The Instigator
Con (against)
0 Points
The Contender
Pro (for)
6 Points

Sin is important

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/21/2013 Category: Religion
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 873 times Debate No: 31527
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (0)
Votes (1)




The Christian bible makes a big deal about sin, stating that it means the difference between heaven and hell.

My position is that the Torah and the Talmud was an old system of law that has been replaced.


Sin is important for several reasons, but for round 1 I'll give you 3 good reasons.

1. Your life.
Sin can affect your life in more ways then one, but lets take this to the larger amounts of sin. You can be put in jail for being a rapist, murderer, or a robber and this can either land you on death row or in the state pen. In jail there are many problems that you would face, but one of the highest problems that many people that go to jail face is rape, which is at an 85% chance, ( and even murder. Did you know that if you die in jail that your death isn't recorded. If you get raped it scares you for life and can even lead to suicide, 33 (

2. Trust
Sin can also affect your personal life as well. If you are a constant liar people aren't going to trust you. That's just common sense. You might say how has this really affected anyone, and I'll say Casey Anthony. People that get out of prison for serious crimes also have a tough time finding jobs. This is common sense, because I mean that aren't going to let a rapist work at a day care center.

3. After Life
Sin can also affect your after life as well. If you have committed a mortal sin then you go to hell. If you have a meh, amount of sin then you go to purgatory, and if your a saint you go to heaven. Now my opponent will probably come up here and say that I'm crazy, because not everyone's a saint and that if what I'm saying is true then hardly anyone can get into heaven, but this is false. People in Purgatory can get into heaven through prayers.
Debate Round No. 1


Rebutting my opponent's points.

1. Your Life.
1a. It is not addressing the point to bring up the larger amounts of sin. Everyone agrees that rapists should be punished. Including rapists.
1b. The article writer claims to be not racist, prefacing a racist comment with this remark.
1c. The number of rapes is overreported by this unreliable source.
1d. Rape is not traumatic to hardened criminals, especially when one considers the harsh environment in which the person lives every day.

Response to the core of the argument. Rather than looking at the sins most atrocious, look at the sins most common. For men this would be lust, impure thoughts, and masturbation. Perhaps a white lie. Sex outside marriage.

Where is the harm in sins that are not crimes. This is the core point.

2. Trust
2a. The most popular people are the ones that are the best liars. "Does this dress make me look fat" is easily evaded and redirected.
2b. Again there is confusion here regarding the distinction of sin and the modern legal system.
2c. A child molester would not work in a daycare, they would be placed on the sexual offenders list.
2d. I have heard reports of the entire factory running to the woods when an officer of the law arrived. Nobody wants to mess with the law. However, police do not enforce the gray area between the legal system and religious sin.

Note the seven deadly sins. These are actually positive attributes.

Lust: sexual desire, perfectly natural and perfectly normal.
Gluttony: desire for food. Biological in origin. Sometimes a symptom of job stress or clinical depression. If a person is making six figures perhaps it is worth it to be overweight. If a person lost a spouse, it is hardly to the point to bring up the topic of eating habits.
Greed: the core of the capitalist system.
Sloth: without downtime the mind snaps.
Wrath: emotional thrusts against what seems unjust.
Envy: fuels greed, addressed above
Pride: self-confidence

By focusing on the the overlap between religious sin and the modern legal system, my opponent raises a straw man.


1. Your Life
My opponent is ignoring today's debate of that is that is sin important. My opponent says this isn't important, but God laid down the 10 Commandments. The 6th Commandment of 'Though shall not kill,' and the 8th commandment of, 'Thou shall not kill.' ( Now we can all agree that these are sins and that we have even built the legal system around the 10 Commandments! So my opponent's argument about this first contention not being important is false.

My opponent claims that my article is false, however, he hasn't brought up an article to counter claim this. Until then my article stands and his claim is just disregarded. My opponent claims that rape is not traumatic, but however he disregards my argument that 1/3 of all rape victims commit suicide. If that isn't traumatic then I don't know what is.

2. Trust
My opponent dances around my entire argument here so you can extend all of my arguments here.

2 1/2. 7 Deadly Sins
My opponent shows you only a portion of the picture, but let me shine some light on this predicament.

Lust: Sexual desire can lead to rape. According to Phil Chalmers's book True Lies, he states that a high percentage of the rapist/ murders that he has interviewed has stated that the reason that they killed/ raped that person is because they stuck out in the hallways and that they looked good.

Gluttony: In the large desire of food it makes people fat and over weight. They get to the point to were if they are so over weight that they can get a heart attack, which is 40% of all deaths in America are heart attacks from fat people.

Greed: Greed can lead to armed robberies and they can lead to embezzlement. This hurts not just them but the economy too. (

Sloth: This leads to laziness and many people get fired for this. (sorry couldn't find a source for the percentage)

Wrath: Many times wrath can kill people. Also wrath is what leads to husband's beating their wives so it's obvious that this isn't a good thing.

Envy: Envy can lead to robbery.

Pride: This can lead to egotistical maniacs. We all hate those type of people.

3. After life
My opponent doesn't even try to refute this point so with only one round left and that being rebuttals the Pro wins this argument, because in debate arguments are like egg shells. Once you drop them you can't pick them back up.
Debate Round No. 2


The distinction of sin and the modern legal system is the crux of the debate, as outlined in the first argument.


The bible states that looking at a woman is the same as sexual intercourse. Matthew 5:28

The legal system says, go ahead and look, have sex if she's of age, just don't rape her.


The medical system says to keep in shape, psychricy says if you have bigger issues to worry about then don't worry about your weight.

The catholic church says that gluttony is a sin, and does not recognize the sympathy that is due to those who suffer.


The legal system states that armed robbery and embezzlement is punishable, and is thus irrelevant.

Again, the capitalist system states that greed is a good thing, and motivates people to be more productive by earning higher wages. Contrast this with Communism, which does not allow greed as a motivation. It simply does not work.

The bible has been used to support Communism, a la Acts 2.


The legal system states that murder is punishable, and is thus irrelevant.

Wrath, properly channeled, fuels every comptition on the planet.


The legal system states that robbery is punishable, and is thus irrelevant.

Seeing a car in Consumer Reports is the most common form of envy, and is abstracted from people.


Dislike is not addressed by the legal system. The job desription of CEO, manager, and authority requires price. Negotiation of a deal requires pride. Being in the military require pride. Be strong. Army Strong. Semper Fi.

The only threat of sin is the afterlife, which my opponent negated in his argument.

There is no afterlife, but that is for another debate.


1. Your Life

My opponent completely drops this argument so you can easily see that I won this contention due to Con dropping this argument so you can extended across my arguments here. Con keeps saying that the distinction between the legal system and sin is gray, but I've showed you that it isn't so my argument here stands.

2. Trust

My opponent yet again drops this argument meaning that I win this argument and you can extend across my arguments and that I have now won two contentions.

2.5 7 Deadly Sins.

Lust- My opponent dances around my last rounds argument of this leading to rape so you can extend my argument here.

Gluttony- You don't need to recognize sympathy for people that kill themselves by going to Mickey D's 4-5 times a weak and end up dying of heart failure or a heart attack.

Greed- All acts of sin are punishable, I've proven this throughout this debate. Weather that it is through jail time for murder or you lose someone's trust because you lied. You still get punished. If what Con is saying is true then there are no sins because they all have punishments.

Wrath- Though wrath isn't always channeled, as a matter of fact 86% of people are abused because of wrath and that isn't a good thing. (

Envy- Already addressed.

Pride- Already addressed.

3. After life

My opponent dropped this in round 2 and can't bring it up in rebuttal's so his round 3 argument is null and void.


As we can see today that my opponent has dropped almost every single argument that I have made and that I have backed up with reasonable facts with sources and we can see that Sin is important weather it's from a murder all the way down to a wee bit lie.

With that I urge you to vote Pro!
Debate Round No. 3
No comments have been posted on this debate.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by Daktoria 3 years ago
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Total points awarded:06 
Reasons for voting decision: Whether the Torah and Talmud is old and replaced or not hasn't been argued here. It's only been argued that they're illegitimate. However, the title says something that the opening remark does not. It's bait and switch. Con also claims a racist remark when it's not racist. The article contains stats. Lastly, Con, in R3 passive-aggressively bounces back and forth between sin's legitimacy and its legal application. Pro also correctly points out that Con is cherry-picking the application of the seven deadly sins.