The Instigator
theprodebater
Con (against)
Losing
3 Points
The Contender
vardas0antras
Pro (for)
Winning
24 Points

Resolved: In the United States, juveniles charged with violent felonies ought to be treated as adult

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 4 votes the winner is...
vardas0antras
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/8/2011 Category: Miscellaneous
Updated: 5 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 3,724 times Debate No: 14324
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (17)
Votes (4)

 

theprodebater

Con

I am neg, so in ld my oppenent must start first
Debate Round No. 1
theprodebater

Con


I negate the resolution Resolved: In the United States, juveniles charged with violent felonies ought to be treated as adults in the criminal justice system.



Definition: Juvenile: According to the Federal Bureau of Prisons, A juvenile is a person who has committed an act of delinquency, but has not attained his/her 21st birthday and is sentenced under the Juvenile Justice and Delinquency Prevention Act.


Treated as an adult: Juvenile courts usually hear cases involving persons between the ages of ten and eighteen. (The upper age may be lower in some states.) If the prosecution charges an older juvenile with a particularly serious or violent offense, the district or prosecuting attorney may request that an adult court try the juvenile as an adult. In some states, juveniles fourteen or older and charged with serious acts like murder, rape or armed robbery are handled in adult courts unless the judge transfers them to juvenile court.




Justice: a scheme or system of law in which every person receives his/her/its due from the system, including all rights, both natural and legal



Violent Felony: In U.S. sentencing guidelines, felonies range from Class E (1-5 year sentence) to Class A (life imprisonment or the death penalty). Examples of violent felonies include murder, kidnapping, arson, crimes against children, armed robbery, aggravated assault, rape, firearm use in certain cases, or firearm possession in certain cases.





My Value today is My Value for today’s debate is justice The resolution is asking us to evaluate an action performed by an individual that inherently links to the removal of rights. As such, the only real value pertinent to the core issue of this debate is the value of justice. All other values miss the core issue the resolution is stating and can be outweighed cleanly by justice.


My Value Criterion is Protection of human rights. We must protect human rights as juveniles.


Observation 1: Since acquitted juvenile defendants are no longer charged with violent felonies, and since we cannot presume the guilt of juveniles that are merely charged with violent felonies, the timeframe of the resolution extends only from charging to conviction. Potential punishment is excluded from the discussion.


Observation 2: Since the burden of the Aff is to prove the resolution true as a general principle, the Aff need not argue that juveniles charged with violent felonies be treated as adults in every single case, or in every single way. Rather, the Aff must show that juveniles charged with violent felonies be treated as adults in the majority (or preponderance) of cases, and in the majority of ways.









Contention 1: Juvenile mind not developed yet and could be harming futute.



Sub Point A; Juvenile mind not developed yet and could be harming future. A National Institutes of Health study proposes that the part of the brain that restrains risky behavior, including reckless driving, and thinking skills is not fully developed until the age of 25. 

Jay Giedd, the psychiatrist leading the study, told MSNBC earlier this year that this finding came as a surprise to him because he used to think that the brain was fully developed by the age of 18. 

The continuous study uses magnetic resonance imaging to scan 2,000 people’s brains every two years. It has been found that teenage brains have extra synapses in the areas where decision making and risk assessment take place. Most of these synapses are useless and even get in the way of one’s judgment. Eventually, as teenagers become adults the synapses disappear, but the findings imply that many life choices are made before the brain’s decision making center is fully developed. Also,

vardas0antras

Pro

Instead of responding to my opponent, I will repost my previous argument (seeing how there was an error) and then we can move on from there.

::Definitions::
Juvenile:
1.1."Not fully grown or developed; young."
http://www.thefreedictionary.com...
1.2."Generally this refers to people between the ages of 14 and 17. They lose their juvenile status on their 18th birthday."
http://www.fair-debt-collection.com...
Felony:
"an offense, as murder or burglary, of graver character than those called misdemeanors, esp. those commonly punished in the U.S. by imprisonment for more than a year."
http://dictionary.reference.com...

::Observation::
We are talking about USA and not Europe or Asia or the world. Now the USA has very violent juveniles:
"There are currently about seventy million Americans under the age of 18, or a quarter of the total US population. Juvenile crime statistics report that 2.3 million juveniles were arrested in 2002. This accounts for 17 percent of all arrests and 15 to 25 percent of all violent crimes. According to juvenile crime statistics, murder accounted for five percent of violent crimes committed by juveniles, 12 percent for rape, 14 percent for robbery, and 12 percent for aggravated assault."
http://www.onlinelawyersource.com...
This may come in handy but at the moment I won't elaborate.

::Argument 1 ::
Cause and effect. Every action has a consequence and while a 5 year old may not know that, a 14 year old will. Yes, I am aware that a 14 year old isn't as mature as an adult but we're talking about a very serious violent crime ! Surely, you can't say that a 14 year old wouldn't know that its wrong or that he thought it was no different from stealing a candy from the local shop.

::Argument 2::
Is a violent attack especially a felonious violent act the doing of a juvenile ? No. Obviously the child isn't pretending to be under 18, however, he is acting like an adult. To steal candy, to insult someone, even to bully someone is encompassed by the mind of a child but to commit such crime one must start to think like an adult. That is to say ones innocence disappears with the act.

Cheerio
Debate Round No. 2
theprodebater

Con

Well my oppenent posted his con even though he is aff so i will wait
vardas0antras

Pro

"Well my oppenent posted his con even though he is aff so i will wait"
Incorrect, I posted arguments which agree with:

Resolved: In the United States, juveniles charged with violent felonies ought to be treated as adult

Debate Round No. 3
theprodebater

Con

theprodebater forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
17 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Cobo 5 years ago
Cobo
Hey, Con.
LD format does work on here.
So throw your high school case out an be orginal.
Posted by TUF 5 years ago
TUF
Con forfeited, and generally doesn't seem to know what he is talking about, all seven to pro.
Posted by vardas0antras 5 years ago
vardas0antras
Did you read my first two arguments ?
Posted by gavin.ogden 5 years ago
gavin.ogden
The argument that was made, is that if a child's brain is not fully developed, how could he/she possibly be charged as an adult? The child does not posses the reasoning skills of an adult, and does not have the same rights as adults. Why should he/she be charged with a crime like an adult. I couldn't be any more clear.
Posted by vardas0antras 5 years ago
vardas0antras
So you have no examples... Argument vote ? Yeah, this is one of those debates that I should just forget.
Posted by gavin.ogden 5 years ago
gavin.ogden
Like I said, The fonts were confusing, and in the end, you had the better debate, however his argument in reference to the child's brain not being fully developed was enough to get him the argument vote. I tried to have the same debate a few weeks ago, but my opponent forfeited as well.
Posted by vardas0antras 5 years ago
vardas0antras
Seriously, what are you guys talking about ?
Posted by vardas0antras 5 years ago
vardas0antras
"Con had a good point, as Pro seemed to be arguing for the wrong side"
An example ? All of my points support the affirmative.
Posted by vardas0antras 5 years ago
vardas0antras
"Dude ur aff I'm neg look at the top"
Exactly, have you read what I wrote ?
Posted by gavin.ogden 5 years ago
gavin.ogden
Correction. With all the differring fonts, this got confusing. Also, Con copy/pasted much of his response before forfeiting. Pro had the better debate.
4 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Vote Placed by Cliff.Stamp 5 years ago
Cliff.Stamp
theprodebatervardas0antrasTied
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Vote Placed by Cobo 5 years ago
Cobo
theprodebatervardas0antrasTied
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Vote Placed by TUF 5 years ago
TUF
theprodebatervardas0antrasTied
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Vote Placed by gavin.ogden 5 years ago
gavin.ogden
theprodebatervardas0antrasTied
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Total points awarded:33