Soul is a living person in the bible
Debate Rounds (3)
Many people see a "soul" in the bible as the what the Greeks saw it as. The "Ancient Greeks used the same word for 'alive' as for 'ensouled', indicating that the earliest surviving western philosophical view found the terms soul"(wikepedia)
The bible never refers to the soul as a dualistic definition.
THe bible claims that God made the body from "dust"and his"breath" and that made a "living soul" which means a living person.
I tried to find more information in the comments but no explanation was forthcoming. So I'll just use this round for acceptance and wait for Pro's opening argument to get a better handle on what he wants to debate.
nadlor1 forfeited this round.
Nadlor has forfeited. I'll make a brief case for the duality of soul and body.
When Adam became a "living soul," that does not mean he became a soul when he started living. All living humans have a soul. The soul is created when the human is, at fertilization. However Adam's creation was different. He was not conceived in the normal way; he was made from the dust of the earth. Therefore God had to breathe breath into his nostrils for him to live otherwise he couldn't survive. When he started living he had a soul.
Paul taught that our soul is separate from our body. In 2 Corinthians 5: 6-8 that while we are in the body, we are absent from the Lord. But we will be pleased to be absent from the body and present with the Lord. Also, Jesus gave the parable of Lazarus and the rich man, who were dead and in the afterlife, Lazarus in Abraham's bosom and the rich man in Hades. Then when the Lord returns, the dead in Christ will be raised first (1 Thessalonians 4:16). Our soul will live on while our body is buried in the Earth, and at the end of time we will be raised to live in the new Heaven and new Earth.
Anyway, as Pro has forfeited please vote Con.
In Ecclesiastes 12:7. it says "Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it." So this means that"The body turns to dust again, and the spirit goes back to God, who gave it. The spirit of every person who dies--whether righteous or wicked--returns to God at death."(Amazing).
So let's see what the spirit is in a biblical view.
"The body without the spirit ["breath," ] is dead." James 2:26. "The spirit of God ["the breath which God gave him," is in my nostrils." Job 27:3.so this means that "The spirit that returns to God at death is the breath of life. Nowhere in all of God's book does the "spirit" have any life, wisdom, or feeling after a person dies. It is the "breath of life" and nothing more."(Amazing).
And no where in the bible does it refer spirit as "soul".
So again what is a soul.."And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul." Genesis 2:7.
the soul is body plus breath.So I say again that the soul only lives with two things.Body(dust) and Spirit(breath of Life).
The soul can die though "The soul that sinneth, it shall die." Ezekiel 18:20."According to God's Word, souls do die! We are souls, and souls die. Man is mortal (Job 4:17)."(Amazing).
Now I will show my opponents errors.
1."Paul taught that our soul is separate from our body. In 2 Corinthians 5: 6-8 that while we are in the body, we are absent from the Lord. But we will be pleased to be absent from the body and present with the Lord."
"Paul knew the Corinthians would not be confused by his language in 2 Corinthians 5 about mortality being swallowed up by immortality, because he had already written his first epistle to them explaining when that immortality would be put on. "… in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump… this mortal must put on immortality. THEN shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory." 1 Corinthians 15:52-54. When would death or mortality be "swallowed up?" "THEN," Paul said. When is THEN? "In the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump." How can anyone stumble over the plain language of these verses?"Paul was longing for that change from the earthly mortal body to the glorious immortal body. He stated that the change would take place on the resurrection-translation day. His chief hope seemed to center upon being translated without ever being "unclothed" in death. He yearned to "be clothed upon" by translation at the coming of Jesus, so that he be not found "naked" (in the grave). Translation would mean that mortality would be "swallowed up of life."
Nevertheless, he hastened to express confidence, as we have just pointed out, in the certainty of a resurrection when death would be swallowed up in victory (1 Corinthians 15:54). In either case, whether by translation or resurrection, he would be "clothed upon" with the immortal body. Either mortality would be "swallowed up" by being translatedor death would be "swallowed up" by being resurrected.
Paul does not linger over the "unclothed" state, because his hopes rested in the new body to be received at Christ's coming. He could not be "forever with the Lord" until that change took place "in the twinkling of an eye." The interim sleep of death in the grave held no appeal for Paul, since it would seem but a fractional second of utter oblivion to the one who died. Looking beyond the uninviting nakedness of death to the land of life, Paul ruled out any possibility of a state between death and the resurrection when disembodied spirits could be present with the Lord. "(Amazing).
2.Also, Jesus gave the parable of Lazarus and the rich man, who were dead and in the afterlife, Lazarus in Abraham's bosom and the rich man in Hades. Then when the Lord returns, the dead in Christ will be raised first (1 Thessalonians 4:16).
"Jesus "said to them, 'Our friend Lazarus sleeps, but I go that I may wake him up.' Then His disciples said, 'Lord, if he sleeps he will get well.' However, Jesus spoke of his death, but they thought that He was speaking about taking rest in sleep. Then Jesus said to them plainly, 'Lazarus is dead.'" (John 11:11-14 NKJV).
He also said, "This is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day" (John 6:39).
Jesus says the dead really are dead. They are not yet in heaven, nor are they yet in hell. They are "asleep," awaiting the resurrection "at the last day."(Amazing).
Although this may be long this explains what truly what the bible teaches.Throughout the whole bible the soul counts as mortal.And if the soul is consider the spirit then why does it say the soul will surely perish.
So i conclude that soul means person and not the duality of ancient Greeks.It may seem hard to understand but in the early church of christians,the church adopted paganism."Over time, as Christianity spread throughout the Hellenic world, and with a number of church leaders having been educated in Greek philosophy there was a fusion of the two modes of thought.
One early Christian writer of the 2nd and early 3rd century, Clement of Alexandria, demonstrated the assimilation of Greek thought in writing: "Philosophy has been given to the Greeks as their own kind of Covenant, their foundation for the philosophy of Christ... the philosophy of the Greeks... contains the basic elements of that genuine and perfect knowledge which is higher than human... even upon those spiritual objects."(wikepedia).
Therefore, dualism was never taught in the Bible until the early paganistic christians.
Pro claims that I have misinterpreted some verses but I will argue that it is, indeed, Pro who has demonstrated a lack of understanding of Biblical verses. As this is the last round, I will not offer any new arguments. I will simply respond to Pro's arguments.
Pro uses Ecclesiastes 12:7, but this works in my favor. As I explained, the body and soul are separate. The body rots away here on Earth while the spirit, the soul, returns to God.
Pro also misinterprets James 2:26. The "spirit" is not the breath. James is saying what is in accordance to my position, that the spirit (soul) is what gives the body life. They are separate. The body without the soul (or spirit) is dead.
In fact, Pro is completely misrepresenting the Bible and misquoting these verses. We are warned throughout Scripture not to add to the words of God. Job 27:3 says "As long as my breath is in me, and the breath of God in my nostrils..." Read the verse in its surrounding context. Job is saying, "as long as I'm alive, I still speak no wickedness or deceit," etc. Pro is completely misrepresenting the Bible.
I have already shown why Adam became "a living soul" in my previous round. A human has a soul when they begin life. We begin life at fertilization so we get our soul then. Adam was not conceived like a normal human, so God had to breathe breath into him (because he needs oxygen to survive), so as soon as he began living he had a soul.
Yes, souls can, technically, die. The Bible talks about two deaths, the physical death (where the soul is separated from the body), and the spiritual death (where a soul who dies in their sins is separated from God eternally, sentenced to Hell). (Hebrews 9:27, Revelation 20:14, Revelation 21:8).
Regarding his rebuttals to my previous round arguments:
1. This does not negate my argument. Our bodies are mortal but our souls are immortal. As I explained, there is a second death in which souls die (they are separated from God eternally). The way we "put on immortality" is to trust in Christ for our salvation, because only then can we avoid the second death and be truly immortal.
2. Again, Pro has misrepresented the Bible. The Lazarus in Jesus' parable was different from Jesus' friend Lazarus. The Lazarus in the parable is found in Luke 16, and Jesus' friend Lazarus who died was in John 11. Jesus told a parable, which was a fictional account to express a spiritual truth. Now, some do believe that the story of Lazarus and the rich man actually did happen (one piece of evidence being that Lazarus was named specifically, and in no other parables did Jesus use a specific man's name). Even if the account of Lazarus and the rich man was non-fictional, this is still a different person.
Jesus' friend Lazarus died and was dead for four days. By saying that Lazarus was "asleep," He was not saying that all dead people sleep until the resurrection. Jesus was going to raise Lazarus up! So in a way Lazarus was sleeping, because, as Jesus said, "I go that I may wake Him up." Lazarus was not going to remain dead, so in a way, He was only sleeping.
Finally, pointing to Clement of Alexandria (and he did not source this, so I have no idea in which work Clement would have written this) is simply an appeal to authority. Let the words of the Bible speak for themselves, and I believe that the meaning is quite clear that there is a body that is alive only insofar as the spirit (or soul) still dwells in it, and once dead the spirit goes to God and the body dies.
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