The Instigator
elemenope
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
dannyc
Con (against)
Winning
23 Points

Simple Debate: The Bible says nothing about homosexuality

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 6 votes the winner is...
dannyc
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 7/21/2014 Category: Religion
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,181 times Debate No: 59298
Debate Rounds (2)
Comments (23)
Votes (6)

 

elemenope

Pro

This will be a simple debate; the Bible says nothing about homosexuality. Con shall state his/her arguments before this debate begins.
dannyc

Con

I accept.

Leviticus 18:22
Debate Round No. 1
elemenope

Pro

I would just like to thank God for this debate.

Leviticus 18:22 can have more than one interpretation. Some people have suggested what is condemned in this verse is pagan rituals, which involved homosexual acts. This fits in with the context of the verse, as Leviticus 18:27-28 specifically says that the pagans defiled the land with such acts. The fact that homosexuality is so rarely mentioned in the Bible should be an indication to us of the lack of importance ascribed it by the authors of the Bible.[1]

"You shall not lie with a male as with a woman. It is an abomination."
(Leviticus 18:22 NKJV).
The Hebrew literally says: "You shall not lie with a male [on] the bedding (or bed) of a woman (or wife), it is a despised thing (or despicable act)." The Bible doesn’t always tell us why something is “despised,” so we have to use reason. Most likely there were two men having sex on the bed of the woman, to rub it in her face to show she wasn't good enough. God would not ask or expect Christians to ever choose between their compassion and their faith.


[2]What cannot be denied is that "Christians" have caused a great deal of pain and suffering to gay persons, by:

  • Banning their participation in the church, thus depriving them of the comforts and spiritual fruits of the church.
  • Banning their participation in the sacrament of marriage, thus depriving them of the comforts and spiritual fruits of marriage.
  • Damaging the bonds between gays and their straight family members, thus weakening the comforts and spiritual fruits of family life for both gays and their families.
  • Using their position within society as spokespersons for God to proclaim that all homosexual relations are disdained by God, thus knowingly contributing to the cruel persecution of a minority population.
"Let any one of you who is without sin be the first to throw a stone at her." — John 8: 7

"Let no debt remain outstanding, except the continuing debt to love one another, for whoever loves others has fulfilled the law. The commandments, "You shall not commit adultery," "You shall not murder," "You shall not steal," "You shall not covet," and whatever other command there may be, are summed up in this one command: "Love your neighbor as yourself." Love does no harm to a neighbor. Therefore love is the fulfillment of the law" — Romans 13:8-10

"Here there is no Gentile or Jew, circumcised or uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave or free, but Christ is all, and is in all. Therefore, as God’s chosen people, holy and dearly loved, clothe yourselves with compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience. Bear with each other and forgive one another if any of you has a grievance against someone. Forgive as the Lord forgave you" — Colossians 3:11-13

"Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You give a tenth of your spices—mint, dill and cumin. But you have neglected the more important matters of the law—justice, mercy and faithfulness. You should have practiced the latter, without neglecting the former. You blind guides! You strain out a gnat but swallow a camel." — Matthew 23: 23-24

"Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you." — Matthew 7:1-2

"Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, ‘Brother, let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when you yourself fail to see the plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye." — Luke 6:41-42

Questions that need to be disputed by Con:

A. "The Bible isn't a rulebook, and Christians cannot lift out of its context any passage from it, and still hope to gain a clear understanding of that passage."

B. "Using the four Old Testament passages to condemn all homosexual acts is not in keeping with any Christian directive from God, nor with the practices of contemporary Christians."

C. "In the clobber passages Paul condemns the coercive, excessive, and predatory same-sex sexual activity practiced by the Romans—and would have condemned the same acts had they been heterosexual in nature."

D. "The Bible's clobber passages were written about same-sex acts between heterosexual persons, and do not address the subject of homosexual acts between a committed gay couple, because the concept of a person being homosexual did not exist at the time the Bible was written."

E. "Because there was no concept of gay marriage when the Bible was written, the Bible does not, and could not, address the sinfulness of homosexual acts within the context of gay marriage."

F. "Being personally repelled by homosexual sex doesn't make homosexual sex a sin."

G. "The greatest of these is love."

Sources:
[1] http://goo.gl...
[2] http://goo.gl...

dannyc

Con

Leviticus 18:22

'Some people have suggested what is condemned in this verse is pagan rituals, which involved homosexual acts'

if that is your take, fine, I win the debate. This debate is not about is homosexuality immoral or moral, this debate is not about does the church teach the bible to be taken literally, this debate is not about gay marriage, and this debate is not about do Christians do bad things.


"B. "Using the four Old Testament passages to condemn all homosexual acts is not in keeping with any Christian directive from God, nor with the practices of contemporary Christians." "

Irrelevant to the debate at hand.

A. "The Bible isn't a rulebook, and Christians cannot lift out of its context any passage from it, and still hope to gain a clear understanding of that passage."

Irrelevant to the debate at hand, I do not care if the bible is or is not a rulebook, the text I posted is clear and simple in one very simple task 'saying something about homosexuality.

"E. "Because there was no concept of gay marriage when the Bible was written, the Bible does not, and could not, address the sinfulness of homosexual acts within the context of gay marriage."

Irrelevant, the verse is talking about actions of homosexuality, I do not care about gay marriage for this debate.


"F. "Being personally repelled by homosexual sex doesn't make homosexual sex a sin.""

Irrelevant.

This is what is relevant, by BOP on the topic "The Bible says nothing about homosexuality" I need to show the bible does say something about homosexuality, that is all I have to do.


Leviticus 18:22

New International Version

"'Do not have sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman; that is detestable.


New Living Translation

"Do not practice homosexuality, having sex with another man as with a woman. It is a detestable sin.

American King James Version

You shall not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.

King James Bible

Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.

Four different versions, four different interpretations, all saying SOMETHING about homosexuality. I do not care if you agree with the verse, I don't care you don't agree with the verse, it is all simply irrelevant! All that I need to prove is that this statement 'The bible says nothing about homosexuality' is false. I have done it, the bible does say something about homosexuality, and for that reason we can conclude the pro position 'The bibles says nothing about homosexuality' is wrong.

Sources.

http://biblehub.com...
Debate Round No. 2
23 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by dannyc 2 years ago
dannyc
Your arguments were irrelevant and I won because I stuck to the debate title.
Posted by elemenope 2 years ago
elemenope
Well played Con. Winning this debate on a technicality and refusing to dispute my arguments.
Posted by elemenope 2 years ago
elemenope
My arguments were relevant to this debate. You can't just pick and choose Bible passages, you need to use reason, logic, and understanding, as well with the context.
Posted by dannyc 2 years ago
dannyc
I dropped your points because they were not relevant to the debate.
Posted by elemenope 2 years ago
elemenope
Again, Con has dropped all my points. Including D. "The Bible's clobber passages were written about same-sex acts between heterosexual persons, and do not address the subject of homosexual acts between a committed gay couple, because the concept of a person being homosexual did not exist at the time the Bible was written."
Posted by elemenope 2 years ago
elemenope
The Bible, as I've stated, refers to it as "sexual acts", not "relationships". This should be clear.
Posted by elemenope 2 years ago
elemenope
Well of course, you need logic. As for today's society, the Bible has been abused and twisted to fit hatred. You can't possibly count the word 'homosexuality' in the today's Bible as something that actually happened, that would be like changing the American flag and saying "This is the flag of how it always been, I don't care what others think".
Posted by elemenope 2 years ago
elemenope
I'm appalled that my opponent has dropped all my points and called my relevance "not on topic".
Posted by dannyc 2 years ago
dannyc
Almost everything you wrote was not on topic.
Posted by elemenope 2 years ago
elemenope
It really baffles me how people think the story of Sodom and Gomorrah is condemnation for LGBT people. Like, God destroyed those cities because... everyone was gay. Really? Everyone was gay? Everyone in the whole city? Lol come on now.
6 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Vote Placed by QandA 2 years ago
QandA
elemenopedannycTied
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Total points awarded:05 
Reasons for voting decision: pro actually admittted to their own resolution but con also successfully showed that the bible does indeed mention homosexuality so an easy one to call.
Vote Placed by FuzzyCatPotato 2 years ago
FuzzyCatPotato
elemenopedannycTied
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Reasons for voting decision: The Bible mentions honosexuality; this fulfills Con's BOP.
Vote Placed by Codedlogic 2 years ago
Codedlogic
elemenopedannycTied
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Reasons for voting decision: Interesting debate. Pro should have been more explicit in what they wanted to debate. Pro's own position showed on Leviticus 18:22 showed that they agreed the passage was about homosexuality.
Vote Placed by t-man 2 years ago
t-man
elemenopedannycTied
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Reasons for voting decision: Pro seemed to arguing something different from their resolution.
Vote Placed by Phoenix61397 2 years ago
Phoenix61397
elemenopedannycTied
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Reasons for voting decision: Pro essentially conceded by admitting that Leviticus 18:22 refers to homosexuality, and con capitalized. The simplicity of the resolution did pro in.
Vote Placed by rings48 2 years ago
rings48
elemenopedannycTied
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Reasons for voting decision: "The Bible says nothing about homosexuality" Even Pro admits that the Bible refers to homosexual acts, even if the word "homosexuality" didn't exist then. Thats just becoming semantics.