The Instigator
diety
Con (against)
Losing
14 Points
The Contender
ournamestoolong
Pro (for)
Winning
25 Points

Resolved: That all forms of slavery are morally unacceptable

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 6 votes the winner is...
ournamestoolong
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/1/2009 Category: Society
Updated: 8 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,564 times Debate No: 8060
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (6)
Votes (6)

 

diety

Con

I am against the resolved. Although you're not obligated to, i ask that you please yield your arguments until next round
ournamestoolong

Pro

Even though I suspect this will be semantics, fire away.
Debate Round No. 1
diety

Con

Thank you opponent for accepting this debate.

First for the definitions

Definition of slavery via wikipedia - A form of forced labor in which people are considered to be, or treated as, the property of others

Now, to point out important aspects of the resolution before I present my arguments. Notice that since the resolved concernes ALL forms of slavery, I simply must find one or more forms of slavery that aren't morally unacceptable. Even if you manage to mention forms of slavery that are morally unacceptable, they won't matter as long as the examples I give aren't.

Now for my arguments

Although many forms of slavery are unacceptable, some forms are quite reasonable

Example 1: Aztec Slavery
http://en.wikipedia.org...

With the aztec style of slavery, slavery was simply a punishment for breaking the law. And even better, slaves still maintained citizenship, as they were able to own property, work elsewhere, and even own other slaves. Also, slavery wasn't based on race, but it was personal. So if you had kids, they would be born free. You could even make yourself a slave to pay off your debts to someone. Slaves where protected from abuse, and even had say as to whether or not they could be sold.

:)

That doesn't seem so bad. If anything that actually sounds reasonable.

I rest my case for now
ournamestoolong

Pro

Thank you for a speedy response.

"With the aztec style of slavery, slavery was simply a punishment for breaking the law. And even better, slaves still maintained citizenship, as they were able to own property, work elsewhere, and even own other slaves. Also, slavery wasn't based on race, but it was personal. So if you had kids, they would be born free. You could even make yourself a slave to pay off your debts to someone. Slaves where protected from abuse, and even had say as to whether or not they could be sold."

It was not always the case that slavery was a punishment. Fathers could sell their children into slavery if they were lazy. Though slaves had some freedom, they weren't free. They could not escape. If slaves attempted to escape several times, they would be sacrificed. Is this just? I think not.
Debate Round No. 2
diety

Con

Ok then, lets play on the resolved moreso than real world examples.

Given the resolved, any hypothetical form of slavery I create must be morally unacceptable for you to win. Let me state the following circumstances in which I as CON deem slavery morally acceptable

1) Slave can own property
2) Slave can vote
3) Slave can be educated
4) Slavery is personal instead of hereditary, meaning your children will not be slaves
5) Slavery is not racial
6) Slaves have protection rights where they can't be abused
7) Slaves could choose whether or not they could be sold (that way they can't be seperated from their families)
8) Slave can work elsewhere
9) Slave only obligated to work. This ties into abuse, where slaves don't have to jump in a pile of crap or have sex with their masters
10) Slavery is a form of punishment or to pay off debts

Under those circumstances, slavery is perfectly fine.

:)

I rest my case for now
ournamestoolong

Pro

"Given the resolved, any hypothetical form of slavery I create must be morally unacceptable for you to win. Let me state the following circumstances in which I as CON deem slavery morally acceptable"

Slavery can only exist if people practice it. I will, however, find flaws in your plan.

"1) Slave can own property"

How can you maintain property with no income?

"2) Slave can vote"

They could be forced to vote the same way as their masters

"3) Slave can be educated"

Why would they want to be?
They would never use those skills if they are being forced to work in fields.

"8) Slave can work elsewhere"

If you can work elsewhere to get a source of income to pay off debt, you would not need to become a slave to pay off debt.

"10) Slavery is a form of punishment or to pay off debts"

That is fine until we begin to disagree on how much slavery is worth, and how much work slaves have to do.

"Under those circumstances, slavery is perfectly fine."

I think not.

Thank you.
Debate Round No. 3
diety

Con

^o^

Ok let me rebut your counterarguments.

""1) Slave can own property"

How can you maintain property with no income?"

Well you have to look at #8 of my argument

""3) Slave can be educated"

Why would they want to be?
They would never use those skills if they are being forced to work in fields."

O.o

So you're saying that the right to read is not important eh? Ever heard of "knowledge is power." Maybe they would want to read so they wouldn't be ILLITERATE, whereas they wouldn't be able to recognize their legal rights or political powers, and they wouldn't be reliant on their masters to inform them about society.

""8) Slave can work elsewhere"

If you can work elsewhere to get a source of income to pay off debt, you would not need to become a slave to pay off debt."

Well what if you've been in debt for quite a while? And what if you couldn't afford to pay off the debts in time? It's either slavery or prison! I think I'll take the slavery for 200 Alex (it's a joke off of a Tyler Perry movie)

""10) Slavery is a form of punishment or to pay off debts"

That is fine until we begin to disagree on how much slavery is worth, and how much work slaves have to do."

No, I think we'll be fine.

""Under those circumstances, slavery is perfectly fine."

I think not."

I think so

Thank you
ournamestoolong

Pro

Thank you.

"Well you have to look at #8 of my argument"

And you have to look at my refutation

"So you're saying that the right to read is not important eh? Ever heard of "knowledge is power." Maybe they would want to read so they wouldn't be ILLITERATE, whereas they wouldn't be able to recognize their legal rights or political powers, and they wouldn't be reliant on their masters to inform them about society."

A slave becomes much less valueable when they can only work part time. The slave wouldn't go to school so they could get done faster.

"Well what if you've been in debt for quite a while? And what if you couldn't afford to pay off the debts in time? It's either slavery or prison! I think I'll take the slavery for 200 Alex (it's a joke off of a Tyler Perry movie)"

If you HAD another source of employment, you could pay off the debt. It is unlikely the slavemaster would take the slave because he would have to give him food, shelter, and water. By being a slave because of debt, you would just "Get along" without making any real money.

"No, I think we'll be fine."

Not an argument. Without money to gauge how much money is worth, people will disagree.

"I think so"

I disagree.

Thank you
Debate Round No. 4
6 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Posted by rougeagent21 8 years ago
rougeagent21
"I simply must find one or more forms of slavery that aren't morally unacceptable."
lol double negative. How about "morally acceptable?"
Posted by ournamestoolong 8 years ago
ournamestoolong
Did you vote, Con?
Posted by Flare_Corran 8 years ago
Flare_Corran
I feel like Con's definition of slavery isn't actually slavery.
Posted by ournamestoolong 8 years ago
ournamestoolong
This is complete semantics. I mean really, come on.
Posted by diety 8 years ago
diety
well we aint talkin bout sacrifice now is we?
Posted by I-am-a-panda 8 years ago
I-am-a-panda
Aztec Slavery o.0? They also practised human sacrifice, as well as human slavery.
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Vote Placed by sorc 8 years ago
sorc
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trendem
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rougeagent21
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vorxxox
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