The Instigator
draxxt
Pro (for)
Winning
49 Points
The Contender
mongeese
Con (against)
Losing
45 Points

Supreme Court's rulings for unconstitutional actions in schools has offset the balance of power

Do you like this debate?NoYes+2
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 14 votes the winner is...
draxxt
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 10/24/2009 Category: Politics
Updated: 7 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 3,378 times Debate No: 9812
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (13)
Votes (14)

 

draxxt

Pro

Thank you, whoever accepts this debate.
I DEFINE:
SUPREME COURT- 1. The highest federal court in the United States, consisting of nine justices and having jurisdiction over all other courts in the nation.
RULING-an official or authoritative decision, decree, statement, or interpretation (as by a judge on a point of law)
UNCONSTITUTIONAL- not according or consistent with the constitution of a body politic (as a nation [in this case, the US constitution])
SCHOOL- Any of the public institutions under governmental control in place to educate.
OFFSET-to place over against something (as in the allocation of power over another power)
BALANCE OF POWER (as represented in the US)- Any of the three powers set in place to keep a system of government from becoming overly dominated by any one of those individual powers (In this case, The Judicial, The Executive, and the Legislative Branches in the US)

I observe:
1)The resolution is confined strictly to the United States and the afore mentioned powers involved (being the Judicial, Executive, and Legislative branches within the United states.)
2) You may only use references from other countries if it pertains to the current educational system in the US and how the Supreme Court rulings effected the educational system in the US.
3) By "offset", the Affirmative is proposing that the Supreme Court has more power than the other two branches would and the Negative is proposing that they have not (being that they are all of equal powers in response to these cases)
4) We must operate under the following Supreme Court rulings and these rulings alone to determine how this resolution should be approached:

a)Goss v. Lopez (1975)
Students are entitled to certain due process rights.
Nine students at an Ohio public school received 10-day suspensions for disruptive behavior without due process protections. The Supreme Court ruled for the students, saying that once the state provides an education for all of its citizens, it cannot deprive them of it without ensuring due process protections.'

b)Hazelwood v. Kuhlmeier (1983)
Administrators may edit the content of school newspapers.
The principal of Hazelwood East High School edited two articles in the school paper The Spectrum that he deemed inappropriate. The student authors argued that this violated their First Amendment right to freedom of speech. The Supreme Court disagreed, stating that administrators can edit materials that reflect school values.

c)New Jersey v. T.L.O. (1985)
Students have a reduced expectation of privacy in school.
A teacher accused T.L.O. of smoking in the bathroom. When she denied the allegation, the principal searched her purse and found cigarettes and marijuana paraphernalia. A family court declared T.L.O. a delinquent. The Supreme Court ruled that her rights were not violated since students have reduced expectations of privacy in school.

d)Bethel School District #43 v. Fraser (1987)
Students do not have a First Amendment right to make obscene speeches in school.
Matthew N. Fraser, a student at Bethel High School, was suspended for three days for delivering an obscene and provocative speech to the student body. In this speech, he nominated his fellow classmate for an elected school office. The Supreme Court held that his free speech rights were not violated.

I wish my opponent luck and would ask that the R1 be reserved solely for the establishment of framework and definitions. Should my opponent accept this debate, they should accept the framework and definitions (or else provide a fair alternative to them) and should reserve their case and refutations for Rs2-5.

Thank you.
~EG
mongeese

Con

Very well. You may begin your argument.
Debate Round No. 1
draxxt

Pro

I'm terribly sorry. Moments after my response to one of y other debates, my computer crashed. Now I am writing this to you with only a minute to spare. I ask that my opponent please grant this debate the lierty of starting in the R3.

Thank you
~EG
mongeese

Con

Sure. This debate will commence in Round 3. Good luck.
Debate Round No. 2
draxxt

Pro

draxxt forfeited this round.
mongeese

Con

Make that, this debate will commence in Round 4.
Debate Round No. 3
draxxt

Pro

draxxt forfeited this round.
mongeese

Con

Might as well put up an argument now.

In all cases listed by my opponent, the Supreme Court gave rulings entirely within its own power. Indeed, all they did was establish that the school has power over students, which at the same time increases legislative and executive power over the students, so all three branches gained power. The only exception was 1975, in which case, due process was indeed due. Just because the Supreme Court got to draw a line, doesn't make it any stronger than the Legislative Branch, which wrote the laws requiring kids to go to school, and the Executive Branch, which gets to force kids to go to school at gunpoint. All in all, government as a whole got more powerful, and tyranny became ever so more increased.

That'll do it for now.
Debate Round No. 4
draxxt

Pro

I'm sorry :/
Bad timing I suppose. I am inclined to repost it, however.
mongeese

Con

Well, good luck to my opponent with his next debate on the subject of the Supreme Court.
Debate Round No. 5
13 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by RoyLatham 5 years ago
RoyLatham
Wow. Pro had the burden of proof and never presented a case, yet won. Pro forfeited, yet some voters gave him the conduct category. This is an example of truly absurd vote bombing. Pathetic.
Posted by thereal_yeti 7 years ago
thereal_yeti
"Christian shirts offend you?"
YES..
In my opinion, many christian T-shirts incenuate that you are NOTHING without Jesus

The difference, I looked at those shirts, rolled my eyes and continued on. As many christians, somehow believe they have the right not to be offended.

side note-Simular to christian music. Many people say that christian music is uplifting, however it is uplifting to christians, while at the same time incenuates that a life without jesus is incomplete and depressing.
Posted by mongeese 7 years ago
mongeese
"if they have a opinion that offends the minority, continue on(christian shirts aren't banned)!"

Christian shirts offend you?
Posted by thereal_yeti 7 years ago
thereal_yeti
A friend of mine had a shirt depicting a stick figure throwing away a cross. The principal asked him to turn it inside out.

He was quite about it, therefore I am not convinced it could be argued as disruptive, If others make a big deal out of it, punish THEM. Otherwise the school would be saying if someone has a opinion that offends the majority they ought to keep it to themselves, but if they have a opinion that offends the minority, continue on(christian shirts aren't banned)! Amounting to blaming the rape victim for the rape.

HOWEVER if he was continiously harassing christians, THAT should be punishable, in the same way if a christian were harassing a atheist THEY should be punished.

I'm also not convinced that shouting out JESUS CHRIST should be punishable. It is offensive purely because of it's RELIGIOUS reasons. It is also against the law to use "the lord's name" in vein on the radio, and broadcast T.V.
Posted by studentathletechristian8 7 years ago
studentathletechristian8
Truly is a pity.
Posted by mongeese 7 years ago
mongeese
And I lost...
Posted by mongeese 7 years ago
mongeese
Magic.
Posted by studentathletechristian8 7 years ago
studentathletechristian8
How is mongeese losing?
Posted by mongeese 7 years ago
mongeese
Thanks.
Posted by Maikuru 7 years ago
Maikuru
Default to Con.
14 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Vote Placed by alto2osu 7 years ago
alto2osu
draxxtmongeeseTied
Agreed with before the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Agreed with after the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Who had better conduct:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:-Vote Checkmark-2 points
Total points awarded:07 
Vote Placed by Danielle 7 years ago
Danielle
draxxtmongeeseTied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:70 
Vote Placed by studentathletechristian8 7 years ago
studentathletechristian8
draxxtmongeeseTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:-Vote Checkmark-2 points
Total points awarded:07 
Vote Placed by Clockwork 7 years ago
Clockwork
draxxtmongeeseTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:70 
Vote Placed by wonderwoman 7 years ago
wonderwoman
draxxtmongeeseTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:70 
Vote Placed by Maikuru 7 years ago
Maikuru
draxxtmongeeseTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:-Vote Checkmark-2 points
Total points awarded:07 
Vote Placed by tynews2001 7 years ago
tynews2001
draxxtmongeeseTied
Agreed with before the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Agreed with after the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Who had better conduct:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:-Vote Checkmark-2 points
Total points awarded:07 
Vote Placed by comoncents 7 years ago
comoncents
draxxtmongeeseTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:70 
Vote Placed by SaintNick 7 years ago
SaintNick
draxxtmongeeseTied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:70 
Vote Placed by Vi_Veri 7 years ago
Vi_Veri
draxxtmongeeseTied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:70