The Instigator
ThePhilosophersDeduction
Pro (for)
Winning
8 Points
The Contender
Chamaeleon
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points

Resolved: Harry Potter is better than Twilight

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
ThePhilosophersDeduction
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/14/2012 Category: Arts
Updated: 5 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,282 times Debate No: 21159
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (19)
Votes (2)

 

ThePhilosophersDeduction

Pro

As stated simply above, the resolution will be: Harry Potter is better than Twilight. I will be arguing Pro (Harry Potter is better). First round acceptance, thank you for considering my challenge.

1st Round: Acceptance
2nd Round: Constructive (Arguments)
3rd Round: 2nd Constructive (More Arguments can be brought up)
4th Round: Cross Examination (Pro will ask 10 questions, and Con will answer them and add their own in their argument.)
5th Round: Rebuttals (Pro will answer Con's questions and both sides will not be able to pose new arguments, just a rebuttal and voters).

Any questions can be posted in the comments section.
Chamaeleon

Con

I accept your laughable challenge and guarantee, in advance, that you will loose swiftly and painfully. My sparkly, spirit fingers will dance across the keyboard and lexically stab at the heart of thee before the next full moon dost rise. Mwahahahaha! *cough*
Debate Round No. 1
ThePhilosophersDeduction

Pro

I thank Chamaeleon for accepting my debate, and look forward to a humorous discussion on the topic of Harry Potter and Twilight.

I would like to provide a few definitions to allow for a more clear debate.

[1] According to Wikipedia, "Harry Potter" will be defined in this debate as: "Harry Potter is a series of seven fantasy novels written by the British author J. K. Rowling. The books chronicle the adventures of a wizard, Harry Potter and his friends Ronald Weasley and Hermione Granger, all of whom are students at Hogwarts School of Witchcraft and Wizardry. The main story arc concerns Harry's quest to overcome the Dark wizard Lord Voldemort, whose aims are to become immortal, to conquer the wizarding world, subjugate non-magical people, and destroy all those who stand in his way, especially Harry Potter."
[2] According to Wikipedia, "Twilight" will be defined in this debate as: "Twilight is a series of four vampire-themed fantasy romance novels by American author Stephenie Meyer. It charts a period in the life of Isabella "Bella" Swan, a teenage girl who moves to Forks, Washington, and falls in love with a 104-year-old vampire named Edward Cullen. The series is told primarily from Bella's point of view."
[3] According to The Free Dictionary, "better" will be defined as all of the three"
1. Greater in excellence or higher in quality.
2. More useful, suitable, or desirable.
3. More highly skilled or adept"
[4] According to Dictionary.com, "is" will be defined as "3rd person singular present indicative of be"

These definitions in place, I will begin my arguments. For organizational purposes, I will provide a road map at the beginning of every one of my rounds.

1. Harry Potter teaches more important morals than Twilight does.
2. Harry Potter provides the reader with better character role-models.
3. Harry Potter has more depth behind the story than Twilight has behind its.
and
4. Harry Potter explores more real-life situations than Twilight does.

1. Harry Potter teaches more important morals than Twilight does.

The novels in the Harry Potter series present more important morals than the Twilight series presents to it's readers. The characters are by far more realistic than those in Twilight. Now, I'm not talking about characters in sense of wizards, witches, giants, and trolls, but more of the personality of those characters.

2. Harry Potter provides the reader with better character role-models.

Hermione Granger is a character in Harry Potter that presents a very strong woman presence. She is "the smartest witch of her time" as stated in multiple books, but most importantly in book 3. We learn that though Hermione may be a snob sometimes about her knowledge, like a real person usually is, she is able to present so much more. She is constantly helping Harry and Ron get into, and out of trouble. A fun-loving and smart witch provides a great role model for girls in today's society.

Bella Swan, a disturbingly depressed main character in the Twilight series when her boyfriend leaves her, throws herself off a cliff just to "see" him. She rides on a motorcycle at reckless speeds and crashes, also just to see him. Not only does she present a very weak woman role, setting a stereotype, but she also constantly relies on her boyfriend and other male figures in the series because she cannot stand up or think for herself. Bella Swan is also very adventurous when it comes to boys. She is thrown in a love triangle debating over Edward and Jacob, and nearly falls in love with both of them. However, while falling in love with one, she continues to pursue the other, and she constantly begs Edward for sex. Clearly, no girl should take Bella as her role-model.

3. Harry Potter has more depth behind the story than Twilight has behind its.

Harry Potter took the author, J.K. Rowling an entire 15 years planning every little detail in the series. Unlike Meyer, Rowling had the plan out before her when she wrote, and although she new the sequence of events while writing most of the time, she makes it just as suspenseful to the reader as if the books were written impromptu. Meyer consistently repeats themes and general plot patterns (fight here, love conflict here, family issue here) sort of thing throughout each book.

4. Harry Potter explores more real-life situations than Twilight does.

Harry Potter is historically accurate (in a metaphorical way), and has a much deeper meaning than Twilight when talking about the depth of it. While Meyer writes her books and only cover a skin deep issue of romance that is cliche in this society anyway, Rowling does an outstanding job of writing her books in a way that incorporates every little detail of real life. The characters have enemies, friends, family issues, fights, challenges, goals, and just about everything you could name.

I would now like to turn it over to Con to present their case and refute my own. Unfortunately I am in 3 other debates, so this one will go un sourced, if the Con is up to that and will be purely opinionated. You may cite books, but page numbers and chapters are not needed. If the Con objects, there will be no penalty for a lack of sources in this round.
Chamaeleon

Con

Ladies and gentlemen, my argument is simple.

Twilight is better than Harry Potter....at being a horrendous, eye-gouging, ear-bleeding waste of millions of dollars.
Harry Potter is a quality series that is wonderful to watch, but it is not better at sucking brown-eye.
I rest my case.
Debate Round No. 2
ThePhilosophersDeduction

Pro

I must point how they did not follow my definition of "better."
Con also did not present their own case in that sense.

Therefore, I extend all my previous arguments.
Chamaeleon

Con

Your definition of "better" is part of your argument, not part of the debate guidelines, therefore I disagree with your definition. You needed to define the parameters of your debate more thoroughly before it began, as in 'better at what?' Since you did'n't clarify that before I accepted the debate, I jumped to my own conclusion. For the sake of my argument, I am defining better as "superior," and so my argument remains that the Twilight series is better at gargling donkey sac than the Harry Potter series. Thus, we are making the same argument and there is no real debate.

I'm not trying to be a jerk; I'm just trying to show you how easy it is to slip up in debates. Like the proverbial evil genie who grants wishes in a way that ends up biting his master in the butt, many people will take advantage of a lack of specificity. It's a fairly painless lesson to learn in this setting, and while I am loathe to be so irritating, if it frustrated you enough to ensure that you are more cautious in the future, then I will not have wasted your time. Voters, you can ensure that it does so by casting your vote for me. This topic in particular may be trivial, but an individual's debating skills are paramount to his or her success in life, so please do this person a favor by siding with me. I thank you for your time.
Debate Round No. 3
ThePhilosophersDeduction

Pro

When I stated the definition of better, I said that it "will be defined as all of the three..." therefore, my claiming the guidelines in my first constructive, I did indeed set the ground for both sides. As in Cons first constructive they did not propose their counter definition, and thereby concede to using mine. However, even if they did propose one, they have to meet both mine and theirs. Therefore, you may throw out all of Con's last argument, as it has no relevance. Note that definitions and counter definitions cannot be brought up AFTER an argument which uses them, unless conceding to the previous definition.

Please show Con that he needs to read more specifically and follow debate etiquette and vote Pro!
Chamaeleon

Con

Chamaeleon forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
ThePhilosophersDeduction

Pro

Please extend my previous arguments.

Note: Con cannot pose any new arguments in this round, as it is the final round.

Voting issues:
1. I proved my position of this debate true.
2. Con proves my position of this debate true.
3. Con proposed no sufficient counter arguments or any sources.

For all of these reasons, please vote Pro in today's debate.
Chamaeleon

Con

Your definition of "better" is irrelevant to my argument. You cannot define a word for both of us as part of your argument. Since definitions often vary, it was essential to agree on potentially contentious definitions BEFORE the debate began, not after. As it is, we have each defined this word differently, and there is no reason to accept one definition over the other. It is merely my word against yours. It is also irrelevant that my definition took place in my 2nd constructive and not my first, as you never made any such requirement in the debate guidelines. The order in which our definitions appear does not dictate which is valid. You are attempting to make up rules after the fact, and I am refusing to agree to them.

If I were to take your tact, I could as easily claim that YOUR argument is the one that supports mine, but it matters little as it was NOT the argument we set out to debate. What we were debating was which of these two movie series was better, that's all. There was no specificity as to what either movie was better at, therefore we each had to make this clarification in our arguments. It is coincidental that we both chose the same clarification, and the fact that such an occurence was possible speaks poorly of the initial guidelines.

In the end, voters will not be deciding between arguments, since we are both arguing the same point. If they are to favor one side over the other, it should be on the basis of who is the better debator.
Debate Round No. 5
19 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by ThePhilosophersDeduction 5 years ago
ThePhilosophersDeduction
I apologize for my absence from DDO for the past couple days.

Shamone: Unless there is no factual evidence in what I quoted, there will be no discrepancy. Prove to me that what I said was false. Could there be more? Yes. But everything I stated was factual and to the point.
Posted by Shamone 5 years ago
Shamone
Your biggest mistake Pro, is that you are quoting Wikipedia. Wikipedia is a nice site, but never acceptable for a real life debate.
Posted by prettymuchpro 5 years ago
prettymuchpro
voting Pro already. There's no use in debating unless youre planning to debate the res.
Posted by Chamaeleon 5 years ago
Chamaeleon
I understand that you are annoyed by this, by I'm not doing it because I don't care; I'm doing it because I do care; not necessarily about the movies, but about people's debating skills. I'm trying to help you refine yours. Personally, I might be too irritated to listen to someone doing what I am doing, but my hope is that you'll see through my methodology to get at the real lesson.
Posted by ThePhilosophersDeduction 5 years ago
ThePhilosophersDeduction
I was looking forward to debating someone who actually cared, but this is fine too!
Posted by Evpietsch 5 years ago
Evpietsch
I'm not sure how one could even BEGIN to argue that Twilight is better. Harry Potter is obviously the best book series that exists and that is FACT! :D :D :D
Posted by PeacefulChaos 5 years ago
PeacefulChaos
@kyro-

You DO believe in facts. Saying otherwise means that you have no sense of reality in this world and do not even accept the FACT that we are human beings. Or that 2 + 2 is 4. Or that you are composed of cells. etc.
Posted by Mak-zie 5 years ago
Mak-zie
Why do debates about this keep coming up?? Harry Potter obviously trumps, there is no question about that...
Posted by kyro90 5 years ago
kyro90
Technically, yes. I would have accepted this, especially since this debate is Almost all based on oppinion and I never believe in facts but I have had way too much on my mind right now.. Oh well, good luck you two!
Posted by ThePhilosophersDeduction 5 years ago
ThePhilosophersDeduction
Aren't most debates based off of opinions mixed with facts as well?
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by 16kadams 5 years ago
16kadams
ThePhilosophersDeductionChamaeleonTied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:40 
Reasons for voting decision: 1. Pro proved the resolution in many ways and had long args. 2. Con had short logically void and odd arguments. 3. Never countered pros arguments 4. FF
Vote Placed by Mak-zie 5 years ago
Mak-zie
ThePhilosophersDeductionChamaeleonTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:40 
Reasons for voting decision: Con to Pro: "I'm doing it because I do care...about people's debating skills. I'm trying to help you refine yours."-Conduct goes to Pro. On the contrary to what Con said, Pro should be refining Con's debating skills, as Con hardly even gave arguments at all, and gave no solid facts. Pro gave many reasons on why HP is better.