The Instigator
JR-CreativeGenius
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
ChickenBakuba
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

Santa Claus is Real

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Post Voting Period
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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 7/9/2015 Category: Religion
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,612 times Debate No: 77439
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (173)
Votes (0)

 

JR-CreativeGenius

Pro

I will be debating that Santa Claus is real. When I was young my parents told me all about Santa Claus and his magical miracles and stuff. He is so kind to bring presents to everyone. When I was six years old my parents gave me a book about Santa Claus. I remember how I used to write my wish list and send it off to Santa and he would always respond to my every request with the presents I asked for. The book about Santa said that Santa will do whatever you ask in his name, and will bring toys and stuff. One day my parents said that Santa was not real. I am really upset now because I know that Santa is real so why are they trying to tell me that he is not. I know he is real because I have a book about Santa and the book is the word of Santa. I am sure that the book is the word of Santa because the it says so right in the book. And the book is infallible because it is the word of Santa. And I know it is the word of Santa because it says so in the book. Anyway, now everyone is trying to tell me that Santa is not real but obviously he is. In the book it says that all nonbelievers will get coal, but if you believe in Santa you will get presents. My friends have tried to convert me to believing in other magical beings such as the tooth fairy and the easter bunny but I know that these are all fake. It's so dumb that they believe in those things. I mean seriously, obviously Santa is the one true magical being. My friends are trying to tell me that if I don't believe in the tooth fairy then I won't get money and if I don't believe in the easter bunny then I won't get a chocolate bunny, but I tried to use logic and reasoning to convince them that they won't get presents if they don't believe in Santa. Then I got my other friends that believe in Santa and I fought against my other friends that believe in their magical beings. I am very mad that people are attacking my beliefs about Santa. Now I wish to debate my opponent.
ChickenBakuba

Con

Grow up, no offence meant.

Read all the Links that I put in my argument, everything. Read my entire rebuttal. You should have the time to read everything, considering that you seem young.

Firstly, *Santa Claus is not real.*

Evidence:
http://www.wikihow.com...
http://www.telegraph.co.uk...
https://en.wikipedia.org...

Please note that Wikipedia states that Santa is a mythical, legendary, historical and folkloric orgins...
"Santa Claus, also known as Saint Nicholas, Father Christmas, Kris Kringle and simply "Santa", is a mythical figure with legendary, historical and folkloric origins who, in many Western cultures, is said to bring gifts to the homes of the good children on 24 December, the night before Christmas Day. However, in some European countries children receive their presents on St. Nicholas' Day, either the 6th or 19th of December."

Although I do not want to spoil your perfect, happy, idyllic world and belief, I honestly do NOT think that Santa Claus is real. Unfortunately, not everything is true. You might have grown up with Santa Claus, but I never grew up with him.

Listen.

Firstly, your belief in Santa was probably instigated by your parents. I know it is hard to stop believing, (just like how I'm a Christian and how my parents told me that God is not real) but honestly, Santa does *NOT* exist.

The book is lying. The book is obviously made for young children, something to induce imagination in a Child.

Note that your English is good, considering that I originally thought you of a 7 year old. If you're trying to troll me, don't try.

"The book is infallible because it is the word of Santa."

It sounds like bullsh1t to me, but if I look at it from your point of view, it's like this:

"The Bible is infallible because it is the word of God."

Unfortunately God is real, proven scientifically, historically and logically, and is a widely held belief, and in my case, a fact.

However, Santa is the exact opposite of this.

I doubt Santa would have wrote the book personally, and I also doubt that his words have been passed down from generations to generations. Santa is mythical, and he is very *VERY* old. I don't think he can live for that long, tbh.

"In the book..."

Nah. The book is wrong. Even if it is correct, I haven't received a single coal in my life, although I don't believe in Santa. This is probably the main reason why your friends do not believe in Santa.

Santa is a fictional character. Note that the Easter Bunny is false, and not exactly real.

And it is a little too late to get mad. Your belief has been trampled on, ripped apart, crushed, destroyed, wrecked, rekt, shrekt, owned, trashed, pwned, since a long time ago. Santa is false, this truth may be hard on you, and I'm sorry, but honestly.

Oh yeah, question time:
How old are you?
Did you give your wish list to your parents where they "sent it to Santa"?

You don't need to answer either of the questions.

Just do something that I ask you to do this year:

In your Wish List, put:

-Lexus (Car. You can also put any car, like a Ferrari, or a Rose Royce)
-Bungalow (You could put a mansion too, or a castle)
-Immortality Potion like the one Chang'e had
-Strength Potion that allows me to rival the strength of Gilgamesh/Hercules
-Epic of Gilgamesh, Enuma Elish
-Awesome Potion that gives you Omnipotence (God)
-Potion that gives you the power of Zeus
-Potion that gives you the knowledge of Athena
-Potion that gives you all the good things in the world
-Unlimited, infinite, wishes that will grant you any wish, and last you a perennial amount of time, a lifetime. But in your case, considering you're immortal, make it infinite and unlimited.
-Potion that gives you the power of Time (Kronos)
-Potion that gives you victory (Nike, Odin)
-Sword of Grief (Grams)
-Sword of the woman of the lake (Excalibur)
-Sword of Arthur (Caliburn)
-Spear of Heaven, made out of Uru, aka Gungnir
-Etc. Anything that you can think of, put it down. Ensure that they are...err...hard to get. Not just any toy.

If you get all these for Christmas and they work, then I'll *instantly* believe in Santa. And make my *own wish list*. Hehe. I CAN BECOME A SUPER VILLAIN HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAA

*Ahem* sorry about that.

Tooth Fairy is a lie too. Your parents sneak into your room, and they replace the tooth with money. My brother experienced that.

Please, your parents told you the truth as they thought that you could accept the lie that they had been telling you throughout all these years. Accept it.

This is my rebuttal. Dingerpants, and all, VOTE 4 ME!

Oh wait, I can make myself win. I'll use the *FAMOUS WISH LIST*! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I WIN THIS DEBATE! HOHOHOHOHOHOHOHOHO

Sorry, but honestly, vote for me,
Debate Round No. 1
JR-CreativeGenius

Pro

My counter arguments to your evidence.

Exhibit a) http://www.wikihow.com...
Exhibit b) http://www.theguardian.com...
Exhibit c) http://hollywoodlife.com...

As you can see my evidence is far more persuasive because it supports the existence of Santa Claus.
Now, I am 100% certain of the existence of Santa and I will prove his existence to you.

I have solid evidence behind the existence of Santa.

1. Look around you. Look at the presents that so many people receive on christmas. Clearly the presents had to be created from somewhere. The presents can't just spring into existence from nothing. As you know, something cannot come from nothing. Do you really believe that the presents just exploded into existence with a big bang and appeared right underneath the christmas tree? It is only logical to believe that the presents must have had a creator. There must have been intelligent design. And that is what Santa's elves are for. They intelligently design the presents. You can conduct an experiment. Try to snap your fingers and make a present out of nothing... See it doesn't work!

2. There have been many miracles and so many children have seen these miracles with their own eyes. The children plead to Santa by writing him a letter and he answers their wishes. If anything he actually seems to answer at least 90% of the time... unlike other things... While there is no camera evidence for some reason, I know that Santa can do many miracles such as fit his obese body down a chimney and fly into every single house in just a single night. That's like more than a million houses in just one night. Oh yeah! And Santa also has a bag that never seems to run out of stuff. Actually his bag gives out WAY more stuff... than some other person... I know that these miracles have never been caught on camera... Ever... but it's still evidence because ether are so many witnesses.

3. Without Santa there is no morality! Where do you get your morals?! Hmmm. At least I get morals from the fact that I know that Santa, an old obese man, is spying on me every second of my life. He watches me while a sleep. All night long. He watches me while I'm awake. He knows when I've been bad or good. This is why I have morals. This is why I act like an angel and I help people out. Because I know Santa will reward me. Where do you get your morals from? How do you know not to behave like an unruly brat? Hmmmmmm. In the great Book of Santa, know as the Babble, Santa clearly lists his ten Santa Commandments. I will list them for you. 1. Thou shalt have no other magical beings before me. 2. Thou shalt not make onto me any merry image. 3. Though shalt not take the name, thy Santa, in vain. 4. Remember the Santa Day, keep it holy. 5. Honor me for I am the one that gives the presents. 6. Though shalt keep thy hands to thyself 7. Thou shalt be loyal to thy playmate 8. Thou shalt share your toys 9. Though shalt not be a tattle tale 10. Though shalt not whine... and complain
See, these are the ten commandments of Santa. These are great morals, and there is no way you could possibly figure this out unless you follow Santa. Santa also doesn't have a reputation of being a mass murder on a global level genocide... like some people.

4. Santa is omnipotent, omniscient, and forgiving! He has so much power and he helps so many children get presents. He has the power to fly at light speed, spy and millions of kids all at the same time, make millions of presents with just a few elves, and he has a bag that hold an infinite amount of things. He has all this power. I find it a bit strange that with this power he doesn't just feed every starving person in the world but whatever. Who cares that he lets evil continue when he has the power to easily stop it but instead he prefers to focus on insignificant wishes such as giving kids toys. Anyway, Santa is helpful to everyone and uses his immense power very wisely. And Remember, it's all part of Santa's grand plan.

5. When I put out the body of Santa (cookies) and the blood of Santa (milk), it always disappears. Santa must exist because he must eat his body and blood.

6. You see, the Book of Santa, The Babble, was written when Santa began giving presents. That was so long ago that nobody can actually verify if the book was actually written by Santa so therefore it must have been written by Santa because nobody was there to verify it. The existence of this book proves Santa's existence.

7. Even if I am... somehow... wrong about my belief in Santa at least nothing happens. I was wrong. At least I lived a life of morals. Nothing to gain, nothing to lose. But you. If you are wrong and Santa is real then guess what... you get big, fat, lump of coal! So what do you pick? A chance for presents? Or. A chance for a big lump of coal!

8. You cannot prove that Santa doesn't exist so therefore he must be real!

9. Santa sends his guardian elves to talk with me and he communicates with me personally. I have a very personal relationship with him that you can not disprove.

Now that I am done giving my unbreakably strong reasons I will give my rebuttals.

You say that my belief in Santa was instigated by my parents. This is absolutely not true. I could have been born in another family that believes in the easter bunny for example and I would still believe in santa and not the easter bunny because I know that santa is the one true magical being. You see, it is not my upbringing that decides which magical being I believe in but it's just that I know for a fact that Santa is real and the others are fake. I mean seriously! A bunny that hops around. How dumb do you need to be to believe that. And a fairy that flies around. Stupidest thing I ever heard. Santa is real, proven scientifically, historically and logically. Scientifically he is real because if he didn't exist then the atoms of the universe would not exist and as some random law of science states if you take those atoms out of the universe then you can not do that because matter cannot be destroyed or something. Historically, he has proved himself over and over with so many miracles. Also his book is to old to verify. Logically you use your brain to know that he exists because it makes sense to me and that is what I want.
You mention that a widely held belief makes something true.
One last thing. Say every single person in the world believed in Santa... except you. Would that make Santa real? Or not............................................................ WELL OF COURSE HE'D BE REAL! HE IS SANTA CLAUS!!!!!!!

VOTE FOR ME THE PRO DUDE!!!!
ChickenBakuba

Con

Erm.

I fking laughed when I saw the first part of the argument. Then I almost cried at the last part of it, and I almost puked too.

I am extremely angry (ok fine, I'm not angry, I'm rlly just fking amused) at my Religion being ridiculed. -.-

I don't know whether to laugh or cry, but...

Exhibit C, I have to admit, was totally bullsh1t. It was so fake, and the beard was probably fake too. I'm pretty sure Santa came through the front door instead of coming down the chimney too.

Exhibit A is total bullsh1t too. Send a message to Santa is entire horsesh1t. Probably a scam, you should know better. As for the books, I haven't read them, so I can't exactly rebut it yet. Tracking is also a scam. You look, you see, it's totally common sense that that was an obvious fake. As for Step 5 & 6...Haha. It was so funny, I forgot to laugh. I'd like to see you get a legit picture of Santa, you can try the steps yourself. And I want a legit one, not your Dad having pillows stuffed inside his jacket and with a fake beard.

Exhibit C was at least decent. It explained Santa's existence with Science. But, nah.

"OK, so neither of these places gets as chilly as absolute zero, but it must count for something that no deserving child would address their wish list to hot places such as, say, Borneo or Brazil. The very idea is quite ridiculous. QED (which stands for Quantum Electrodynamics, as any fule kno.)"

Nope. This theory is unfalsifiable. But I liked the theory of Santa Claus being in every place, simultaneously, everywhere, but wavefunction collapsing if discovered.

Rebuttal Type 1:

"As you can see my evidence is far more persuasive because it supports the existence of Santa Claus.
Now, I am 100% certain of the existence of Santa and I will prove his existence to you."

Nope. My argument, will always, always be far more persuasive. Particularly because it is widely known that Santa is a lie.

"Clearly the presents had to be created from somewhere. The presents can't just spring into existence from nothing."

The "intelligent design" is "coincidentally" the same as human design. For some reason, the Elves have the same technology as humans. Same old plastic, same old factory. The presents had a creator, that is, the toy industries or factories. My friend caught his Dad sneaking down to put down some presents at the last minute while attempting to catch a glimpse of Santa. Parents have admitted to sneaking down and putting Christmas Presents at Midnight. It was a traumatising experience for him. As for me, my parents go to a toy shop. They ask me "What do you want for Christmas?"

...Sad life, I know ^

Hmm.

Rebuttal Type 2.
Miracles. Please define the word Miracles. Santa answers their wishes? Don't make me laugh. He answers "at least 90% of the time". You have stated that Santa is omniscient & omnipotent. Santa could easily grant all the Children's Wishes - 100% - if he was indeed omniscient and omnipotent. This is *NOT* logical. If Santa was indeed omniscient and omnipotent, he would not need anybody to catch him on a mere technological device (that is, a camera). Neither will he need a child to catch him putting presents below the Christmas Tree. It is hardly evidence and illogical. Santa would wanting to be on tape is pure crap.

Rebuttal Type 3.
"Without Santa there is no morality! Where do you get your morals?!... Etc. Etc."

Now, my lass. You seem to have terribly mistaken Santa for God. Either this is one big troll, or I'm hallucinating. I honestly hope it's the latter. You get your morals from Religion. Christianity, Jewish, Catholic, Islam, and others. They give you a reason for life, and morals. In our Religion (yours is basically a deluded version of our Religion) God is watching us every second. He knows what we're thinking, how we're feeling. He is omniscient. He knows everything about us. God judges us for Good or Bad.

You act like an angel and you help people out. Because you know Santa will reward you.

This is truly undeserving, as you *act like an angel and you help people out only for the reason that Santa will reward you*. Purely helping people out (and actually, you're just acting) for the sake of presents aren't very good. You help people, and your morals are purely based on the fact and belief that Santa will give you presents if he judges you good. This shows that your ulterior motive is to *GET PRESENTS*. However, we Christians do not act. We legitly help others. We act like angels, because we know God does not judge us on our actions alone, he looks at our hearts. He knows our true motive, and he judges us based on that. Your definition of "good" in this context is almost purely subjective:

Good = Help your mom carry groceries
Bad = Not obeying your mom's orders

I think those definitions are good enough. Note that you can't retract your statements.

Our definition:

Good = Be a "role model" for the none believers of Christ, be a believer, do not sin, etc. etc.
Bad =...self explanatory.

As you can see the difference ^

The 10 commandments are totally screwed up. I commend you on your creativity though. Santa rewards you with materialistic gifts that you crave and silently lust for, God rewards you peace of mind, happiness, joy, immortality, and many others.

If you are talking about God having a mass murder on a global level of genocide, then I warn you, you will lose that one.

Rebuttal Type 4.
I find it strange that most of your arguments are based on the premise that Santa is real. Whatever, I'll rebut them in the context that Santa is real too then.

"I find it strange that with this power he doesn't just feed every starving person in the world but whatever."

You yourself admit that Santa's thinking is flawed. Isn't this strange? Starvation. Hunger. Tragedy. Overpopulation.

"Santa is helpful to everyone and uses his immense power very wisely."

You usually say a sentence like this when you have a limited/finite amount of power. But remember, Santa is "omnipotent". So he does not have to use his immense power very wisely. Santa does not have a great plan. The more I read, the more you blasphemy. I am almost extremely certain that you are trolling.

Rebuttal Type 5.
Purely stupid. Readers, the sh1t is real. Deez nuts.

Rebuttal Type 6.
Erm, it's Bible. There is no such "babble". There is no existence of that book. Only the existence of the Bible.

Babble definition:
talk rapidly and continuously in a foolish, excited, or incomprehensible way.

Rebuttal Type 7.
You are wrong indeed, in your flawed belief of Santa. You did not live a life of morals, you blasphemed. Firstly, we are correct. You are wrong. Nobody wants toys. We don't get coal either. If you honestly believe that all non-believers of Santa get coal, then slap yourself. Nobody wants toys. We want real gifts, gifts that only our omnipotent, omniscient, eternal, and transcendent of time God can give us. He offers us everything. Everything we want. Not mere toys.

Rebuttal Type 8.
It is a widely held, universally known fact that Santa does not exist. This is a *FACT*.

Rebuttal Type 9.
Wait. I just read this. You wot m8?
The outcome of this Debate is concluded.
Dude, trust me, taking drugs/weed is not cool. Destroys your body, and makes you *hallucinate*.
If you are talking legitly, then that is the Satan, corrupting you, which partially explains why you are like that.

He has not done any miracles. Jesus is the true saviour. He is a LIE. I never said that a widely held belief makes something true. God is scientifically and...............proven.

If every single person believed in Santa, then even I, admit that I will believe in Santa. He will be real to me, but he will not be real in reality, nor before God.

Note that you have not posted any rebuttals for some of my statements or rebuttals. This means that you AGREE with me.

If you put these for your Wish List:

-Lexus (Car. You can also put any car, like a Ferrari, or a Rose Royce)
-Bungalow (You could put a mansion too, or a castle)
-Immortality Potion like the one Chang'e had
-Strength Potion that allows me to rival the strength of Gilgamesh/Hercules
-Epic of Gilgamesh, Enuma Elish
-Awesome Potion that gives you Omnipotence (God)
-Potion that gives you the power of Zeus
-Potion that gives you the knowledge of Athena
-Potion that gives you all the good things in the world
-Unlimited, infinite, wishes that will grant you any wish, and last you a perennial amount of time, a lifetime. But in your case, considering you're immortal, make it infinite and unlimited.
-Potion that gives you the power of Time (Kronos)
-Potion that gives you victory (Nike, Odin)
-Sword of Grief (Grams)
-Sword of the woman of the lake (Excalibur)
-Sword of Arthur (Caliburn)
-Spear of Heaven, made out of Uru, aka Gungnir
-Gae Bolg. Spear of Child of Ireland, Belly Spear
-Etc. Anything that you can think of, put it down. Ensure that they are...err...hard to get. Not just any toy.

If you put these sh1t on your Wish List, I can guarantee you that no matter how good you act or how nice you are, you will NEVER, EVER, EVER RECEIVE THESE FOR CHRISTMAS.

All the other fictional things are all fake too. Bunny, Tooth Fairy and all are all lies. Like Santa.

Vote Con. vi_spex, you are not the most ret@rded person after all.

I would have composed a poem, but since I've not enough time, I'm off to bed.

VOTE CON!

P.S. I did not check my argument so there might be some mistakes (grammatical, spelling or vocabulary)
Debate Round No. 2
JR-CreativeGenius

Pro

I will start by rebutting your argument that Santa will not give any of those super cool awesome presents to anyone. I will simply say this is not true. He just won't give them to you because you don't believe in Santa. Santa would most definitely give all those presents to me because I have faith in Santa.

By the way, I did not bring up your religion in any point of the debate. At no point did I mention your religion or god or anything. I have solely spoken of Santa Claus. You must have made those connections on your own.

Now, I will explain to you using extreme scientific methods why Santa exists. I know that this information will be a lot for you to take in but here it goes. Are you ready for the truth. It's about time you learned. The whole world is in on the secret except for you.
Sigh

Adults buy and put the presents under the christmas tree until eventually the child discovers the truth. If the child does not discover on their own then they will eventually be told that Santa "does not exist." In reality he does exist. This obstacle is to test the faith of the children. To PUSH their faith in Santa to the very limits. When you turn 18 years old an adult will inform you of the real truth. The shocking truth. The truth that Santa is real and he was the one actually giving the presents the whole TIME!!!!

The reason that the parents had to pretend that they were giving the presents is because Santa refuses to give teenagers presents because to often they ask for drugs and other illegal things. The only way to make teenagers not request things from Santa was by having the parents pretend that Santa wasn't real so then the teenagers would immediately assume this was true. Then, when teenagers thought that Santa wasn't real, Santa could continue to give presents to younger kids who did not ask for drugs and illegal things. All adults know of Santa's existence and they know that it is their duty to make it an easier transition for their kids when they find out that Santa is a "Lie." To make the transition easier the parents act extra suspicious, as if they were the ones actually giving the presents. There is a secret department in the government that controls all affairs and interactions with Santa Claus. The government knows that teens often use the internet to find information so they posted countless cites that claim that Santa is fake. They made up stories about children finding out about the big Santa "lie" and getting upset. Other such things to truly trick teenagers. With this system Santa Claus does not have to deal with all the drug and alcohol requests made by teenagers.

To further make teenagers believe that Santa did not exist, Santa demanded that his magical elves copy the same machinery that is used in factories to make toys. This way the toys looked like they were manufactured in a factory when really they were made by the elves in Santa's workshop. This big lie has teens thinking they know the truth, but really adults and kids know the actual truth.

Time for the science behind Santa.
In 2004 Santa Claus accepted to be tested in a lab of science for a top secret investigation at area 51. I know because I was an intern at the time. I can not reveal too much information because I can be sent to prison for treason for revealing this information. However i am so desperate to win this information that I will reveal Santa's secrets anyway. Santa's reindeer were tested as well. First they tested Rudolf to see how he could fly. What they did was they placed the reindeer in a wind tunnel and when they cut the air surge Rudulf continued to float. I literally saw this with my own eyes. I was there. When the scientists scanned the perimeter they discovered that Rudolf used P-Waves emitted from his bright red nose to travel at a top speed of 6 billion miles per nanosecond. The P-Waves were so concentrated that it could go hyper sonic to the power of 99. This incredible validity and acceleration would surly rip Rudolf to shreds however that is not the case. We can tell from E=Mc2 that the air resistance Rudolf would feel at that speed would be the equivalent of 800 Tsar Nukes. This much friction from enertia would distort gravity to a point where time moves exactly 1 million times slower than real life. Of course this does not take into account the heat and explosive force generated. Scientists found that when gamma rays where blasted a Rudolf his fur acted as an extreme absorbent and no gamma rays escaped. This was because of his nose that shone at 80 octillion candlepower therefore all incoming disruption of atomic mass would be diluted from the light. The light was concentrated in the nose because of the immense gravity creating a black vortex that acted as an absorbent. The other rain-deer were tested to fly at the same speed however they could not do so without the guidance of Rudolf because if they flew at that speed alone they would ignite to a nebula super nova explosion due to not having a light absorber. This is the real reason Rudolf needs to lead. If he doesn't the rain deer die in a cosmic mega ton blast. Now, Santa was tested to see how it was possible for him to carry so many toys in one bag. When using uranium radiation near the bag the decay process increased dramatically. This lead to an almost full certainty that with using Newtons second law, a worm portal through time and space was the only explanation. When directed elves placed more toys in the drop compartment at the factory. These appeared in Santa's bag when needed. Now, I witnessed the scientists electrocute Santa with a series of shocks to find his ability to endure the rapid speed of particles slamming into him in the thermosphere while he sat on the back of his sled. Santa was unharmed at even the maximum level of 80 million watts. This proved that Santa could phase through electron particles at such speeds to be completely unharmed by toxic space radiation. My team and I figured out that Santa actually visits 100 houses a night meaning that one christmas night took Santa 277 years of gift giving. With time slowed down Santa can enter a house in real time and with Rudolf nearby his gravitational ionic force keep the realtime in actual in a time so slow for the rest of the world that an example would be for every month that passed for Santa would be the equivalent of 2.22 seconds for the world.

The next scientific feat was find out how Santa and the rain deer could focus for 277 years in order to complete one christmas voyage. We tested Santa in a both where he had to decipher the order of pitch sounds of a sound the went of at 157 bps and he had to order the sizes of dots that appeared on a screen at 30 frames per second. Santa easily completely both these tasks at the same time with 100% accuracy. This proves absolute control over nerve functions and this could be verified when we scanned Santa's brain. Lastly we tested the materials the elves in the factory used to never corrode for so many years. We new that Santa's sleigh was made of Neuron Nova hardened Carbon Alloy and they deflected heat to stay in shape. However in the north pole this type of allow would become brittle and crack under the cold as the particles slowed to a crawl. We tested and saw that the elves used diamond machines that were laces through every particles with calcium-flouride a mixture of bone and fluoride. This type of material could last forever in the North Pole. After these tests we escorted Santa from are 51 and now he goes back to his usual job of giving kids presents.

VOTE PRO
ChickenBakuba

Con

Wow.

Your argument is based on literally almost no premise.

You did not bring up my Religion? I laughed out loud when I saw that bullsh1t. Look in the comments:

"You do realize that all my arguments were just recycled arguments for christianty that I changed to accommodate Santa Claus. Just saying."

Stated by JR himself, personally.

There is no such thing as "Babble" or "10 commandments of Santa" or anything else. I presume you made that up yourself. Go do an internet search, if you can find a website as evidence, I admit that there is a new Religion about Santa. Not a Religion made up by yourself. Unless you make up some bullcrap about you walking up a hill and receiving a tablet with the 10 commandments of Santa from Santa himself, and then throwing the tablet onto the ground and causing a massive earthquake, I don't think there's any way to rebut this.

I regret to reply to you that you have almost no backup evidence for most of your claims, except for some.

It is time to accept the cruel reality, and not live in the idyllic reality that you believed in, and continuously deceive yourself. That reality will be shattered, broken by me. It is about time you learn, most 15 year olds already know the actual, sad truth. (Sad to you, that is)

"Santa will not give any of those super cool awesome presents to anyone. I will simply say this is not true. He just won't give them to you because you don't believe in Santa. Santa would most definitely give all those presents to me because I have faith in Santa."

Please, this is not how a 15 year old argues.

In that case, I would like to the the Epic of Gilgamesh (tablet) in your hands, and you gaining immortality and floating to the moon, and you being omnipotent, omniscient, and stronger, better, than Santa. (Who is a lie)

Prove your power right now, by destroying all the 7 wonders of the world. It will be on the news; fear naught, I will definitely be fking watching.

Fyi (For your info), saying that you do not have the items right now/saying I have to wait till Christmas is basically a win for me. If you had read through the Christmas List which I recommended, you would have noticed "Potion that gives you the power of Time (Kronos)"

The future you would have teleported back to the past and destroyed the 7 wonders of the world. I hate it, especially when idiocy and ignorance is the hardest to Debate, as they cannot see your points, and ignore them.

In your first paragraph, you state that Parents are testing their Children, pushing their beliefs of Santa to their very limit. Right off the bat, I believe I have found a fatal flaw that you have made.

"When you turn 18 years old an adult will inform you of the real truth. The shocking truth. The truth that Santa is real and he was the one actually giving the presents the whole TIME!!!!"

Now, readers. How about you go search internet. And find out what *EXACTLY* is wrong with this damned statement. Or, any of you, could ask a 18 year old (and above) person and ask him if his Parents have fking said that Santa was real. The evidence is absolute, concrete. I dare you, JR, ask someone on this Debate Website, who isn't bribed or in cahoots with you, to answer this question truthfully.

Your Second Paragraph is also bullcrap. Let me point out the flaws in your argument:

"The reason that the parents had to pretend that they were giving the presents is because Santa refuses to give teenagers presents because to often they ask for drugs and other illegal things. The only way to make teenagers not request things from Santa was by having the parents pretend that Santa wasn't real so then the teenagers would immediately assume this was true."

Firstly, teenagers do NOT ask for drugs and other illegal things/alcohol. Any educated teenager would know that drug and other illegal things harm the body. Majority of teenagers are educated (in my country), almost all are. Besides, drugs are only for one purpose: Joy. Peace. Happiness. I am sure Santa could grant pills that don't harm the human body, making the teenagers happy.

As for the government part, as my readers should know, total bullcrap. I should have skipped that; I lost a few neurons. And I mean that literally.

Santa does not have to deal with all the drug and alcohol requests made by teenagers? Are you kidding me? He could solve that problem instantly with a flick of his hand; he is omnipotent, as stated in your above argument.

Most of them are bullcrap, but they are also unfalsifiable.

They have absolute no concrete evidence that can be proved.

Your statements have absolutely no evidence at all. This is not the work of a 15 year old.

As for the Science, I'm afraid, Science is nothing, if it cannot be proven, or is too imaginative and stupid to be logical. Science is supposed to be a logical way to explain things to people, to get them to understand. The Science part was good, but your foundation which you built your claims on was bad. Oh wait, you don't actually have a foundation.

Are you retarded...

We need concrete evidence, not something out of a Child's imagination. Btw (By the way), Santa wouldn't need to go to a fking research lap to get researched, especially if he is omnipotent and omniscient. He shouldn't bother to even acknowledge the humans. He is, after all, omnipotent. He could just snap his fingers, and BOOM! Scientists understand everything about him. No need to go through dreary things like that.

Note that the Elves use technology higher than that of the humans (diamond machines). That contradicts your earlier statement about toys having same technology as humans.

Note that Santa has no use for Elves. He could create all toys with a snap of his fingers. Also, he does not need to climb down a chimney, considering that he is omnipotent. He can do anything he wants. Yet he does not solve chaos, death, and others. But *NO* he continues to make toys and give out toys .-. .There is a serious flaw in this. Santa has no use for any servants.

God however, has use for Angels and Humans. He balances everything. He makes the Dark, he creates the Light. He kills, and resurrects. He makes the rich, he creates the poor.

Wow, an intern. Sooooooo believable! Hey, you readers out there, how many of you believe this story?

You have no evidence, concrete or not, to support your claims. Do you not understand?

I can say that:

God gave me a task. God gave me a reason to be in this world, I was born to eradicate idiots like you off the face of the Earth. God himself told me. God told me, I have a reason. He told me, when I was 5, that someone like you would come and talk about Santa. God predicted and foresaw this. Yeah, he did. He is guiding me right now, I can hear his voice.

Note that all those are bullcrap. But this, is how exactly you sound. You have no evidence, and they aren't even half solid concrete.

I have a bad feeling you're smarter than this, and you're just waiting for the final Debate.

*NOTE THAT PRO HAS NOT REBUTTED ALL MY STATEMENTS, AND ARE CURRENTLY IGNORING THEM! THIS IS A SERIOUS MISTAKE FOR HIM! THIS EITHER PROVES THAT I WIN (AND THAT HE HAS NOT ENOUGH EVIDENCE) OR HE AGREES WITH MY STATEMENTS!*

I shall now compile & summarise the Rebuttals that you have ignored:

Rebuttals not rebutted:
-Wikipedia, and almost all links related to Santa states that Santa is false, fake, and a lie. This surely proves something.
-None of the non-believers of Santa has received coal for Christmas ever in their lives.
-God is real, proven scientifically, historically, logically, is a widely held belief, and in my case, a fact. God has almost literally been proven, the part where it is proven Scientifically is based on a *strong foundation*, while yours doesn't even have a foundation.
-Destroy the 7 Wonders of The World, right here, right now. I haven't seen it yet. You can also claim credit for destroying the 7 Wonders of The World.
-Santa does not need Children's wish lists, he is omniscient, and already knows what everybody yearns for or wants.
-Most of your links are unfalsifiable. Get better concrete, hard, evidence. "I have solid evidence behind the existence of Santa". Don't make me laugh.
-He answers "at least 90% of the time". What is with that "at least" and "90%"? Santa is, according to your statements and claims, omnipotent. He can answer 100% of the time.
- If Santa was indeed omniscient and omnipotent, he would not need anybody to catch him on a mere technological device (that is, a camera). Neither will he need a child to catch him putting presents below the Christmas Tree. It is hardly evidence and illogical. Santa would wanting to be on tape is pure crap.
-You yourself admit that Santa's thinking is flawed. Isn't this strange? Starvation. Hunger. Tragedy. Overpopulation. Santa does not solve these problems, instead he gives out presents to kids.
-"Santa is helpful to everyone and uses his immense power very wisely."
You usually say a sentence like this when you have a limited/finite amount of power. But remember, Santa is "omnipotent". So he does not have to use his immense power very wisely. Santa does not have a great plan. The more I read, the more you blasphemy.
-There is no such definition of "Babble". In your context, you state that this "Babble" is a book. Allow me to show you:
Babble:
talk rapidly and continuously in a foolish, excited, or incomprehensible way.
Somehow, it admittedly suits you.
-You admit that you copied some statements from the Bible, and changed them. Gtfo, and Stfu. Saying one thing while Debating and saying another thing in the Comments section widely affects your position.
-You have no evidence, concrete or not, to support your claims. Do you not understand?
-There is a serious flaw in this. Santa has no use for any servants, yet he has elves to make toys when he could materialise them out of thin air.
-Elves have higher technology than Humans, but the toys are still the same.
-More rebuttals but out of spac
Debate Round No. 3
JR-CreativeGenius

Pro

I am shocked. I spent hours writing the most incredible argument... I use all 10,000 characters. Everything. It was perfect. I press the review button and I did not have internet connection. I try to get my work back. It is gone. Everything. I guess you should count yourself lucky. I utterly decimated God in that post. I drew the similarities between God and Santa. Everything. Words cannot explain how furious I am... but maybe not posting it was good. For you. There is no way I am writing it again. I did it too perfectly. I even ended with the line, "It is time to accept the cruel reality, and not live in the idyllic reality that you believed in, and continuously deceive yourself. That reality will be shattered, broken by me." - a quote by yourself. I am so upset that my mind cannot process the fact that I lost it all. I started with the perfect entry. I gave a link to a song to listen to while you read my argument. This was the link.
https://www.youtube.com...

I thought out every word with so much care. I explained that everything you have said about Santa applies to God. Every flaw you pointed out about Santa is a flaw about God. I said so many cool sounding things. About mirrors. So many things.

I'll try to remember my 8 arguments. I'll just tell them in single sentences even though I went into WAY more detail.

1. I think I said that when you told me to ask Santa to destroy the wonders of the world I said why not ask God to destroy the wonders of the world because in the bible he says he will do anything you ask.
2. You said Santa doesn't need children's wish listed because she is omniscient and I said that god doesn't need prayers because she is omniscient.
3. You said Santa should answer 100% of the time not 90% because he is omnipotent and I said God should answer prayers 100% of the time because he is omnipotent but he doesn't so you criticized God.

4. You said that Santa needing to be caught on a mere camera is dumb because he is omniscient and omnipotent so he should be able to prove his existence with something greater such as moving a mountain, and I replied by saying that God should prove his existence better then a mere old book and god should move a mountain to prevent atheists from burning in Hell.
5. Your quote about me admitting that Santa's thinking is flawed because he allows starvation is identical to God because she allows starvation so you are saying that God's thinking is flawed.

6. I think that this one was about the elves and elves have higher technology then humans but the toys are still the same so I said that god supposedly has far superior intelligence but his actions in the bible do not indicate so and I gave a TON of examples but you can probably guess.

7. I forgot. I have no clue what this one was.

8. Your quote was that if Santa is omniscient and omnipotent then why did he need to go to a lab to get tested when he could just give them the knowledge and I said if God is omniscient and omnipotent why does he force people to read a long boring bible to find out about him instead of just giving everyone the knowledge instantly.

Then I concluded by giving a long paragraph about how you would feel if everyone in the world except about 2% of people believed in Santa and you didn't understand why and you had to go to Santa's Workshop of Worship every Sunday to write wish lists to Santa and you had to go to Santa classes. That's about it. I also kept going on and on about how all of your arguments against Santa were arguments against God also.

I seriously considered just forfeiting after losing everything but I can't. I'll stay to the end even if it mean I won't win now.

My main argument to win this though was that since there is the same amount of Evidence for God and Santa which is none, then if Con believes in God then he must also believe in Santa because there is the same amount of evidence to support both. Therefore if he believes in God then he believes in Santa and if he believes in Santa then I win.

I am still really upset that the world will never get to see what i wrote. Just remember that the most important lesson on DDO is to copy everything you write and put it on a word document. This isn;t the first time I lost everything. Also check the internet.
ChickenBakuba

Con

You will not decimate God, you merely will decimate yourself. You are digging your own grave. You have rebutted my Rebuttal with rebuts that I have already rebutted. (I <3 tongue twisters)

"Count yourself lucky..."

I've a feeling this is a lie. Btw (by the way) the work on this Debate.org saves, so even if you don't have internet connection, it will still save your work.

You have used my words wrongly, "I even ended with the line, "It is time to accept the cruel reality, and not live in the idyllic reality that you believed in, and continuously deceive yourself. That reality will be shattered, broken by me." - a quote by yourself."

I have accepted the cruel reality, it is not you that hasn't.

1. God will not do anything you ask. And no one wants to destroy the 7 Wonders of the World, except you. You don't rebut my statement with a question. You've got the Bible all wrong, as usual. He is not under much obligation to reply to our wishes.

2. God indeed doesn't need prayers. Prayers is just something we Christians do, to acknowledge God, to attain his blessing, to communicate to him, and gain wisdom. God did not request Prayers.

3. You are replying my statements with regards to Christianity. God does not need to answer prayers 100% of the time, but he is always listening.

"Surely the arm of the Lord is not too short to save, nor his ear too dull to hear. But your iniquities have separated you from your God. Your sins have hidden his face from you, so that he will not hear."3"

He ignores us, because we are sinful, or we doubt him, or we do not believe in him. Sin has separated us from him. He is pure and hates Sin, which is why sometimes God does not answer our Prayers.

Link:
http://www.everystudent.com...

4. God has already proved his existence. Also, God has no need to prove his existence. He does not need to prevent Atheists from burning in hell. I have already answered this rebuttal. Please, open your eyes.

"God however, has use for Angels and Humans. He balances everything. He makes the Dark, he creates the Light. He kills, and resurrects. He makes the rich, he creates the poor."

God is the ultimate arbiter and adjudicator. He does not need to prevent sinful people from burning in hell and getting thrown into Gehenna.

5. God's thinking is not flawed. God created an idyllic, perfect, flawless world for us. But nooo. We humans had to go and Sin, and allow evil in this world. There are 2 types of Evil:

Natural Evil: Disasters, Catastrophe, Tornado, Earthquakes, etc.

Moral Evil: You can guess.

This destroyed God's creation, and he couldn't do anything about it. Because he took a gamble, and allowed us to have free will. We abused it, and now he cannot do anything to help us. We allowed starvation. God is not to blame. God is not to blame for any Sin, we *are Sinful*.

7. God always has a plan, and a great one. There are many points to prove that, just like Jesus's act of dying on the cross. From the prediction in the Bible that predicted Jesus's coming 2500 years beforehand, it clearly shows that The Plan of Salvation was already planned.

8. God is pure, and he can do anything in this world, except for anything that is contrary to his nature. (Sinning) We are Sinful, we do not deserve his omniscience. God has abandoned us multiple amounts of times in the Bible, and we made him so angry that at times, *"the lord did not even spare his own house in his anger"*. God has literally destroyed every single one of the altars or covenants or temples that Israel once had, (In the Bible) and has allowed its enemies to pillage, slaughter his own people, the people that he had chosen. He has allowed mass genocide, and has killed numerous amounts of people, to the extent that it is possibly beyond the calculations of Mathematics. God has killed more than billions. The Bible also states that God killed all the people on the Earth once (except for Moses).

Sin does not apply to God, as whatever God does, he cannot Sin. The Bible states so. The word and definition of "Sin" does not even apply to an omnipotent being like him. Santa, however, is not omnipotent nor omniscient, (except in the context of your argument, which I rebutted already) and thus, he *CAN* Sin.

9. I would say, indeed, for a fact that I would believe in Santa, in the context that everyone in the world worshipped Santa except for about 2% of the population. However, nobody in the world worships Santa except for you. This is Reality. Btw, I would get thrown into Gehenna, into the River of Fire for worshipping an Idol. I would get punished, severely, for worshipping Santa.

Your main argument is stupid. I shall now destroy your main argument.

There is not sufficient evidence to state the Existence of Santa. Scientifically, Santa does not exist. You stated scientifically about how Santa and his reindeer worked, (and I applaud you for that bullcrap) but the science part was based on the claim that you visited Area 51, which is not believable, and not backed up by any evidence. God is proven scientifically, from a single tiny strand of DNA to the measurement of plants and music, and most of all, nature. Logically and Scientifically, God is real. There is an ultimate Designer of this Universe, it is just which one. And theoretically, logically, God exists. There is no evidence of Santa. Most of your rebuttals are on the premise that you assume that Santa is real, while you do not have any evidence to state that fact. Which is why most of your rebuttals are originally not meant to be rebutted, but as kindhearted as I am, I did rebut.

This Debate has been stupid, especially as my opponent himself is stupid. He thinks that making up all these lies and claims, that are based on no evidence will help him win this Debate. By proof, I mean legitimate proof.

Most of your "evidence" is fake, false, and a lie. (claims)

"The Babble states that...

10 commandments..."

Bullcrap, Santa does not have 10 commandments and a Babble. Get actual evidence. This is one of the rebuttals which I have posted last round. You still have not rebutted it. Just saying, "I lost my work" is not an actual excuse.

I win, tejretics is back. He isn't stupid like you, and will most likely vote for the better Debater.

I believe in God, because he has concrete, scientific evidence, while Santa does not.

*NOTE THAT "****" MEANS PRO HAS NOT REBUTTED, AND "*" MEANS THAT I HAVE REBUTTED THE STATEMENT!*
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Rebuttals:
-Wikipedia, and almost all links related to Santa states that Santa is false, fake, and a lie. This surely proves something. This is what everyone means by Concrete Proof. Almost no links state that Santa is real, and most of them are obviously scams. You can try them for yourself, my dear readers. **** (Not rebutted)

-None of the non-believers of Santa has received coal for Christmas ever in their lives.***** (Not rebutted, I win. You can't retract your statement. You have made a serious blunder."

-God is real, proven scientifically, historically, logically, is a widely held belief, and in my case, a fact. God has almost literally been proven, the part where it is proven Scientifically is based on a *strong foundation*, while yours doesn't even have a foundation.* (I have already rebutted your weak rebut. You can rebut this statement now)

-Destroy the 7 Wonders of The World, right here, right now. I haven't seen it yet. You can also claim credit for destroying the 7 Wonders of The World.* (Rebutted your rebut)

-Santa does not need Children's wish lists, he is omniscient, and already knows what everybody yearns for or wants.* (Rebutted your rebut)

-Most of your links are unfalsifiable. Get better concrete, hard, evidence. "I have solid evidence behind the existence of Santa". Don't make me laugh.**** (Not rebutted)

-He answers "at least 90% of the time". What is with that "at least" and "90%"? Santa is, according to your statements and claims, omnipotent. He can answer 100% of the time.* (Rebutted your rebut)

- If Santa was indeed omniscient and omnipotent, he would not need anybody to catch him on a mere technological device (that is, a camera). Neither will he need a child to catch him putting presents below the Christmas Tree. It is hardly evidence and illogical. Santa would wanting to be on tape is pure crap.* (Rebutted your rebut)

-You yourself admit that Santa's thinking is flawed. Isn't this strange? Starvation. Hunger. Tragedy. Overpopulation. Santa does not solve these problems, instead he gives out presents to kids. (Rebutted your rebut)

-"Santa is helpful to everyone and uses his immense power very wisely."
You usually say a sentence like this when you have a limited/finite amount of power. But remember, Santa is "omnipotent". So he does not have to use his immense power very wisely. Santa does not have a great plan. The more I read, the more you blasphemy.**** (Not rebutted)

-There is no such definition of "Babble". In your context, you state that this "Babble" is a book. Allow me to show you:
Babble:
talk rapidly and continuously in a foolish, excited, or incomprehensible way.
Somehow, it admittedly suits you.**** (Not rebutted)

-You have no evidence, concrete or not, to support your claims. Do you not understand?

-There is a serious flaw in this. Santa has no use for any servants, yet he has elves to make toys when he could materialise them out of thin air.* (Rebutted your rebut)

-Elves have higher technology than Humans, but the toys are still the same.* (Rebutted your rebut)

Dear Readers, note that there are more statements that Pro has not rebutted. Pro, search through my Debate for them. Should you not give an actual rebut, you lose this Debate.

Admit it, I win this Debate. Did you see mah *AWESOME* Poem? Nah, nvm, I'm clearly the better Debater.
Debate Round No. 4
JR-CreativeGenius

Pro

The final round has begun. As thou gazes upon my ultimate and final argument I ask of thee to listen to this epic song. It shall enhance the fury and power my grand argument possesses.
https://www.youtube.com...
~
~
~
Now, playtime has finished.
It is time to utterly annihilate christianity.

Time and time again thou has failed to grasp the meaning of this debate.
I have tricked thee and thou hath plummeted into my trap.
I have created a character identical to God.
The God whom you believe in.
The character I have devised is Santa.
Instead of pointing out God's flaws to thee myself, I have fooled thee into finding God's flaws yourself.
Thou hast criticized Santa's logic.
Thou hast criticized Santa's actions.
Thou has criticized Santa's powers.
In reality, thou hast criticized God himself.
All of your criticism of Santa applies directly to God.
This is because I crafted the character of Santa to be EXACTLY the same as God.
The only difference between my character of Santa, and God is that you do not believe in Santa.
Therefore your first instinct was to demonstrate to me that Santa does not exist.
In doing so thou has only proven that God does not exist.

Congratulations, thou has debated as an atheist, only this time instead of debating for God's non-existence thou has debated for the nonexistence of God only under another name.

Your failed logic in this debate has consisted of this.

First, thou pointed out the illogical flaws of my belief in Santa Claus.
Then, thou gave explanations to defend God when I pointed out that God has the same illogical flaws.
Now, I ask, why do the explanations that thou used to cover God's flaws, not cover Santa's flaws as well?
It is interesting that thou criticized Santa in this way if thou already knew the explanation to these flaws.

Now, I shall summarize the debate to demonstrate that CON has been my puppet, and I... the master.
First, I lured CON to enter the debate about a mythical character that CON knew would be easy to obliterate.
Next, I gave Santa all the powers that are possessed by God and I made Santa act the same way God did. I knew that CON would criticize these powers and actions because they are ridiculous. CON bombard Santa (God) with criticism.
Then, I used the same criticism that CON used to destroy Santa and I used it against God. Suddenly, CON had a defense for each and every one of these criticisms.

Sorry, to inform thee but it does not work like that. Either you revoke all criticism for both Santa and God or you keep it and prove that both are imaginary.

Also, here are errors made by CON throughout this debate.
~

~
1. https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com...

CON makes exceptions to explain why it is acceptable for God to do something that CON has already stated is not acceptable for Santa to do.
Example: "God indeed doesn't need prayers. Prayers is just something we Christians do, to acknowledge God, to attain his blessing, to communicate to him, and gain wisdom. God did not request Prayers." I could say the same about Santa's wish lists, yet, before CON defended God, CON criticized the need for Santa's wish lists. This is a clear example of the bias CON has for believing in God and how desperately he attempts to hold onto his belief.

2. https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com...

CON has mentioned that God is a common widespread belief, when in reality that is irrelevant.

3. https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com...

I suspect that CON does not understand my arguments. My evidence for this claim is the fact that CON continues to point out the illogical nature of my now irrelevant arguments that I made in the first few rounds. CON does not understand that these arguments were not real, and instead they were to mimic the way a christian would debate.

~

~

~

Time for rebuttals

1. You say that "God will not do anything you ask." Then why pray?
Just saying though, what about this, "And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son."

2. Sending wish lists is just something we do to acknowledge Santa. Why did you criticize Santa if you knew the answer beforehand?

3. "God does not need to answer prayers 100% of the time" Hmmm. Interesting. But you criticized Santa for not answering 100% percent of the time. You said that Santa should be able to because he is omnipotent. Isn't God Omnipotent also? According to your logic God should also answer 100% of the time. Why are you contradicting yourself?

4. You say God has already proved his existence. How? Through an old book? Any logical person wouldn't deem that to be enough evidence. Just because the generations before us claim that this book is true is not enough evidence. Do you think it is right for someone to suffer torture for all eternity just because they could get themselves to believe in something that has no evidence other than a highly questionable book. Even people who are no where near the intelligence of the great God who is so loving and good, are smart enough to realize that torture is wrong. People know that it is not right to torture someone that steals. Someone that sells illegal drugs. Even someone that kills another person. People are smart enough to know that torture is not right. And that is just a little bit of torture. Nothing compared to an entire eternity of torture. Would you say that not believing in God is anywhere near as bad as killing someone? Yet, God tortures non-believers for eternity. What kind of irrational monstrous God do you believe in?

5. You are quite the hypocrite. You say that Santa's thinking is flawed when he doesn't care about starving people, but God, his thinking isn't flawed at all. Just because a few people are "sinful" means that God has the right to put innocent people through the horrible agony of starvation? Here is a thought. Maybe people wouldn't be "sinful" if God gave them a good life.

(CON SKIPPED IN HIS NUMBERING)

7. CON originally criticized Santa's elves by saying that the elves have higher technology then humans but the toys are still the same. I responded by saying that God supposedly has superior intelligence yet his actions indicate the same intelligence as humans. (actually much lower intelligence.) CON's ridiculous rebuttal was "God always has a plan." CON mentions that the Bible predicted Jesus's coming 2,500 years beforehand. How is this supposed to demonstrate God's incredibly advance and FAR superior knowledge, logic, and reasoning? If God were a person living today he would be ridiculed for being racist, sexist, and for having extreme anger issues. The reason that God acts this way is because he was made up by man thousands of years ago. At the time morals were next to nothing, and because of this, it was acceptable for God to act the way he does in the Bible. There are so many examples that show God's lack of intelligence. God is so dumb that he made two humans and told them not to eat from one tree. When he is not watching they eat from the tree. What did he expect? These people are literally new to Earth. They know nothing about manners. They have never been taught. How could God expect them to know how to follow rules. Then God is so dumb that he punishes every human that will ever live for all eternity just because of this one event. To further prove God's lack of intelligence, God kills people without regret just because they were "sinning." Is it a coincidence that at the time killing people for no reason was completely acceptable? If God were actually smart like he is described to be, then he would teach people to not sin. And if for some reason that didn't work, he can threaten them without actually violently killing them. I'm pretty sure that a threat from God, the most powerful being in the universe, should be enough to change someone.

8. So, you criticize Santa for having to go to a lab to be experimented on when he could've used his omniscience but then you say that it is fine for God to not give out his information using omniscience because God can do anything he wants. How can you criticize Santa for something and then say it is fine of God to do the same thing. Talk about double standards. Also, you are fine with following a God that is allowed to kill everyone if he wants. Interesting. I'd rather believe in nothing then in a psychopath that can not manage his anger and is so unpredictable that he could turn on you at any second.

You say that God is proven scientifically. How do you know that the science that proves God actually proves Santa's existence instead? Maybe Santa made the DNA.

You say God is logically proven. How? Logically Santa makes more sense.

Tell me, what evidence "proves" God that doesn't also prove Santa.

This debate is over. Santa does not exist. God does not exist. I can say that Santa does not exist because I do not believe in God. If I were to believe in God then I can not say that Santa does not exist because the same amount of evidence supports both. You however must believe in Santa because you believe in God. If you believe in God then you must also believe in Santa because both are supported by the SAME EXACT evidence.

Mathematically If..
A = the supporting evidence that proves
B = the probability of God's existence
C = the probability of Santa's existence

A=B and A=C then B=C

This means that I will win the debate because you believe in Santa. If you believe in Santa then I win.

CON believes in Santa Claus so...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~VOTE PRO~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Just remember CON...
"It is time to accept the cruel reality, and not live in the idyllic reality that you believed in, and continuously deceive yourself. That reality will be shattered, broken by me."
ChickenBakuba

Con

Awesome. Thee has provided I with a good challenge. I acknowledge thou as a proper opponent, for the first time. Methinks that thee is still retarded, sadly. Your trap is indeed wonderful, I acknowledge thee as a creative and wonderful opponent.

As thou gazes upon my glorious, divine argument, I ask of thee, "Who is the ultimate puppeteer? The one that makes the puppet think he's the puppeteer?"

O great and divine Santa, gtfo.

You have complete fallen into my trap. I had been waiting for you to post this argument, the final argument, stated this way.

Now, as you said, playtime is finished.

It is time to annihilate you and win this argument.

Time and time again, thou hath failed to grasp thy meaning of this Debate
Thou hath decimated thyself, and thou is digging his own grave.
Thou hath indeed created a character identical to God, the God that I believe in.
In thy context of thou's argument, Santa is only similar to God. I hath pointed out Santa's flaws in that context, simply assuming Santa is omnipotent and omniscient, and hath 10 commandments, and hath a book called Babble.
I hath criticised Santa's logic.
I hath criticised Santa's power, although he has none.
I hath criticised Santa himself.
In Reality, I hath not criticised God himself. I hath only perhaps criticised him in thou's context.
Thy character of Santa is not exactly the same as God, as he is crafted by claims, of which hath no evidence.
I indeed believe naught in Santa, as I hath stated, Santa has insufficient evidence.
Santa is not the same as God, only same in thou's context which has no evidence, and is totally made out of claims.

I hath only debated as an Atheist under thou's context. Thou hath created an unrealistic context, which is completely based on claims and a lack of evidence. That is exactly what I hath tried to point out. All my other arguments criticising Santa, is based on the foundation that thou's context does not hath enough evidence. Thee hath assumed that just because he crafted Santa as God, I hath insulted God. No, I hath naught insulted God, as your context hath not enough evidence. I hath rebutted this in my last round, and hath included that thee's context hath not enough evidence. Thee's logic is flawed, he hath created Santa out of claims. Only therein the flawed thinking of thee, is Santa real. I hath stated this continuously throughout my argument, it is my main argument, one of my foundations.

I could easily claim that thou is a camel.

But thee is not a camel.

I however, keep insisting that thee is a camel, without proper evidence to back my statement up.

This is how thou sounds.

There is naught the same amount of Evidence for God and Santa. I hath provided extreme rebuttals for this, yet thou do not grasp my rebuttals completely. Thou hath not rebutted my rebuttals for how Santa lacks evidence. Santa's sole evidence is about the Babble, imaginary 10 commandments. However, Santa does not hath these. Thou argument about how I Santa is the same as God is flawed, especially as Santa has not enough evidence. (Claims do naught count as evidence) Thou couldn't even rebut my rebuttals about God having more evidence than Santa. No, thou hath keep insisting that Santa has sufficient amount of evidence, the same as God. Thy flaws that cover God's flaws, does not cover Santa's, as Santa does not have enough evidence. God hath real evidence indeed, in the real world, while Santa's hath only claims as evidence, claims made by thou.

Now, I shall summarise the Debate, to show that I am the ultimate puppeteer, and Pro my puppet.

First, I predicted this outcome, and Con thought that he had "lured" me into this Debate. All my fear, about how I was scared about Con's final argument, is all faked.
Secondly, Con's thinking is flawed. He literally gave Santa these powers, that are similar to God. However, we are debating about Reality here, not some Child's flawed thinking. You can't give Santa these powers. He needs to have proper evidence of these powers.
Thirdly, the same criticism that I used cannot be used against God, especially as Santa needs to have proper evidence of these powers in the first place. The powers cannot be simply made up by you. If that was the case, there would be no such thing as Religion.

Sorry to inform you about this, but in a Debate, EVIDENCE is the fundamental requirement to winning a Debate. Your argument had NO evidence. And I mean almost literally none.

Here are the errors you made.

~Get shrekt~

Rebuttal Type 1

I provided scientific evidence as to why God is real, yet you do not. Santa does not have scientific evidence, only evidence made out of claims which needs more evidence. I have been emphasizing this throughout my Debate. This is ironic, as this Link should be used against Con instead.

The bias is false. This Rebuttal against me is clearly based on the assumption that Santa can be given powers (by you) similar to God.


Rebuttal Type 2

Pro has yet made another blunder. If popularity cannot be used as a piece of evidence, then surely imagination cannot be used too.

Rebuttal Type 2

I find this ironic, as you have pointed out the flaw in your argument.

"CON does not understand that these arguments were not real, and instead they were to mimic the way a christian would debate."

I am the puppeteer, you are the puppet. I know everything about you. I already knew from the start that these arguments were not real.

Time for Rebuttals

1. God sometimes ignore us, as we are sinful. God will not abide with our Sin.

2. Wish lists are for parents to know what their kids want, so they can rush down to the toy shop when their kids are sleeping.

3. I have already rebutted this. God should not need to answer 100% of time. God cannot stand Sin, and we are Sinful. Only the purest of the purest can speak to God, and even then they are not complete pure.

4. God has proved himself more than an old book. God is an arbiter, our definition of Sin does not apply to him, and never will. I have already stated this. God has proved himself more by just a Bible. Are you blind? Read my arguments.

5. We destroyed our good life, abusing our Free Will. God gave us good life. I have already stated this. Read my arguments.

6. I have fking rebutted this in my last argument. God provided oppotunities for Sin, so that Adam and Eve would be tempted. Adam and Eve were spoiled, they only knew perfectness, because of the idyllic world God gave them. God took a gamble, and put that tree smack in the middle of the Garden. The thing is, you need to experience bad health to know what good health is. I have already said that God is the balancer, he balances everything. Which is why he is fair. He creates the good, he creates the bad. He kills, he revives. A threat from God will contradict his nature, as God gave us Free Will. Threatening will be compromising it, and God does not do anything contradictory to his nature.

7. Lmfao, your argument is flawed. You are arguing as an Atheist. I could say that the other way round. BoP is on you, btw. So you've to prove it. I rebutted this in the comments.

8. You are stupid. Arguing that Santa and God is imaginary is against your position. You are not arguing as an arbiter or as an Atheist, your position is arguing as a believer of Santa. This contradicts his position. I urge Voters to look carefully.

I am the ultimate manipulator. You have been fooled, tricked into believing you are the master.

Summary:

Pro's rebuttals can be rebutted by his rebuttals.

Pro has yet to rebut some of my rebuttals. He has provided weak rebuttals for all of them.

His argument, the final one contradicts his position.

He has not read through my arguments carefully, and he has provided weak rebuttals that have already been rebutted by me.

All his rebuttals are based on the assumption that you can create a Character and give him powers. No, the Character needs to have the power by himself, and he requires proof too.

Evidence is everything in Debating. Pro obviously does not know this. He has again and again provided rebuttals that are already rebutted.

Link
https://scholar.google.com.sg...


Summary:

Pro loses. His argument is not based on any premise, and he has yet to rebut some of my rebuttals. I have rebutted all of his weak rebuts so far.

His argument contradicts his position.

I am the ultimate manipulator.

All Vote Con!
Debate Round No. 5
173 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by JR-CreativeGenius 1 year ago
JR-CreativeGenius
I hope they accept your challenge
Posted by Discipulus_Didicit 1 year ago
Discipulus_Didicit
I wouldn't be surprised if they still don't get it, after all I basically just restated what you and vi_spex were saying over and over. Still, I think I can get the point across if they accept my debate challenge. I sense a potential teachable moment if they do.
Posted by JR-CreativeGenius 1 year ago
JR-CreativeGenius
Thank you disciples for understanding and explaining to CON what this debate was actually about.
Posted by vi_spex 1 year ago
vi_spex
spot on discipulus
Posted by vi_spex 1 year ago
vi_spex
aliens are not omnicient and omnipotent..

and facts are in the past, you have no honest story to tell about god
Posted by Discipulus_Didicit 1 year ago
Discipulus_Didicit
Do you accept?
Posted by Discipulus_Didicit 1 year ago
Discipulus_Didicit
"The world is stupid, get used to the fact discipulus"

Oh trust me my friend, in my line of work that is one thing I do understand and will get used to more than you can ever imagine.

"And I'm not a grown man, so don't condemn me"

Grown man, grown woman, whatever. Your profile says you're 19 so you're a grown something...

"Discipulus, did you honestly fking think i took it seriously?"

Yes.

Anyway, ever notice how your arguments in favor of god were pretty much a mirror copy of his arguments for santa? That was the whole point. That was the intent behind this debate since before you even hit accept.

He said santa could be proven scientifically then never even tried to do so.
Then you said god could be proven scientifically and never even tried to do so.

He said santa gives you morals by always watching and giving small rewards like toys.
You said god gives morals by always watching and giving better rewards like living forever.

The list goes on. How did he know your arguments would be based off of morals, rewards, misunderstanding of science, etc.? because they always are. Every time god is argued for theists give the same types of arguments, it was pretty easy for him to predict what your arguments would be because they never change. All he did was use the word santa.

He changed one word. The rest was the exact same.

I actually have an idea you may like. I will challenge you to a debate, you choose how many rounds. In each round you provide one proof of god and describe how this proof shows god is real without showing how my definition of santa is real (Not JRs definition, I feel he overdid it a bit). All I ask is that you message me beforehand a short sentence summarizing each of your arguments so that I can adjust my definition of santa accordingly (if he is made up as you claim, it shouldn't matter what definition I use right?) No need to give away your arguments, just a short sentence summarizing the bottom line of each one.
Posted by ChickenBakuba 1 year ago
ChickenBakuba
God is a fact because I proved him, while Santa isn't real because he isn't proven, and because he isn't omnipotent and omniscient in the mythology
Posted by vi_spex 1 year ago
vi_spex
you dont have to imagine god?
Posted by ChickenBakuba 1 year ago
ChickenBakuba
God is not an imaginary idea. I thought I had stated that more than enough times
No votes have been placed for this debate.