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FollowerofChrist1955
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The Contender
buildingapologetics
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STOP debating Atheists and Unbelievers! Take Back Your Religion Board!

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 12/31/2017 Category: Religion
Updated: 2 weeks ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 637 times Debate No: 106274
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FollowerofChrist1955

Pro

STOP debating Atheists and Unbelievers! Take Back Your Religion Board!
Debating is not witnessing! Those who accept are hardcore atheists, they are here to mock, nothing more! Do not give them the opening. What can an Atheist tell YOU of your Religion? What nugget can be gleaned by ignorance?
#1 RULE only be a Christian that we may discuss this!
Rationale, a nonChristian cannot possibly understand scriptures nor Gods requirements, because they lack participation in Religious ceremonies and lack Biblical Knoowledge completely!
How to stop it .... Always put as requirement a Christian! Then if atheists accept you cab report them to moderators and if the persist, they will be removed by moderator for harrasment!

Witnessing to people
1 Peter 3:15 Instead, you must worship Christ as Lord of your life. And if someone asks about your Christian hope, always be ready to explain it.

Mark 16:15-16 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

Romans 10:15 And how can anyone preach unless they are sent? As it is written: How beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news!

Matthew 5:16 In the same way, let your light shine before others, that they may see your good deeds and glorify your Father in heaven.

Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of this Good News about Christ. It is the power of God at work, saving everyone who believesâ€"the Jew first and also the Gentile

2 Timothy 1:8 So do not be ashamed of the testimony about our Lord or of me his prisoner. Rather, join with me in suffering for the gospel, by the power of God.

Luke 12:12 For the Holy Ghost shall teach you in the same hour what ye ought to say.

Matthew 10:20 for it will not be you speaking, but the Spirit of your Father speaking through you.

2 Timothy 1:7 for God gave us a spirit not of fear but of power and love and self-control.

Notice, it does "NOT" require YOU to prove anything! Let us reinterate the Word of the Lord!

Mark 16:15-16 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

Many of the younger Christians seem to have difficulty with the damned, as their compassion is great. I caution you to set aside you compassion in matters of the Lord as you have been instructed to do .... by the Command to DENY YOURSELF, spoken of in Matthew Luke and Mark. To become a Disciple requires an active choice to DIE to the SELF. The self is our greatest hinderance! It IS where Most belivers Live today! It is also wrong!

You are "Not" given the right of Choice as to worship, belief, or conduct. As the Lord so adequately puts it .... YOU ARE NOT YOUR OWN!
1 Corinthians 6:19
19Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own;

You are not your own? Do you have rights based on this statement? Can you choose what denomination you will belong to? Can you pick how you will worship? Can you declare which denomination is right, which is Wrong? Do you see the error of YOUR WAY!

Isaiah 65:2
"I have spread out My hands all day long to a rebellious people, Who walk in the way which is not good, following their own thoughts,

This requires no interpretation!

Isaiah 55:8
"For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways," declares the LORD.

And what about this? Matthew 15:9
in vain do they worship me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.

If you will grow you must pray for assistence to die to the self. You need to stop doing things your way. You need to inform the Dead of the price to be paid at the end of Life.

If you leave out Hell, what purpose do they have to change? Did not the Lords word state if they believe not THEY ARE DAMNED? If you failed to inform them of the consequence of Hell, what have you done? Removed the urgency to act!

Their blood shall be accounted to you?
According to Ezekiel 3.
18 When I say to a wicked person,˜You will surely die," and you do not warn them or speak out to dissuade them from their evil ways in order to save their life, that wicked person will die for their sin, and I will hold you accountable for their blood. 19 But if you do warn the wicked person and they do not turn from their wickedness or from their evil ways, they will die for their sin; but you will have saved yourself.

What not to share: that which is for YOU and you alone! All are aware that little of the Bible is for the unbeliever, why then do you share it with them? You were i structed not to do thisfor very reasonable purposes .... they MOCK the Holy Word! Is this not what God told you would happen?

Matthew 7:6
"Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to pigs. If you do, they may trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces.

Consider what is the point of accepting debates with the atheists and unbelievers? They exist on this board to mock you, nothing more. They have no grasp of the Holy Word, you will simply exhaust yourself with one who by command cannot understand!

Isaiah 6:9
He said, "Go and tell this people: "'Be ever hearing, but never understanding; be ever seeing, but never perceiving.'
Now I ask you "WHY" would you accept debates on scripture with the very people that cannot understand it! Your success rate will be zero!
Use the Religion section for its purpose to GROW believers, not to argue with the Atheists, the unbelieving. Answer them in the comment section, but do not debate them, they can't understand you. Use the time to discuss with the more mature Christians The ways of God. And they whys of it? If the unbeliever listen in of what is that to US? God will either open their eyes that they may see or Block their senses as He wishes!

Be on the look out for False believers ... those who know not God nor his word! Only the utterly ignorant or Atheists place their opinions ABOVE Gods WORD! You can HELP neither!
turn them over to Satan as directed.

1 Corinthians 5:4-5
4 When you are assembled in the name of the Lord Jesus and my spirit is present, with the power of our Lord Jesus, 5 you are to deliver this man to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord.
buildingapologetics

Con

My friend, you are deeply mistaken about this. You are not only acting illogically but against what scripture clearly teaches. There are at least four possible benefits from debating atheists:
1) It is possible for even hardcore atheists to convert. While it is not likely, we are not to just give in; that ignores what Christ clearly teaches. Of course, there are some where there would be no point in debating. It would not be wise to debate someone who is hurling insults; that wouldn't help anyone. But, as long as the atheist is civil, the debate would be extremely valuable.
2) We may plant a seed. If we truly win the debate in the mind of our opponent, that may make them question what they believe. If we can simply plant a seed of doubt, that seed may later come to fruition.
3) Debating also sharpens ourselves. If we are trained by debating highly knowledgeable atheists, we will be ready to answer the same questions from an interested agnostic.
4) If we truly show how the case for Christ is much better than the case against Him, we may influence those who watch the debate. Many people have converted to Christianity after watching a Christian vs atheist debate. It is an important part of evangelism to smash every obsticle in front of the gospel that may cause others to question the faith.

On the otherhand, after watching your debates with atheists, perhapse you should stop debating them. You are not demolishing their arguments, nor are you making the superior case for the gospel clear. If you walk into such a debate unprepared, you may accomplish the opposite of the goal.

1 Peter 3:15 Tells us to give an answer or a reason for what we believe to anyone who asks us. This includes logic, history, science and anything else we can use to defend the faith. Of course, this requires study, but that is a study we are commanded to do.

Mark 16:15-16 Is not scripture. This passage was added later by a well-meaning scribe, but it was not written by Mark. It was added later and contradicts other scriptures. I want to know what Mark wrote, not what someone else thought Mark should have written.

"Notice, it does "NOT" require YOU to prove anything!" My friend, you do not have the correct attidude. Even if we are not told to prove our case directly, that does not mean we should not try. This sounds like you are trying to justify your own laziness by not giving a reasoned defense. You are waiting on God to explicitly tell you what you should do when you should already know what do. We are commanded to give such a defense in 1 Peter 3:15. Also, there are other passages that teach that we should debate, but you did not quote them. Just because those passages that you quoted do not explicitly teach this (except for 1 Peter), it does not mean other passages do.

Thank you for perhapse the worst explanation of "deny yourself" that I have ever heard. In fact, this means pretty much the exact opposite of what you twisted it to mean. Denying oneself should NEVER be interpreted to mean deny other people. Denying ouselves means to let go of earthly desires in order to serve God. Part of serving God is giving a reasoned defense to those who do not believe. You are ignoring the commandment of God. You seek to justify your laziness while you deny both atheists and God.

"You are not your own? Do you have rights based on this statement? Can you choose what denomination you will belong to? Can you pick how you will worship? Can you declare which denomination is right, which is Wrong? Do you see the error of YOUR WAY!"

While we certainly belong to God after we have surrendered ourselves to Him, this should not be taken to mean we have no free will. Your lack of willingness to defend the gospel of Christ is evidence that we can resist God.

"According to Ezekiel 3.
18 When I say to a wicked person,"You will surely die," and you do not warn them or speak out to dissuade them from their evil ways in order to save their life, that wicked person will die for their sin, and I will hold you accountable for their blood. 19 But if you do warn the wicked person and they do not turn from their wickedness or from their evil ways, they will die for their sin; but you will have saved yourself."
This proves exactly the opposite of your case. When we try to dissuade other people, we use every means necessary. If you are not fully studying the reasons to believe the gospel, you cannot full dissuade other people from rejecting it.

"What not to share: that which is for YOU and you alone! All are aware that little of the Bible is for the unbeliever, why then do you share it with them? You were i structed not to do thisfor very reasonable purposes .... they MOCK the Holy Word! Is this not what God told you would happen?"
That statement legitimately shocked me because it is so evil. The entire Bible and all of its revealed truth is for ALL people, not just a few elect. All people are called unto salvation by the gospel since the gospel is given to all. It is simply up to us whether we may take it. Are you actually suggesting that we should actually withold God's truthfrom unbelievers? If so, you are an obsitcle to the spread of the gospel, and I would even question your own faith. You also assume that all atheists mock the word of God, but this is not true. Many atheists are respectful of what we believe and are respectful of the reasons we have for it.

"Consider what is the point of accepting debates with the atheists and unbelievers? They exist on this board to mock you, nothing more. They have no grasp of the Holy Word, you will simply exhaust yourself with one who by command cannot understand!"
Purhapse they mock YOU after the kind of arguments that you tend to use, but I have debated plenty of respectful atheists. There is a point where we should not bother trying, but that point tends to be way too easy to reach for you.

"you will simply exhaust yourself with one who by command cannot understand!"
That statement is also evil. You mean exhaust ourselves like Paul did? Of course that requires actually denying ourselves which you seem unwilling to do. God does not command anyone not to understand. We are hardened by ourselves, so the blame does not fall on God. Not ONCE in scripture did God harden anyone so that they may not be saved. All that we hardened were hardened for a different purpose.

Isaiah 6:9
He said, "Go and tell this people: "'Be ever hearing, but never understanding; be ever seeing, but never perceiving.

Why did God command the hardening of Israel? Was it so that they would not be saved? Of course not!

Romans 11:1,11,20,25-26
I ask, then, has God rejected his people? By no means!... So I ask, did they stumble in order that they might fall? By no means! Rather, through their trespass salvation has come to the Gentiles, so as to make Israel jealous.... That is true. They were broken off because of their unbelief, but you stand fast through faith. So do not become proud, but fear.... Lest you be wise in your own sight, I do not want you to be unaware of this mystery, brothers: a partial hardening has come upon Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. And in this way all Israel will be saved...

They were hardened for ther unbelief, not because God rejected them before the foundation of the world. They were blinded that they may fall, but in order to bring about the greater purpose of salvation to all people. They were also hardned so that when the gentiles came in, Israel might be jealous and turn back themselves. Therefore, even those who were hardened by God still might eventually accept Him. God's hardening is partial, not absolute as the passage says. Lastly, Israelites are not the atheists on this site. God did not harden the atheists, He hardened the Jews. I'm afraid your point breaks down in every way it is analyzed.

"Use the time to discuss with the more mature Christians The ways of God. "
If I did that, I don't think I would be able to debate you. You have ignored the commandment of God and sought to justify your own lack of willingness to provide reasons for your belief.

"Be on the look out for False believers ... those who know not God nor his word! Only the utterly ignorant or Atheists place their opinions ABOVE Gods WORD! You can HELP neither!
turn them over to Satan as directed."
We actually can help them; that's why we are called to evangelize and destroy all barriers to belief. Perhaps you would turn them over to satan as you are directed, but I will choose not to listen to Satan.

With that, I will provide examples of other's reasoning with unbelievers:

Acts 28:23-24
When they had appointed a day for him, they came to him at his lodging in greater numbers. From morning till evening he expounded to them, testifying to the kingdom of God and trying to convince them about Jesus both from the Law of Moses and from the Prophets. And some were convinced by what he said, but others disbelieved.

Paul reasoned from the scriptures and proved to these people that Jesus is the Christ. He did this from morning until evening. This was not just a little debate; this was hours and hours of providing evidence. This is something we should all be willing to do.

Acts 18:28
For he vigorously refuted his Jewish opponents in public debate, proving from the Scriptures that Jesus was the Messiah.

Acts 9:28-29
So Saul stayed with them, moving about freely in Jerusalem and speaking boldly in the name of the Lord. He talked and debated with the Grecian Jews, but they tried to kill him.

Acts 17:2,17
As was his custom, Paul went into the synagogue, and on three Sabbath days he reasoned with them from the Scriptures, So he reasoned in the synagogue with the Jews and the devout persons, and in the marketplace every day with those who happened to be there.

These are just a couple examples about how Paul reasoned with hostile nonbelievers. Was he not denying himself as you seem to believe?
Debate Round No. 1
FollowerofChrist1955

Pro

Greetings, and welcome. Let us begin in declaration of whom we serve The Lord GOD!
Upon reading your words .. let me say that again (YOUR WORDS) my first thoughts are that there is far to much of YOU. As I wish not to make the same error, I will proceed with Gods Words which we can agree are the only words that count ... yes?
your words "There are at least four possible benefits from debating atheists:"
The word of the Lord. Romans1; 18 The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of people, who suppress the truth by their wickedness,

21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened.

24 Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another.

26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones.

28 Furthermore, just as they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, so God gave them over to a depraved mind, so that they do what ought not to be done.

31 they have no understanding, no fidelity, no love, no mercy. 32 Although they know God’s righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.

These scriptures make clear there is NOT 1 good reason to debate atheists, let alone 4.

you cite opinion. God says it's wrong!

Your words "Many people have converted to Christianity after watching a Christian vs atheist debate."
to ambiguous, be specific or don't use them they mislead and I think you know that!

1 Peter 3:15 Tells us to give an answer or a reason for what we believe to anyone who asks us.
the debater isn't ASKING he is challenging.
God does not call you to DEFEND anything. God's view is much more simple.
1 Peter 3:15 Instead, you must worship Christ as Lord of your life. And if someone asks about your Christian hope, always be ready to explain it.

Mark 16:15-16 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

NOTICE: preach the gospel to every creature.

your debates:You choose the topic! Scriptures used=0
your debates:Is Calvinism Taught in the Bible? Scripture used=0
your debates:Does God Exist? -QUICK DEBATE! Scriptures used=0
Your debates: Liberalism Or Conversativism: The Future! Scriptures used=0
Your Debates: Is Jesus Almighty God according to the Bible? Scriptures used=0
Opinion Arguments: 5 Scripture use=0

your words "Even if we are not told to prove our case directly, that does not mean we should not try."

Isaiah 55:8
"For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways," declares the LORD.
that sound familiar?
Remember what happened to those who attempted to cast out demons when not told to?
Acts 19; 13 Some Jews who went around driving out evil spirits tried to invoke the name of the Lord Jesus over those who were demon-possessed. They would say, “In the name of the Jesus whom Paul preaches, I command you to come out.” 14 Seven sons of Sceva, a Jewish chief priest, were doing this. 15 One day the evil spirit answered them, “Jesus I know, and Paul I know about, but who are you?” 16 Then the man who had the evil spirit jumped on them and overpowered them all. He gave them such a beating that they ran out of the house naked and bleeding.

that is precisely what is meant. You do as YOU will, that it goes directly against scripture and that it doesn't bother you is evidence against you already! The fact that the scriptures TELL YOU to preach the gospel to every creature, and you do "not" do this instead preaching your OWN WORDS, so far in every document I have read from your profile, debates and opinions.

Acts 18:28
For he vigorously refuted his Jewish opponents in public debate, proving from the Scriptures that Jesus was the Messiah:

in the synagogue .... RELIGIOUS leaders, not unbelievers! Key that Jesus WAS the Messiah!

unbelievers don't know what Messiah or God was!

Acts 28:23-24
from the Law of Moses and from the Prophets. KEY= were all believers, not unbelievers ... otherwise would NOT have known of the Law of Moses!


Romans 11:1,11,20,25-26
speaks of the Religious Jews, blindness to be completed at the Rapture of the Church. Absolutely no bearing on our topic?

please state scriptures that apply! Quit guessing!

When challenged by atheists, you are aware they have know idea of scripture, have neither understanding nor desire to understand. their focus has always been to degrade God! The reject God. Atheists straddle no fences they know what they believe! they do not have doubts. The key is in the assault. Unbelievers do not attack God or His servants, only atheists do that!

So to debate them is a waste of effort better spent elsewhere! The scriptures are self evident, we speak of the DAMNED not the unbelievers. These are those shown the gospel and rejected it! as defined in Romans 1.

as to your decree of what is and is not scripture? you can take that up with God. I think He would be annoyed that you think HIM able to be outmaneuvered by Man! As that demonstrates a weak god, and NOT The God! a Fallible god and NOT an infallible God, an errant god and NOT an inerant God. It also shows you do not believe in the Scriptures Holiness as you have declared the Bible Fallible before the eyes of your brethren!

You are not only wrong but accountably wrong! You will never mature in Christ based on your own thoughts! but that is on you. we shall continue to debate the obvious foolish conduct of those who debate the DEAD!
buildingapologetics

Con

"Upon reading your words .. let me say that again (YOUR WORDS) my first thoughts are that there is far to much of YOU. As I wish not to make the same error, I will proceed with Gods Words which we can agree are the only words that count ... yes?"
This sounds like an excuse for lack of argument.

Why are you citing Romans 1? It has nothing to do with speaking with atheists nor about giving a defense for what we believe. If you think it is relevant, please do more than say "These scriptures make clear there is NOT 1 good reason to debate atheists, let alone 4." Actually, there are more than four if you must know:
1) They may convert.
2) We can plant a seed.
3) It sharpens ourselves
4) It demonstrates our case before the world
5) It glorifies God
6) It stimulates the church to think

"you cite opinion. God says it's wrong!" Thank you for your opinion.

"Your words "Many people have converted to Christianity after watching a Christian vs atheist debate."
to ambiguous, be specific or don't use them they mislead and I think you know that!" Alright, here are a few people: https://www.reasonablefaith.org...

In second Peter 3:15 the word for reason (apologia), literally means a logical defense or a reasoned argument (http://biblehub.com...). Debating atheists both helps us give this defense, and it makes us better able to have the defense when other people ask.

"NOTICE: preach the gospel to every creature." I agree, so why are you withholding parts of the gospel from them? Before you said, "turn them over to Satan as directed."

"your debates:You choose the topic! Scriptures used=0
your debates:Is Calvinism Taught in the Bible? Scripture used=0
your debates:Does God Exist? -QUICK DEBATE! Scriptures used=0
Your debates: Liberalism Or Conversativism: The Future! Scriptures used=0
Your Debates: Is Jesus Almighty God according to the Bible? Scriptures used=0
Opinion Arguments: 5 Scripture use=0"
This is an outright lie. For the debate "You choose the topic!", I cited 4 and referred to several others. For the debate "Is Calvinism Taught in the Bible?", I have not gotten to the debating stage yet. For the debate "Liberalism Or Conversativism: The Future!" I quoted none but referred to many. For the debate "Is Jesus Almighty God according to the Bible?", I quoted 20 and referred to many more.
Total: 24 scriptures quoted, and countless referred to. You are either delusional or a liar, and I'm running out of patience with you.

"Remember what happened to those who attempted to cast out demons when not told to?" Well, I'm not attempting to cast out demons now am I? I am trying to demonstrate the case of Jesus Christ over all opposing obstacles as you seem unwilling to do. A more apt passage is the parable of the talents. Rather than trying to increase the kingdom by arguing with atheists, you would rather bury the information that demonstrates the case for Christ.

"that is precisely what is meant. You do as YOU will, that it goes directly against scripture and that it doesn't bother you is evidence against you already! The fact that the scriptures TELL YOU to preach the gospel to every creature, and you do "not" do this instead preaching your OWN WORDS, so far in every document I have read from your profile, debates and opinions."
I am completely willing to preach the gospel to all men, but you are the one refusing to share with atheists! You are the one not obeying this commandment. You refuse to give a reasoned defense because you are too lazy and seek to justify your own sinfulness.

"in the synagogue .... RELIGIOUS leaders, not unbelievers! Key that Jesus WAS the Messiah!"
Of course, they were religious leaders and unbelievers. You couldn't possibly argue that they are regenerated by the Holy Spirit? These are the same people who wanted to kill Paul. Paul tried to reason with those who wanted to kill him. The atheists on this site are nothing compared to that.

"Acts 28:23-24
from the Law of Moses and from the Prophets. KEY= were all believers, not unbelievers ... otherwise would NOT have known of the Law of Moses!"
You fool! None of them believed the gospel and they all mocked Christ. Do you want to say they are believers? This is the same group that was hardened according to the passage that you cited.

" Romans 11:1,11,20,25-26
speaks of the Religious Jews, blindness to be completed at the Rapture of the Church. Absolutely no bearing on our topic?

please state scriptures that apply! Quit guessing!"
I am arguing with a crazy person. Let me make this painfully clear to you. You quoted a passage from Isaiah that said the Jewish people would be hardened. Romans 11 speaks of the condition of these hardened Jews and even refers back to Isaiah. You used the blindness of Jews as evidence that He hardens atheists. I pointed out to you that this does not mean God hardens atheists. Now you are criticising me for referring to something you brought up because it has nothing to do with the debate!

"When challenged by atheists, you are aware they have know idea of scripture, have neither understanding nor desire to understand. their focus has always been to degrade God! The reject God. Atheists straddle no fences they know what they believe! they do not have doubts. The key is in the assault. Unbelievers do not attack God or His servants, only atheists do that! "
I'm sure many atheists no more about the scripture than you do. Secondly, who cares if they are hostile towards God unless they are simply uncivil? Most of them have been more civil than you, so I do not see the problem. Thirdly it is important that we destroy their arguments in public so that everyone may see the superiority of the Gospel.

"It also shows you do not believe in the Scriptures Holiness as you have declared the Bible Fallible before the eyes of your brethren! "
This demonstrates that you have no understanding of the inerrancy of scripture. Inerrancy means that scripture is perfect and without error. It does not say that we have perfect copies of that scripture. You would be wise to know the difference.

"You are not only wrong but accountably wrong! You will never mature in Christ based on your own thoughts! but that is on you. we shall continue to debate the obvious foolish conduct of those who debate the DEAD!"
You say this because I'm willing to try to reach a group of people that you deem unworthy of God's grace. That is an evil thought that makes me question your faith again. You are also misunderstanding the term dead as it is used in scripture. That is a common Calvinist mistake, but one I hope you will not make in the future.

Now I will demonstrate from the scriptures that we should debate unbelievers:

Acts 19:9
But when some became stubborn and continued in unbelief, speaking evil of the Way before the congregation, he withdrew from them and took the disciples with him, reasoning daily in the hall of Tyrannus.

This clearly labels the people as unbelievers, yet Paul continued to reason with them. I can either listen to you or Paul, and I choose Paul.

2 Timothy 4:2
Preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, and exhort, with complete patience and teaching.

These combined with the passages I quoted in my last response are enough to clearly teach that we should argue, debate, and convince everyone, even if they are trying to kill us. This is why Paul tells us to demolish all arguments against Christ:

2 Corinthians 10:5
We destroy arguments and every lofty opinion raised against the knowledge of God, and take every thought captive to obey Christ,

If you refuse to debate atheists, you are refusing to demolish their arguments against Christ, and you are refusing to obey scripture. Think about what would happen if Christians never tried to refute atheists. Their arguments would go unchallenged, and more people would believe faith is irrational. It is because of people like you and your infectious ideas that the church is suffering. We have stood too long in the shadows, and now that the church is finally gaining territory back, you opt to stand in its way. You seek to prevent the church from truly destroying the barriers of satan, and you stand in the way of the God's mission to reach all people.

Stop telling us who we can and cannot debate, and get out of the way of God!
Debate Round No. 2
FollowerofChrist1955

Pro

hehehe,you don't KNOW scripture do you? That's why we are only hearing YOU. That's what YOU rely on .... you? That's why That's why after 5 debates and 5 opinion discussions you have NEVER used scriptures ... just YOUR OPINION of scriptures. Sorry, Christianity doesn't work Like that!
You just can't decide not to know scripture and just give everyone YOUR point of view! Because it makes you false and a liar. See; when you give people what YOU THINK, it's never what God says or thinks! That's exactly Why God said:Isaiah 55:8
"For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways," declares the LORD.
you simply can't ignore that!
When God says your worshipping IN VAIN ... he's talking about YOU! Teaching people what Men say instead of God. Here:
Matthew 15:9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

That's what you do ... you teach people what you think, because you Don't know scripture. Hey don't get mad at me? You can look at my profile? If I'm not quoting scripture I'm just as wrong as you! The fact is God demands we conduct ourselves accordingly. He expects all f US to KNOW SCRIPTURE ... that ain't optional!. Here:
2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Your conduct does not demonstrate Gods approval as you do not KNOW Scripture and do "NOT" use them, in discussions. You can't make excuses for that! You don't say ... well it doesn't say not too, like your in kindergarten ... you KNOW to obey God! even the smallest Christian knows that! Why aren't YOU then?

It states share the Gospel, you do not! You tell people what YOU think, and that isn't the instruction! Gods word is God breathed, inerrant, and:2 Timothy 3:16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for instruction, for conviction, for correction, and for training in righteousness,
I want you to focus on the word ALL, what does that mean? It means ALL, you don't get to say what is or isn't Gods word because your listening to some clown who violates scripture Himself ... you are being held accountable for the foolishness you allow in your Life! YOU are responsible to research seek out the Truth of God from God Himself, through the Spirit as you were or would be told if you botheredto READ the bible!
Check it out John 6:45 It is written in the Prophets: 'They will all be taught by God.' Everyone who has heard the Father and learned from him comes to me.
Does that say, your preacher? Commentaries? Extra books? No it says God and it means God!
Isaiah 54:13
"All your sons will be taught of the LORD; And the well-being of your sons will be great.
does it say, a Scholar, a Theologian, a concordence? NO it says God!

1 John 2:27
And as for you, the anointing you received from Him remains in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But just as His true and genuine anointing teaches you about all things, so remain in Him as you have been taught.
clearly "NOT " you but it could be you IF you stop listening to the god of SELF! Humble yourself before God, throw out that trash you THINK you know ... and get back into the Word of God! Because you are defenseless without Gods word!
Philippians 3:15
All of us who are mature should embrace this point of view. And if you think differently about some issue, God will reveal this to you as well.
WHO WILL REVEAL IT? ............ God!
So all that nonsense your talking? TRASH, all you! Atheist are under Gods curse for REJECTING and trampling underfoot the Son of God. You can do nothing for them. They must humble themselves before Christ, and they ain't gonna do that by your imagination and ready wit!
You asked? Why are you citing Romans 1? short answer it reveals the damned are CURSED! Lets set aside your commentaries and Theologian books for a moment and JUUUUSST LOOK at the scriptures for a moment OK?
lets review shall we? WHO is the Damned?

ALL TOGETHER NOW .... Mark 16:15-16 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel ( NOT PREACH WHAT YOU THINK THE SCRIPTURES SAYS ... USE THE SCRIPTURE BABE!)to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

"God’s Wrath Against Sinful Humanity" Don't need strongs to know that means WRATH AGAINST someone right? Who Sinners! but not just ANY SINNER! Observe please.

Roans 1: 18"people, who suppress the truth by their wickedness," WHO suppresses the TRUTH?
not unbelievers they don't KNOW the truth. Then WHO? ATHEISTS! Why atheists only ... because they REJECT the God your just a babe in Christ so you have not met up with as many as I but ... atheists? not only KNOW OF GOD! They adamantly and agressively attack everyone associated WITH God. and their all over this Section of the Board!

but lets go on since your clueless on Romans.21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God

hopefully I DON'T have to tell you that IN Romans it tells all humanity that we are without excuse ... because He (God) has:
"19 since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them."

*** unike you I prefer using scripture, cuz you can't argue with scripture .... though YOU certainly are giving it the college try eh***

So God says the Atheists are cursed ... who else were atheists? Pharisees. They rejected Christ, they knew scripture, tithed a tenth did everything by the numbers and going to Hell just as sure as the unbelievers!
Matthew 5:20 For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

Does yours surpass the righteousness of the Pharisees? I shown you that you don't know scripture. I've shown you your in direct violation of scripture.

You choose to disregard scriptures! Told to spread the Gospel, you do not, instead telling fanciful tails, pretending to know scripture but anyone who does can tell you do not!

2 Peter 1:20-21 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.21For no prophecy was ever brought about through human initiative, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.…

Your comment of what is allowed in scripture and what isn't is in direct violation of this passage. If the prophets were "NOT" allowed to interpret scripture ... how come your doing it? Worse why are you listening to those who also violate this scripture!
I can tell you? Because your NOT learning from God your learning from Man! Otherwise you would have KNOW about this scripture!

let's look at it again ... lets SEE IF you need ANYONE to interpret its meaning for you!
Knowing this first, (that means you should know this FIRST right ... not hard, stay with me your doing fine!

that no prophecy of the scripture- The Bible ... it's all prophecy ... okay so far knothing we need to call out the Scholars for yet!

is of any private interpretation. Means nobody was allowed to interpret the Word! Hang in there, your getting it?

For no prophecy- Okay NONE of the Bible ... got it ...

was ever brought about through human initiative. Humanity had NO PART IN ... alright ... yeah, no need for the theologians just yet.

but men spoke from God .... men spoke in scripture okay got it, another words Not like your doing ... LIKE I'M DOING!

carried along by the Holy Spirit ... Youshould recognize this one, you know the Spirit your holden hostage, while you play Ghandi!

Understand I am not here to blow sunshine up your skirt. Get serious aout God and stop pretending. KNOW and PREACH the Word of God alone ... nobody cares WHAT you think!

You act as if your in sunday school. Godis the creator of all things, He don't ask permission, He demoands and expects your total commitment to Him, give it or get out of the Family business!

Now Atheists are not going to be saved byreason of their rejection! period! That you don't even know what the difference between a nonbeliever and an atheist are is disturbing. Stop listening to humanity. Or you will likely be the Christian in 1 Corinthian 3 :15
the one who will be SAVED ALONE ... but read the last part ... to get the seriousness of what I'm telling you!
BUT ONLY AS ONE HAVING GONE THROUGH THE FLAMES!
Don't know what that means BUT it IS directed at Christians who because of CONDUCT have earned ZERO rewards. These are the lowest form of Christian. You should at least try for the top two! But its up to you!
oh almost forgot to put it here for you since your not LIKELY to look it up!

1 Corithians 3
10 By the grace God has given me, I laid a foundation as a wise builder, and someone else is building on it. But each one should build with care. 11 For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw, 13 their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each person’s work. 14 If what has been built survives, the builder will receive a reward. 15 If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved—even though only as one escaping through the flames.


buildingapologetics

Con

After reading your response, I just have to laugh at it. If I didn't laugh, I would cry based on its stupidity. Now I understand why atheists mock you; they are correct to do so. That is all you can do when you are debating a crazy person. Please follow your own advice and don't debate atheists; you are making Christianity look bad. Well, I suppose I will get started by listing a few of your repeated misunderstandings.
Sola scriptura: This does not mean scripture is our only authority, it means scripture is our only infallible authority. Other things such as reason, logic, intelligence, scholarship are useful authorities. I'm sorry that you seem incapable of using any of them, but they are useful.
Scriptural Infallibility: This states that scripture, as it was brought down was perfect. This does not mean scripture is perfectly preserved for us today. While 99% is an accurate representation of the original, we know the other 1% that we have was not in the original. I care what Mark wrote, not what a scribe thought Mark should have written.
Sharing the Gospel: I am not required to quote a single piece of scripture in order to share the gospel. As long as I accurately describe Christ's sacrifice for our sins and what men must do to be saved, I have preached the gospel. While I probably would quote scripture, that is not what defines a gospel presentation.

"you don't KNOW scripture do you?"
I have actually studied every single scripture that you are about to quote. Now I don't know scripture as much as I would like, but I will never become satisfied. Does that displease you, your majesty?

"That's what YOU rely on .... you? That's why That's why after 5 debates and 5 opinion discussions you have NEVER used scriptures ... "
You know that's an outright lie. Anyone can go to my debates right now and know that it's not true.

"Because it makes you false and a liar. See; when you give people what YOU THINK, it's never what God says or thinks! That's exactly Why God said: Isaiah 55:8"
I'm not the one who has lied during this debate; that was you. Isaiah 55:8 is about how I am in no position to question God, but I am in a perfect position to question you. While we are on the subject, what is wrong with you? This has nothing to do with debating atheists.

"When God says your worshipping IN VAIN ... he's talking about YOU! "
I am not trying to supplant the scriptures as another ultimate authority. You are simply wrong in your view of sola scriptura. Also, why are you interpreting this scripture? Interesting...

"You can look at my profile? If I'm not quoting scripture I'm just as wrong as you! "
I can say something without quoting scripture and still be correct. Watch this: "2 + 2 = 4". Isn't that amazing! Also, while you quote scripture, you misunderstand and misapply it.

"He expects all f US to KNOW SCRIPTURE ... that ain't optional!. Here:"
And if you knew scripture, you wouldn't be making so many mistakes.

"You can't make excuses for that! You don't say ... well it doesn't say not too, like your in kindergarten ... you KNOW to obey God! even the smallest Christian knows that! Why aren't YOU then? "
You are the one who made a similar excuse for not debating atheists. You said that because scripture doesn't explicitly telly you to debate atheists that you shouldn't. Your whole case depends on something you just ridiculed and I never did.

"It states share the Gospel, you do not! You tell people what YOU think, and that isn't the instruction! Gods word is God breathed, inerrant, and:2 Timothy 3:16"
2 Timothy 3:16 is about the nature of scripture, not what counts as scripture. The end of Mark was not inspired, so it is not scripture. Also, as long as what I think coincides with what God thinks, I am in right standing. While I obviously make some errors, I do not make myself out to be inerrant.

"Check it out John 6:45 It is written in the Prophets: 'They will all be taught by God.' Everyone who has heard the Father and learned from him comes to me."
Yes, we should absolutely be taught by God. We should also be taught by men as Christ says:
Matthew 18:15-17 "If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. 16 But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. 17 If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector."

Above we are taught to seek the authority of the church. While this church is not an ultimate authority, it is a useful tool of epistemology.

"WHO WILL REVEAL IT? ............ God!"
You sound dangerously close to trusting your feelings over the word of God. That is how Mormons convert Christians.

"So all that nonsense your talking? TRASH, all you! Atheist are under Gods curse for REJECTING and trampling underfoot the Son of God. You can do nothing for them. They must humble themselves before Christ, and they ain't gonna do that by your imagination and ready wit!"
Obviously, they are under God's curse; that's exactly why we need to try to get them out! You don't just give up. That's not what Christ teaches. We want to do everything in our power to remove them from that curse by convincing them. Of course that requires reason and logic as 1 Peter 3:15 commands, so maybe you should leave that up to someone else. I do thank you for calling me witty though, that's awfully kind.

"God"s Wrath Against Sinful Humanity" Don't need strongs to know that means WRATH AGAINST someone right? Who Sinners! but not just ANY SINNER! Observe please."
God's wrath is against all those who do not believe in Christ as their lord and savior. That's exactly why we should debate atheists. Perhaps we can provide an example of the superior case of Christ over that of atheism. Romans 1 clearly teaches that all who have heard but reject Christ suppress the truth. In that time, it would include Jews.

Even if I conceded that atheists are the only ones under a curse, so what? We should still try to get them out of such a position, and failing to do so ignores the commandment of God.

"*** unike you I prefer using scripture, cuz you can't argue with scripture .... though YOU certainly are giving it the college try eh***"
I'm not arguing with scripture, I'm arguing with your interpretation of it.

"Does yours surpass the righteousness of the Pharisees? I shown you that you don't know scripture. I've shown you your in direct violation of scripture. "
You have not shown that I do not know scripture. How could you possibly read my mind and claim to know what I know? You have not provided a single instance where I go against scripture, although I know I do elsewhere. I don't love God with everything I am, so you are right in saying I am not perfect. That's the point of the gospel. I hope you have heard the gospel before because you should know this by now.

"Your comment of what is allowed in scripture and what isn't is in direct violation of this passage. If the prophets were "NOT" allowed to interpret scripture ... how come your doing it? Worse why are you listening to those who also violate this scripture!"
When I thought your reply couldn't possibly make less sense, you go ahead and say that. It might enlighten you t know that you have been interpreting scripture the whole debate. Also the passage you cited means that the revelations contained in scripture are not simple man's interpretations. This has nothing to do with us interpreting scripture. In fact, if we were not allowed to do so, we couldn't understand a single thing the Bible says!

"is of any private interpretation. Means nobody was allowed to interpret the Word! Hang in there, your getting it?"
But you are not apparently.

"... nobody cares WHAT you think! "
Aw shucks, that hurt my feelings.

"Now Atheists are not going to be saved byreason of their rejection! period! "
Are you saying that no atheist has ever converted to Christianity? That's quite an assertion without any evidence. It is our job as Christians to try to bring them to a saving relationship with Christ, even if we fail.

Conclusion:
I provided evidence quite clearly in my opening statement that we are supposed to debate unbelievers. We are to debate anyone who stands opposed to the gospel, otherwise, the church may fall. You sir stand in the way of God and call to deny a certain group of people the gospel simply because they mock your obvious stupidity. If you don't want to debate an atheist, then don't. Please don't. Meanwhile, stay out of the way.
Debate Round No. 3
76 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by ANANIGMA 1 week ago
ANANIGMA
I added to his words? I passed it to you word for word from scripture. Your going into some really unjustifiable reasoning to say anyone who "speaks" doesn't first "think" it. Are you sure your not clinging to your own understanding? The Word of God doesn't seem to support your claim.

Proverbs 23:7 "For as though he THOUGHT it in his HEART: so will he SAY unto thee".

Matthew 12:34 "For out of the abundance of the HEART the mouth SPEAKS."

As for the rest of what you have to say about me, I will re-quote 2 Timothy 2:16, "But avoid irreverent and empty chatter, which will only lead to more ungodliness." Brother, take a page from the lesson I learned and was humbled by: "Make sure what the spirit moves you to say isn't intended for you first before speak it to someone else."
Posted by missmedic 1 week ago
missmedic
FollowerofChrist1955
Your actions show that you have failed this debate, by debating Atheists in the comments section.
Practice what you preach, what kind of believer are you?..........< rhetorical.
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 1 week ago
FollowerofChrist1955
ANANIGMA;
Your statement: "Sure, Matthew 5:43-48 is just one example of many."

Why do you embarrass yourself? Have you not read:Proverbs 30:6 Do not add to his words, or he will rebuke you and prove you a liar.

Note your very next statement? Quote"He actually went beyond thinking it, "
This statement PROVES, you KNEW he didn"t say "I Think", that is deception another form of deciet, and evidence of a LIAR!

You a believer, so caught up in you own mind, your own thoughts. Devoid of the Word of God, like all the other disobedient Christians, one who has demeaned the importance of the Word of God, before humanity and sinners.

How long will you make jokes that are inconvenient? How long will you tolerate your incompetence, how much longer will you "Pretend" you know what your talking about? Humble yourself and return to the Lord. Fullfill your promise to DIE TO YOURSELF.

All I here is YOU! Release the Holy Spirit from the dungeon you have placed Him in and allow HIM upon the throne of your Life. Step aside, and allow Him to restore your standing among the Brethren who need Not BE ASHAMED for lack of knowledge of the Word of God.
2 Timothy 2:15-16
15Make every effort to present yourself approved to God, an unashamed workman who accurately handles the word of truth. 16But avoid irreverent and empty chatter, which will only lead to more ungodliness,"

I will speak to you no further till you. Cease your foolishness of "Caring what "OTHERS" say. Heed the Lord, or forfiet your rewards!
Posted by ANANIGMA 1 week ago
ANANIGMA
Some people argue that "morals" come from the Bible and other people rebut it with "they don"t need the Bible to get morals." Yes indeed we can all construct our morals without the Bible but few can say the morals they construct are equal to articles like this in the Bible. Therefor those who don"t find themselves equal to the morality displayed by Jesus here might have some growing and improving to do. Not because it is Jesus saying it but because it is a more perfect way.

You may have a different instruction with your life. Whenever I get spiritual instruction, I ask if this is a lesson for me first because I believe GOD has the ability to reach out and guide every single person on this earth without me having to preach to them. An example of when I have felt the need for God to use me in this way was to bring companionship and comfort to another person. Sometimes we as humans need another human to be there and God understands this.

He commands and you do?? In Mark 9:35, Jesus said to the Twelve, "If anyone wants to be first, he must be the last of all and the servant of all." This would be a contradiction of Christ if he wished to be worshipped. It"s my belief that Christ was a servant to man by bringing a message to find a better way than what they knew before. You can claim to follow Christ 24-7 but if you"re not actively working to follow the message: Who are you following? John 8:31, "If you continue to follow my teaching, you are really my disciples."
Posted by ANANIGMA 1 week ago
ANANIGMA
FollowerofChrist1955 -

------Point out in the scriptures the one that says .... and Jesus said "I THINK" let me know when you find it!

Sure, Matthew 5:43-48 is just one example of many.
"Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbor, and hate thine enemy. But I say unto you, Love your enemies: bless them that curse you: do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which hurt you, and persecute you, That ye may be the children of your father that is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to arise on the evil and the good, and sendeth rain on the just and unjust. For if ye love them, which love you, what reward shall you have? Do not the Publicans even the same? And if ye be friendly to your brethren only, what singular thing do ye? do not even the Publicans likewise? Ye shall therefore be perfect, as your Father which is in heaven, is perfect."

He actually went beyond thinking it, he commanded it by saying, "I say". He didn"t say "God says", or "The one who sent me says". He is speaking on his own authority and making changes to what the people of his time thought the message of God was. Also read the rest of it. Where does it say, "curse those who are your enemies to hellfire"? Where does it say you should ONLY be friendly to your brothers in Christ? If my history serves me correct, Jesus was a priest who befriended Pagans, rescued an adulterer, and rivaled the religious authority of his time. Jesus didn"t author Corinthians, that was Paul and most of his writings were meant to be private letters. Not taken as Gospel.
Posted by MRAAJ.evil 1 week ago
MRAAJ.evil
You still here mate? Not talking to yourself again are ya? It's quite common for those with dementia.
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 1 week ago
FollowerofChrist1955
Anyara :
Indeed, but as is and was expected, they could "NOT" advance to the level of God himself's challenge thus they remain, the nothings they are!

Yes God issued challenges long ago to ALL GODS of the Minds of Men. Of them ALL, only God HIMSELF accomplished the impossible, and it has remained so ever since!

only GOD foretold The future with 100% accuracy, and it continues today!
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 1 week ago
FollowerofChrist1955
ANANIGMA; Continued
indeed, do you go get beer with the sinners?, Do you accompany them to the Bars, the strip joints? Do you make best Friends of them?

Then you are disobedient brother. That is of course your choice, but I caution you to encourage such behavior in those who are less stable in Christ than you?

If Christ said not to be yoked with unbelievers .... it is ALL He SHOULD HAVE TO SAY. But for YOU, this is not so, WHY? because you still worship the God of SELF more than the God of Creation! Yes you ARE SAVED, I do not speak of Salvation, I speak of obedience to Christ!

Behold ... you are instructed not to be yoked to unbelivers and you instantly "INTERPRET" the extent of the command. You paint the scripture, with a ball point pen, instead of a BROAD BRUSH.

Where then is the scripture that tells you, YOU HAVE thee authority to CHOSE the commands you WILL or WILL NOT obey! Can you tell me this my bother. ARE YOU of Christ? or are you as you demonstrate ... your OWN MAN!

in conclusion:
You state: "the first thing I ask: is this a lesson for me? "

Romans 9:20 But who are you, O man, to talk back to God? Shall what is formed say to Him who formed it, "Why have you made me like this?"

God asks nothing HE COMMANDS and you DO, or in your case DO NOT! Choose who you follow my brother ... do you follow Christ, or YOURSELF?
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 1 week ago
FollowerofChrist1955
ANANIGMA;
your statement: "In my opinion the only thing that should go to hell is the fear-mongering campaign and the inescapable guilt trip that could of only been imagined in the minds of evil men."

and YET the reality continues .... the WILL of God shall be done. That you, me or anyone else, believes anything at all, is not nor WILL ever be the point!

You see my brother ... God IS, and because He is, all things follow a pattern set at what?
Ephesians 1:4 For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love

you know if you would only STOP THINKING, you would become the wisest of US all? The man who can DIE COMPLETELY to himself, shall be the FIRST in the Kingdom of God. The reason is self evident.

All his thoughts are on the scriptures alone, Gods will alone, Gods direction, purpose, and will. There is ZERO of himself to get in the way, to stray left or right. in him is the Spirit of the Living God alone .... he neither thinks, believes, nor desires naught but The WILL of the Father.

Oh that's right ... it WAS Christ Jesus. Tell me my brother ... you've read the Holy Word? Point out in the scriptures the one that says .... and Jesus said "I THINK"

let me know when you find it!

You state: Treat people how you would want to be treated.

As they fall INTO HELL! Because in your foolishness your attempt to be popular instead of OBEDIENT to Christ, has made you so!

Hebrews 13:1-2 says"Let brotherly love continue.

Behold the ignorance reveals itself, my brother. it speaks of YOU and ME. we are one in Christ. the sinner is not YOUR BROTHER indeed he never can be?

2 Corinthians 6:14 Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness?
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 1 week ago
FollowerofChrist1955
KostasT.1526
Supposing an individual who does not believe in the Christian God. ...

I have a neighbor, who is also not a Christian, and she refuses to seek God also. She says .... What about those people who live in areas that are inaccessible to Man. What about Them? Are They also going to Hell?

Truth hers at LEAST is a real possibility. The choice to dwell in the Greatest of ALL Nations is strictly of YOU OWN doing. The IMAGINEnation!

suppose you could hold your breath forever? Will that stop you from ever dying? No, Why?
Hebrews 9:27Just as man is appointed to die once, and after that to face judgment, 28 so also Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many; and He will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who eagerly await Him."

Remember the TRUTH IS .... nothing you imagine, or pretend, or believe, or wish NOT to believe alters Reality!

as to your nonsense question?
Romans 3:10 As it is written: "There is no one righteous, not even one;

man is BORN in sin ... man is SLAVE to sin. IF even one sin exists, the sentence is Death.
Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

I could make up a myriad of foolish questions ... in the end they are but excuses, NOT to be responsible for the stupidity associated with not looking!
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