The Instigator
isaiah589
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
bazinga390
Con (against)
Winning
3 Points

Squidward Tentacles just isn't musically gifted enough to play the Clarinet well.

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
bazinga390
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 4/3/2013 Category: Entertainment
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,866 times Debate No: 32065
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (2)
Votes (1)

 

isaiah589

Pro

I am arguing for the statement that Squidward Tentacles just isn't musically gifted enough to play the clarinet well. Remember this debate is just for fun so be creative and have fun. Round 1 will just be an acceptance of the debate.
bazinga390

Con

I accept this debate.
Burden of proof is on Pro.
Best of luck to my opponent!
Debate Round No. 1
isaiah589

Pro

Thanks to my opponent for accepting this debate. I have been trying to think of ideas for spongebob related debates and thought of this one. This should be fun.

Squidward, as we all know, loves to play the clarinet. But we can see throughout the history of Spongebob episodes that he is not very good. There are a few points I would like to make.

1. Many characters in Bikini Bottom tell Squidward he is bad at the clarinet. Spongebob:"It's too dangerous to play the clarinet that badly in the wilderness. Or in another episode a doctor comes knocking on Squidward's door after he had been playing the clarinet and says "I understand you have a dying animal on the premises." Those are just two characters, and I could name more, but I want to keep this short and sweet.

2. There was a whole episode showing that Squidward could not lead a band. Although he did posses some minor skills in leading the band and playing he did not make the members of the band any better. There was a quote from that episode (Band geeks) that showed that he didn't really know how to make the band better. "People talk loud when they want to act smart right? So if we play loud, people might think we're good." I realize that the creatures in the band were not the best, but Squidward hardly improved them at all, he even says so himself.

3. Finally and most importantly, if Squidward was musically gifted enough to play the clarinet well, he would have already been a famous clarinet player in Bikini Bottom. Squidward has the drive, he has the desire, it is what he wants to do. What he doesn't have is the musical ability. He does have some minor skills, but he is not musically gifted enough to play the clarinet well. If he was, he would be right up there with Squilliam, being well known and rich.
bazinga390

Con


My opponent claims that, “Many characters in Bikini Bottom tell Squidward he is bad at the clarinet.” However, I believe this is all in good fun, and the characters do not truly believe that he is bad at playing his clarinet. One character that is mentioned in the previous argument was Spongebob. If Spongebob truly thought that Squidward was bad, then why would he go through so much trouble to allow him to continue to play? In one episode, he risks his life to retrieve a reed from inside Squidward. -http://spongebob.wikia.com... In another episode, when Squidward becomes a giant, Spongebob creates a giant clarinet for him to play. -http://spongebob.wikia.com... Spongebob’s “best day ever” even includes going to one of Squidward’s clarinet recitals. -http://spongebob.wikia.com... To condense my argument, characters do not truly believe that Squidward is bad at playing the clarinet.


Pro states, “There was a whole episode showing that Squidward could not lead a band.” This is not entirely true. Over the four days of practice, Squidward was able to mold his band from not having any experience, to playing an amazing show at the Bubble Bowl. -http://spongebob.wikia.com... This episode is actually a great example of how much musical talent Squidward actually has.


My opponent says, “If Squidward was musically gifted enough to play the clarinet well, he would have already been a famous clarinet player in Bikini Bottom.” Being musically gifted does not necessarily mean you will become famous. This fact in the real world also applies in cartoons. Squidward can play his clarinet very well, but he hasn’t had his ‘big break’ yet.


Debate Round No. 2
isaiah589

Pro

Thanks again for accepting the debate by the way.

First off, con claims that "The characters do not truly believe that Squidward is bad at playing his clarinet." I do agree that some of the characters do pick on him just because they like to. Yet there was a Spongebob episode that I recall called Squid Wood in which at the end of an episode, a man who represents one of Squidward's favorite clarinet players arrives. Squidward tries to show off his clarinet skills (remember, this is someone who has never met Squidward before) to the man, and the man laughs at his terrible playing with a joke and leaves. .http://spongebob.wikia.com...(transcript). Con mentioned that "If Spongebob truly thought that Squidward was bad, then why would he go through so much trouble to allow him to continue to play?" Spongebob is a pretty nice character, and he considers Squidward his friend. He is not just going to tell Squidward to give up on his hopes and dreams, this is not how the character Spongebob is. Spongebob will be there to help Squidward achieve his dreams... but its too bad Squidward isn't good enough.

I've watched Band Geeks many times (it is my favorite episode haha). Squidward says this after the fourth day: "Well this is our last night together before the show. And I know that none of you have improved since we began." http://spongebob.wikia.com...(transcript). It was not Squidward that made the band good. After Squidward leaves, Spongebob gets everyone to try their best. If anything it is Spongebob who is musically gifted. Near the end of Band Geeks, Spongebob directs the band. At the Stadium, Squidward doesn't even do anything, he just rocks out.

Squidward has had many opportunities to get big breaks. It is some of the fun of the show, watching Squidward not fulfill his dreams while working so hard, and usually Spongebob will come along and do it with ease. It is not due to the lack of opportunities Squidward gets. It is due to the lack
bazinga390

Con


I would like to thank my opponent for creating this debate. I am having a lot of fun with it.


My opponent uses the fact that the man representing Squidward’s favorite clarinet player tells him he is bad. But this is the opinion of just one man (fish). If a judgment of talent is based on opinion, then, to be conclusive, it needs to include many opinions that are unanimous. I now draw your attention back to the “Best Day Ever” episode. At the end of Squidward’s concert, there was a roar of applause indicating that he had played well. [1] Because of the large amount of people in the audience, this is a more conclusive judgment of Squidward’s skill than the talent agent's.


[1] http://spongebob.wikia.com...


In the “Band Geeks” episode, like my opponent said, SpongeBob was the last one to practice with the band before the performance. However, this does not prove that Squidward did nothing to prepare the band. Over the four days of practice, he taught the band all of the skills needed to perform, but he was not able to get the band to use these skills. This is likely due to his grumpy personality. SpongeBob, on the other hand, is very charismatic and was able to get the band to use the skills. Also, the fact that Squidward is not a very good music teacher does not correlate to his own abilities as a musician.


I agree that Squidward has had plenty of opportunities to fulfill his dreams. However, as I said before, a lot of opportunities to become famous does not necessarily mean you will become famous. I believe that Squidward just has some bad luck when these opportunities come up. This is probably due to the fact that, as my opponent said, watching Squidward fail at his dream is part of the fun in the show.


Debate Round No. 3
isaiah589

Pro

Last Round and closing statements. I had fun.

Con says that because the man (or fish thing haha) representing Squidward is just the opinion of one person (fish) and that it is just one opinion. But think about how you become a famous musician. You need the opinions of others. Especially those who are experts at the subject. The man representing Squidward's favorite clarinet player, although we don't know too much about him, seems to be an expert on what makes a good musician, considering he is managing a very good one. Let's say you are a good painter. You can't tell me if Picasso came up and told you how to improve your paintings that you wouldn't listen to him. A judgement of talent is always based on opinions, and it is conclusive in Squidward's case. Has any fish or creature ever in Spongebob ever came up to Squidward and said: Hey you are really good at Clarinet, or hey you have real talent at playing the clarinet. No. The crowd in the audience is pretty irrelevant, considering con stated earlier that when the characters in Bikini Bottom tell Squidward he is bad at the clarinet, they do this all in good fun. If they are picking on him all in good fun, who is to say that they are clapping out of true loving of his performance?

Con states that Squidward taught the band in "Band Geeks" all of the skills needed to perform, yet the whole episode shows just the opposite of this. The episode never shows in Squidward really actually teaching the band anything.

Finally con stated that Squidward has "just had some bad luck when opportunities come up." He had been successful at many things and had gotten big breaks on many things such as the "House Fancy" episode or the episode he turns the Krusty Krab into a 5 star restaurant. Like I said before. He has the drive to succeed. He wants to be famous it is his dream. Opportunities show up all the time. Unfortunately for Squidward, it is not bad luck, it is because he just isn't musically gifted enough.

Vote Pro! :)
bazinga390

Con


I think we are getting away from the true point of this debate. This debate was intended to conclude whether or not Squidward can play the clarinet well. Not that he could become a famous clarinet player.


My opponent says, “The crowd in the audience is pretty irrelevant, considering con stated earlier that when the characters in Bikini Bottom tell Squidward he is bad at the clarinet, they do this all in good fun.” I still believe this is a relevant argument considering the crowd was in a formal situation where they are more likely to give their true opinion of the performance.


My opponent and I seem to be at an impasse when it comes to the “Band Wagon” episode. I believe that Squidward taught the band necessary skills. My opponent says it was only SpongeBob who taught the band. Either way, teaching a band does not mean you are musically gifted. It has more to do with charisma which Squidward lacks. Because of this, I don’t believe this episode is relevant in this debate.


Pro mentions Squidward’s many success stories that do not involve the clarinet. If you read the transcripts of these episodes, you will see that SpongeBob is more responsible for these successes than Squidward is. Also, this would have only proved that Squidward is capable of becoming famous which is not what this debate is about.


Finally, I would like to make a quote from Squidward’s character page on SpongeBob wiki (which is a valid source considering both me and my opponent have used it.) “Squidward has a strong affection for interpretive dance, sculpture, painting, and playing the clarinet, but seems to have almost no talent for any of them whatsoever, although he does play the clarinet beautifully at the end of the "Christmas Who?", and at the end of the "Bubblestand" episode, also in "The Two Faces of Squidward".” This proves that Squidward has played the clarinet well which makes the statement “Squidward Tentacles just isn't musically gifted enough to play the Clarinet well” False.


Vote Con!! :D


Debate Round No. 4
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by Bigcheese3232 3 years ago
Bigcheese3232
I love this debate
Posted by isaiah589 3 years ago
isaiah589
I made some typos on that last round... sorry about that.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by TN05 3 years ago
TN05
isaiah589bazinga390Tied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: Very good debate. I believe Con gets the edge here - just slightly.