honest and create our new values. Remember how vilified homosexuals were just 50 years ago? How people of other colors were discriminated? And look how we have changed. Rape does not change; but we can change our thinking about rape. Just imagine. It is not that hard if we try.
Actions_Speak

Con

Warning: The hard to stomach details will be in bold for the sake of my argument being readable to more viewers.

Before I begin, to everyone who must read what my opponent has happily written I credit you for sticking with me, and I promise to win this debate for you. Unlike my other debates I did not take this for personal pleasure but rather I cannot stomach the idea of this debate being lost to my opponent.

Rape is not sex, rape is not BDSM, sex and BDSM are consensual without consensuality rape occurs. Rape causes PTSD, and a lifetime of pain for the victim. Rape is often torture, and the conventional definition of torture is as followed
"any act by which severe pain or suffering, whether physical or mental, is intentionally inflicted on a person for such purposes as obtaining from him or a third person information or a confession…." [1]

However rape is not limited to being a torture technique as it may benefit the rapist, a likely benefit for the rapist is by providing said rapist with an offspring. Of course rape has both provided a time-tested torture technique that still holds up as arguably the most inhumane torture, seeing the cruel nature of rape and how it has the potential to benefit the rapist. It continues to rear its ugly face in society.


Is torture immoral?
"During his State of the Union address, President Bush spoke about the horrifying torture techniques Saddam Hussein has inflicted on prisoners in Iraq. He described the use of electric shock, burning with hot irons, acid, and rape. He said that the Iraqi government tortured children to get their parents to confess to crimes.
President Bush concluded: "If this isn't evil, then evil has no meaning." "[1]

My opponent's made up definition of rape:
"a passionate, direct, intimate and unforgettable connection established deeply between people, with the result of tremendous sexual gratification and pleasure."

rape: unlawful sexual intercourse or any other sexual penetration of the vagina, anus, or mouth of another person, with or without force, by a sex organ, other body part, or foreign object, without the consent of the victim. [2]

To quote a truth in cases of sexual assault:
"When a victim “identifies” with the attacker, it does not invalidate the attack. Rape is rape. Assault is assault. And Stockholm Syndrome is very real." [3]
Any pleasure found by the victim or the assailant is inconsequential, even in the event the victim develops stockholm syndrome. Albeit it may make the case more difficult to prove especially before the victim receives "examinations by both a physician and a mental health professional" which are completely necessary in this event. [3]

How unpopular is torture?

A median of 45% across the countries polled said they did not believe use of torture by their governments against suspected terrorists to try to gain information about possible attacks in their country could be justified. Literally meaning torture techniques such as rape aren't justifable to almost half of the population regardless of it it's being used on our worst enemies. [4]

How unpopular is the death penalty?

Where do we stand with the death penalty? 41% of those polled by gallup do not favor the death penalty. [5]

Quite literally according to popular view the death penalty is more favorable than torture, irregardless of who may be tortured and the circumstance.

To quote my opponent:
"unlike other crimes, such as murder, arson, fraud, or theft, there is little to no physical loss in rape"

While physical loss is comm in crimes it would be silly to say a physical loss is necessary for a crime to have occured In fact, assuming physical loss is necessary for a crime to have occured is fallacous.



In addition to this you added in a sneaky undermining of injuries that occur in events of rape, luckily the human body besides the heart and brain have great healing potential, but nevertheless severe physical injuries often occur alongside the aspect of mental trauma.

Injuries ocuring in Vaginal rape by Penis (from the pdf rape as a method of torture)

"When a woman is not sexually aroused, the vaginal surfaces lie in apposition and the vagina is no more than a potential space. Forced entry is painful because the vagina is not being lubricated by an outporing of mucous. Rather than adjusting her position to enable penetration, a woman being raped is actively avoiding the union, and these struggles result in bleeding, bruising and pain. If she is a virgin the hymen may be torn. After violent rape the bruises can be very painful especially when walking or sitting.." [6]

Injuries occuring in Anal penile rape (from the pdf rape as a method of torture)

"Anal penetration usually requires more force because men and women who are raped can tighten the anal sphincter. If the rapist persists against resistance, anal rape can tear the anal mucosa and cause heavy bleeding. If she already suffers from haemorrhoids (piles), which are bulging veins around the anus, these are also likely to be torn, which causes more blood loss."
"Anal rape may lead to anal fissure – a crack in the mucosa that fails to heal and which gives intense pain on passing faeces."[6]

Rape in wartime?
Mass rape of a countries women is an extremely demoralizing technique often used in war. Alongside the trauma and injuries inflicted on the women. Men were often mentally demoralized and broken as such events occured. In the classic fashion of rapists they may later subject the victim to murder, especially those who resisted. To quote a Filipino women's ordeal:



"The door banged open and soldiers from the Imperial Japanese Army were suddenly upon them. They grabbed Bartonico’s cousin and dragged her across the floor. The girl screamed and kicked and scratched the soldiers’ faces. Three soldiers took turns raping her before they killed her.


Witnessing her cousin’s assault and murder, Bartonico wept as another soldier tied her up and raped her in front of her family and friends.“I wanted to resist, but I was too afraid,” she said. “So began my suffering ... at the hands of japanese soldiers." " Cases were well documented as an estimated 400,000 women and girls were kidnapped and put ito forced service at "comfort stations" by the japanese military during WW2 [7]

To conclude rape has proven itself one of if not the worst forms of torture, and when not being used as a torture technique it is hardly different. Arguably worse since the rapist instead of looking for information is literally only attempting to rape you meaning you likely have no way out.

[1] https://www.hrw.org...
[2] http://www.dictionary.com...
[3] http://thestonefoundation.com...
[4] http://www.pewresearch.org...
[5] http://news.gallup.com...
[6] https://www.freedomfromtorture.org...
[7] https://www.huffingtonpost.com...
Debate Round No. 1
RapeAdvocate

Pro

Hello, Actions_Speak. Thank you for participating in this argument. I hope you enjoy this as much as a rapist enjoys his rape.

You started with a complete falsehood by claiming that rape is not sex. Rape is one of the many forms of sexual acts(in short, sex) that humans have perform universally and timelessly. The presence of sexual acts is what distinguishes rape from other sorts of acts, such as beating up, shooting or stabbing someone. Even the legal definition of rape that you provided clearly states "... sexual intercourse or any other sexual penetration..." as a core component of rape. Now does the legal definition of physical assaults or murder contain the said sexual acts in its definition? No. For your reference, here are the definitions of murder[1] and assault[2]. So this is one crucial fallacy and contradiction in your argument.

You distinguished rape from BDSM based on the condition of the presence of consent. However, the very notion that some sexual act requires a consent stems from the socially constructed idea that has been brainwashed into the mass public. A consent is never a what's called a "necessary condition" for the act of sex to occur. The fact is that any sexual act can happen without any sort of consent, as a huge number of raping males and raped females are the concrete evidence to prove the truth that no one needs consent to have sex with somebody else. To pretend to need a consent for sex is the blatant demonstration of being completely influenced by the social construction that I argue against.

You equate the rape with torture, and thus show how you have been indoctrinated by the social construction that I stand against. Because society has brainwashed its members into the delusion that rape is bad, people are pre-installed with such prejudice and bias in regard to rape. Torturers, who look for many methods to torments the subjects of torture, deliberately use such prejudice and bias that the tortured hold about rape in order to maximise the effect of torture. If the subjects did not hold the mindless dogma about rape, then rape as torture would be completely futile as the subjects would not be influence by rape-as-torture methods, leading to torturers discarding the practice. What you are saying actually lends further support to my position that we need to teach people to view rape in a positive and good way, so that it would not be used in cases of torture.

Crimes require some sort of significant physical, aka. material, concrete, real, damage or loss that results in some significant material/physical/concrete difference in a matter that can be evaluated. Unlike consent, those types of loss is a necessary condition for some act to be recognized and established as a crime. The loss of hymen is not and cannot be considered any significant loss, due to the fact that there is no change in the female physiology resulting from it being broken. Bruises are negligible, due to the fact that those can occur even in any sort of hard, rough sexual acts, and so can the loss of blood. In fact, to minimize bruises and bleeding is to try not to resist or fight back, but accept and embrace rape as it comes. The act of attempting to fight rapists has its grounds on the social indoctrination that rape is bad, negative, and harmful, which causes females to fruitlessly fight back even using force. In the process, the majority of bruises and bleeding related to rape happens - the raping male who tries to hold the female down and the raped female that tries to get away generates a lot of physical, violent, passionate physical activities, leading to some sort of bodily injuries. But, if females were not brainwashed with the socially constructed delusion, there would be significantly fewer females attempting such physical, pointless resistance, which in turn would save those females from receiving those bruises and bleeding. It is for the females' good. Then the male and the female can engage and relish in the sex that can produce orgasm in both parties, which cannot and should not ever be underestimated or ignored in rape for its real chemical presence in the body generates a tremendous physical effect. This way, rape serves as an important, significant, meaningful bodily practice both of which can find great pleasure, intimacy, and most importantly, a deep human interconnection.

Rape in a war is not even a significant issue. Some sort of sex, however lousy or bad you may find it, is never even close to the tragedy of a war in which people actually kill the lives of other and lose the ones of the loved ones or even themselves. To even equate the two, sex and death, would fundamentally mean incredible insult to those who died and those who have their loved ones dead in a war. It is also insulting to raped females, since it means evaluating raped females as dead ones.

You brought a lot of stories from a lot of sources. However, all of them are grounded in the social construction that has brainwashed people into holding the unfounded fallacy that "rape is bad/negative/harmful", the very notion that I am attacking. Society has constructed such basis, and inculcated it into the minds of the mass public, and my position is that the very idea has no evidence, no basis, and no use at all. I have provided with concrete examples an argument as to why we must get rid of the false dogma that "rape is bad" society has instilled in people for the better of everyone; meanwhile, you have not provided any argument as to why we must continue to hold onto the dogma even if it only hurts people further. I will await your response.

[1]https://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com...
[2]https://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com...
Actions_Speak

Con

I suppose you might have a point that rape is an act of sex by some definitions, regardless that point is unrelevant to this debate. Their are certainly arguments that rape is not sex and that it is, but I feel no need to argue over semantics. Rather than creating a debate about our semantic difference within a debate of is whether rape is wrong I shall carry on with the current. Also important to note you convienantly left our that rape is distinguished from sex in the very definition as it's unlawful.

You seem to not have an understanding of the logic fallacy I posted in the previous round, my apologies I should've posted the enlarged photo. You continue to hold onto the theory that a physical loss must occur for a crime to have been committed. I could give many examples of how this is untrue such as selling certain arms to someone mentally disabled.
You argue holding onto the "dogma" only hurts people and seemingly that we should embrace a rape culture, this is unfounded and is there is a plethora of evidence against every aspect of this point.

Psychological effects of rape (list courtesy of healtyplace)[1]:
  • Post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD) – feelings of severe anxiety and stress
  • Depression
  • Flashbacks – memories of rape as if it is taking place again
  • Borderline personality disorder
  • Sleep disorders
  • Eating disorders
  • Dissociative identity disorder
  • Guilt
  • Distrust of others – uneasy in everyday social situations
  • Anger
  • Feelings of personal powerlessness – victims feel the rapist robbed them of control over their bodies

Any one of these Psychological effects may make living a nightmare and after an incident of rape you can expect several to follow. You argue that giving into rape and embracing it will take its power away, this is simply not true. Irregardless these effects shall follow suit. In fact the effects such as guilt are prone to intensify, albeit physical injuries theoretically could be reduced. However I don't think you have an understanding of how a vagina works. Those being raped can't clench it as opposed to events of anal rape.

In addition countries that have recently passed more strigent rape laws as opposed to those who haven't have reduced chances to face civil war and strife. [2] They have also shown hints of lower rape numbers, however these statistics are hard to understand considering the previous plethora of onducomented rape cases.

Should progress of rape reduction be undone? Most certainly not, progress has been so fast that in 16 years rape (sexual assault in the courts) cases are under half of what they were, this enormous progress has come even as population skyrockets.
.
[3]

I also find it very important to note that your entire first round argument appears to be a plagiarized reddit post, I am stunned you make no mention of it in the first round, and even the second:
https://www.reddit.com...

[1] https://www.healthyplace.com...
[2] https://news.ku.edu...
[3] https://www.rainn.org...
Debate Round No. 2
RapeAdvocate

Pro

I am the same person that posted the same subject on reddit.com. Due to the fact that I have posted this argument and my response in a hurry, I forgot to disclose the fact that I had already and also posted the same argument on the reddit before. So if you ever tried to accuse me of plagiarism, I cannot do that with my own writing. With this in mind, let us critically analyze your "argument."

The fact that rape is one of the diverse forms of sexual activity is critically relevant to the debate, and to every rape discussion. The social indoctrination in regard to rape has greatly misled people to falsely interpret rape as only an act of crime, with you being one of these people, so the clear realization and admission of the fact that rape is sex can help us smash the current, narrow confinement of our perception of rape and open our intelligence to a wide range of possibilities concerning how we can correctly and freshly recognize rape - from "just a crime" to "another human sexual act" and many more. So this is where you were incorrect with your analysis. In addition, rape is an act, which exists completely outside of the realms of words - professionally called "semantics". To view rape as a mere semantic problem shows your failure to grasp the fact that rape is what is "done", not "said".

Why is it illegal to sell firearms to mentally disabled people? It is because such act has a high likelihood of causing the firearm to be misused, leading to physical, material harm to the bodies and properties of other people. If there was no worry for such damage, then it would be totally fine for any of us to sell firearms to maniacs and for them to purchase one. You incorrectly identified a fallacy in my argument because you lack understanding facts that serve basis for arguments. Try to remember how "validity" and "soundless" differs, and how "strength" and "cogency" does. Without you correctly comprehending the facts, hanging only onto discovering logical fallacies will reveal your lack of insight.

You then presented a list of purported psychological effects of rape, mistakenly assuming that such a long list of psychological symptoms would lend strong support for your argument. Actually, the list provides more support for my position. Raped females are gravely troubled by those symptoms because the socially constructed notion that rape is bad, harmful and negative had already been deeply indoctrinated inside their brain long before their rape. And when they finally experienced their rape, the pre-installed brainwashing got triggered for its moment of realization. Then, how would those females react if the social indoctrination was very different? Their reactions would be very different too. This is my point, which cannot be more clear and concise: If those females were not brainwashed with the current social construction about rape, they would not even be able to suffer from those miserable psychological conditions you have listed.

To this point of mine, you have no counterargument except uttering that "these effects shall follow suit" without any evidence and any argument at all. You also muttered "I don't think you have an understanding of how a vagina works." without supplying me with any argument or explanation as to why you made such a claim. I know why - you just don't have any cogent argument founded upon physical, concrete evidence to justify your stance. Please be reminded that I am not insulting your intelligence or your level of knowledge; I am merely pointing out that there can be no cogent argument backed by concrete evidence that can be used against my stance on the social construction of rape brainwashing.

I do appreciate you for giving me something to laugh at with the "study" you presented. You did successfully demonstrate a lucid case of the fallacies: "Correlation does not mean causation" and "Post hoc ergo propter hoc." Stringent rape laws and a lower chance of civil war or strife do not have any causal connection between each other. Sure they may coexist, because in a country that's unstable with a high probability for a civil war lacks the amount of law enforcement and focus to focus on rape - remember that survival(aka. life) is more important than any rape. Meanwhile, a country that is stable and has a low probability has enough law enforcement resources to focus on carrying out rape-related laws. Yet there is no concrete evidence that stronger rape laws cause less chance for a civil war. If you still can't understand, imagine you go to Syria now and demand more strict rape laws to be enforced. It will not stop the civil war going on in there, although they may behead you for being really brainless and irritating - which is why not even a radical feminist group would even dare visit the place right now. If this type of "study", which is nothing but another fallacious nonsense already abounding in academia, is what you can provide, I strongly suggest that you thoroughly format your brain and learn everything again anew.

In your fun research in the field of rape, did you really not come across the fact that rape is one of the most un- and under-reported crimes? You show those tables as if the numbers were ever closer to the numbers of rape in reality, while it at best only deals with reported ones without any mention about those that go silent. Didn't it really occur to you as to what the figures would be be if all those unreported were actually reported? Whlie nobody can be certain about the real figures of rape incidence, researches can tell you one thing in a completely harmonious agreement - more rape exists than reported.

So, overall, you have not been able to refute my point with a cogent argument based on proper, concrete evidence. The points you have made have been, to put it politely, decimated like the WTC on 9/11/2001 due to your lack of distinction between acts and words, correct insight into facts, and proper understanding of causal links and statistics, while you misidentified a fallacy and presented a purely nonsensical "study"(Oh Dear...).

In order to help you, I ask you again. I argue that "It is the case that people hate/fear rape, because they have been brainwashed by society to believe it so." For you to refute my position, you should present your argument as follows: "It is NOT the case that people hate/fear rape because they have been brainwashed by society to believe it so." Hope this helps. I await your response.
Actions_Speak

Con

Seeing as i've laid a solid and long framework for the physical and mental efforts of rape that are well documented, this seems like as good a time as ever to give input on social concepts. It is understandable that some social concepts may be in need of change, the classic is the response to "what if your spouse cheats". Despite the societal concept in place some relationships tolerate cheating unhindered seeing as if your spouse doesn't become pregnant or get an STD it isn't necessarily a bad thing and could even help the spouse with stress relief. Nevertheless people get murdered for cheating regularly, so perhaps this societal construct needs to change. However any comparison to rape would be one poorly made. Regardless on the outlook society has when you've been injured you've still been injured. Also regardless of the outlook society has when you've been traumatized you've still been traumatized. Saying or implying such physical and mental injuries only exist because of the social outlook on rape is a statement made with no backing to say the least. You can look long and hard for a source to back you, it simply won't exist.

Quick rebuttal to your claim of my fallacy. The laws on rape across these countries are consistantly changing making any facts hard to accurately display and even research for that matter. A classic example in crime deterence is the death penalty, while the punishment is of course to a greater extent, it gives strong evidence n that stronger punishments deter crime. [1]

Quick rebuttal about my research of sexual assault cases, I found that sexual assault cases use to go moreso unreported then they do nowadays. Hence if anything the statistics difference throughout the years is no doubt understated.

[1] https://www.heritage.org...

Debate Round No. 3
RapeAdvocate

Pro

All the claimed negative physical and mental effects (not "efforts". Please mind your wording), such as the purported "injury" or "trauma", of rape is caused by the brainwashing of the social construction that rape is bad, negative, and harmful. My argument has been very consistent that we first must get rid of the said brainwashing of such concept, so that raped females do not get triggered the idea when they finally experience their rape. This, I argue, will help raped females as they would perceive and comprehend their rape in a different manner as a positive, happy and satisfying occurrence in their life.

Considering you hold a ultra-convservative notion that rape is bad, it is no surprising to me that you referenced the Heritage Foundation, which is very well-known for its conservative perspective on social issues. To a true progressive like me, the source that death penalty deters a crime is a laughable conclusion - of course the criminals sentenced to death will no longer commit any more crime, right? However, we human beings do not condone capital punishment due to the fact that it actually a crime to take lives of other people, a crucially irreversible act even in case of a grave human error. That's why so many advanced countries have acknowledged the truth to have abolished capital punishment in their criminal laws in spite of its supposedly "great" effects.

Also, on a deeper level, you perceiving rape as a crime demonstrates clearly again that you are brainwashed with the social construction that rape is a crime. It is not. Rape is just another form of human sexual acts. Rape becomes a crime only if you think of it as a crime, and you have been indoctrinated by society to regard rape in that way. The more you talk about rape, the more you reveal your deep-seated bias, prejudice and brainwashing about rape.

I pointed out that your statistics about rape trend is flawed due to the numerous under- and un-reported cases of rape. It has always been that way since society brainwashed its members to think of rape as something harmful, shameful, negative and bad. Had society taught rape as something positive, good and fulfilling, more females would surely openly talk about rape with pride and happiness and without shame and guilt. All of your argument presumably against rape actually lends support to mine as to why we must change our attitude towards and perception of rape from the negative to the positive.
Actions_Speak

Con

Your arguments have been backed entirely by an unfound claims, regardless of your conviction they argument is about as meaningful as someone claiming "the earth if flat".

Allow me to quote myself:
"Regardless on the outlook society has when you've been injured you've still been injured. Also regardless of the outlook society has when you've been traumatized you've still been traumatized. Saying or implying such physical and mental injuries only exist because of the social outlook on rape is a statement made with no backing to say the least. You can look long and hard for a source to back you, it simply won't exist."

Some sort of rape culture in which the traumatized and injured victim pretends to find false happiness will change nothing.
If my view on rape is ultra conservative (very liberal actually) then I can't imagine what you think of society. Also the reference in quiestion is outside of the debate and about death penalty deterance statistics. I don't understand how you came to the conclusion that all of society is brainwashed, because we have this social construct that is well-found. Especially seeing at there are much more attackable and unreasonable constructs.

Debate Round No. 4
RapeAdvocate

Pro

My argument is very well-founded by numerous occasions in history where mass-scale social brainwashing led people to believe a falsity as something true, causing people to act in accordance with the indoctrinated ideology. Most famously, it happened with religious witch-hunting, killing people of different colours, discriminating people who were born into lower classes, ostracizing people of different sexual orientation, and, of course, persecuting people just because they raped. All of these happened because society indoctrinated people with a particular social construction, aka. an ideology or, better yet, a delusion, and people who had these ideas deeply implanted acted on those thoughts without ever realizing that they were just brainwashed. So your claim that there is no source to back my argument is simply a falsehood and a lie. Do not lie about rape. We already have too many of it.

Your self-quotation is only a repetition of your pointless idea that you pretend to have regarding the issue of rape. The very reason why those trauma and injuries are associated with rape is exactly due to the fact that people have been brainwashed by the social construction that rape is bad, negative, and harmful, which is the ultimate foundation of my argument. Had they been taught about rape in a different matter, they would perceive and interpret their rape experience completely different from they way they do so now. The very notion that "rape causes trauma, injuries, pain and suffering" is actually a falsehood, because it is an idea about rape that society has inculcated into the minds of the mass. Rape can cause happiness, joy, and fulfillment if the social construction about rape teaches and helps people to take it so.

You claim that a significant change in how society teaches people about rape will produce no change overall. That's another falsehood and a lie. Please stop lying about rape, I have to remind you. A change in how society makes its members view rape will change a lot, especially for raped females. They will no longer view their rape experience as harmful and shameful; rather, they will take it as a good, positive, happy moment in their life, and embrace rape as often and much as they could. No longer will they have to suffer any pain or misery from it. No longer will society have to dehumanize a human male only because he raped some female. No longer does society have to waste its time, money, and energy into finding, arresting and imprisoning any human being in a monstrous, bitter and evil way, only for some rape. All such changes will bring about less waste and pain, and more happiness and joy.

Any idea against rape is an ultra-convservative idea that has its roots on the ancient patriarchy system that criminalized rape and brainwashed its members to falsely believe it to be an act of evil. How can you even dare pretend to be "liberal" when you are also brainwashed too much even to recognize the fact that you hold a super-conservative ideology that would make any extreme conservatives proud? I wish that you were not a hypocrite. When it comes to rape, the only liberal and progressive position regarding rape is that of humans who actually give rape, and those who condone such act (like me). So far, unfortunately, this has been a stance of the only true minority that matters in the world. And the true minority is here to stay, along with rape. Rape, along with murder, theft, fraud, arson and so on, has been, is, and will be timeless and universal.

It takes careful thinking and honesty to realize this massive scale of social construction brainwashed into the members. Every meaningful revolution in human history started with this sort of recognition, which later evolved into an act of bringing about a change into the world. A first step towards a revolution is identifying what we call "false consciousness" that has been indoctrinated into the minds of the masses, and that's what I am doing here relating to rape. You claim that the current social construction is "well-founded" without ever being able to present a shred of factual, meaningful evidence to support your assertion, because you have also been deeply brainwashed into falsely believing the ideology that rape is "bad", "negative", and "harmful" that you never even thought about the truth and logic about that ideology. How you are reacting to is just like how a super-religious person faces the fact he/she has been brainwashed by a religious institution about god and everything related to it. They can never provide evidence to defend their position, because they never had any time of reflection to question their dogma. What's a religion to them is what is rape to you. You never cared about rape; you only cared about repeating the social construction of rape that has been shoved down to your throat since the beginning like everybody did. You never thought about rape, except for the delusion about it that society has created for you. You never tried to even understand rape; you only reinforce your prejudice about it.

So tell me, how are things in your church of rape?

In this debate, I have presented the thesis that it is the case that people negatively think of rape because they have been brainwashed by the social construction to view rape as such. I have presented my argument logically, coherently and consistently, while refuting all your mindless points that pretended to attack my points. You had to present your thesis against mine, but you could not. You had no thesis debunking my thesis and logic. Your argument was so scattered that it never contained any main point, not to mention any evidence that could strongly support your claims. You had to show that it is not the case that people negatively think of rape due to the brainwashing of the social construction. To do that, you had to present material, factual evidence as to how people came to negatively view rape even before the establishment of civilizations which produced and reinforced social constructions. Yet, you defeated yourself by continuing to repeat the very social construction and its effects that I annihilated.

I am very willing to debate you or anyone on this matter further in the comment section. As rape is my chief interest, I am always happy to discuss it, read about it, hear about it, and talk about it with anyone anytime, anywhere.

Thank you for engaging me in this pleasant debate about a joyful subject. I await your response.
Actions_Speak

Con

I have to disagree, while your theory is loosely based on some interesting theories and social ideals, it has no bulk. Their is no backing, while I believe it's human nature to craft conspiracy theories and the like, they are meaningless without any bulk. While I don't necessarily respect your claim, because of the subject, the lack of evidence you've provided, and because of the evidence I have provided against it, I am atleast trying to have some respect for your opinion.

The end result is the burden of proof required to prove "that society has been brainwashed into believing rape is wrong when it isn't" certainly hasn't been met which was your goal in this debate. I've actually went out of my time to show a plethora of evidence against said theory.

Thanks your for time to my opponent any readers of this debate, and have a wonderful day.
Debate Round No. 5
11 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by RapeAdvocate 2 weeks ago
RapeAdvocate
It does no, WOLF.J. Stop behaving like a freshly raped female and please be reasonable.
Posted by WOLF.J 2 weeks ago
WOLF.J
Still self plagiarism counts as plagiarism
Posted by RapeAdvocate 2 weeks ago
RapeAdvocate
WOLF.j, I am the same person that posted the same debate on reddit.com.

While you are here, I highly encourage you to check out another post of mine on rape, titled "Raped females should be euthanized."

Have a great day. :)
Posted by WOLF.J 2 weeks ago
WOLF.J
Ai we know you cheated boii, why you still posting. Am i talking to a wall!???!!!
Posted by WOLF.J 2 weeks ago
WOLF.J
https://www.reddit.com...

IS THAT YOU CUZ?!. Pro been cheating
Posted by WOLF.J 2 weeks ago
WOLF.J
and he enjoyed it!!!!!
Posted by WOLF.J 2 weeks ago
WOLF.J
I bet my man Pro was raped!
Posted by vi_spex 2 weeks ago
vi_spex
beautiful women would go insane
Posted by KwLm 2 weeks ago
KwLm
Sure, yeah, totally makes sense, let men and women violate everybodys body phisically, it's not rape, it's just love, in a tough way
Posted by vi_spex 2 weeks ago
vi_spex
womens only real argument against rape is the law since men are stronger.. but that dosnt make it right, violation of free choice is a problem
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by Ragnar 1 week ago
Ragnar
RapeAdvocateActions_SpeakTied
Agreed with before the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Agreed with after the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Who had better conduct:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:--Vote Checkmark3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:01 
Reasons for voting decision: Plagiarism committed by pro. Were the original author and pro to share a name, I'd give the benefit of the doubt, but right now there is nothing to imply anything beyond impersonation.