The Instigator
debater12332
Pro (for)
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The Contender
KRTxBallistic
Con (against)
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Should Medical Marijuana be Legal?

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/29/2016 Category: Politics
Updated: 5 months ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 408 times Debate No: 92023
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (6)
Votes (0)

 

debater12332

Pro

I think that Medical Marijuana should be legalized to help people with illnesses. Please be respectful both when posting a comment or an argument. Good luck to my opponent. Thank you.
KRTxBallistic

Con

Medical Marijuana should not be legalized. Marijuana is a harmful drug, and should not be used as medicine.

1 - Marijuana is a harmful drug: Marijuana is a dangerous drug. Studies show that smoking 3 joints a day, can cause the same amount of damage as 20 cigarettes [1]. Marijuana smoke contains 50%-70% more carcinogenic hydrocarbons than tobacco [2]. Another study published in the European Respiratory Journal found that 1 joint of Marijuana increased a users risk of lung cancer by 8%, versus 1 pack of Cigarettes [4]. Tobacco has proved to be a plague to society, and an economic nightmare. The cost of Tobacco is $170 billion a year [3]. Far more than generated in tax revenue. It does not make sense to use something that is as dangerous (and possibly worse) as cigarettes, for medical purposes.

30 Independent studies also show that Marijuana can lead to schizophrenia [5].

Marijuana has also been shown to cause depression, anxiety, and suicidal thoughts [8], and that's not all. There are even more short and long term consequences from using Marijuana [9].


2 - There is most likely better options:
One condition Marijuana is said to treat, is Glaucoma. While it does relieve eye pressure, it's not a good way to treat Glaucoma. Henry D. Jampel writes "Although marijuana does lower the eye pressure, it also lowers blood pressure. Lower blood pressure could result in reduced blood supply to the optic nerve, which in turn might harm the optic nerve. Therefore it is possible that even though marijuana does lower the eye pressure, its use could conceivably make the vision loss from glaucoma worse!" [6]. One treatment that is recommended, are eye drops [7]. If someone were to use Marijuana to treat their Glaucoma, they would be unable to drive, operate machinery, etc, thus, they would be unable to work and be productive, when they could have just used eye drops, or other recommended treatments.


Conclusion: Marijuana is a dangerous drug, not medicine. The few benefits Marijuana has, when used as medicine, are outweighed by the risks and consequences of the using the drug, especially since there are already superior alternatives available.



Sources:

[1] http://news.bbc.co.uk...
[2] http://www.state.ia.us...
[3] http://www.prevent.org...
[4] http://erj.ersjournals.com...
[5]
http://www.schizophrenia.com...
Debate Round No. 1
debater12332

Pro

Marijuana is safe, effective, and has way less side affects than most drugs.
http://watchdog.org...
You said 'Marijuana is a dangerous drug' but source you wrote down is a link to a website referring to Recreational Marijuana not Medical Marijuana.
'Smoking pure cannabis is more harmful to lungs than tobacco, a health charity is warning.'
http://news.bbc.co.uk...
The same problems occurs with most of your other studies and links. They are referring to recreation marijuana. There are different ways to take marijuana and some ways are much more dangerous than others. It is the act of smoking it for a high that makes it dangerous.

Marijuana is not all the same. You do not get high on Medical Marijuana unless you try to. The chemical Tetrahydrocannabinol is the cause of marijuana making you high and not all marijuana has it. You can take marijuana with Cannabidiol, which does not make you high.
http://cannagramma.com...
http://www.menshealth.com...
http://beyondchronic.com...
And yes marijuana has been found to improve health. Numerous studies show that it does have beneficial properties. Such as slowing and killing cancer cells...
http://www.huffingtonpost.com...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
as well as treating other illnesses both physical and psychological such as Schizophrenia, PTSD, Insomnia, Epilepsy, Multiple Sclerosis and many more.
http://healthland.time.com...
http://unitedpatientsgroup.com...
http://www.medicalmarijuanablog.com...

So in conclusion marijuana is safe, effective, and should be used in the place of pharmaceutical drugs whenever it can be(and don't worry you won't be walking around on a high if your taking medical marijuana). Thank you.
KRTxBallistic

Con

Recreational versus Medical -

Pro argues that my arguments/sources only refer to recreational Marijuana use, not medical, so the harmful effects should be ignored. I would disagree. Smoked Marijuana is one of the most popular ways "Medical" Marijuana is administrated. And I said, with sources earlier, three joints of Marijuana a year is equivalent to smoking 20 cigarettes, a drug that has proved to be detrimental to peoples health.

If there is medicine that developed using Marijuana ingredients, such as Marinol, that is fine. There are ingredients that have the potential to help people. But Marinol is not Marijuana, and since this is debate is about Medical Marijuana, this should be ignored.

Many approved drugs already exist that can help treat these illnesses. There are safer, more effective alternatives that mimic Marijuana.

THC also weakens the immune system [7].

Cancer: There have been studies that have shown to slow down cancer growth, but most of the studies that say that, also show that it promotes other cancer growth, or even creating cancer cells. It does not cure cancer. Marijuana has up to 70% more cancer causing hydrocarbons [1]. As I've shown in the previous round, users who smoke 1 joint of Marijuana had an increased risk of lung cancer by 8%, while 1 pack of cigarettes increased it by 7%. Because medical marijuana is commonly administrated by smoking it, this is relevant information in legalizing medical Marijuana.


Schizophrenia, PTSD, Insomnia, Epilepsy and Multiple Sclerosis:

Schizophrenia - Marijuana has been shown to cause epilepsy by 30 separate studies.

PTSD - Marijuana has been shown to increase suicidal thoughts and depression [2]. Using it to treat PTSD does not seem like a good idea.

Insomnia - There are many alternative, more effective drugs on the market that can help insomnia.

Epilepsy - While many share anecdotal stories of Marijuana helping their epilepsy, there is are some that speak out against it that have epileptic seizures. The author of an article titled "Epilepsy and Pot -- One Epileptic' s Perspective" writes "I cannot use marijuana; it makes my seizures much worse. I can’t even breathe in the second hand smoke or vapor from someone using it because even that will cause me to have a seizure" [3]. Marijuana does not help everyone with epilepsy, because every has epilepsy for different reasons, and everyone responds differently to different drugs. Further evidence marijuana can worsen epilepsy comes from Dr. Brooks-Kayla. She writes "... in 20 percent of the cases that a team from Children's Hospital in Colorado reviewed, seizures worsened with the use of cannabis oil."[5]

Multiple Sclerosis - Marijuana is not recommended to treat MS. A statement by the National Multiple Sclerosis Society reads "Smoked cannabis research studies have not produced enough evidence to assess its safety or effectiveness for treating MS symptoms including spasticity, pain, balance, posture and cognition changes." [4]. Staivex, treatment for MS spasticity, which contains equal parts to THC and CBD, already is approved.


Medical Marijuana increases recreational use: Medical Marijuana's prescription method has been a disaster. It is very easy for someone to get a Marijuana prescription, without actually having any serious illness. As a result, Marijuana use goes up. From 2006-2013, states that legalized medical Marijuana, use among children had gone up over 600% [6].






Sources

[1] http://www.state.ia.us...
[2] http://www.webmd.com...
[3] http://www.poppot.org...
[4] http://www.nationalmssociety.org...
[5] http://www.11alive.com...
[6] http://cpj.sagepub.com...
[7] http://www.livescience.com...
Debate Round No. 2
debater12332

Pro

Sorry about the short response. I've been really busy.

More studies actually show that marijuana can actually treat asthma, PTSD, appetite loss, and insomnia.
http://www.nabp.net...
http://www.naturalnews.com...

Even the FDA is starting to look into the possible treatments that marijuana can offer.
https://www.drugabuse.gov...

Sates in which Marijuana is legal have seen a declining rate of crime.
http://www.msnbc.com...

And even while there are still many warnings about the affects of marijuana, they are targeted at recreational use. Medical marijuana is different, and that is what our debate is all about.
http://www.webmd.com...

-Thank you.
KRTxBallistic

Con

Before I begin, I'd like to point out that Pro uses Naturalnews as a source. Naturalnews is not a reliable source [1] [2]. This is the only source I have a major issue with. Because it's very unreliable and known to spread misinformation, I believe it's reasonable to completely disregard it.


Recreational versus Medical:

Pro ignores my argument that Medical Marijuana is usually administered by smoking the drug, and never addresses that already existing Medicine that uses Marijuana ingredients, such as Marinol, are not considered Medical Marijuana, and that there is almost always a more superior alternative. Because of this, the harmful effects of Marijuana can be raised when discussing Medical Marijuana. Also considering that in States with medical Marijuana is legal, use has gone up, with over a 600% increase in young children using the drug [4], we can reasonably say that abuse would go up, and more would suffer from it's harmful consequences, that would have been fine had it not been legal.


"Insomnia"

Pro states Marijuana can help treat insomnia. A condition called cannabinoid hypermesis syndrome, caused by Marijuana, can cause nausea, vomiting and stomach pain [3]. This can keep people from being able to sleep. As I stated before, there are multiple consequences of using Marijuana, including digestion, YouTube user C0nc0rdance has done multiple videos on the effects of Marijuana, including Marijuana edibles, from a scientific point of view (Here is a play list of all of his Cannabis videos https://www.youtube.com...)


"PTSD"

Marijuana can cause depression, psychosis [5], suicidal thoughts and other mental health problems. Considering this, it does not seem like a good way to treat PTSD.


"appetite loss"

As I've shown above, Marijuana can cause cannabinoid hypermesis syndrome, which would not help appetite loss, but would do the opposite.


FDA looking into research

His source states that the FDA is looking to doing research on Marijuana extracts, which are usually not considered medical marijuana, and as I already stated, the FDA has approved drugs that use Marijuana extracts.


Marijuana legalization decreases crime

Pro states that legalization has decreased crime in states in which it is legal. I find it hypocritical that Pro scolds me for using arguments that he believes only applies to recreational use, but uses the legalization of recreational Marijuana as an argument. In his next paragraph, he states "And even while there are still many warnings about the affects of marijuana, they are targeted at recreational use. Medical marijuana is different" right after he uses recreational Marijuana legalization as an argument.

However, I will still address it anyways. Many crimes are committed by people high on Marijuana. In fact, in the first year of legalization, crime increased 8.6%. The following year, it increased another 2.5% [6]. 55% of the states population is in the Denver Metro Area, while the rest of the state has low population density, which some of these areas opted out of Marijuana legalization. In the Denver Metro area, crime has gone up, and homicide has increased about 70% [7]. Amsterdam has also seen crime higher in areas close to Coffee shops.



Conclusion: In states that have legalized medical marijuana, there has been an increase in use. Considering all the harmful effects of the drug, an increase in use, will always lead to an increase in abuse. Legalization of recreational Marijuana has also caused an increase in crime. Also considering there are superior options to Medical Marijuana, the risks outweigh the benefits.




Sources

[1] https://www.exposingtruth.com...
[2] http://rationalwiki.org...
[3] http://www.dailymail.co.uk...
[4] cpj.sagepub.com/content/early/2015/06/03/0009922815589912.abstract
[5] http://drthurstone.com...
[6] http://www.poppot.org...
[7] http://www.poppot.org...



Debate Round No. 3
debater12332

Pro

First off we are not debating about sources, but due to Con's request I will not use naturalnews for this final round. And yes, it is true that one of my points was based off of every form of marijuana, but that was to prove the point that crime goes down with marijuana considering that most states with medical marijuana also allow recreational use. I was making a point, but because of my other activities I did not have time to explain.

Most of these stats saying that marijuana legalizations causes increased amount of smoking and crime are referring to stated where all types of smoking is legal. And as for the crimes committed by people high on marijuana, are they using it for medical or recreational reasons? This debate is about responsible people using marijuana for medical reasons not kids messing around with drugs. Most of your sources are reporting numbers involving recreational marijuana users.

Marijuana has been used as medicine for a long time, and is not something that was just made up. Just like every other medical drug marijuana can be miss used, but that doesn't mean it should be outlawed. Throughout this debate I have been arguing about how safe medical marijuana is when I should be arguing that is safer, more effective, and more natural than the medical drugs we are currently using. Tens of thousands of Americans die from legal medical drugs every year, proof that anything can be used the wrong way. This debate isn't about whether medical marijuana is perfectly safe, because all drugs have side affects. It's about whether it should be legal or not.
http://www.cannabiscure.info...
http://naturalsociety.com...
http://www.scientificamerican.com...
http://www.alternet.org...
http://www.collective-evolution.com...
http://www.foxnews.com...

In conclusion: Yes, medical marijuana use can be dangerous just like any other medical drug, but if used the right way it can help save many people. Thank you.
KRTxBallistic

Con

Rebuttals:


"And yes, it is true that one of my points was based off of every form of marijuana, but that was to prove the point that crime goes down with marijuana considering that most states with medical marijuana also allow recreational use."

As my source said, crime increased 8.6% the first year it was legalized, and increased another 2.5% the next year [1]. Pro has not refuted these statistics.

"Most of your sources are reporting numbers involving recreational marijuana users."

Pro ignores my argument that smoked Marijuana is still a popular way to administer Medical Marijuana, thus, all the harmful effects of Marijuana also apply to medical Marijuana. He also ignores that already existing medicine that uses isolated Marijuana ingredients have been approved, but are not considered medical Marijuana. My argument that even digesting Marijuana; taken as a pill, is still harmful.

My source that shows use among children goes up over 600% in states that have legalized medical Marijuana [2] has also been ignored.

My only sources that talked about recreational Marijuana, were the ones I used against Pros claim that Marijuana legalization decreases crime.

"Marijuana has been used as medicine for a long time, and is not something that was just made up."

Lots of things have been used as medicine for a long time. Many of these have proved to be harmful, or flat out don't work as medicine. This argument is pointless.

"Just like every other medical drug marijuana can be miss used, but that doesn't mean it should be outlawed."

No, but since Marijuana is already a harmful drug, even with minimal use. As I've stated in round 1, 3 joints of Marijuana is the same as smoking 20 cigarettes [3]. Right off the bat, Marijuana is already more harmful than cigarettes. Something that's this dangerous, with little use should not be legalized, even for medical purposes, especially when I've shown that there are better, more efficient alternatives, other than Marijuana to treat illnesses.

"Throughout this debate I have been arguing about how safe medical marijuana is when I should be arguing that is safer, more effective, and more natural than the medical drugs we are currently using."

Here, Pro uses the Appeal To Nature Fallacy [4].

The following quotes come from Pros own source:

"Yet it may not be as effective as other recently developed drugs, so marijuana is not considered a first-line treatment for these symptoms."

"High-quality human studies are lacking, however, leaving many open questions."

"Yet a number of pharmaceutical drugs have been shown to be more effective and longer lasting than medical marijuana."

"In one randomized controlled trial, patients given a cannabis like compound were twice as likely to gain weight as patients given a placebo—a boon for people battling the wasting effects of this disease. The treatment's long-term effectiveness remains untested."

"Studies have suggested that marijuana is only slightly better than a placebo in reducing acute inflammation, and it may even increase the perception of pain in some patients."

[5]

It seems Marijuana is not very effective, or lack testing. We should not legalize a drug, when it lacks proper testing for medical purposes.

Furthermore, many of Pros sources are again highly unreliable, but I won't make as big a deal over it, as I did with his NaturalNews source.



Conclusion:
Marijuana is an inefficient dug to use as medicine. In some cases, it lacks proper testing. Pro has ignored some of my arguments, and was disproved by his own source. Marijuana is too dangerous, and the risks of the drug outweigh the few benefits for medical purposes. Medical Marijuana is inefficient and should not be legal.





Sources

[1] http://www.poppot.org...
[2] http://cpj.sagepub.com...
[3] http://news.bbc.co.uk...
[4] https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com...
[5] http://www.scientificamerican.com...

Debate Round No. 4
6 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Posted by KRTxBallistic 6 months ago
KRTxBallistic
That's alright.
Posted by debater12332 6 months ago
debater12332
Sorry I didn't get back to you I was gone. The first round doesn't have to be acceptance, whatever you did was fine.
Posted by KRTxBallistic 6 months ago
KRTxBallistic
Some of my sources accidentally got deleted. I am going to post them here

[6] http://www.glaucoma.org...
[7] http://www.glaucoma.org...
[8] http://www.webmd.com...
[9] http://www.dea.gov...
Posted by KRTxBallistic 6 months ago
KRTxBallistic
Before I accept, is there a specific round structure (1st round acceptance, etc), or do we just get right into it?
Posted by debater12332 6 months ago
debater12332
Ok, I'm looking forward to it.
Posted by KRTxBallistic 6 months ago
KRTxBallistic
I'll be home in a few hours, if no one accepts the debate by the time I get back, I will accept.
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