The Instigator
Havoo07
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
Espera
Con (against)
Winning
20 Points

Should the U.S. be more capitalistic?

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 4 votes the winner is...
Espera
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/4/2015 Category: Politics
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 328 times Debate No: 74723
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (3)
Votes (4)

 

Havoo07

Pro

It should, as government regulates business just too much. Imagine not having to pay special taxes when operating your own business. To me, our government controls too much of American businesses.
Espera

Con

There is a reason Ayn Rand and her philosophy is frequently held up to mockery... Well, okay there are lots and lots and lots of reasons why her work is mocked, but a major point is her naive view of capitalism. Despite what the most go-hung of individuals will say capitalism is not given to self-regulation or social consideration. Like an animal population that has gotten out of control left unattended capitalism will cheerfully eat it's self out of house and home before auto-cannibalizing it's self.

Case in point - the most recent economic downturn which nearly became the 2nd coming of the Great Depression. The reason it occurred is because of the eight years of concentrated dismantling of federal overview and economic regulation. Without someone outside the business of speculation acting to prevent the creation and selling of junk bonds speculators and banks went whole hog. And as might be expected inevitably the bubble popped and suddenly everyone was in trouble.

Honestly, capitalism is a fine system - however it is a system run by humans and humans are selfish, self-centered, short-sighted idiots 9 times out of 10. If allowed to companies would gladly hire children for dangerous tasks and force workers to work for unreasonable hours - because they did in the past. If allowed businesses would gladly lock workers into unsafe buildings and happily advise workers to practice unsafe methods - because they did in the past. And it wasn't until something deeply unfortunate happened - like groups of people coming down with radium induced cancer or 200+ people dying in a fire - that regulations were entered into practice.

And even with that people are still being screwed over - or have you forgotten Enron? A company that lied to it's employees, stole their retirement from them, and mostly saw it's crooked management get away scott-free. Or what about the issue of the US government having to bail out so many businesses that have continued to practice unsustainable business models while refusing to do right by their workforces? Even beyond that taxes are used to support the country's functions - everything from enforcement of laws to protection of the nation's most vulnerable. I don't see how someone could argue with the need for taxes.

The more so as the taxes paid by businesses is proportionally lower then the tax rate of workers in the lower socioeconomic stratum. My first job was in light industrial and my first paycheck was $81.50 after taxes (before taxes it was $133.78) and that's with loosing both federal and state taxes from my money. And that doesn't include the costs a job might put on a worker for insurance, dental, and whatever else. If anything businesses should be taking on more taxes and financial responsibility then they currently are. It's not like it'd destroy them seeing as other nations (most of them Scandinavian) have done so and are functioning just fine. Which comes back to the issue of self-interest versus sustainable practice... and also perhaps basic decency.

I mean Thomas Jefferson and Franklin D. Roosevelt (both excellent politicians... for the most part) had their criticisms of capitalism. Jefferson said quote: " "I hope we shall crush ... in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country". So over 200 years ago Jefferson was worried about the effect of lobbies and SuperPACs in terms of real democracy and personal rights.

FDR on the other hand worried about giving rise to a sort of pseudo-fascism based on the power of one's wallet. "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic state itself. That, in its essence, is fascism " ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power." And it's true - majority concerns are being buried under the wants of those with millions to throw at the problem.

So no - the probability of owning more possible wealth is not worth the actual reality of little or no regulations on a system that historically has proven it cannot self-regulate. If anything the U.S. needs to more socialist in it's behavior as well as more bound by logic rather than populist nonsense, lynch mob hysteria, and ruthless greed.

Thanks for your time.

Sources
http://www.economywatch.com...
http://www.forbes.com...
http://etext.virginia.edu...
http://links.jstor.org...(194206)32%3A2%3C119%3AAAMFTP%3E2.0.CO%3B2-B
http://econpapers.repec.org...
Debate Round No. 1
Havoo07

Pro

Havoo07 forfeited this round.
Espera

Con

As shown by my opponent's rather lacking argument and his subsequent forfeit of a round the only reasonable vote is in favor of my position - therefore all voters should vote Con. Thank you for your time.
Debate Round No. 2
Havoo07

Pro

Havoo07 forfeited this round.
Espera

Con

As my opponent has failed twice to present his arguments, and has also presented a fairly shallow opening argument I think it's only fair that voters Vote Con. Thank you for your interest in this topic.
Debate Round No. 3
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by tajshar2k 2 years ago
tajshar2k
We need to promote private property freedom better. Its a big issue.
Posted by BearWithMe 2 years ago
BearWithMe
What taxes are we speaking of specifically?
Posted by Varrack 2 years ago
Varrack
Indeed it should be. People like Obama are hurting that cause though.
4 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Vote Placed by Theunkown 2 years ago
Theunkown
Havoo07EsperaTied
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Total points awarded:07 
Reasons for voting decision: Con wins by forfeiture if nothing else.
Vote Placed by lannan13 2 years ago
lannan13
Havoo07EsperaTied
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Reasons for voting decision: Pro Forfeited. Con posted thorough arguments backed by reliable sources and since Pro failed to uphold the BOP. The debate goes to Con.
Vote Placed by Midnight1131 2 years ago
Midnight1131
Havoo07EsperaTied
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Reasons for voting decision: FF, conduct to Con. Pro's initial statement was refuted by Con and Pro also included other arguments that Pro never responded to. Con was the only one to include sources.
Vote Placed by Ragnar 2 years ago
Ragnar
Havoo07EsperaTied
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Reasons for voting decision: FF