The Instigator
Pro (for)
6 Points
The Contender
Con (against)
0 Points

Son Goku (Dragon Ball Z) vs Post Crisis Superman (DC Comics)

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/11/2015 Category: Miscellaneous
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 3,497 times Debate No: 75101
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (1)
Votes (1)




This will be a fun debate. My opponent will be arguing for Post Crisis Superman taking the win.

Rules: No trolling, swearing, or insults.
If you accept, you must do the research and no forfeiting on any round unless you give a good reason for doing so, and post your arguement for any missed rounds in the current round.

Round 1: Acceptance
Round 2: State your argument
Round 3: Rebuttal
Round 4: Final Arguments


I accept your challenge, dear boy. Watch your back.
As to your structure, fo' shizzle ma nizzle.
Debate Round No. 1


This is going to be very long.


During the Saiyan Saga Piccolo shot an basic energy beam at the moon and destroyed it. The beam lasted 3 seconds until disappearing and the moon blowing up

now the moon is 238857 miles away... So how fast was that energy beam?

- With the distance being 238857 miles away that means the basic energy beam moved at '79619' miles per second

- Note that at this stage Piccolo's power level is around '329' thus the beams power could also be '329'

- The reason for this being that Piccolo's 'Special Beam Cannon' took much longer to charge and its power was '1330'. This beam however was charged much quicker thus weaker

- The Beams power could be around '200' (since Master Roshi also destroyed the moon with a power level of 139 when he fought Goku in the World Tournament thus Piccolo only needed to shoot a beam stronger than that

But if Raditz shot an basic energy beam how fast would it be?

- Raditz is around 3.5x stronger than Piccolo meaning a basic energy beam from Raditz would take under 1 second to reach the moon...

- Thus Raditz beams move around '278666' miles per second (the speed of light is '186000' miles per second in a vacuum)

- So a basic energy beam from Raditz is around 1.3x faster than the speed of light

- Also Raditz dodged Piccolo's first 'Special Beam Cannon' (with a power level of '1330') thus the beam moved at speeds over '278666' miles per second, meaning Raditz can move at around 1.3x the speed of light

Upon returning from Other World Goku's power level is 8000 (lol no 9000 here) that’s around 6.6x that of Raditz's power level so what does this mean...

- So a basic beam (with a power level of 8000) would travel at '1839198' miles per second

- Let’s not forget that Nappa is 3.3x stronger than Raditz thus a basic beam from him would move at '919597' miles per second

- Goku managed to counter Nappa's mouth laser with a Kamehameha even though Nappa shot first

- Thus Goku can react and respond in under '161.3' milliseconds (that’s 0.161314 seconds)

- That’s if the beam Nappa fired had a power level of '4000' it could have been more for all we know

When Frieza as fighting Goku he said he was at 1% of his full power thus he had a power level of '1200000' though this 'could' be a bluff lets take him on face value and look at the numbers...

- Even at 1% power Frieza is still 150x Goku's power level in the Saiyan Saga (after King Kai's Training)

- Thus as I said a basic beam from Saiyan Saga Goku (after King Kai Training) moves at '1839198' miles per second... So Frieza's beam moves at around '275879700' miles per second

- So Frieza's Death Beam moves at around 1483.2x the speed of light (also note that only Vegeta at a power level of 2000000 could even see the beams)

- Note Goku reflected the barrage of blast from Frieza, meaning Goku's reactions and speed is faster than '275879700' miles per second

So Goku did it he transformed into a Super Saiyan and gets a huge power boost, also Frieza ups his power to 50% so how does this affect their and there energy beams speed?

- Frieza's power is a 50% meaning he has a power level of '6000000' now after Goku transformed into a Super Saiyan Frieza shot a number of death beams at him again

- These Death Beams would move at around '413819550' miles per second and again Goku dodges them

- Again meaning Goku can move at speeds faster than '413819550' miles per second at Super Saiyan 1 with a power level of '150000000'

- Thus if Super Saiyan Goku used a basic energy beam it would move at '10345488750' miles per second

So as you can see, during the Frieza Saga Goku can fire projectiles that move at '10345488750' miles per second along with being able to move at the same speed himself...

Strength/Energy Output

This is striking strength, not lifting strength. Goku managed to punch a hole in King Kai's planet when he fought Beerus for the first time.

The first calculation is figuring out the mass of the planet using gravity and radius since those are the two things we know.

The next step is Volume, using the radius.

And the third is density using the mass and volume we calculated.

I also have links to a few calculators/converters I checked the answers on.

Rearranged gravity formula to calculate mass instead (had to do shorthand got formula from wikipedia)

g = m/r^2

m = r^2 x g

Volume formula

V = (4/3) × pi × r^3

Density Formula

P = M/V

*Very good overall calculator

cm/g to m/kg calculator ... perm3.html

Density calculator ... lator.aspx

Volume calculator ... lator.html

Here's the actual calculations

g = m/r^2

m = r^2 x g

m = 0.0000156961230576^2 x 10

m = 0.0000000024636827904 earth masses

Earth’s mass = 5.97219 × 10^24 kilograms

5.97219 × 10^24 X 0.0000000024636827904 = 14,713,581,723,998,976

m = 14,713,581,723,998,976 kg

This considers King Kai’s planet as 100m radius and 10X gravity.

The small number is the size of King Kai's planets radius in relation to Earths.

volume of a sphere is V = (4/3) × pi × r^3

V = (4/3) × pi × 100m^3 = 4188790.2047863905m^3

This is using King Kai’s planet as 100m radius.

Knowing the mass and Volume we can get density.

P = M/V

P = 14713581723998976kg / 4188790.2047863905m^3

P = 3.512608892.9415128417291527 X 10^9 kg/m^3

Density of a white dwarf star: "The average density of matter in a white dwarf must therefore be, very roughly, 1,000,000 times greater than the average density of the Sun, or approximately 10^6 g/cm3." Which translates to 10^9 kg/m^3. So in other words it is over 3.5 times as dense as a white dwarf star.

Now for Energy Output, this image talks about the power of Super Saiyan 2.

s://; alt="" width="182px;" height="277px;" />

A summary of the translation of this databook states that Super Saiyan 2 has the power to push back Cell’s energy bullet which had enough energy to destroy the solar system. Here, Vegeta is talking to Goku. (Sorry for it being in such low quality.)

s://; alt="" width="175px;" height="288px;" />

Vegeta says “Impressive. You’re stronger than Gohan when he fought Cell.” Then Goku later transforms into a Super Saiyan 3 whose power was so transcendent that it could be sensed from the realm of the Kais and shook the world when Goku powered up.

s://; alt="" width="619px;" height="609px;" />s://; alt="" width="624px;" height="956px;" />

So with all of this evidence, it’s reasonable to assume that Goku at full power could destroy multiple solar systems, and that’s not even including Goku’s Super Saiyan God transformation.


My opponent makes arguments about speed and power of Goku. He claims that Goku can destroy multiple solar systems. However, Superman is NOT a solar system, he's the MAN OF STEEL. There is an incredible simulation of a fight between Goku and Superman,

In the beginning, Superman gets rekt, but he doesn't lose because he's the MAN OF STEEL. So he prevails, and can wear down Goku. Thus, in the end he launches Goku straight through the Earth and wins.
Since my evidence is actually a simulation of a fight between Goku and Superman, and my opponent's evidence is inpertinent because Superman is not a solar system, it is clear that SUPERMAN would win the fight.
Thank you.
Debate Round No. 2



My opponent points out Screw Attack's Death Battle between Goku and Superman. While the video was fun to watch, Goku's statistics were calculated incorrectly. They used the speed at which he could travel long distances instead of the speed at which he could react and fight. The Gravity Formula acts as though Goku only gets stronger when he trains at increased gravity which is not the case and it falls apart when applied to other saiyans such as Vegeta, Trunks, and Goten. Vegeta trained at 400x Earth's gravity for the Androids and was easily beaten by Android 18, but Trunks, who could barely handle 150x Earth's gravity, could hold his own against Android 18 fairly well. The feat with Goku only lifting 40 tons is extremely inconsistent when in Dragon Ball, Goku managed to push a large boulder. Doing size and mass calculations I found that the boulder weighed around 350 tons.

So, I pass it back to my opponent to try and prove that Superman could beat Goku.


ZenithOfPi forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3


So, for the final round I will summarize. Goku has superior combat speed, striking strength, and durability to Superman and would be able to beat him in a fight only using Super Saiyan 2.


ZenithOfPi forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
Posted by the_ultimate_creation 1 year ago
Goku wins here
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by daem0n 1 year ago
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Total points awarded:60 
Reasons for voting decision: Conduct: Con forfeited. Sources and arguments: Pro's position is a very well-researched case for Goku's physical superiority, and Con's case relies on a video that is debunked by Pro.