The Instigator
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The Contender
Con (against)
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Socialized health care is better than private market health care

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/15/2011 Category: Health
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 896 times Debate No: 19314
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (3)
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I will allow my opponent to state his arguments first.


The debate topic is : Socialized health care is better than a private market health care.
In which I would like to point out that my opponent has to prove a socialized health care system is better than the private system. However I only have to disprove that its not better and I don't have to argue that private market health care is better but that they are the same or socialized health care is worse.


Ct1. The point in a socialized health care system is that taxes will rise, government taxes will pay for those who cannot pay. Now one might say thats a good thing, however do you believe we should pay our taxes for a smoker who wouldn't quit and you now have to pay for his surgery. Our the extremely fat people which we deem the word obese. Not trying to say that medical reasons isn't the reason but some majority of the obese is because parents don't know how to stop getting Mc donalds everyday for their kid. We all have to pay for that, you would definitely will see a giant taxe increase and burden the people.

Ct2. As well as when the government gets their hands on the hospitals in america, they will soon be controlled by the politics of congress. Just like the global gag rule, which when bush was elected re-enacted which tied strings to the funds we gave to hospitals in other country's. These hospital's could not even utter the word abortion or they would have their funding taken away. Just like that imagine that but at home, soon as a republican is elected, no more abortions would be allowed. Any kind of operation they disagreed with could be restricted, politics would ruin medical care.

Ct3. Malpractice Cost would cause even higher taxes.

Ct4. Doctors, Nurses, and etc, would lose jobs in the transition from private to socialized medical care.

Ct5.Profit motives, competition, and individual ingenuity have always led to greater cost control and effectiveness.

Ct6.Health care equipment, drugs, and services may end up being rationed by the government. In other words, politics, lifestyle of patients,and philosophical differences of those in power, could determine who gets what.
Debate Round No. 1


I will first respond to my opponents case points and afterwards post my own arguments/evidence in support of my position.

Ct.1) This "problem" that my opponent presents can be fixed easily, and is in fact already in effect. All you have to do is tax tobacco and unhealthy food products and use those funds to partly pay for Socialized health care. This is already done with tobacco products were the government taxes them in order to provide children with health care.
I would also like to point out that my opponent is using a Strawman logical fallacy; the definition of a socialized health care system is that it is controlled by the government this doesn't mean that the government provides universal health care. For example the government could be in control of the health care system but could pay for it the same way we pay for private insurance, meaning that in this system you would only be paying for your own health care not anyone else's.

Ct.2) I find this argument of my opponents odd considering in his first argument he said he was against socialized health care because he incorrectly assumed that the government would be paying for health care for everyone instead of people paying for their own health care. So basically my response is that my opponent can't have it both ways, he can't be against socialized health care because the government could pay for peoples individual health care, and then also be against it because the government wouldn't pay for peoples individual health care.

Ct.3) Again this is a strawman just like in case point number 1. However I'd like to add another response to it. Either way we have to pay for malpractice/health care we can either pay for it through taxes or through insurance premiums/deductibles.
Also paying for health care through higher taxation is more efficient than paying for it through insurance premiums. Paying via taxes results in less paper work, no dealing with insurance companies; no need for a cashier at every hospital or medical facility, and no need to fill out all the paper work regarding payments.

Ct.4) Prove it.

Ct.5) I'd say prove it again but I'll address this in my own arguments.

Ct.6) A non-socialized health care system already rations health care; notice how in America 15% of the country doesn't have access to health care. In America you can be denied health care because you have preexisting conditions; or insurance companies can simply drop your coverage if you develop a sickness. That is the very definition of rationing. The difference form a Socialized health care system is that in a socialized system health care is rationed by the government which is elected, by and served by the people; while in a private health care system health care is rationed based on profit and the greed of insurance companies who serve shareholders instead of people.

Now on to my arguments.

1)My major argument is that socialized health care systems compared to non-socialized ones cost less money and provide better quality care.
Example 1: The VA.
The VA in America is a completely socialized health care system .
VA health spending per person is 40% lower than private health insurance; this is despite multiple studies that show that VA health outcomes are 30% higher than their private counterparts

Example 2: Medicare.
Medicare's costs when adjusted for age are around 40% lower than private insurance; this is despite the fact that Medicare beneficiaries reporting better care than those on private insurance.

Example 3: Medicare advantage.
Medicare advantage is a health reform that was created in the 00's by Bush that allowed private insurance to compete with the governments Medicare insurance. The results were a complete failure; the private insurance costs were 20% higher than the governments even though the private insurance provided no increase in health outcomes or benefits. This is because private insurance has lots of administrative costs and costs associated with profits.

Example 4: The rest of the industrialized world.
America compared to the rest of the Western world is the only country with a major private health care system. America health costs are around 150% higher than the rest of the western world this is despite the fact that every analysis of the quality of health care shows that America has worse health care; this is also in despite of the fact that 15% of Americans do not have health insurance compared to 0% for the rest of the western world.


joshuaXlawyer forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2


My opponent forfeited so....


joshuaXlawyer forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3


My opponent forfeited


joshuaXlawyer forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by Willoweed 4 years ago
Blah should of won this debate to bad no one voted...
Posted by logicrules 4 years ago
Do you mean health care or Health Insurance?
Posted by Logic_on_rails 4 years ago
Question, would you be annoyed if con argues for private health care which incorporates a government option? Asking so that I don't accept and take a stance if that's not the debate's intention.
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