The Instigator
Ultronite5000
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
alphafailed
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

Should "Link" from the "Legend of Zelda" series have a female option in future games?

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/8/2015 Category: Games
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 897 times Debate No: 68043
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (2)
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Ultronite5000

Pro

In the Classic video game series, "The Legend of Zelda", in a sentence, is a game where a young boy must embark on a quest to save the land and usually to save the princess frm her captive. Today, I'd like to question the "boy" part of the summary. It is my beleif that the "Legend of Zelda" series (LoZ for short) should have a female option for future games.

The series, which started roughly 29 years ago, had a simple story; Link must save Hyrule and the princess Zelda from the evil of Ganon. 29 years later, with many installments later, the general formula is generally the same; Link must save Zelda from an evil force. Since it has always been Link, a male, who saves Zelda, they are often paired together, and in some games, the evidence is clearly there. Because of the constant pairing, the dynamic between them would surely change if the protagonist was a female instead. And I find that this is one part on why some fans oppose the idea of a girl Link. But here is a counter argument; a change in the dynamic can be a good thing, Just because someone saves someone else from peril, it doesnt mean that there is any romantic relation between them at all. A female link could easily have a desire to rescue the Princess, and would add an interesting part of story deveolpment.

Prosecution, I now give you the chance to argue this point AND/OR create a different point.
alphafailed

Con

Before I begin my rebuttal, I'd like to clarify that I am in no way against women in positions of power or otherwise. All people are equal in gender, race, and all other differences between each other. However, I will be arguing that the character of Link should stay the way he's been portrayed in every installment of the LoZ franchise up to this very day.

Firstly, the pro-debater would have us believe that Princess Zelda is always the damsel in distress, being kidnapped by the evil green guy that terrorizes the fields of Hyrule. Unfortunately, I think this fact is confused with the LoZ franchise's developmental sibling, Super Mario Brothers. Compared to the prim and pink princess peach, Zelda can hold her own much more efficiently. An example of this is evident in the game "Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time" where Zelda turns into Sheik, her ninja-like counterpart, to avoid Ganondorf's forces of darkness. I'd like to draw attention to the manga series for this game. In that series, it is revealed that Sheik actually poses as one of Ganondorf's minions, and is favored among them. This is for good reason as she is a skilled combatant who ca take out hordes of minions at a time. (This is partially evident in chapter 6. I took the liberty of adding this to the "court record" via hyperlink http://mangafox.me... ). Before you dispute that Sheik is portrayed as a boy as believed since 1998, Nintendo's Bill Trinen has gone on record saying "The definitive answer is that Sheik is a woman " simply Zelda in a different outfit." Furthermore, Zelda (in and out of her sheik form" has been able defeat many a foe in installments throughout the franchise, such as the recently released "Hyrule Warriors".

To revoke Mr. Nite's statements about the "romantic dynamic", Link does not always have a romantic interest. Really, the only games I can think of off the top of my head that have Link directly pitted towards a specific lady-lover are Skyward Sword (The First Zelda) and Twilight Princess (Ilia) (in ocarina of Time, there are many women that have a thing for Link, leaving open possibilities for all you shippers out there.) The base dynamic for every Zelda game always comes down to defeating Ganon and saving Hyrule.

I think adding a female Link option would only put strain of Nintendo's executives. Every installment of Super Smash Bros forward would have to have to have the female option as playable, lest angry female players stage a revolt. I believe a better alternative would be to make a game where Zelda is the main protagonist.

That's all I'll dispute for now, but this is just the hilt of my Excalibur of points to be made.
Debate Round No. 1
Ultronite5000

Pro

Alpha, are you giving this argument to me? You claim that it would put a strain on Nintendo's executives, namely due to further installments of the smash series would have to include female link skins if a feamle link was canonically created in the Legend of Zelda series. However, if you look at the most recent installent of the smash bros. series, you'll notice that several of the characters have alternate skins that are of the opposite gender of the default; the Wii Fit Trainer, The Villager, Bowser Jr. (one of his alternate skins is Wendy) and Robin all have different gender skins.(here is some proof for those who do not own smash bros for Wii U/3DS: http://www.gamnesia.com...)
alphafailed

Con

You misunderstand my argument, Sir Nite. I don't think adding a female Link skin to Smash would be impossible (in fact, one of my original arguments I'd written down was that there are too many gender swaps in games already), but it would be an unnecessary addition that many gamers would criticize Nintendo for missing, given the chance. It would be that much more work that Masahiro Sakurai would not need added to his plethora of factors to add to an upcoming Smash game.

But back to the topic at hand, another point I'd like to make is that there is almost an over-abundance of important female characters in the game that, if added to, might just "tip the scales" of equal gender roles in the LoZ universe. Let's face it, the female roles really are more important than the male ones, Link being the exception (For instance, there were three goddesses that created Hyrule. In Ocarina of Time, five out of the seven sages that protect Hyrule from Ganondorf are female. Impa serves as captain of Zelda's guard. Etc.).

Traditionally, in the Zelda lore, the world is always saved by a HERO wearing green. The word "hero" stands out here because of it's gender-specificness. They could have used a word like "savior" or "warrior", but they used a word specific to men (the female term for hero is heroine, in case anyone has forgotten). Thus I conclude that in Zelda lore, the hero cannot genetically be born female, lest tamper with the prophecy read in each game from the 80s to now, and Nintendo probably doesn't have any plans to add this option in the near future, based on this theory.

Again, if anything, I think Zelda should be offered up as a playable character in a future LoZ installment to avoid over-inflation of either gender side.
Debate Round No. 2
Ultronite5000

Pro

Yes, I admit that many sages and other important characters are available in the games. However, there is a difference between an important supporting character and a protagonist. Now, I will say that the likely reason for the inclusion of a large amount of female supports is because Link himself is male, and they wish to balance he roles in the games. In a game where a Link would be female, I feel there would be a high possibility o more supporting male cast alongside of the female supporting characters.

Also, you say that "hero" is gender specific. However, in the 21st century, "hero" has become both masculine and gender neutral, much like the word "actor", which now can mean either male or female player of the stage. Because of this, the ambiguity of the word "hero" can either detonate a male OR female legendary figure. it is grammatically correct to say that, for example, that Oprah Winfery is a hero. If you remember my original question to the letter, I specially said "as an option". Because of this, the word 'hero" can still be used if any other game references the events of the game with either gendered Link. Another thing; reincarnation doesn't have to discriminate. Though the specifics in reincarnation has been different depending on what it is portraying, the general theory is that someone's soul is put in a new body in a different time. In the legend Zelda, it fannonically (fan cannon) accepted that in many games of the series, the 2 people main people reincarnated forms the of the bearers of the triforce (courage=Link, Wisdom=Zelda, and all the times we see Ganondorf, it is the same guy, different part of the timeline). Reincarnation appears in many form of media, and one example in particular involves gender swapping. The beloved Avatar involves the reincarnation of the avatar, many of them have been women, many of them have been men. So for sure in North America, at least, the concept of gender changing in reincarnation is not unheard of. Reincarnation, in theory, should not discriminate against gender. In all versions of Link, it's a hero who rise from forest/ small town life to become a Great legend among people whom Link saves. As Link adventures, the spirit of courage within grows, boosting the courage Link has had all along. In all games, Link is generally a kind, helpful, and courageous Hylian whose greatest desire is to save the world from peril. The spirit of the hero of courage has always just happened to be male in the "Zelda" games we've played before, but that does not mean that a girl would not be suitable to host the spirit of Link. A women can just as well exhibit these courageous- traits that her predecessors have shown before.

Finally, a female reincarnation of the bearer of courage would be a refreshing concept for an aging series. As I write this, the legend of Zelda series is reaching their 29th anniversary in February. This game is old, and for many iterations The general formula is the same. If we want the general to stay fresh, we need to make new things to re-innovate the game play and/or story. One such innovation was the transition to 3D. Another idea was motion controls. in each game there is always a new mechanic, or a new twist in the story, some stay, some go, but all make some impact on the player. As ideas start to run low on series that been around for nearly 3 decades, a Link who could be a woman could very well be an innovation we need. The idea is new, but also radical, which I understand would surprise and maybe a little too radical for some, but just because something in the series hadn't happened before, like girl Link, does not mean it can't happen. Since we have all been playing as guy Link, we have grown accustomed to seeing the hero's face as male, and seeing that face scares some people. nether less, We shouldn't be scared of a change since really, did it matter in the grand scheme of things? Yes, it was originally a boy saving the princess, and there is a little affection revealed after, but since the games in the 1990's, Link's gender didn't' matter as much, as many cases he would of saved the land anyways. We have always admired the spirit of courage in Link, and just because the spirit of Link could be in a female form does not lessen the spirit that we have always admired, just changed the face of the spirit ( and you, sir Alpha, should know all about same spirit, different face)

And that is all I have to give, my challenger. I gave you my all. I hope you do as well. And with this I ask the jury to judge fairly. The defense now rests.

alphafailed

Con

The third paragraph of the last argument. You say adding a female Link would be "innovation", yet it's a concept as old as the NES itself! From the words of a wise, slightly delirious man, "Are you a boy, or a girl?". Saying it would be the kind of innovation the franchise needs would be like saying we could paint CoD guns different colors and market it as a new game.

I'd like to place one last thought into the reader's head for a moment. I'll be frank, there isn't a lot of need for a female option in the Legend of Zelda series, and I don't believe the majority of the fandom cares. We've played the LoZ games for 29 years now, and if there is gonna be a change, it should be in something more relevant. Character customization is such a common thing, I'd be surprised if the Xbox and Sony fans don't jump on it as "Nintendo grasping at straws" and "running out of ideas". It's not that it's not possible, or probable, but that it's unnecessary. A small detail that really doesn't NEED to be tweaked. We certainly aren't afraid of change (it's certainly a brave new world, the 21st century is THE century of change!), but do we need change JUST for the sake of change?

Now before anybody says "Dude, what if the girls wanna play as girls?". There ARE games where we don't have male counterparts to the female we play as (i.e. Metroid, Lara Croft, Super Princess Peach, etc.) so gender-equality certainly isn't the issue here. Sometimes it's fun to play as a woman, but the choice doesn't have to be implemented into every game.

Overall, I think Nintendo has bigger fish to fry than gender-changes, such as new, innovative weapons and the like to boost the Legend of Zelda series into a new era!

But hey, that's just a debate....
A GAME DEBATE!
Thanks for reading!
Debate Round No. 3
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by PowerPikachu21 1 year ago
PowerPikachu21
I'm for Con.
Posted by PowerPikachu21 1 year ago
PowerPikachu21
hmmmm..... You know what I think? Some people like sexy ladies, I think Ultronie5000 might be one of those people. However, that aside. I don't think it's nessicary for Link to be female. Link has always been a male, and so did his ancestors. From the first game, to Link to the Past, Ocerina of Time, and Skyward Sword, even Hyrule Warriors! If Link should be female, why not Mario?
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