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State mandated administration of childhood vaccinations is justified

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 4/24/2012 Category: Health
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 4,149 times Debate No: 23170
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (5)
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This will be a PF-style debate. First round is accepting and constructive, second round crossfire. Third round will be rebuttals, fourth is final CX. Last round will be Final Focuses.

I affirm. Resolved: State mandated administration of childhood vaccinations is justified.

Contention 1: The status quo is not working
Subpoint A: Herd immunity is currently threatened.
With the current movement of parents refusing to vaccinate their children, the US's herd immunity strategy is being threatened. In 2006, 219 cases of mumps were reported in Iowa, well above Iowa's yearly average of 5 cases. 34% of those infected did not get the recommended immunizations. In February, PBS reported that there were 13 cases of measles following the Superbowl; all 13 of them had refused vaccination. The health of other communities around the United States is also threatened because of too-low vaccination levels. The CDC reports that In Montana, only 59% of children get common childhood vaccinations. Only 69% in Northern California received them. These levels are NOT adequate, as the CDC reports that levels of up to 95% are required to maintain herd immunity.
Because of the public health risk posed by the lack of herd immunity and because the state must protect its people, that state- mandated vaccinations are justified.

Subpoint B: Mandated vaccination is the only way to ensure that the HPV vaccination is administered.
Each year, HPV causes cancer in 15,000 females and 7,000 males. 6.2 million new cases are reported each year. Vamos, Mcdermott and Daley reported in 2008 that the HPV infection is prevalent in 25% of females from 14-19 years old and 45% of females 20-24. According to the CDC's 2010 National Immunization Survey, only 32% of female teens in the United States have fully received the recommended HPV vaccinations. Many parents refuse to vaccinate their children solely because they expect their children to remain virgins until marriage; they believe that the vaccine will give their children a green light to have sex. However, sexual intercourse is not always a result of choice. The Rape, Abuse, and Incest National Network reports that 1 out of every 6 American women has been a victim of rape in her lifetime. Even if a child follows the parents' expectations, there is still an uncomfortably large chance he or she may be raped. State-mandated childhood vaccinations are justified as the only realistic way to protect rape victims from HPV.

Contention 2: Mandatory Vaccinations protect those who are most vulnerable
Subpoint A: Mandatory Vaccinations will help those of lower economic classes.
Without mandates, the CDC stated, "Coverage for most vaccines remained lower for children living below poverty than children living at or above poverty." A study by Kievens and Luman noted, "The difference in estimated vaccination coverage between children living in severe poverty and those living above poverty was…10.0 percentage points in 1999." Furthermore, according to Stewart and Cox, the vaccination levels of children under 35 months old living in and near poverty was about 77%. This means one in four children living in or near poverty have not received adequate vaccinations. Without them, these children are much more vulnerable to common diseases that could easily be avoided. With state mandated childhood vaccination, these children will receive vaccinations that may save their lives.
Therefore, protecting the entire population, not just those who are better off, justifies state-mandated childhood vaccinations.

Subpoint B: Mandatory vaccination is key to protecting the safety of those who cannot get vaccinated for health reasons.
The health and lives of children who cannot be vaccinated are at risk from their parent's refusal to vaccinate their healthy children. "Those who cannot be vaccinated, including young babies, transplant, and cancer patients, depend on the immunity of the herd to protect them." Unvaccinated children can contract disease and spread it to those unable to be protected. "In 2008 in San Diego, a 7-year-old boy whose parents refused vaccines contracted measles while on a family trip to Switzerland. … the boy went to school and infected four other kids at school, after having already infected his two siblings. He then infected four other children who happened to be in the waiting room…. Three of those children were too young to have received their MMR vaccines. One of those infants was hospitalized; another traveled on an airplane while infectious." (Tatel, 09, The fact that those who are unable to get vaccinations are vulnerable to vaccine-preventable disease justifies mandating that the rest of the population receive the vaccination. Mandatory vaccinations protect both the minority and the majority.

For these reasons, I urge your strongest affirmative vote.



I Negate. Resolved: State mandated administration of childhood vaccinations is justified.

My First Contention: Many parents hold religious beliefs against vaccination.
Subpoint A: It is a direct violation of the 1st amendment in the Constitution to mandate the vaccination of any individual.
It is a direct violation of the 1st amendment in the Constitution to mandate the vaccination of any individual if it is a direct violation of their religious belief. These religions include (but are not limited to): Christianity, Mormonism, and Jehovah's Witnesses. 1st Amendment which guarantees citizens the right to the free exercise of their religion, as it can be quoted as saying "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;..."

My Second Contention: Common childhood vaccinations may cause rare yet serious reactions.
Subpoint A: These reactions can include anaphylactic shock, paralysis, and sudden death. This risk is not worth taking, especially considering most diseases vaccinated against are not necessarily life threatening. Vaccines can also trigger auto-immune disorders such as arthritis, multiple sclerosis, lupus, Guillain-Barr� Syndrome (GBS), and other disorders.
Vaccines can cause brain inflammation (encephalopathy) which can lead to death or permanent brain damage and disorders such as autism, ADD/ADHD, and other developmental problems. In addition, the vaccine additive thimerosal (found in most pre-1999 vaccines) has been associated specifically with the development of autism and is still found in certain meningococcal, tetanus, and flu vaccines such as the H1N1 vaccine.
Subpoint B: Vaccines clog and disrupt the lymphatic system with large foreign protein molecules (the active ingredients contained within vaccines) which may lead to lymphatic cancers such as leukemia and lymphoma. All vaccines cause immune system suppression, and can permanently damage the natural immune system. Unvaccinated children build and strengthen their immune systems through fighting off infection and developing natural immunity to diseases like measles and chickenpox. Artificial immunity, generated through vaccination, weakens the immune system and leaves children more vulnerable to all other diseases and infections.
Subpoint C: About 30,000 cases of adverse reactions to vaccines have been reported annually to the federal government since 1990, with 13% classified as serious, meaning associated with permanent disability, hospitalization, life-threatening illness, or death. According to the CDC, infants (children less than one year old) are at greatest risk for adverse medical events from vaccination including high fevers, seizures, and sudden infant death syndrome.

My Third Contention: Governments should not have the right to intervene in the health decisions parents.
Governments should not have the right to intervene in the health decisions parents make for their children. 31% of parents believe they should have the right to refuse mandated school entry vaccinations for their children, according to a 2010 survey by the University of Michigan. Extending the power of the Federal Government to this extent (ignoring it's violation of the Constitution) would be directly opposite of AT LEAST 31% of the populous. This would reflect poorly on the federal government.
Moshe Tishler and Yehuda Shoenfeld, "Vaccination May be Associated with Autoimmune Diseases," Isralie Medical Association Journal, July 2004
National Vaccine Information Center "Autism: Introduction to Autism Information," (accessed Jan. 8, 2010)
Joseph Mercola, "Vaccines and Immune Suppression," (accessed Jan. 5, 2010)
Richard Moskowitz, "The Role of Vaccines in Chronic Disease," (accessed Jan. 13, 2010)
Gary L. Freed, et al., "Parental Vaccine Safety Concerns in 2009," Pediatrics, Mar. 1, 2009
Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System, "About the VAERS Program,"
Debate Round No. 1


1. Why are Christians, Mormons, and Jehovah's Witnesses opposed to vaccination? (by the way, Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses are Christian.)
Are there other types of Christians that oppose vaccines? (Christian in a broad term)
How many parents of these said religions oppose childhood vaccinations?

2. How many children actually get these rare yet serious side effects?

3. Do people continue to get vaccinations made before 1999?

4. What scientific studies prove your second contention, subpoint B?

5. Are you advocating that instead of vaccinating, children should choose to strengthen their immune systems naturally?

6. Aren't very young children (under 1 year old) especially susceptible to disease, especially without vaccinations?

7. Do you believe that if a large percentage of the population favors/opposes something, the government should do as the population says?

8. Is one of the duties of the government to protect its citizens?

9. You state "Governments should not have the right to intervene in the health decisions parents make for their children". So, it is completely alright if a parent has a child with a life-threatening (but curable with proper medical care) condition but refuses medical care for that child, correct?
Should the government intervene when parents deprive their children of food?


"Why are Christians, Mormons, and Jehovah's Witnesses opposed to vaccination?"
The bible teaches that there are unclean animals and that we are not to put the unclean into our bodies (Deuteronomy 14). – Vaccines are made from blood products and tissue of animals.

"How many parents of these said religions oppose childhood vaccinations?"
Despite the numbers of those who are opposed to vaccinations on religious grounds, the constitution supports the right to practice religion freely. Mandating vaccinations imposes on the individuals ability to deny these vaccinations without being seen (in the legal world) as a criminal.

"How many children actually get these rare yet serious side effects?"
More than 12,000 adverse reactions to vaccines are reported each year. If the rate of under-reporting is considered, this number should be closer to 120,000. Vaccine-related deaths occurring each year may be over 1000. The compensation portion of the Vaccine Injury Act awards up to $250,000 if a child dies from a vaccination or millions in dollars to cover lifelong medical bills, pain and suffering in the case of a brain-damaged child. By 1997, more than $802 million had been awarded for hundreds of injuries and deaths (5000 cases, 700 of which were deaths). Thousands of cases are still pending and the estimated future liability for the government exceeds $1.7 billion.

"What scientific studies prove your second contention, subpoint B?"
Joseph Mercola, "Vaccines and Immune Suppression," (accessed Jan. 5, 2010). Feel free to also examine

"Are you advocating that instead of vaccinating, children should choose to strengthen their immune systems naturally?"
Not necessarily, but I do not think it is right to believe or claim that vaccination is the only way to protect public health and ensure that diseases disappear. The possibility that a child's immune system can overcome diseases still exists and is an alternative to vaccination. Practicing sanitation and cleanliness also helps to minimize the impact of diseases.

"Aren't very young children (under 1 year old) especially susceptible to disease, especially without vaccinations?"
Young children are susceptible to diseases, but this does not necessarily mean that vaccination is the reasonable alternative. Adults who come into contact with these young children, should be made aware of the impact of cleanliness and sanitation.

"Do you believe that if a large percentage of the population favors/opposes something, the government should do as the population says?"
It is in the governments and peoples best interest to keep opinion in mind. There is no legal coverage under which the federal government could reasonably mandate vaccination (as it is also, again, constitutionally violation), and this will be known if they were to attempt to ball a law similar to the one proposed.

"Is one of the duties of the government to protect its citizens?"
Protecting the citizens entitles protecting their constitutional rights as individuals.

"Should the government intervene when parents deprive their children of food?"
And the answer is yes, but the difference between food and vaccination is that the lack of food means direct physical harm to the child without any room for doubt. Not being vaccinated does not mean that the child is going to, without a doubt, catch a deadly or harmful disease. The difference lies in the effect it has on the child, and your comparison of these two items is unreasonable and shocking. These are two entirely different entities, as they also reflect two different mind-settings of the parent. If the parents denies a child food than they are, in one way or another, trying to inflict harm or deny the child of something that they couldn't live without. This is not the same for vaccination. A child CAN live without being vaccinated, and the child can pursue a happy life.

Vaccine, as defined by, is "a substance used to stimulate the production of antibodies and provide immunity against one or several diseases, prepared from the causative agent of a disease, its products..." This means that vaccinations themselves introduce small amounts of these diseases into the child's bodies in the hopes that their immune system can build up defenses against it. What is the possibility that these introduced organisms could be detrimental to the child's physical or mental health?

What are the long-term effects of the HPV vaccination you said should be mandated, in Contention 1 Subpoint B?

What evidence do you have that vaccination is always effective (using Measles, mumps, small pox, polio and Hib as examples)?

Why is vaccination a reasonable alternative to the naturally developed immune system?

What legal heading could the Federal Government put mandated vaccination under?

What Religions are not opposed to vaccination?

In terms of percentage, how effective is this vaccine after the first dose? After each subsequent dose?

Quantifiably speaking, what are the child's chances of catching Disease X if vaccinated? Unvaccinated? What about catching AND spreading it?

Do you have a list of ingredients for these vaccine/s suggested? Has there been any independent, longitudinal research on the safety of these ingredients?

Can you please tell me about studies done proving the safety of adjuvants, particularly aluminum?

Hepatitis B: Why does any newborn need Hep B, if the mother is negative, and Hep B is mainly transmitted through sexual contact or sharing needles?
Debate Round No. 2


1. While small side effects do occur, it is highly uncommon that these organisms will fire back.

2. "there are no known long-term side effects of the HPV vaccine" (1)

3. It's not always effective, and it's crucial that everyone be vaccinated to make sure that we can have herd immunity. Herd imm. levels account for the fact that vaccines don't work on everybody.

4. Why is vaccination a reasonable alternative to the naturally developed immune system?
Vaccines are the number one way to prevent disease. Let's turn to Japan as an example..."In 1974, Japan had a successful pertussis ...there were no deaths from pertussis. But then rumors began to spread that...that the vaccine was not safe, and by 1976 only 10% of infants were getting vaccinated. In 1979 Japan suffered a major pertussis epidemic, with more than 13,000 cases of whooping cough and 41 deaths." (2)

5. I don't understand the question.

6. Until you provide superior evidence, it should be assumed that NO religions oppose vaccinations.

7,8.You have not specified a vaccine or disease.

9. (3)

10. "The best way to answer this question is to look at people who are harmed by aluminum. These people can be divided into two groups: severely premature infants who receive large quantities of aluminum in intravenous fluids, and people with longstanding kidney failure who receive large quantities of aluminum, primarily in antacids. (The average recommended dose of antacids has about 1,000 times more aluminum than a vaccine does.) Both of these groups of patients can suffer brain dysfunction, bone abnormalities or anemia because of the very high quantities of aluminum that have accumulated in their bodies. For aluminum to be harmful, two criteria must be met: people must have kidneys that don’t work well or don’t work at all, AND they must receive very large quantities of aluminum for months or years. In these situations, a lot of aluminum enters the body and not enough leaves the body." (4)

11. The vaccine is most effective when administered to newborns. And because most kids grow up and have sex. Some even share needles.

1. Religions opposing vaccinations
The bible in its entirety is not taken literally by pretty much all Christians. The act of cornering one chapter or verse, as my opponent did, is the same way people used to justify racial discrimination. Because my opponent specified Mormons and JW's as types of religions who oppose vaccination, I'd like to provide evidence that refutes these claims.
-Mormons -- In a general conference address, Boyd Packer, one of the top guys in the Mormon Church, states, "We have little concern that our grandchildren will get the measles. They have been immunized and can move freely without fear of that." (5) Furthermore, I am a Mormon, and have received plenty of vaccinations.
-Jehovah's Witnesses. "The decision of whether to vaccinate themselves or their family is currently a decision made by the individual Witness." (6)

a. The Constitution = right to practice religion freely My opponent can't even prove that people who oppose vaccines on religious grounds do exist. Furthermore, no rights are absolute. Take Rastafarian. Although marijuana has a religious significance to them, marijuana is illegal in the United States. (7)
Honor killings are also a religious ritual to some Muslim extremists. In the US, honor killings are also illegal.
All in all, religious rights are already violated in US law. My opponent has no proof that people oppose vaccinations on a religious basis.

2. Rare, serious side effects
My opponent just copied-and-pasted her answer to my second question from
The numbers she provided have no scientific basis. Just because some website says something doesn't mean that its legitimate. Furthermore, children in the vaccine-receiving age are more likely to experience things such as seizures etc. with or without vaccinations. Concerning the Vaccine Compensation Program, of course many people will petition, as it would provide them with money. Of the 13,074 who have claimed injury since 1988, less than 3,000 have been compensated. ( This amounts to less than 150 per year. Additionally, Time reports "Injured parties may file for compensation without having to prove cause - they simply have to demonstrate that the injury occurred immediately after vaccination." (8)

3. My opponent failed to answer my 3rd question. Because she can't defend her point about thimerosil, it falls.

4. ",;

-These are both bad sources of evidence. For example, on, Mercola claims that microwaves are dangerous and alter the food's chemistry. He is also against homogenization, the process that makes everyone's milks SAFE. A visit to the front page already screams "NOT RELIABLE!" But digging deeper, we find that the site says, "The entire vaccine program is based on massive fraud". No reasonable person would believe this claim. Polio didn't just solve itself. Only after the vaccine did levels lower.

5. "Practicing sanitation and cleanliness also helps to minimize the impact of diseases." "The possibility that a child's immune system can overcome diseases still exists and is an alternative to vaccination."
6. "Adults who come into contact with these young children, should be made aware of the impact of cleanliness and sanitation."
It is irrational to expect children to practice good sanitation. Kids who like to play in the mud can't all be stopped, especially because there are parents who don't care about the whereabouts and activities of their children. Although some people can live a long life without getting vaccinations, it is because of HERD IMMUNITY, in which a large amount of the community gets a vaccination, which results in those not getting vaccinations to be generally safe form the disease because the disease can't thrive in the community.

7. "There is no legal coverage under which the federal government could reasonably mandate vaccination (as it is also, again, constitutionally violation)"
Again, rights are not absolute. The government can legally impose a vaccination, as they did in Jacobson v. Mass.

8. "Protecting the citizens entitles protecting their constitutional rights as individuals"
Again, these rights are not absolute. Above all, the US should try to protect the health and wellness of all of its citizens.

9. "A child CAN live without being vaccinated, and the child can pursue a happy life"
While a child can live without vaccinations, they are a lot more likely to get sick. For example, someone who has not received the mumps vaccine is 10 times more likely to get it. (9)
Sick =/= happy


C1: As I have shown, the religions my opponent has listed permit vaccinations. The first amendment is already violated concerning religious rights.
C2, A: Thimerosal falls: no one uses vaccines made before 1999. Autism: (10) There are brands of the meningcoccal, tetanus (classified under Tdap), flu/H1N1 vaccines that contain NO thimerosal. (11) People can choose to refuse a brand that contains thimerosal for a brand that has none. "Reactions" may not be caused by vaccines itself.
B: Evidence contains no link to scientific studies etc. Not a site managed by people with medical degrees. Information is not backed, and source cannot be trusted.
C:The Compensation program has flaws. As I have stated, the Nat'l Vaccine Compensation Program doesn't require proof that injuries occurred because of vaccines.
C3: Parent Authority is not unlimited. The government can already intervene in health decisions, as shown through social workers. The government frequently does things that 31% of the populous disagree with. For example, even though almost 50% of the population wants to legalize weed, the gov still hasn't.

all opponents' claims have been refuted.
my opponent's sources are in question.
Vote affirmative


Please, let me address my opponents disbelief in religious conflicts;


The bible teaches that there are unclean animals and that we are not to put the unclean into our bodies (Deuteronomy 14). – Vaccines are made from blood products and tissue of animals. (Read, ‘The Sanctity of Human Blood: Vaccination Is not Immunization' by Tim O'Shea for more on this).

Ye shall not eat of anything that dieth of itself; (Deuteronomy 14:21) and hut flesh with the life thereof, which is the blood thereof, shall ye not eat. (Genesis 9:4) – i.e. you should not be putting anything from an animal or its blood into your body.

What? Know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own. For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's. (I Corinthians 6:19,20) – i.e. your body is a temple which houses the Holy Spirit and so you have to look after it and not pollute it.

'"We must obey God rather than men." (Acts 5:29) – i.e. Vaccination is an artificial invention made by man to alter immune function. The immune system, on the other hand, is a natural function given by God to protect us from disease. Trusting in manmade vaccination is like saying that we think God didn't make us correctly and that we need artificially ‘boosting' in order to survive.

Mormons also refer to the bible in conjunction with the book of Mormon, so the above passages should apply to them also. As well as this, their organisation has made it clear they are against termination of pregnancy, and it is known that MMR, MR, Rubella, Varicella (Chickenpox) and other vaccines contain human diploid cells cultured from aborted foetuses.

The First Presidency, which is the governing body and highest ranking quorum in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, has said, "Abortion must be considered one of the most revolting and sinful practices in this day." (First Presidency (Spencer W. Kimball, N. Eldon Tanner, Marion G. Romney), Priesthood Bulletin, Salt Lake City, Utah: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, Feb. 1973, p. 1-2.

Clearly, if a Mormon then vaccinates their child with a vaccine containing aborted foetus, this constitutes a contradiction of faith. Their own founder, Joseph Smith, also stated: " Trust in God when sick, and live by faith and not by medicine or poison." (11th edition of the encyclopedia of Brittanica).

Catholics also have the same stance on termination and vaccination:

They called the use of human foetal tissue in vaccination, ‘a kind of evil which is widespread in biomedical research and which people rightly think they should combat when they can.
‘The practice of medicine is being made parasitic on the evils of abortion and foetal experimentation and refusing vaccination is one way of seeking to turn medicine from a course which will increasingly subvert people's confidence in it.' (Catholic Bishops Conference of England and Wales, 1994).
Jews also have strict dietary requirements as part of their religion and have to eat or take into the body, animal parts which are KOSHER.

Rabbi Simon Dahan recently highlighted this controversy with the latest bird flu scare, when it emerged that the bird flu vaccinations given to livestock may not be kosher, therefore rendering poultry products unsuitable for Jewish people:
"If they conduct the vaccination on the lungs or the neck, the animal might not be kosher anymore," Dahan said.

"According to Talmudic laws if the oesophagus or the trachea is mutilated, the animal is not considered kosher anymore," he added, considering that if the vaccination would be considered as some kind of mutilation by Jewish law. Furthermore, vaccinating the poultry in the leg might also be a problem because the operation might alter some the animal fragile nerves, which are supposed to stay untouched by the same Talmudic laws," (European Jewish Press, February 2006).
Vaccines for people may also be made with animals that aren't kosher, making them against Jewish law.
My opponent claims that the HPV vaccine is among those that should be mandated. The CDC reports that the vaccines do not protect against all HPV types— so they will not prevent all cases of cervical cancer. About 30% of cervical cancers will not be prevented by the vaccines, so it will be important for women to continue getting screened for cervical cancer (regular Pap tests). Also, the vaccines do not prevent other sexually transmitted infections (STIs). So it will still be important for sexually active persons to lower their risk for other STIs. The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) says that vaccination should occur for females ages 9 through 26 years and approved by CDC as safe and effective.
Under question 11, where did you get the information that supports your claim that the vaccination is more effective when administered to newborns? How many children share needles that can spread this disease?
When will these vaccinations be administered, and who will be checking to make sure that every individual will be receiving every vaccination? In the case of the HPV vaccination, how will the ages at which these vaccinations are administered differentiate?
9. Are all children going to get sick if they're not vaccinated?
My opponent displays complete disregard for the Constitutional rights of the individual, the very basis of which our three-branch government system was based upon.

They also communicate the belief that vaccination is the ONLY option to stop these diseases and maintaining the health of the community, which is completely ignoring our bodies natural approach to handling these diseases.

I have refuted my opponents claim that these religions permit vaccinations, as their religious texts, when read, directly address and prove this wrong.
Vote negation.

I will post more conflicting religious beliefs in the comments.
Debate Round No. 3


My opponent's arguments are entirely based on the fact that "it's against the religious doctrine. She assumes that everything the bible suggests remains relevant today. However, it is not. In regards to her last response:
1. Christians
a. Unclean animals: Christians eat these so-called "unclean" animals (pigs and shellfish) anyways.
b. Don't pollute your body: This passage can have various interpretations. Because it refers to your body housing the Holy Spirit, I believe a more correct interpretation would be concerning substances such as tobacco and alcohol, which can both mentally and physically hurt one's faith.
c. "We must obey God rather than men"- This passage could justify breaking any law because government is a man-made system. Breaking laws=bad.

2. Mormons
a. Aborted fetal tissue: Russell Nelson, a church authority states that abortions are permissible in health/rape/incest circumstances. (1) Furthermore, the "sin" has already been done. Vaccinating does not promote abortions.
b. "Live by faith, not medicine". When Joseph Smith was alive, medicine wasn't as efficient. Dallin Oaks, a president of the quorum of the 12 apostles, states, "When a person requested a priesthood blessing, Brigham Young would ask, “Have you used any remedies?” To those who said no because “we wish the Elders to lay hands upon us, and we have faith that we shall be healed,” President Young replied: “That is very inconsistent according to my faith. If we are sick, and ask the Lord to heal us, and to do all for us that is necessary to be done, according to my understanding of the Gospel of salvation, I might as well ask the Lord to cause my wheat and corn to grow, without my plowing the ground and casting in the seed. It appears consistent to me to apply every remedy that comes within the range of my knowledge, and [then] to ask my Father in Heaven … to sanctify that application to the healing of my body." Brigham Young, one of the Church's most prominent members in history, explains the absurdity in expecting faith alone to heal.

3. Catholics
Again, the "sin" has already occurred. The Catholic News Service states, "The Vatican urged parents to use caution when deciding not to inoculate their children against infectious diseases when so-called "ethical vaccines" are not yet available." (2)
Obviously, Catholics are still allowed to get vaccinations despite the fetal tissue. This evidence is the most superior because the Vatican is the head of the Catholic Church.

4. Jews
a. Bird flu is irrelevant. "Childhood Vaccinations" refers to the vaccines recommended on CDC schedules. (3) And livestock aren't Jews. Vaccinations are made from already existing animal cells, so the fact that livestock is being injected with un-Kosher vaccinations doesn't apply to today's debate. Ultimately, the evidence my opponent provides just shows that Jews may have to be more careful about what they eat.
b. There are other alternatives. (4) Contains a list of vaccines containing gelatin, a non-Kosher product. (5) Contains a list of vaccine brand names and alternatives. If one desires to vaccine Kosher, it is completely possible. For the Dtap, they can get Infanrix. Flu=Agriflu.
MMR (Measles, Mumps, Rubella)-Varicella=ProQuad.

5. Muslims
“The Gelatin formed as a result of the transformation of the bones, skin and tendons of a judicially impure animal is pure, and it is judicially permissible to eat it.” --1995 decision by the Islamic Organization for Medical Sciences in English and Arabic (8)

6. HPV
It is true that the HPV vaccine doesn't work against all strains of HPV. However, without a mandated vaccine, a large number of people would be getting HPV, although most cases would be PREVENTABLE. Although we can't completely eliminate it, we should try to minimize it to the best of our abilities.

7. Hep B and newborns
"In many cases, the hepatitis B virus passes from mother to baby during birth when the mother does not know she is infected. In other cases, the virus is spread to the baby during close contact with an infected family member, caregiver, or friend. Most people who are infected with hepatitis B do not feel sick and have no idea they carry this virus." (6)
-While it might not be the children themselves sharing needles, it is entirely possible that a person would use a dirty needle in their life. The key word is prevention. A kid could be running barefoot and step on a needle. A teen could be doing heroin. Even though these may not be the best choices, it is important to make sure that as few people as possible are infected with Hep B.

8. "When will these vaccinations be administered, and who will be checking to make sure that every individual will be receiving every vaccination? In the case of the HPV vaccination, how will the ages at which these vaccinations are administered differentiate?"
As this is a PF debate, I am not required to provide a plan. (7) However, the HPV vaccine, as well as all the other vaccines, will be administered according to the CDC's current schedule. (3)

9. "Are all children going to get sick if they're not vaccinated?"
No. But according to herd immunity, if 25% or more children don't vaccinate, disease will be able to thrive in their community. When disease thrives, it will infect many people in the community.

10. Constitutional Rights
As I have stated, no right is absolute. If this debate were to focus mainly upon rights, it should be that an individual should not be able to put the life of someone else in danger. By not vaccinating, parents would be putting the lives of their children in danger. They would also be putting the lives of those with weak immune systems in danger, which is by all means, NOT JUSTIFIED.

11. Vaccination is the most effective way to prevent disease. Our immune systems are not capable of conquering everything. As shown through my previous Japan example and throughout history, epidemics happen when people don't vaccinate.

All points refuted with more recent and more superior evidence.
Opponent's previous evidence is still in question. If it can't be defended, the claims in the second round should flow pro.
My case still stands.
It is only justified to mandate childhood vaccinations.
1. Is it preferable to vaccinate or to let the natural immune system try to fight off disease?
2. Is it typical Christian behavior to take the Bible literally?
3. Should everyone who wishes to get vaccinated be able to do so?
4. Is it right to put another person in danger?



maradygert forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4


  1. Remember, the Final Focus does not allow new arguments per PF rules.

    I have refuted all of the con's points with superior evidence and logic, while upholding my own points. Just to sum up the main arguments:

    1. Without a mandate, herd immunity will be threatened. A mandate is the only way to make sure that enough people will get vaccinated, and will ultimately remain healthy. Furthermore, it is not right to put someone else in danger if it can be helped. By depriving their children of vaccines, parents are not only putting their own children in danger, but also putting the children of others in danger. Referring back to my Contention 2, subpoint B, when people fail to vaccinate their children, kids with weak immune systems etc. can and will be hurt.

    2. Parents don't always make the best choices for their children. Diseases that cannot be be protected through herd immunity, such as tetanus, creates a greater need for everybody to get vaccinated. A child should not be forced to endure diseases such as tetanus because of a bad decision of their parents.

    3. Vaccines are expensive. If vaccines were mandated, those with less money would be able to get the vaccines.

    4. All of my opponent's "religious beliefs" claims have been proven to be incorrect. First and foremost, biblical word isn't taken literally. All of the religions my opponent brought up allow vaccinations.

    5. The constitution does not provide absolute rights. Furthermore, because my opponent cannot proven that any religions explicitly prohibit vaccines, this point falls in my favor.

    6. Vaccines are safe. If a parent is concerned about certain ingredients, they can get an alternative brand of vaccines.

    7. Vaccination is preferable to natural immune systems. (Refer to my Japanese example)

    8. It is preferable to give children vaccines: So they're safe throughout their life. It's more effective when given to children.

    Because of these reasons, I can only urge a Pro vote.



maradygert forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
5 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Posted by maradygert 4 years ago

Allah says, "We have indeed created man in the best of moulds." (95:4). The Arabic word in this verse is taqweem, which can be translated as mold, form, nature, constitution. Although this especially refers to the spiritual nature of man, it can also mean the mental and physical structure. There is no faulty in Allah's creation. Allah gave man the purest and best nature, and perfection and balance are evident in man's physical, mental, and spiritual composition. Allah, subhanahu wa ta'la, says,

"O mankind! What has made you careless concerning your Lord, the Most Generous? Who created you, fashioned you, and gave you due proportion; in whatever form He willed, He put you together." (Qur'an 82:6-8).
Posted by vmpire321 4 years ago

Vaccinations = biological shots used to develop immunity

State-mandated = the state forces you to take vaccinations.
Posted by Oldfrith 4 years ago
Let me rephrase: what are the state mandated vaccines?
Posted by Oldfrith 4 years ago
Question: What are statemadated vaccines?
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