Suicide because of bullying is more unacceptable than bullying itself.
I have made this debate impossible to accept (or at least I think I did). Please leave a comment if you wish to compete. Or if it didn't work for me, feel free to just accept it! :)
I will be saying "yes, Suicide because of bullying is more unacceptable than bullying itself" It is immoral and a stupid thing to do and society should focus more on 'stop suicide' instead of 'stop bullying'
In this case the definition of
1. suicide: Killing oneself because of others who bully them/depression.
2. unacceptable: immoral, stupid, socially unacceptable and should be more focused on in comparison to bullying. ie society should say: "Bullying is bad, suicide is worse"
3. bullying: Can be bullying to any extent or the average 'high-school' bully.
Please try to keep each round over 1500 characters if possible. :)
I'll start off:
Bullying is something that will never be resolved. It will always be there because there can be no happiness without sadness. To know what happiness is, you must understand what [emotional] pain is. By killing yourself because of all the insults, you are simply saying to yourself that you don't deserve happiness. You are saying to yourself that you are weak and undeserving of life.
Bullying is like every other thing in life. Everyone will go through something bad in their life, something horrible. No matter who you are. Rich, poor, black, white, girl, boy, everyone will go through something bad!
Life isn't perfect and it'll never be and to think that you are deserving of a better life means that you are just attention seeking and pathetic and weak. To take your own life because of the tragedies you've suffered mean you are selfish and uncaring for all the people you are going to hurt. To think that you are the only one's who's ever suffered means you are stupid and purely self-centered
So let's start ( anyways I will just do more COPY PASTE OF WHAT I SAID but I'll refrain from being personal as well)
Suicide is taking away one's life, but in your topic, through BULLYING.
What is exactly BULLYING?
According to Wikipedia:
Bullying is the use of force, threat, or coercion to abuse, intimidate, or aggressively impose domination over others. The behavior is often repeated and habitual. One essential prerequisite is the perception, by the bully or by others, of an imbalance of social or physical power. Behaviors used to assert such domination can include verbal harassment or threat, physical assault or coercion, and such acts may be directed repeatedly towards particular targets. Justifications and rationalizations for such behavior sometimes include differences of class, race, religion, gender, sexuality, appearance, behavior, body language, personality, reputation, lineage, strength, size or ability.
Your definition of bullying was unsatisfactory.
The human body may take physical pains but emotional problems are critically dangerous to the one"s psychological aspect. And this psychological aspect I am referring is highly connected to one's thinking process and may lead to DEATH.
If that is not dangerous hannachoi I don't know what it is.
Moving on, suicide because of bullying takes away one"s life and may encourage others to do the same.
Now you may say that this is what makes "suicide because of bullying" more unacceptable.
But it only proves how DANGEROUS, CRITICAL, DESTRUCTIVE and more UNACCEPTABLE bullying is.
Generally speaking, one will not honestly kill his or her own self if he/she is not BULLIED.
Can you see the impact brought by bullying?
Suicide is not only the result of bullying. Isolation and being anti-social may occur. Anger may develop deep inside and one may not be able to connect to his/her own family. There are more results of BULLYING.
To wrap up, in life nothing is absolute, cases like BULLYING can never be stopped.
SUICIDE is not the right solution but that doesn't give suicide because of bullying the edge to be more unacceptable than bullying itself. Thank you.
You said that bullying can damage one's psychological aspect and can lead to thinking about suicide or actual suicide. But the ‘thinking’ happens in the ‘victim’s’ brain. A lot of people have been bullied throughout their lives including me and everyone at some point will think or have thought of suicide as a way out. The rational people will say "Hey. I'm stronger than this. I will NOT kill myself!" and irrational people...you know.
The point I am trying to make is that society focusestoo much on bullying and not enough on suicide itself resulting in a giving suicide a positive look. It makes suicide seem almost alluring. If you kill yourself, all the pain will go away…
The focus on bullying should die down alot and the focus on the negatives of taking one's life should be looked into. Bullying is one of thecauses of suicide. We should focus on the problem at hand, not just one of the causes. If there were a disease, you would try to treat to the disease itself, not the symptoms, right?
To conclude, the thought of suicide crosses everyone’s mind sometime but most people are strong and make sure they can pull through. But others will think of suicide as something great, they’ll see it as freedom because nobody calls it ‘an unacceptable thing to do, a pathetic and weak thing to do’. Bullying may be the cause of suicide, but no one can make you do something. Suicide is an option.
You mentioned many things in your second paragraph (you were able to mention few things about factors and "encourage") but those OTHER points (where you mentioned PITY and many more), you were not able to expand and support your argument concerning our debate topic.
According to you, no matter how bad one's life is he should not take it (bullying). How sure are you that all of those "victims" can manage to be strong? Research proves that even adults have hard time in defending themselves against bullying.
Doesn't that show how bullying already crossed the line and how more unacceptable it is even for older people? I mean, in the state of the world we are living in, BULLYING is everywhere, in the streets, in school, in offices of large and small companies and even at home, this is very visible around us and even to anyone who is reading this cannot deny that point.
You mentioned this, "The point I am trying to make is that society focuses too much on bullying and not enough on suicide itself"."
EXACTLY, because society thinks BULLYING is more unacceptable.
You continued, "Resulting in a giving suicide a positive look. It makes suicide seem almost alluring. If you kill yourself, all the pain will go away""
HOW EFFECTIVE IS THAT POINT? HAVE YOU SHOWN ON THAT?? Just because society prioritizes BULLYING instead of "suicide because of bullying" doesn't mean it gives suicide a positive look, right?
I mean, if you have a disease and you focus too much on the reasons of your disease not on the disease itself, do you give the disease a POSITIVE look? OF COURSE NOT! You may ask, "Why would I focus on the reasons of my disease?"
Well, to avoid having the same disease by knowing and avoiding its factors.
In your analogy, " We should focus on the problem at hand, not just one of the causes. If there were a disease, you would try to treat to the disease itself, not the symptoms, right?"
You were trying to say that the disease is the SUICIDE and the symptom is BULLYING.
YOU KNOW SYMPTOMS ARE NOT THE CAUSES OF A DISEASE RIGHT? I mean, if you have a fever, a symptom for DENGUE, does that mean the fever is a cause for Dengue?
I know SUICIDE because of bullying is a BIG PROBLEM but you're wrong, the problem at hand is not that, it is BULLYING. The world's major problem right now is BULLYING wherein kids tend to push themselves to give up or fight back, this is very evident everywhere, just like what I mentioned in my 4th paragraph.
Of course someone or something can PUSH you to do something. When you're tired and sleepy and you don't want to study, yet you still PUSH yourself to study because of your exams your school implemented, doesn't it show that VICTIMS ARE BEING FORCED to do things they think they can but deep inside them, they don't want to.
RELATING TO "SUICIDE BECAUSE OF BULLYING"
Suicide in that case is not a CHOICE it is an EFFECT.
Why would somebody commit suicide if he/she is not bullied? Of course victims wanted to escape their own misery, others just commit suicide, but why? IT IS BECAUSE OF THE "MISERY", it is because of bullying.
HOW DOES ONE PERSON BENEFIT FROM SUICIDE? Is it because he/she can escape this cruel world?
To wrap up, it is very hard to escape bullying. ALL OF US HAVE OUR OWN CHOICE and OUR OWN DECISIONS, but we won't come to think of something like that if it is not BECAUSE OF SOMETHING. Suicide is a choice, but SUICIDE BECAUSE OF BULLYING is not a CHOICE, it is an EFFECT. You my friend, if you are not bullied, would you kill yourself?
The topic is "Suicide because of bullying is more unacceptable than bullying itself." I was saying bullying only plays a part in a suicide and that bullies CANNOT plant the thought of suicide into another's head. The main reason they want to commit suicide is NOT because of bullying but because of the 'reward' they think they can gain from it. That is why suicide is more unacceptable. It's not 100% (not even 70%) the bully's fault.
You said: "How sure are you that all of those "victims" can manage to be strong? Research proves that even adults have hard time in defending themselves against bullying." Yes, they do have a hard time defending themselves but they still don't commit suicide. Why? Because they're strong. Research didn't prove that adults suicide as well.
I agree, bullying is everywhere. But that's the problem. There are bullies everywhere you go (you said: "in the streets, in school, in offices of large and small companies and even at home") So if bullying is EVERYWHERE, why are we working so hard to stop it? There aren't as many cases of suicide so why don't we work on that instead? To let it prioritize over bullying?
If our goal was to stop suicide, to show people how bad it is, how much worse than bullying it is, then people will start to listen and the amounts of suicides will drop dramatically. If we stopped making a big deal and feeling sorry for those who've already killed themselves, people will see that suicide will no longer make others feel the way they want them to feel and that they won't make a huge difference in our world, they'll think twice about it. And wouldn't that also make a change in bullying? The bullies won't get the same reactions they want so the amount of bullying will also drop.
"Society thinks BULLYING is more unacceptable." Key word being 'thinks'. Society should make SUICIDE more unacceptable.
"Just because society prioritizes BULLYING instead of "suicide because of bullying" doesn't mean it gives suicide a positive look, right?"
Society is giving suicide a positive look by feeling sorry for the people who committed suicide. Everyone feels sorry for that person including all the celebrities. Who wouldn't want celebrities to talk about them? The reason society makes suicide seem positive is by focusing TOO much on bullying and not ENOUGH on suicide. So little, that people think it's OK to do it. If we changed it around so that we prioritize suicide, more and more people will frown upon it and the suicide numbers will drop.
"if you have a disease and you focus too much on the reasons of your disease not on the disease itself, do you give the disease a POSITIVE look?" I was comparing bullying to symptoms of a disease. Besides, people today focuses on curing the disease itself anyway. If someone had cancer, you would remove the tumour causing it instead of constantly giving that person pain killers for the pain, right? Bullying is causing pain but suicide is the deciding blow.
You compared suicide to forced study because of exams and you said "but deep inside them, they don't want to." That is wrong. Deep inside, people want to commit suicide (and want to get good grades, but that off topic). Suicide is an option. No one can make you do anything. Drugs is an option, homicide is an option, to argue is an option. EVERYTHING IS AN OPTION.
If someone were holding a gun to your head and told you to give you all your money, you still have a choice. To die or not to die. To scream? To fight? To 'emergency call' the police? You will always have a choice. Bullying + misery does not = suicide. In most cases, it will equal a stronger person. A person who can take any insult and yet not be harmed by it. A person who will eventually get tired of the harassment and will eventually tell the bullies to STOP.
Like I've said before, suicide is an option as are many other things. It is a choice a person makes when they feel like they have been completely destroyed. Some people will take drugs to fill the emptiness. They both do it because of misery by why is one more frowned upon than another? Of course, one is more fatal but what if the reasons are exactly the same? Say, both people are doing it because someone at school is harassing them. Why is a person who takes drugs called an 'drug abuser' while someone who suicides is called a 'victim of suicide'. 'Abuser' and 'victim' but both for the exact same reasons. Why?
The people who commit suicide need to understand that life is unfair. You will not always get what you want in life and that is something you have to deal with, not run away from. People understand that at different stages of their lives. They might understand that when a close relative dies or from what they see in movies or from experience i.e. being bullied. Life is unfair. That is a fact and people who commit want suicide need to understand. Some of them refuses to understand and kills themselves anyway. That is what is unacceptable. They think they are the only people who have ever suffered, they don't care that there may be people suffering worse. They think their life must be perfect and if it's not, there's no point in living (to clarify: the 'imperfection' being bullying).
Although bullying may be terrible, the thought of suicide happens all in the victim's head. They think they deserve better than everyone else and because they don't have it, they kill themselves. That is why suicide is more unacceptable than bullying.
"You my friend, if you are not bullied, would you kill yourself?" No, I wouldn't. And if I were bullied (which I have been) I STILL wouldn't kill myself.
Sources from youtube video by @ rob dyke
Are we blaming the victims for committing suicide? Of course not! If a girl did commit suicide, it is because she can't take it, it is because BULLYING is already out of hand and just proves that it is really more unacceptable.
YOU MENTIONED ABOUT A REWARD they'll get from it? PLEASE SPECIFY.
It is estimated that 160,000 children miss school every day due to fear of attack or intimidation by other students. Source: National Education Association.
282,000 students are physically attacked in secondary schools each month.
71% of students report incidents of bullying as a problem at their school.
That does not show suicide but a minor cause of BULLYING. Even in that simple way (of not hurting themselves), doesn't that show the great impact of BULLYING to the children?
How sure are you that adults can't manage BULLYING.
Bullying Caused Women"s Suicide, Inquiry Told.
That article talks about the death of a woman caused by BULLYING in her workplace.
We cannot deny the point that BULLYING already caused SUICIDE to adults, there are more incidents about that.
You rebutted my point that bullying is everywhere by saying, " So if bullying is EVERYWHERE, why are we working so hard to stop it? "
IT IS BECAUSE BULLYING IS MORE UNACCEPTABLE. Why aren't we stopping SUICIDE? (you mentioned that before)
Because the WORLD presumes BULLYING to be very severe and something that must be stopped. We can't question that point?
YOU KNOW WHY? THAT IS REALITY. THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT'S HAPPENING AROUND US even though it's very hard to change and ACCEPT that.
REMEMBER you said, " So if bullying is EVERYWHERE, why are we working so hard to stop it? " and you said, "Bullying is something that will never be resolved. ". You showed a little contradiction to your point. Anyways, we are indeed WORKING HARD to stop BULLYING. Is there any progress? If bullying is not MORE UNACCEPTABLE there would be at least an improvement.
Why are professionals making seminars about BULLYING? Not about SUICIDE BECAUSE OF BULLYING? Another evident example of how bullying overpowers its effects.
IN THE SECOND PARAGRAPH OF MY OPPONENT'S REBUTTAL,
my opponent was not able to STICK to the topic and to the argument
Our argument is "Suicide because of bullying is more unacceptable than bullying itself." And we should argue more on how Suicide because of bullying is MORE UNACCEPTABLE than BULLYING itself, or the other way around. Not on what we should DO to stop bullying and suicide.
"Society should make SUICIDE more unacceptable.", how effective is that point?
I mean, if society made Suicide more unacceptable, how? By showing how severe the effects of suicide is? By showing how bad it is? Doesn't that show how WORSE BULLYING is?? That because of bullying, suicide is taking place. That if there is LESS bullying, there will be LESS suicides?
"Society is giving suicide a positive look by feeling sorry for the people who committed suicide." WHAT? Are you saying that if you are sick and I feel sorry that you are sick, does that mean your sickness is a positive thing for me? I don't think so.
Your point is repeating, Society does not give SUICIDE a positive look just because it prioritizes bullying. Pity does not give a positive outlook to the DISEASE.
"So little, that people think it's OK to do it.", sorry my dear opponent but you are making a Debate Fallacy. Just because you proved that everyone knows how to pity such thing, does not mean everyone gives that thing a POSITIVE look and everyone thinks that is okay. I pity you when you are sick, do you think it is alright for me to be sick as well?
" I was comparing bullying to symptoms of a disease." EXACTLY, I know you meant that, but your analogy of CAUSE and EFFECT was wrong. You can't have the symptoms to be the cause of the disease.
"Bullying is causing pain but suicide is the deciding blow." BULLYING is the one that caused the pain and the deciding blow.
I guess you misunderstood my analogy, what I meant is that they don't want to STUDY at that moment, I did not mention anything of NOT having good grades.
"Deep inside, people want to commit suicide"
Why? Why would they commit suicide in the first place? What is that thing that pushes them to do suicide, what is that thing that gave them the idea of committing suicide? Isn't it bullying?
Just like what I said, Suicide is indeed an option, but suicide because of bullying (OUR MAIN ISSUE HERE) is an effect, that's why we have the conjunction "because". Drug is an option? But how about "drugs because of medications" isn't that an effect?
I am not saying that we don't have a choice, just like what I said in my previous argument, we all have our own choices and decisions, but what do you think pushed us to do such thing? What do you think made us fight? Is it only our choice to fight? As a debater and as the CONS of this argument, I am not taking away our rights to have our own choices, I just want to prove that there are times that things won't go the way we planned, there will be a time that we will be pushed to do such thing, and to make that choice and the choice I mentioned is the effect of what we've felt under the control of fear and danger.
"Say, both people are doing it because someone at school is harassing them. Why is a person who takes drugs called an 'drug abuser' while someone who suicides is called a 'victim of suicide'. 'Abuser' and 'victim' but both for the exact same reasons. ", I am not arguing about the difference between victim of suicide and drugs abuser but to defend my point and TO STICK TO OUR TOPIC (very necessary), both of them are victims of harassment, right? Isn't it a type of bullying? I mean, they both experienced depression that's why they did such thing.
Doesn't that show how MORE UNACCEPTABLE BULLYING is? If not, then you should have said that Drugs because of bullying is also more unacceptable than bullying itself. At the end of the day, the choice the abuser made is still the EFFECT of bullying which is very unacceptable.
"The people who commit suicide need to understand that life is unfair", and to think that life is unfair is because life is not treating them well right? And it is because of our society right? To relate to our issue, life being unfair is the result of BULLYING.
" Some of them refuses to understand and kills themselves anyway. That is what is unacceptable. "
What's unacceptable is the BULLYING they experienced that made them REFUSE TO UNDERSTAND AND KILL THEMSELVES.
"Although bullying may be terrible, the thought of suicide happens all in the victim's head. "
And the thought of suicide you are talking about is also caused by bullying.
You may say that I focus too much on BULLYING being a CAUSE but it can't be stopped. I know, it can't be stopped, but what's the use of these these seminars and life lessons? Lessons that prove how MORE UNACCEPTABLE BULLYING is.
You answered NO to my question, which proves that bullying is indeed an effect. But you countered it back with " And if I were bullied (which I have been) I STILL wouldn't kill myself.", that is YOU. That is your OWN decision, just like what I mentioned again we have our own choices which is the EFFECT of our own situation.
SUICIDE is very bad and unacceptable, but how much more is BULLYING? People come up to different kinds of resulted decisions, they tend to make things they don't really have to do, overall, it is because of what we call BULLYING.
Society is making BULLYING to be more unacceptable and I did not say anything about making suicide positive. If you were paying attention to some of my previous points my dear opponent, I mentioned that focusing to much on something does not give another a positive look. Your arguments are not that effective since giving more attention to BULLYING, we don't give suicide a positive look. For the victim's perspective, suicide is the solution. They think that it is the"good" solution but they also know that it is NOT the "right" solution. We all know the difference between GOOD and RIGHT. And we all come to think between the WRONG and RIGHT solution. When there is a problem, we tend to think for a solution, and of course we BRAINSTORM for POSSIBLE solutions, if you were able to think of one, does it mean to be CORRECT immediately? We are being PUSHED to think that it is CORRECT because of our situation (for our topic's case, because of BULLYING) which just proves how unacceptable that situation might be.
To further support my stand, DEPRESSION is caused by BULLYING right? Research proves depression can mean just being in low spirits. It doesn't stop you leading your normal life, but makes everything harder to do and seem less worthwhile. At its most severe, major depression can be life-threatening (http://www.mind.org.uk...). It also proves that the mind cannot focus much and think well during depression wherein the solutions the victim can think might be the wrong remedy, that once again proves the dangers of BULLYING.
" Society is saying 'if you kill yourself, you'll be free'. That is why suicide is more unacceptable than bullying."
NO, BULLYING is more unacceptable because it MAKES society say that if one kills himself he will be free. Which is not a benefit. BULLYING makes our world a terrible place and makes the people think terrible, that is unacceptable right? But it does not give the edge to be more unacceptable than bullying itself, and I was able to mention WHY from my previous arguments in the past rounds.
People blame drug-abusers for taking drugs, but shouldn't we focus AGAIN on blaming the cause? Blaming depression which pushed them to do so, take note, PUSHED them, which they will not actually do if they were not forced in the first place. In the 3rd round you said that,
" Besides, people today focuses on curing the disease itself anyway. If someone had cancer, you would remove the tumor causing it instead of constantly giving that person pain killers for the pain, right? " HOW DO WE GET TO CURE THE DISEASE without CURING IT'S CAUSES? If you analogized the tumor to BULLYING, the tumor caused the disease (suicide) that's why we are getting rid of it. And you were agreeing on my side.
"Victims of a murderer do not have a choice but people who suicide do. That is why suicide should take priority. The show people that thereisa choice.", of course victims of murder have a choice but whatever their choice may be it is because of their own situation, to fight back? To call the cops? To give up? Aren't these choices BECAUSE they are in that situation? I agree there is a choice, but the point I am trying to make is we won't choose that choice if it is not because of how TERRIBLE and more UNACCEPTABLE our situation is.
"I have. The reward they get is: people noticing them, celebrities talking about them, people calling them pretty or saying they wish they were their friend and the opportunity to make the bullies feel bad.", Are you serious my dear opponent?! In the first place, people don't commit suicide to have THOSE rewards. If someone killed herself because of BULLYING it is because she doesn't want people to NOTICE her but to ESCAPE her misery. And that is not a reward, that is PITY, is PITY a reward? No! If bullying made bullies feed bad, why isn't it stopping even though cases of SUICIDE are enormous?
" Of course many people report incidents of bullying but hardly anyone reports incidents of suicide. " EXACTLY, because BULLYING is more unacceptable.
Of course we can tell our children how bad suicide is but we should also tell them how WORSE bullying is. That if we told them that bullying causes these and those and told them a bully's perspective, of course they'll avoid bullying. All we can do is just avoid the cause of them being a bully and of them being bullied. How? Of course ethics, morals, guidance and more.
In your 5th paragraph, you are agreeing that BULLYING is more unacceptable than SUICIDE. How? You said the "easier to change" is suicide, am I right? Which proves how hard BULLYING is and how more unacceptable it is. You mentioned that bullying's improvement is slow which agrees to my point.
That's the risk of SUGGESTING solutions, it's a slippery slope situation. And how effective are those solutions, how effective can they be to drop the cases of suicide dramatically? In our world today, in our society and the way it treats BULLYING, I doubt.
Bullying encourages others to bully someone or other people, which then increases suicide. "If he can bully that girl, it means I can bully that boy too". That proves bullying is indeed more unacceptable.
Celebrities talking about you is not POSITIVE. It is even worse because they negatively talk about how MISERABLE the victim's life was because of bullying, is that positive? I don't think so.
"That is exactly what I'm arguing. Bullying is NOT the cause of suicide." BULLYING is the cause of suicide. That is a fact and you can't question that. SO, to relate to our topic, what caused suicide then if not bullying? Choice? Then what led them to that choice? Of course it's BULLYING.
"Also, you shot yourself in the foot with "what is that thing that gave them the idea of committing suicide?" because your first sentence was "Bullies don't plant the thought..." What I meant to the first question was BULLYING which gave them the idea. BULLIES do not plant the thought. The doer does not plant the thought but the the action, that is if you were paying attention to my arguments.
"which I believe they do but my point is suicide-because-you-don't-have-happiness is unacceptable", you should have changed the debate title then.
" come up with a plan yourself. Isn't that what we do in debating?" EXACTLY, we plan BECAUSE we want to win, we wan't to prove something right or wrong. That's exactly why our choices are effects." I chose to eat cause I'm hungry. I chose to debate cause I want to prove something, I chose suicide cause of bullying which pushes me."
you said " If they can persuade people to stop bullying, they must be able to stop suicides.", EXACTLY, persuade to stop bullying because it is more unacceptable than suicide.
To wrap up, bullying does not affect ONE person in general. It affects the bullies and the witnesses around them. BULLYING affects more than suicide. The fear it gives to the victims and to the witnesses, the negative confidence it gives to the bullies and to other superiors, the depression it causes that disconnects FAMILY and distracts education and society and the painful reality it proves about our world. There's nothing RIGHT about being WEAK but why is that it is very hard to fight against bullying? Why are others STRUGGLING to fight back, while others GIVE UP? Don't you think it is because of how SEVERE BULLYING IS? If one of my friends killed himself, of course I would be disappointed to the same reason of yours but I would be MORE disappointed to why BULLYING EXISTS. It always breaks my heart to think that EVEN BULLIES DID NOT MEAN TO HURT OTHERS BUT THEY STILL DO. Why? It goes back to the bully's ENVIRONMENT.
BULLYING EXISTS, that's the PAINFUL "FACT", and we can't stop it. If we can stop SUICIDE not BULLYING, doesn't that show how more unacceptable BULLYING is?
This is the message society should work on. To show how truly unacceptable suicide is and how it should take priority over bullying. We should stop learning about bullying and focus on suicides because that is what is causing all the trauma, the tears, the pity and the even more suicides.
Another problem with our world is that we try to prevent things after it has happened. We only try to prevent bullyingbecause people suicide from it. Repeat: we try to prevent bullying Because Of Suicides. What we should do is focus on stopping suicides. Why? Because of suicides, of course. We should try to prevent people from killing themselves in the first place rather than focus on the so-called cause of it.
My opponent is trying to say that we should FOCUS more on suicide, that we NEED to tell them that it is wrong, that we should CHANGE society's outlook, and MAKE it more unacceptable than bullying, but these points were only his/her opinions which then proves what is REALLY happening in our world right now, that BULLYING is still more UNACCEPTABLE than suicide, because he/she's trying to make a CHANGE, but our goal here is only to PROVE why it is more unacceptable not to show WHAT TO DO to make it more unacceptable.
My dear opponent we are only spinning in circles with your point about making it POSITIVE, but my previous points were able to prove you wrong cause your rebuttals are still the same and not changing.
I disagree with your point about shooting my self in the foot, just like what I said, depression caused by bullying, making the victim think that SUICIDE is the right solution. Now, that's a reason to support my stand.
Your points in the SECOND paragraph were not strong enough. It is because it all goes back to the BULLYING that caused the child's death and caused the depression and the mother's death. That choice they made was because of BULLYING which is only more unacceptable.
Once again, in my opponent's 3rd paragraph, points were trying to make a CHANGE and not PROVING how more unacceptable suicide is.
In the 4th paragraph, it is still making a change, you said, "Our world focuses on how bad drugs are so peopleknow it's bad. If we show people how bad suicide is, they willknow it's bad too and will decide against it.", your point here is to tell how bad suicide is, but doesn't prove WHY? Our world is showing how bad BULLYING is that's why you asked to do an ACTION in making suicide bad, so it just proves the reality and the evidence it gives on how more UNACCEPTABLE BULLYING is.
" In fact, I was saying the exact opposite. I was comparing bullying to symptoms and by treating to symptoms, it will make no difference on the disease." JUST LIKE WHAT I SAID, YOU CAN'T HAVE BULLYING TO BE THE SYMPTOMS, explanations are on the previous arguments and you know that.
I disagree in your 6th par., I was able to give ENOUGH explanation, of course you do have a choice but that choice is just a RESULT of what is happening around you.
"Victims of amurdererdo not have a choice because they would not have seen it coming (as long as the murderer's smart and clean) but if someone were holding a gun to your head and told you to give them all your money, you do have a choice. Please do not twist my words." YOU ARE CONTRADICTING YOUR OWN POINT. Even though they would not have seen it coming they would still have a RESULTED CHOICE., it is just like what you said, remember? ", you do have a choice."
I wasn't twisting your words, I was correcting your words, your CHOICES are RESULTED CHOICES because of the situation.
In your 7th paragraph, you're still making a CHANGE on what society's doing, which then agrees to my point. Were you able to site more examples? Just because you proved one doesn't mean all of them wanted THOSE REWARDS you mentioned. Some just wanted to escape from BULLYING not to be PITIED, if you killed yourself because people are bullying you, is it because you wanted others to mention how beautiful you are? Of course not! It is because you don't want to be BULLIED anymore.
"Bullying is much worse than suicide so it's OK to do it if you're bullied." , the message you saw from that was WRONG. That's why we are saying that BULLYING is WORSE to say that SUICIDE is BAD. And that doesn't show that it is OK. Hunger caused by society is worse than stealing because of hunger caused by society, was I saying that stealing is OK? No!
JUST TO RECAP WHAT I MENTIONED my dear opponent, we're here TO PROVE NOT TO SHOW WHAT TO DO , we should be telling facts on what is happening around us to support out argument, not showing UNDONE ACTIONS to be able to support our points. " I said that it is easier to stop suicide than to stop bullying because, let's face it, we are progressing much too slowly.", EXACTLY, suicide is easier, bullying is HARDER, that's why we are progressing slowly, isn't that already an evidence why BULLYING is more unacceptable?
In your 10th paragraph, if you understood my SUMMARY, you were unable to understand why. I wasn't replacing your words I was expanding it to support my argument. It gives others NEGATIVE CONFIDENCE to bully inferiors, that is my point and that is exactly what is happening in schools right now.
"Suicide is a choice and no one can force you nor "push" you to make that choice." NO! Of course, AGAIN, someone or something can push you to do that choice, it is your RESULTED DECISION to commit suicide or not if you were not BULLIED, as you see, VICTIMS would really stop suicide if BULLYING them stopped as well.
" You chose suicide because you are too weak to stand up for yourself and because the world did not tell you "No". They did not try to stop it so you though it OK.", NO, you became weak because of BULLYING, you lost confidence and self-esteem, that's why you could not fight for yourself. The world was not able to tell you NO because of BULLYING, see? It is very SEVERE just to push the victim to think that the world is against you.
I disagree, I wasn't contradicting my side. My dear opponent if you were able to understand my rebuttals, they weren't empty, the EVIDENCE is your STATEMENT, you can then scan our previous arguments. Your STATEMENTS were telling reality and I was expanding why is that reality? It is because it proves how hard, painful and destructive BULLYING is, just enough reason to say it is MORE UNACCEPTABLE than suicide. Why am I saying those points? It is because you yourself contradicted your own side by, AGAIN exposing REALITY.
MY FINAL POINTS
Suicide did not cause our weaknesses, BULLYING does. One is strong, but BULLYING just destroys it through lowering the self-esteem, the confidence, the belief, the power to shine and increases FEAR, HATE, ANGER and DEPRESSION. We can't blame them for being weak, we cannot force them to stand up all by themselves. Just like you, do you really have to stand up if your foot hurts SO MUCH? If you can't, should I be disappointed at you like that? just like how disappointed you are to the victims? NO! Because I know your limitations. We all have our own limitations. But friends help us, so as a FRIEND, I will CARRY you to help and save you. But what is BULLYING doing? It takes away FRIENDSHIP for the FEAR of being BULLIED as well. It takes away one's courage to help you for the fear of getting hurt by bullies. REALITY HURTS SO MUCH.
I remembered that you said SUICIDE is not caused by BULLYING now you're taking it back. How can we stop people from killing themselves if we won't tell them how CRUEL its CAUSE is. I know, taking away one's life is bad, but how much more is the cause for it? Right?
Once again, from the way you wanted SUICIDE to be changed to something more unacceptable, it just proves how MORE UNACCEPTABLE BULLYING is right now that's why you are insisting for an action.
To end this, BULLYING is a widespread virus that kills, it can't be stopped but it can be avoided just like how FIREWALLS in our computers are used against viruses. We can't stop it, a reason, an evidence, a FACT, isn't it enough to PROVE how MORE UNACCEPTABLE it is? Why? I can't accept that it cannot be stopped, that we have no chances of destroying it. However, GOD is great to help us, I know suicide (its result) is not the right answer but it can be stopped, it can be changed (just like what you're saying), and that is ACCEPTABLE for me, you know why? Cause it gives me HOPE against that UNACCEPTABLE BULLYING.
Thanks for making this debate great and thrilling hannachoi. I appreciated your WORDS OF ENCOURAGEMENT, and I learned so much. Hope you learned something as well :D.
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