The Instigator
imabench
Pro (for)
Winning
5 Points
The Contender
Esquire42
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points

Resolved: Pope Francis should be put in charge of the NSA

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
imabench
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 12/30/2013 Category: Politics
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 790 times Debate No: 43158
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (1)
Votes (1)

 

imabench

Pro

First round acceptance only
3 rounds, 3000 characters
Esquire42

Con

What the heck, let's do this. This ought to be fun, and I am looking forward to it.
Debate Round No. 1
imabench

Pro

Sorry it took me so long to post an argument... Lotta weird sh** happened ot my computer when I was in Vegas for some reason.

Anyways here are my opening arguments for why Pope Francis should be put in charge of the NSA:




1) Hes great at fixing images.

When Francis inherited the Catholic Church, it was mostly known for the child sex scandal and outdated stances on certain religious and political issues.... Since then though the Church has greatly increased its reputation, which is hard as sh** to do since just a few years ago, the Church was literally known predominantly for the child sex scandal.....

The NSA meanwhile has an image problem of its own in light of the revelation of blatant abuse of power over unsuspecting victims, much like the Catholic Church did a few years ago. If Pope Francis can fix the Catholic Church, he could fix the NSA too since they essentially are suffering the same problems




2) Pope Francis already knows who to keep an eye on.

- The Pope is officially the human link between God and humanity, meaning that the Pope answers to God and nobody else
- God is (allegedly) all knowing
- If Pope Francis is put in charge of the NSA, he will literally have the connection to God to know who to spy on and who not to spy on

Not only will Pope Francis manage to make the NSA likable, he will make them infinitely more efficient since he literally knows who to spy on and who not to spy on due to his connection with the all knowing God.



3) He has better qualifications than anyone else

Who else in the world has experience in handling massive organizations and is as trustworthy as Pope Francis? He's literally the best option available to have run the NSA and he would probably be approved by Congress with flying colors since Conservatives and Liberals both love the guy.



4) He'll probably reveal other crazy sh** the NSA has done.

Snowden did a pretty decent job in exposing crazy stuff the NSA has done in the past, but you can believe that Pope Francis will be honest and straight-foward in revealing what else the NSA has done in the past and be sincere in promising to change it. That gives Pope Francis accountability, which these days is something we can use in politics :P



5) It could help him run for President in 2016

Being a head of these big national organizations usually gives someone a stepping stone for building a presidential run, and even though im a fan of Hillary, I would throw her and half the democratic party off a cliff to have Pope Francis run for President.
Esquire42

Con

Here's my opening arguments for why Pope Francis should not be in charge of the NSA.

I guess we'll do opening arguments this round, and then refute the opposing side next round.


1. Pope Francis still clings onto bigotry.

While Pope Francis certainly has brought the Caltholic Church into better light, church doctrine has not changed while Francis is in charge. Yes, Pope Francis has opened his arms to both the LGBT community and atheists, he still vehemently believes that both group are destined for hell. This will ultimately cause a rift in the Catholic community between conservative and liberal Catholics, one that may bring the chruch down. This bigotry cannot be overlooked, and would not be acceptable for a government official in the United States that is in charge of a very powerful orginization. How would you feel if the head of the NSA thinks Catholics are going to hell? Not very trusting, eh? This, combined with the insurrection brewing in the ranks of the church, do not make Francis fit for leadership of the NSA.

2. Pope Francis would disenfranchise millions of Americans.

Pope Francis is very obviously Catholic, and putting him in charge of the NSA would be great, if the entre country was Catholic. However, it is not. According to a 2012 survey by the Pew Research Center, only 22% of the US population is Catholic. Another 20.4% is unaffiliated with any religion, 48% are Protestant, 3% are Mormon or Orthodox, and the remaining 6% are of some other faith. As you can see, over 75% of Americans woud disagree with Pope Francis on belief alone, and his policies could alienate that same ~75%. Also, the head of the NSA is not elected, which would cause more dissatisfaction with the appointment of a heavily Caltholic chief.

3. Pope Francis still hides records of child abuse.

While Francis has done a great deal to bring justice to child-abusing priests, there are still thousands of incidents that have gone univestigated and thousands of offenders that have gone unpunished. Therefore, while Francis may seem transparent at first glance, he is actually protecting offenders and molesters. Who's to say he will do a better job with the NSA?

4. Pope Francis has an easy cop-out.

If anyone questioned his motives for a certain act while head of the NSA, he could easily say that God told him to do it. He would wash his hands of any guilt, and we would never know if his statement was true, as we are not the Pope. (Well, if you are an atheist, it's different, but I'm going to relegate myself to the outliers in the data.)

Debate Round No. 2
imabench

Pro

1. Pope Francis still "clings onto bigotry."

"While Pope Francis certainly has brought the Caltholic Church into better light, church doctrine has not changed while Francis is in charge. Yes, Pope Francis has opened his arms to both the LGBT community and atheists, he still vehemently believes that both group are destined for hell."

Actually thats completely false... The Catholic Church no longer believes in a literal belief of hell on the grounds that 'The church no longer believes in a literal hell where people suffer. This doctrine is incompatible with the infinite love of God'
http://www.spyghana.com...

So your claim that Pope Francis is a bigot is completely false and rather idiotic.



2. Pope Francis would "disenfranchise millions of Americans."

"As you can see, over 75% of Americans woud disagree with Pope Francis on belief alone, and his policies could alienate that same ~75%"

Again thats pretty idiotic logic.... We've had Catholic PRESIDENTS in the past (Kennedy) and he did not disenfranchise 75% of Americans, and there have also been a ton of Jews appointed to high positions which by your claim meant that 99% of Americans would be 'disenfranchised' since only about 1% of Americans are Jewish.

Also: Disenfranchise means to deny people the ability to vote, and there is literally no evidence at all that Pope Francis would or even COULD take away 75% of the people's right to vote.



3) Pope Francis still hides records of child abuse.

"While Francis has done a great deal to bring justice to child-abusing priests, there are still thousands of incidents that have gone uninvestigated and thousands of offenders that have gone unpunished"

First off - Thats not all you can put on Pope Francis, there are thousands of other people who are likely working to keep it a secret from Pope Francis himself

Second - He actually acknowledges that the scandal exists and he is trying to fix it, not deny it and cover it up

Third - Have you even SEEN what other politicians try to hide? Theres plenty of way worse stuff then a sex scandal that everybody has known about for the past 15 years being covered up in DC right now.....



4. Pope Francis has an easy cop-out.

"If anyone questioned his motives for a certain act while head of the NSA, he could easily say that God told him to do it"

This is POPE FRANCIS we are talking about here, not some dumb republican senator from some god-crazy hell state in the Midwest.... If Pope Francis did something wrong it is likely he would admit to it and try to fix it rather then just say God told him to do it, because again, Hes POPE FRANCIS

==================================================================================


Extend all arguments about being liked by Conservatives and Liberals alike, being able to fix organizations riddled with controversy, being more qualified then anyone else, and being able to make the NSA mega-efficient due to his connections with an all-knowing God.
Esquire42

Con

Last minute argument time! I am going to be short, as I am dead tired.

Response: Pope Francis is liked by conservatives and liberals alike.

Well, George Washington is the same way, Both cons and libbys like him. Does that mean we should bring him back from the dead to run the NSA? No. (Well, that's another debate.) The fact is that just because some parts from both sides like something doesn't make it the best option. It merely means it is the compromise option.

Response: Pope Francis will be able to make the NSA mega-efficient due to his conversations with an all-knowing God.

I'm sorry, but this is a bit outside the parameters. You could easily substitute Pope Francis in this one with any other religious leader that is liked by both sides and get the same argument. The fact of the matter is there is so much burden of proof on the issue that it would create a black hole if it had mass. Even if he did talk to God, the Bible shows he is pretty much a douche bag. I mean, he killed more people than Satan did, way more.

It seems like most of your argument boils down to Pope Francis being Pope Francis. Just because he is indeed Pope Francis doesn't mean he will be the best leader for the job. Your argument can apply to anyone, just for the sake of being them.

That's what I came up with on four hours of sleep, thanks for the debate. See you around, and maybe next time we can get really serious.
Debate Round No. 3
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
Posted by TheHappyMAn 3 years ago
TheHappyMAn
This is the most intense debate.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by Anonymous 3 years ago
Anonymous
imabenchEsquire42Tied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:50 
Reasons for voting decision: Con basically accused the pope of not being liberal enough, which is absurd. Pro made his argument, though I can't see many people disagreeing with him anyways. Pro also used the only source.