The Instigator
Markov
Con (against)
Winning
7 Points
The Contender
SourLemons
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points

Should the American Colonies Have Revolted Against British Control?

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
Markov
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/16/2014 Category: Politics
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,783 times Debate No: 49193
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (2)
Votes (2)

 

Markov

Con

For the first round we will both state our beliefs about the topic. In the second and third rounds we will rebut the other's points, and in the final round we will make concluding statements. Please cite reliable sources and refrain from arguments based on patriotism alone.
SourLemons

Pro

Based on how the world is today, I support the colonials revolting against the British and becoming the nation it is today. Of course this topic is going to be very difficult to address because when we are talking about alternative history we have to take into consideration any possibilities that could occur from an alternative perspective so I cannot say whether WW1 or WW2 would have occurred in the alternative universe where the colonials still remained under British control but what I do know is that I prefer the colonials revolting against a monarchy, establishing a democratic system, and staying as a powerful nation that is capable of protecting weaker countries from being integrated by belligerent nations.
There are many people both inside and outside America that are going to complain about its history, policies, etc. but you have to realize that if America never existed, the world would be so different from today. I won't state what would happen in an alternative universe but I will list some historical occurrences that occurred due to America. The victory of World War 1 and the the formation of the UN. I know there are many better examples of historical events that occurred due to America but I picked WW1 and the formation of the UN because I deemed it a vital topic of discussion for shaping the world as we know today.
The reason why I picked WW1 and the formation of the UN as a topic for discussion is because I believe that if America never existed, 1) most of the world would be under European influence and 2) the world would never have an international organization that is as dedicated to global prosperity as the UN. At the height of the European imperialism, 1914, the countries of United Kingdom, France, Spain, Portugal, and Netherlands controlled more than half of the entire world together. The British Empire had 1/4 of the world alone with France following not that far behind land accumulation. It wasn't until after WW2 when the European nations became too weak to oppose and suppress the independent movements of colonial nations that we have the nations that we have today. So in summary, if we didn't have WW2, we wouldn't have the 196 countries we have today. We also wouldn't have WW 2 if we didn't have America being the last push for victory in WW1 because the main reason we had the rise of Nazism and the devastating effects of WW2 was because of the harsh demands for reparation from the Germans in the Treaty of Versailles, which only came to be because America existed to support the allies and came in in 1917 for the push that helped the Allies win the "Great War." If America never existed, the victory could have gone to the Germans, making the German Empire an official superpower which could have curbed the British naval supremacy in replacement for a German one which would change the world as we know today. For my 2nd argument about the formation of the UN. The UN is one of the most historical creation in the history of humanity. Never in history has there ever been an organization that housed representatives from nations all over the world to settle their differences in a courtroom. The creation of the UN is actually very remarkable because nations have never become more engrossed for humanitarian cause since the creation of the UN. Without the UN, nations wouldn't have humanitarian aids for natural disasters such as famine or hurricanes. It wouldn't have sub-organizations like UNICEF, INTERPOL, the World Bank, etc. that are dedicated to different expertise for the prosperity of not just for one nation but the nations on this earth. America has contributed a lot in the progress of humanity that has both its ups and downs based on perspectives but it all started with the colonial rebellion against a tyrannical king. And I am glad they did it.
Debate Round No. 1
Markov

Con

I believe that the American Colonies shouldn't have revolted against the control of the British. I will argue using two primary points the first being that the revolution was unjust and the second being that United States has made the world a worse place than it would have been had the British retained control of the colonies.

The unjust establishment of the states-
At most only 20% of the American Colonists were supportive of the revolution, and those who were in favor of the rebellion were incredibly radical. The number of people who attempted to rebel is shocking in its smallness especially for a country that regards majority rule so highly.

America's worsening of the world-
America's creation led to the deaths of many innocent people namely the Native Americans killed by years of violence, the Japanese citizens who died in Hiroshima and the huge number innocent middle-easterners who have been killed in Iraq and Afghanistan. Throughout history, 114 million Native Americans have been killed by American troops. That fact alone is a huge stain on our nation's history, but when you think of how a plethora of societies and cultures were decimated by the hostile takeover of Native American lands you realize that it commuted the worst genocide in history. To end WWII on the Japanese front, America dropped nuclear bombs on the cities Hiroshima and Nagasaki. 130 thousand were killed instantly, and 103 thousand have died from radiation caused by the bombings. In recent history 132 thousand civilians have been killed in Iraq and Afghanistan by U.S. soldiers. If, so many innocent people have been killed by America was it's establishment really worth it?

Please keep in mind that this is not my real opinion, and I'm just doing this for the sake of argument

Sources
historum.com
boundless.com
bbc.co.uk
world-nuclear.org
wired.com
SourLemons

Pro

I rebut my opponent's argument that the colonial's call for revolution was unjustified by stating that the British Empire did provoke such movements by imposing "taxation without representation." Benjamin Franklin once said, "Nothing in this world is certain except death and taxes." So if a brilliant man like Benjamin Franklin admits that a country's existence is dependent on the accumulation of capital from taxes, we can presume that its not the imposition of taxes that moved the colonials to cry for revolution but the action of passing unwarranted taxes on the colonials without a representative to represent the people of the American colonies. Some examples of the burdensome taxes that were legislated in Great Britain but paid for in the colonies are the: Sugar Act, Currency Act, Quatering Act, Stamp Act, Townshend Act, Tea Act, and when the colonials thought there couldn't be more taxes, the Intolerable/Coercive Act. The list of taxes imposed by the British would deprive the colonials of their wealth all for the ever expanding British Empire in their expansion for more land. There is also another note that I would point out in this time period. The colonial's neighbors to the north, Canada, was recently added on to the British Empire. The majority of the residents of Canada were French speaking inhabitants so the British Empire didn't want to cause instability in the region and thus passed none/minimal amount of taxes to the newly conquered peoples. If you think about it, the colonials fought side by side with the British regiments in Canada and after the war, the colonials were taxed heavily for the war while the conquered people in the regions of Canada weren't.

Yes America has a dark history in its progress to becoming the world's strongest nation. The stepping stone to America's rise consists of plethora corpses of not only Native Americans, but their own people, the Spanish, Germans, Japanese, Koreans, Chinese, Vietnamese, Russians, Afghanistani, Iraqi, so on and on. Its a history that the world should not and must not forget. However, I don't believe that these killings/massacres wouldn't have happened even if the colonies remained a part of the British Empire. Humans are born with greed. This greed results in the lust for power which entails wars and the destruction of one group of people for the benefits given to another. I don't believe that the British Empire wouldn't have expanded and killed the millions of Native Americans in North America for its pursuit of more power. The British Empire was already killing millions of people around the world in Europe, Africa, Asia, and Oceania. What differences would it make whether the colonials remained a part of or independent of the British Empire? Humans are accustomed to do evil. We cannot escape it no matter how much we try to cover it up by doing good deeds. It will always remain a part of us.
Debate Round No. 2
Markov

Con

The belief that the taxes imposed on the Americans unfairly is flawed. Many of the oppressive (but not really that bad) taxes actually were used to pay for the Seven Years War which ended in 1763 and left Britain with massive debts. My opponent may say that the taxes were still unfair, but the British actually spent huge amounts of money defending the colonies from the French. Without the aid that the British gave to the colonies in the war's American theatre, the colonies would have been decimated by the French, and their Native American Ally's. My opponent has argued that the Canadians should have been taxed for the war, but should a people be taxed for having been conquered when it was the Ally's of the conquering party who received the financial aid throughout the war.

I cannot speculate about history, but I can say that the massacre of the Native Americans would have never happened if America hadn't been formed. The British had made several pacts with Native American tribes that gave the 13 colonies to the British so long as they wouldn't expand their empire into the rest of the Native American's territory.
SourLemons

Pro

SourLemons forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
Markov

Con

To conclude, the American colonists should have never revolted against British control. The revolution was only fought with 20% support from the American colonists and without majority rule the revolution was unjust. The creation of America also led to a huge number of deaths that prevent the creation of America from being validated.
SourLemons

Pro

SourLemons forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by SourLemons 3 years ago
SourLemons
I forgot to post my sources for my 2nd argument.

Here are the sources that I didn't use (except for wiki) but posted for the sake of posting.
http://www.taxhistory.org...
http://www.brainyquote.com...
http://www.history.com...
http://en.wikipedia.org...
Posted by Jifpop09 3 years ago
Jifpop09
I don't think the action was justful, but I believe the result was good.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by Seeginomikata 3 years ago
Seeginomikata
MarkovSourLemonsTied
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Total points awarded:40 
Reasons for voting decision: Arguments and forfeit. One of the big turn-offs in the pro argument was the nonsense about WW1 and WW2. If the U.S. never existed, it wouldn't have given the support needed for victory in the last years of either war true, it would have started from day 1, like Canada, a British dominion which was the part of America that did not win independence. There are many other points I could address, but that was the biggest flaw in logic I saw.
Vote Placed by zmikecuber 3 years ago
zmikecuber
MarkovSourLemonsTied
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Total points awarded:30 
Reasons for voting decision: FF