The Instigator
NextGenerationElephant
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
Ragnar_Rahl
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

Should Ron Paul's "Audit the Fed" be passed?

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 7/25/2012 Category: Politics
Updated: 5 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,557 times Debate No: 24853
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (6)
Votes (0)

 

NextGenerationElephant

Pro

I know that this bill has a lot of support in Washington, but what about outside the capitol? Does anybody feel strongly against this bill?
Ragnar_Rahl

Con

The Federal Reserve ought not exist, fiat money is evil as well as stupid-- I suspect we agree on this point. However, so long as it exists, it is an institution filled with unelected experts, and a concentration of government power, which simplifies matters to voters as they can see who is responsible for what is happening them today. Changing the Federal Reserve from a politically independent institution to a bureaucracy that does nothing more than enact the whim of Congress ignores the fundamental thing that makes such interventions as fiat money stupid in the first place-- The economy is an incredibly complex thing, and no majority of voters (or Congressmen) can have any idea what the hell they are doing on any particular issue unless they do very little. This problem becomes worse the more people you have who are responsible for knowing things-- political ignorance is a failure of division of labor. A few independent technocrats will make bad decisions about how to manage something as nebulous as "the money supply," true-- but Congress will make even worse ones, and "Audit the Fed," being a measure designed to threaten the Fed's independence, renders more of the decision into the unspecialized hands of Congress.
Debate Round No. 1
NextGenerationElephant

Pro

You are correct we both agree that the Federal Reserve must be terminated. My thought is that this is the beginning of the end for the Fed. I say this because in the past, only partial audits were completed. Ron Paul is proposing a complete top to bottom audit and exposing all the secrets that the Fed has been keeping. I think you are saying that the Congress will control the Fed if this bill makes it all the way through, but in fact all this bill does is force the Fed to tell the Congress what they have been doing. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the Federal Reserve independent of the government? As in, yes it was created by the Congress, but the Congress does not dictate its policies. Please correct me if I am wrong, but this is what I think is what's going on.
http://www.auditthefed.com...
Ragnar_Rahl

Con

" My thought is that this is the beginning of the end for the Fed."
It may well be-- and the beginning of the restoration to Congress of all the Fed's powers. The Fed's powers sticking around without the Fed is worse than having the Fed, only eliminating both at once is beneficial.

" I think you are saying that the Congress will control the Fed if this bill makes it all the way through, but in fact all this bill does is force the Fed to tell the Congress what they have been doing"
You can't simultaneously argue that the bill is a slippery slope and the bill is not a slippery slope. Those are contradictory positions. Either this bill is the beginning of the end for the Fed, or it does nothing but disclose.

Besides, Congress does not institutionally know what questions to ask, and it will doubtless craft them in ways that either do nothing or create political pressure for bad policies (such as-- print more money, the traditional result of political pressure on the Fed.) Ron Paul may know some good questions to ask, but there are hundreds of other Congresscritters.

:Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the Federal Reserve independent of the government?
It is independent in policy, its heads are appointed. So long as the powers bound up in the Federal Reserve exist, this is one of the best arrangements we could hope for-- it results in specialized experts running things. Anyone running powers like that will run them badly, but specialized experts will run them less badly than your average legislator.
Debate Round No. 2
NextGenerationElephant

Pro

NextGenerationElephant forfeited this round.
Ragnar_Rahl

Con

Kentucky fried.
Debate Round No. 3
6 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Posted by 16kadams 5 years ago
16kadams
It was passed in the house
Posted by NextGenerationElephant 5 years ago
NextGenerationElephant
@Numidious, I agree I think the Fed should be completely shut down. But this bill is a good start, it's proposes a complete audit, from top to bottom. I hope that eventually Congress attempts to end the Fed.
@Ron-Paul I guess not, the Fed needs to be audited badly and on Capitol Hill it is meeting little resistance.
Posted by Ron-Paul 5 years ago
Ron-Paul
Man. Can't anybody make a con audit the fed open challenge?
Posted by Numidious 5 years ago
Numidious
The Fed should not only be audited, it should be abandoned. The only interferences with government in the economy should be directly to raise the standard of living of it's citizens i.e. universal healthcare, public schools, welfare etc.
Posted by NextGenerationElephant 5 years ago
NextGenerationElephant
Indeed. It seems like this bill has a lot of support so far. Hopefully it stays this way.
Posted by fakedebate 5 years ago
fakedebate
I would accept this but I agree with you. Should be interesting to see what the opposition has to say
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