The Instigator
WyattEarp19
Con (against)
Winning
14 Points
The Contender
KozWanderer
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points

Should Flag Desecration be Prohibited? Pro(It should) Con(It shouldnt)

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
WyattEarp19
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 10/31/2013 Category: Politics
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 707 times Debate No: 39781
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (6)
Votes (2)

 

WyattEarp19

Con

1st Round is for acceptance, however an opening argument is allowed in the 1st round if the challenger forfeits the last round as agreed. Must require citation link if quoting or citing from a site.
KozWanderer

Pro

I would be against this. Even if it was prohibited, people wont care. But whatever. Just for some challange
Debate Round No. 1
WyattEarp19

Con

Thank you for accepting the challenge.
" Those who would burn the flag destroy the symbol of freedom, but amending the Constitution would destroy part of freedom itself. "

"Vietnam veteran Richard Savage

Assertion One-By adding an amendment or making a law that prohibits free speech is a violation of the First Amendment. No form of speech or expression should be prohibited if non threatening or non violent. Flag Desecration has been in Supreme Court numerous times all trying to prohibit and ban it all of which failed. Flag Desecration is non violent and not threatening according to Supreme Court and a majority of The Senate.

Assertion Two-"Supreme Court Strikes Down All Laws Banning Flag Desecration (1989)" After this no laws are allowed to prohibit the form of speech but it was not over. In between the years 1990, 1995, 1997, 1999-2000, 2001, 2003, 2005 and 2006 an amendment was proposed to ban Flag "Desecration". Even these failed and did not pass. Also there seems to be something "vague" about the laws.

Assertion Three- "What exactly does "desecration" mean? Is it just flag burning " or does it also include smearing the flag with dirt? How about dropping it on the ground? And why should law enforcement get to decide who to arrest for such desecration? What if I wear my flag like a cape as many Olympians or soccer hooligans are known to do? What if I fly it upside-down in protest? Will these acts count as desecration? And what counts as a flag? Does my boss's ridiculous flag-inspired tie he pulls out every July 4th and Memorial Day require protection? Will Americans be threatened with jail time for having questionably patriotic fashion choices?"-(Burn the Flag or Burn the Constitution?)
What I mean by "vague" is that there is hardly a clear view on what "desecration" is. Take the "Spence vs Washington Case" for example. Something as simple as putting a sticker on the flag was considered desecration. Even having a patch of the American flag on your jeans was considered desecration. How can we be sure if dropping the flag is desecration?

Flag Desecration is not a crime according to some of the public, Congress, and The Supreme Court whom judge and interpret our laws.Is a piece of clothe worth infringing our founding nations document?

Citation- https://www.aclu.org...
http://civilliberty.about.com...
KozWanderer

Pro

First, the title does not specify any country. But im assuming your talking about the American flag.

"Flag dececration is non violent"

Yeah, people getting bashed because they commited a flag dececration is non violent.

"What if i wear my flag like a cape as many olympians or soccer hooligans are known to do?"

Simple, your playing for a country.

Ok im not quoting anymore.

The thing you did was shove laws onto me which is already known.
And so your basically saying that flag dececration can be caused easily.

Ok, it depends on what your doing, are you shouting that the flag sucs, are you insaulting to america, all while destoying the flag. Dont come to me and say that putting a patch on my jeans from the American flag will get me finned. Whose that st#pid to call the police just to say that i had an American flag piece as a patch. All this is refering to some of your statements.

So if someone is burning the flag of my country then i will be angry sh*t and tell him to f&ck himself.

If we prophibited flag deceration the people of the country will be pleased and who the hel cares about the court, they dont do sh*t but say c&ap into peoples mind.

Summary

Con states crap load of laws and says how easy flag dececration can be.

Pro states that the court should shut %p, OUR FLAG IS OUR SIGN OF VICTORY AND LIBERATION OVER THE HUNDREDS OF YEAS AND THAT WE WILL BEAT THE CRAP OUT OF ANYONE WHO WANTS TO INSAULT THE STARS AND STRIPES OF OUR FREEDOM AND COUNTRY!!
Debate Round No. 2
WyattEarp19

Con

Sorry for not specifaclly stating that Americas Flag was the main topic.

Rebuttal-

Contention One-
In my previous argument I stated in (Assertion Three) That laws prohibiting flag desecration are "vauge". I then went on about having a patch on jeans of the flag and being "fined" You then stated-
"Dont come to me and say that putting a patch on my jeans from the American flag will get me finned. Whose that st#pid to call the police just to say that i had an American flag piece as a patch. All this is refering to some of your statements."

Actually this did cause a stir-
"1972
: Smith v. Goguen (415 U.S. 94) — The Supreme Court held that Massachusetts could not prosecute a person for wearing a small cloth replica of the flag on the seat of his pants based on a State law making it a crime to publicly treat the flag of the United States with "contempt." The Massachusetts statute was held to be unconstitutionally "void for vagueness."

Someone as a matter of fact was almost charged for having a patch of the American Flag on his pants. Dissproving your argument.

Contention Two-You stated that

"If we prophibited flag deceration the people of the country will be pleased and who the hel cares about the court, they dont do sh*t but say c&ap into peoples mind."

Well you contradict yourself because you stated that

"Dont come to me and say that putting a patch on my jeans from the American flag will get me finned."

Well if Supreme Court was so invalid why did they agree with your statment?

Contention Three-You seem to use profanity and obscene language to support your "argument" Such as-

"st#pid", " f&ck himself.", " sh*t but say c&ap" "shut %p", " WE WILL BEAT THE CRAP"

Not exactly a nice set of vocabulary right? Also even though I would sometimes have typo you seem to have faore than I do but it would take a while to go over it so Ill spare you the lecture.

Contention Four-Your argument is mostly invalid-

  1. You have no citation or evidence.
  2. You contradict yourself.
  3. You state-"YEAS AND THAT WE WILL BEAT THE CRAP OUT OF ANYONE WHO WANTS TO INSAULT THE STARS AND STRIPES OF OUR FREEDOM AND COUNTRY!!"-Who is "we" and where is your evidence to or statistics that show that a mojority of people agree with you?
  4. You dont make any points but instead "argue" that Im wrong. Yet you havent provided any evidenceprove that Im wrong and your "right"

Conclusion-Pro uses foul languange and no factual evidence to prove his side and point. Pros's argument is invalid with no real conclusion. Please take this in to consideration respectfully voters.

To be honest Im dissapointed that Pro didnt even bother to research or put effort in to his argument.








KozWanderer

Pro

LoL. i lost

"Not exactly a nice set of vocabulary right? Also even though I would sometimes have typo you seem to have faore than I do but it would take a while to go over it so Ill spare you the lecture."

"Not exactly a nice set of vocabulary right"
You dont say.

(time to say useless crap thAT might work)

Destorying the flag is a waste of time, anyways.
The flag is usually made of polyester and are mass produced in factories, manufacturers or whatever. "polyester fibers are formed from a chemical reaction between an acid and alcohol" http://www.madehow.com...
  • Wasting recources
  • Wasting acid
  • Wasting alcohol
  • Wasting useful material
  • Wasting time in making a flag
  • Wasting money
  • Wasting oxygen (http://www.dailymail.co.uk...) FAIL!
  • Wasting time
"Wasting recources and material" http://www.madehow.com...; (You get the idea right?)

"Wasting oxygen" http://www.dailymail.co.uk...;(Fail)

Most of the stuff up there shouldnt need evidence to prove right. Because of EDUCATION

RECOURCES
http://www.madehow.com...;

" "st#pid", " f&ck himself.", " sh*t but say c&ap" "shut %p", " WE WILL BEAT THE CRAP" "
You make me look like an assho&e. Should record that if in audio and make a remix.

""WE WILL BEAT THE CRAP""
lol.

Ok thanks. YA TORN i think. not checking...........ad'egaer;l





Debate Round No. 3
6 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Posted by KozWanderer 3 years ago
KozWanderer
We will beat the crap!
Posted by WyattEarp19 3 years ago
WyattEarp19
Thank you for your vote.
Posted by bladerunner060 3 years ago
bladerunner060
Welp. This was an odd one.

Conduct to Con for Pro's cursing and general behavior.

S&G to Con because, while Con was certainly far from flawless, Pro's errors were far more plentiful, and in some instances made his case downright hard to read.

Sources to Con because while the number was relatively equal, Pro's sources were directly relevant to his case, and were reliable.

As to arguments: Pro appeared to concede with his "LoL i Lost". Beyond that, Con presented reasons to think that flag desecration laws were ill-founded and subject to abuse--Pro had no reasonable responses to that other than an attempt at simple negation.
Posted by KozWanderer 3 years ago
KozWanderer
What if i vote my self?
Posted by WyattEarp19 3 years ago
WyattEarp19
I don't understand how that makes my argument less reliable if I provide factual evidence of laws and attempts to make an amendment to prohibit Flag Desecration in the U.S.
Posted by KozWanderer 3 years ago
KozWanderer
too much bloody laws to read
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by TetsuRiken 3 years ago
TetsuRiken
WyattEarp19KozWandererTied
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Total points awarded:70 
Reasons for voting decision: Same reasons as the last voter.
Vote Placed by bladerunner060 3 years ago
bladerunner060
WyattEarp19KozWandererTied
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Total points awarded:70 
Reasons for voting decision: RFD in comments.