The Instigator
yoda878
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
Rational_Thinker9119
Con (against)
Winning
6 Points

Spirit matter is the spirit world

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
Rational_Thinker9119
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/10/2012 Category: Religion
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,395 times Debate No: 21059
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (6)
Votes (2)

 

yoda878

Pro

Dark matter is the spirit world. I will debate that dark mater is the spirit world and con will debate that it is not.
Rational_Thinker9119

Con

I accept, present your case.
Debate Round No. 1
yoda878

Pro

We know that spirits can move through things, we can not see spirits, they would not be easily detected.
These are all things we know about dark matter.
Dark matter is an invisible substance, that congeals, and holds together our universe. Massive galaxy clusters have been documented, that simply cannot be explained otherwise. This matter is not only invisible, but it also does not directly interact with the physical world around it, other than to produce gravity. This substance is all around us, and we dont even know it.
Know we have been told that the spirit would is all around us, dark matter the spirit realm.
Rational_Thinker9119

Con

Rebutting my opponent's argument:

"We know that spirits can move through things"

No "we" don't, what evidence do you have that spirits exist?

"we can not see spirits"

Then how do you know they exist? Can you provide any evidence besides observation that the do?

"they would not be easily detected"

Then how have you detected them, to the point where you can confidently say they exist?

"These are all things we know about dark matter."

What evidence is there that dark matter exists? Also, even if both spirits and dark matter cannot be easily detected and can move through things, you still haven't provided any evidence that dark matter is the spirit world. All you have done is taken a couple of very vague qualities you believe both to have, (even though I can name many things that share those same qualities), and tried to build a case that they are the same thing based on nothing.

"This matter is not only invisible, but it also does not directly interact with the physical world around it.."

The case for dark matter is based on it being inside the universe, anything inside the universe is part of the physical world. If there is a spirit world, it would most likely exist as it's own universe not part of ours.

"other than to produce gravity..."

So now you believe the spirit world produces gravity? If this is the case then the spiritual world existing is a scientific claim, what are the properties of this spiritual world (and don't mention properties of dark matter, because all that would be doing is building a case for dark matter, not for the spiritual world).

"This substance is all around us, and we dont even know it. Know we have been told that the spirit would is all around us"

Molecules are all around us, microorganisms are all around us....Are you saying that molecules and microorganisms are spirits because they are all around us? That's pretty much what your logic boils down to.

So basically your argument is: Dark matter moves through things, is all around us, invisible, and hard to detect. Since the spirit world claims share those qualities, then dark matter is the spirit world

Problems with my opponents argument:

Many things we know of move through things, are all around us, are invisible, and hard to detect....Does this mean they are either dark matter or a spirit world? No, so the logic fails.

My case for Dark Matter not being the spirit world (based on opponent's claim):

1. Only physical things with mass can "produce" gravity
2. Dark matter exists within the universe, it is not a universe of its own

Spirits are defined as:

"spir�it/ˈspirit/
Noun:
The nonphysical part of a person that is the seat of emotions and character; the soul.
Verb:
Convey rapidly and secretly: "stolen cows were spirited away".
Synonyms:
noun. ghost - soul - mind - psyche
verb. encourage - hearten"

The above means that if spirits exist (which you haven't provided evidence of) then they are non-physical. If my opponent is correct that dark matter exists (which we still need evidence of) and it "produces" gravity, then it cannot be a spiritual world because only physical things "produce" gravity.

Conclusion:

Unless my opponent:

1. Provides evidence that spirits exist
2. Provides evidence that dark matter exists
3. Ties the two together with more than just vague property matching
4. Refutes my argument

Then the debate is clearly leaning in my favor.
Debate Round No. 2
yoda878

Pro

What evidence is there that dark matter exists? Also, even if both spirits and dark matter cannot be easily detected and can move through things, you still haven't provided any evidence that dark matter is the spirit world. All you have done is taken a couple of very vague qualities you believe both to have, (even though I can name many things that share those same qualities),
Can you name any other thing that has those same qualities?
and no molecules do not have the same qualities of what we know about spirits and dark matter.
http://science.nasa.gov...
Dark matter does in fact exist, this is a link to NASA.



"This matter is not only invisible, but it also does not directly interact with the physical world around it.."
awe but your wrong if you look at the link i gave you it shows how it can.

The case for dark matter is based on it being inside the universe, anything inside the universe is part of the physical world. If there is a spirit world, it would most likely exist as its own universe not part of ours.
Our spirit is in our body and our body is physical.


Conclusion
Even big bang sincerest are interested in dark matter saying that dark matter was responsible for it.
Interesting spirit / Black matter was responsible for the creation of the universe? IF black matter is the spirit world than, that explains why god can be in all places at once.
On the macro level, astronomers believe that whole galaxies and clusters of galaxies — hundreds of millions of stars — are surrounded by a halo of this matter. While invisible to our current sensors it nevertheless influences the stars in visible ways.
Dark matter does exist that is fact
Unless you can prove that spirits don't exist than you can't know that you are right.
Some believe that this may prove otherwise.
Rational_Thinker9119

Con

Rebutting my opponent's arguments:

"http://science.nasa.gov......
Dark matter does in fact exist, this is a link to NASA"

Good job, now we are getting somewhere in regards to dark matter.

"Our spirit is in our body"

Evidence? You still have not provided evidence that spirits or a spiritual world even exists. Also if our bodies are the spiritual world, then dark matter cannot be.

"IF black matter is the spirit world than, that explains why god can be in all places at once."

You have provided no evidence that a spiritual world, spirits, or a God exists, let alone a God that can be everywhere at once. You have only provided evidence that Dark Matter exists.

"Unless you can prove that spirits don't exist than you can't know that you are right"

The burden of proof is one the one making the claim that something exists, especially in the context of this debate.

All you have done is provided evidence that dark matter exists, you have provided no evidence that a spiritual world exists. Therefore, you have failed at providing a solid case for Dark Matter being the spiritual world.

Continuing my case for Dark Matter not being a spiritual world:


1. There is no evidence that a spiritual world exists, therefore there is no logical reason to believe that dark matter and the spiritual world are the same.

2. The physical vs non-physical problem, explanation below:

Also lets look at the definition of matter.

"Matter - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matter
Matter is a general term for the substance of which all physical objects consist. Typically, matter includes atoms and other particles which have mass"
http://en.wikipedia.org...

Now lets look at the definition of spiritual:

"Spiritual - definition of spiritual by the Free Online Dictionary ...
www.thefreedictionary.com/spiritual
Definition of spiritual in the Online Dictionary. Meaning of spiritual. ... 1. relating to the spirit or soul and not to physical nature or matter;"
http://www.thefreedictionary.com...

Do you see the contradiction? Dark matter cannot be the spiritual world because matter is defined as involving the physical, and spiritual is defined as non physical and not relating to matter. Therefore, if anything relates to matter it cannot be spiritual.

Conclusion:

I have provided a solid case for why dark matter is not the spiritual world, while my opponent has presented a flimsy case in her favor at best.
Debate Round No. 3
6 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Posted by Rational_Thinker9119 2 years ago
Rational_Thinker9119
Thank you for the debate as well!
Posted by yoda878 2 years ago
yoda878
This was for fun, i can not really prove this and that is obvious but you do have to admit it is intriguing thanks for the debate! :)
Posted by yoda878 2 years ago
yoda878
I'm new at this I didn't know i couldn't go back and edit this I meant world not would. and now* lol . Ill take more time on the next one.
If you can edit can someone tell me how?
Posted by yoda878 2 years ago
yoda878
This is for fun
Posted by yoda878 2 years ago
yoda878
Oh but you must debate.
Posted by Doulos1202 2 years ago
Doulos1202
what evidence do you have?
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by RoyLatham 2 years ago
RoyLatham
yoda878Rational_Thinker9119Tied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro had the burden of proof and did not show that spirits exist.
Vote Placed by THEBOMB 2 years ago
THEBOMB
yoda878Rational_Thinker9119Tied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: Con adequately refuted Pros case. Pro proved Dark Matter existed but, never actually showed how dark matter == spirit world. Furthermore, Pro never showed that spirits actually exist...