The Instigator
imabench
Pro (for)
Losing
3 Points
The Contender
ConservativePolitico
Con (against)
Winning
13 Points

Resolved: The United States should take on the debt of the entire world for nothing in return

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 4 votes the winner is...
ConservativePolitico
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 6/12/2013 Category: Politics
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,442 times Debate No: 34739
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (13)
Votes (4)

 

imabench

Pro

The resolution is that the United States should take on the debts of all the other nations in the world, including those of Greece, Spain, Zimbabwe, France, Italy, etc. for no compensation in return.

First round acceptance only. 3 rounds, 3000 characters.

Warning, I have an unbeatable argument for this one >:)
ConservativePolitico

Con

You're on.

Bring it.
Debate Round No. 1
imabench

Pro

The reason why the US should take on the debt of the entire world for nothing in return.....
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Is because we are already F*CKED

Of the 50 trillion in debt the world has, the US alone owns 12 trillion of it..... about 25% of all debt in the world belongs to the US and lets face it, there is NO-HOOO-HOOO way in hell we are ever going to pay that off.... Because the US owes more money then what actually exists o_O

http://www.economist.com...
http://theeconomiccollapseblog.com...

Seeing as how the US government is incapable of being fiscally responsible, let alone enough to even put a dent in this debt we have, the US should do the logical thing and take one for the team (team = humanity, take one for it = take all of their debt)

Why should we be nice to other nations? Well we kinda owe it to them both literally and figuratively..... In addition to our massive debt, we drove Russia into financial ruin, we nuked Japan, weve invaded both Canada and Mexico on different occasions and never apologized for it, we also drove Cuba and North Korea into economic collapse, completely demolished Iraq and Afghanistan, weve invaded numerous countries in Latin America for bs reasons in the late 1800's, weve meddled with Iran for ages and act like weve done nothing wrong, the list goes on and on.

The other reason we should do this is because America's days are numbered.... Seriously we are right on the path to failing and the US probably wont be around much longer. Our debt is exploding, Congress cant even pass bills with 90% public support, agencies left and right are f*cking up their job, the president cant do anything since Congress is so divided, the Supreme Court takes forever to decide on issues, and Obama is STILL emailing me asking for money even though he won the presidency months ago!

The government is failing and our debt is exploding.... If the US is still a country by the time you read this sentence, ill actually be surprised.

I await the con's response while I go out and buy more ammo for the impending chaos and anarchy.
ConservativePolitico

Con

1. Taking on Debt Doesn't Eliminate Debt

Taking on someone else's debt doesn't eliminate it. Someone is still owed money, so how does that really solve anything in the economic sector? The money is still owed and there still isn't anyone paying it. The real danger of debt is not being placed on the countries who owe it but rather the institutions who gave the loans. The integrity of the financial world is still in jeopardy and no matter who holds the debt, it will bite everyone in the collective a$$es.

2. Reparations

To the victor go the spoils. We really don't owe anybody anything. Cuba pointed nukes at us. Russia challenged us for supremacy. Canada was British Canada and they provoked us. We paid Mexico for their land AFTER we beat them senseless. [1] If this is an argument for the taking on of debt countries like Russia, Germany, Italy, Great Britain and Japan would be strong contenders as they've also fvcked up other nations for centuries. Britain and Spain and Portugal have been doing for far longer than the US. We are not a unique case nor are we a particularly strong case. There's nothing to suggest that because we've meddled in international affairs, like all superpowers do, that we should take on the ENTIRE global debt.

3. Days Are Numbered

What you described about the way the US is working right now... is how it's been working since the nation's founding. Unpopular congress? Divided government? Slow legislation? This is US politics in a nutshell and is nothing new. I suggest reading up on early 19th century politics if you doubt me. Besides, if we go down right now the world will erupt into chaos, why would we speed that along by acquiring a ton of debt?

Let's Review

Okay boys and girls, let's review why imabench's arguments don't work. First off, taking on debt does nothing to help the financial system, it only burdens the superpower with debt that no one can pay off. The loaners are still fvcked which means we're all still fvcked (read up on housing collapse). Second, we don't owe anybody anything. Countries have been screwing with each other since the dawn of time, we are no different than anyone else and most of the places we messed with got compensated or had it coming. Third, the US is always in this state of political irritation. Our days are not numbered and even if they were, how does piling on the debt of the world into a failing country solve anything? It wouldn't. The money would vanish if the US collapsed and so would the global economy. Not a pretty thought.

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org...
Debate Round No. 2
imabench

Pro

I would like to thank CP for taking a troll debate seriously

-__________________-

Whatever, Ill try my best with whatever I get to work with.



"Taking on someone else's debt doesn't eliminate it. Someone is still owed money, so how does that really solve anything in the economic sector?"


It gives nations that are far more mindful of their spending then us a clean slate to start fresh now that they know to be careful.



"Cuba pointed nukes at us"


Dude people point nukes at us all the time, that doesnt mean we invade them (even though occasionally we do)



"Russia challenged us for supremacy."


Can you blame them? we were asking for it when we dressed that way



"Canada was British Canada and they provoked us"


Canada was the sibling that was minding their own business when the US got in a fight with mother England. They had nothing to do with that scrap



"We paid Mexico for their land AFTER we beat them senseless."


Yeah we paid $15 million for land that today is worth a couple trillion, seems real fair.



"countries like Russia, Germany, Italy, Great Britain and Japan would be strong contenders as they've also fvcked up other nations for centuries."


Yeah but the US has screwed up more stuff in the last 200 years then most of those nations have in the past 2000 years!



"There's nothing to suggest that because we've meddled in international affairs, like all superpowers do, that we should take on the ENTIRE global debt. "


It goes beyond that though. The fact is that weve caused more hell in 200 years then most other countries have in their entire existence, but at the same time our debt is just MASSIVE UNCONTROLLABLE compared to others.



"Unpopular congress? Divided government? Slow legislation? This is US politics in a nutshell and is nothing new"


Exactly! we've never had a well functioning government which only shows how we are very near the end.



"Besides, if we go down right now the world will erupt into chaos, why would we speed that along by acquiring a ton of debt? "


Ever pull off a bandaid really quick rather then slowly and over a long period of time? Exact same concept.



"Okay boys and girls, let's review why imabench's arguments don't work."


I would like to point out that CP thinks you all are children while I think youre all very mature, intelligent, and very good looking adults.... ;D



"Third, the US is always in this state of political irritation. Our days are not numbered"


If Obama can get reelected in THIS economy then im pretty sure our days are numbered....

Lets say Paul owes 2 Trillion dollars to people,
Then Jack walks in and says he'll take care of Paul's debt even though Jack himself owes 12 Trillion to other people as well,
Jack does this for everyone so he owes everyone a lot of money while everyone else is now debt free
Then jack dies by getting hit by a train.
Now those debts arent an issue anymore and everyone is now debt free
And on top of that, Jack had terminal cancer which means he was going to die soon anyways!

I rest my case
ConservativePolitico

Con

My numbered points are going to match up with ima's bolded statements from this round. And for all of you wondering what the kryptonite to imabench's trolling is? It's a serious debate.

1. How do we get a clean slate by taking on debt? And how does taking away someone's debt help them to be mindful of their spending? If someone took my credit card debt away I'm going to spend more, not less. They have to learn a lesson by suffering through and solving their own debt problems.

Pro dropped all of my points about the financial system gaining no benefit from moving debt from one place to the other. This was a main point and was conceded.

2. We didn't invade Cuba...

3. I didn't blame Russia, I just pointed out a fact about their behavior.

4. Canada was being used as a staging ground to provoke and attack the US during the late 18th and early 19th century, they were involved.

5. The fact we paid the losers of a war anything was generous on it's own and the land is only worth that much more due to inflation.

6. You can't prove that the US has "screwed up" more stuff than all of those countries in the past 2000 years. Japan raped Asia alone in WWII and left deep lasting repercussions. Nice try though, no evidence here.

7. Our debt seems large but we also have the largest GDP in the world. Our debt is roughly now equal to our GDP when compared on a year by year basis while countries like Japan have debt at 180% GDP.

8. Our government functions it's just not fast or efficient, it was designed to be slow and deliberate in order to promote carefulness and bipartisanship.

9. Wrong, the US tanking and making all that debt vanish with us would cause the geopolitical world to erupt into chaos with possibility of war very large and the financial system would completely collapse leaving us to figure out a new system of salvage the old one. I'd rather take it slowly with a possibility of finding a solution rather than rushing to the end just because we can. That's not a rational action model.

10. Boys and girls was my best attempt at being nonserious in a debate.

11. Our days are not numbered, there's no actual evidence to support that claim.

Conclusion

There's no logical reason why the US should take on the world's debt. Their debt is their responsibility. They have to figure out fiscal lessons just as we do. The financial system would collapse if we did that as debt needs to be paid in order for lending and spending to continue, since we can't pay all the world's debt banks would go under due to the lack of money flow. Our days are not numbered. We don't owe anybody anything.

Your case, imabench, was resting before we got started because it's asleep at the wheel.
Debate Round No. 3
13 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by ConservativePolitico 3 years ago
ConservativePolitico
YAY, thanks MD
Posted by MassiveDump 3 years ago
MassiveDump
Welcome to the We Beat Imabench at something club, CP.
Posted by ConservativePolitico 3 years ago
ConservativePolitico
I'm on troll patrol.
Posted by ConservativePolitico 3 years ago
ConservativePolitico
Yeah, I'm counter-trolling.

Word to your mother Crypto.
Posted by ConservativePolitico 3 years ago
ConservativePolitico
Yeah, I'm counter-trolling.

Word to your mother Crypto.
Posted by MassiveDump 3 years ago
MassiveDump
CP, it's ima. IMA. The fact that it's a troll debate is IMPLIED.
Posted by xXCryptoXx 3 years ago
xXCryptoXx
Taking a troll debate seriously?!

Ima, you've been counter-trolled.
Posted by ConservativePolitico 3 years ago
ConservativePolitico
In fact, there was nothing in your opening round or your title that denoted this as a troll debate at all.
Posted by ConservativePolitico 3 years ago
ConservativePolitico
It wasn't in Round One so it's not a rule :P
Posted by imabench 3 years ago
imabench
Giving serious arguments in a troll debate warrants a full forfeit, you know that right?
4 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Vote Placed by Guy_D 3 years ago
Guy_D
imabenchConservativePoliticoTied
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Reasons for voting decision: I agree that there was nothing in the opening round or that denoted this as a troll debate, but the title surely implied it.
Vote Placed by tvellalott 3 years ago
tvellalott
imabenchConservativePoliticoTied
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Reasons for voting decision: Lol, sorry ima. In reaction to cp's counter troll, you should have gone full retard. I know, I know, never go full retard. But if you'd turned the metaphorical absurd dial up to 11 you still could have won this.
Vote Placed by TN05 3 years ago
TN05
imabenchConservativePoliticoTied
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Total points awarded:07 
Reasons for voting decision: To begin, Pro did not state this was a troll debate until AFTER Con made his first argument. There were several rules listed, and 'being a troll' or 'troll debate only' was not one of them. Pro did not suggest or imply trolling anywhere in his first argument, and only said it was a troll debate AFTER a strong first argument from Con. For that, conduct goes to Con. With that out of the way, Con gets arguments for countering every single argument Pro made and negating the main resolution. S&G goes to Con because Pro's arguments were riddled with spelling errors, while Con's arguments were virtually flawless in terms of spelling and grammar. Sources go to Con because Con's source is more useful than Pro's sources towards proving a point, and it is far more accurate than 'The Economic Collapse Blog' to boot. I hate to votebomb, but the winner of this debate is clear. Imabench could have avoided this by specifying this was a troll debate BEFORE the debate began.
Vote Placed by Daktoria 3 years ago
Daktoria
imabenchConservativePoliticoTied
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Total points awarded:30 
Reasons for voting decision: I didn't think Pro would have a decent argument, but he does oddly enough. It's basically, "We're going to throw the garbage out and there's nothing stopping it from happening, so we might as well fill it up as much as possible." Nicely done. Con makes analogies to the 19th century and all of history for why America's days really aren't numbered, but he doesn't complete the analogy by showing how or why today's path is the same as before. Con especially doesn't show how "responsibility" is something the world cares about either.