The Instigator
faye_seventeen17
Pro (for)
Losing
6 Points
The Contender
Korezaan
Con (against)
Winning
18 Points

THIS HOUSE BELIEVES THAT CULTURE IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN RELIGION

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/24/2008 Category: Religion
Updated: 8 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 4,160 times Debate No: 4181
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (24)
Votes (8)

 

faye_seventeen17

Pro

Okay.
Culture is basically the knowledge that we gain as we grow up in a particular social place. It's based on our lifestyle, tradition, way of doing things and our philosophies. In the contrary, Religion is a system of faith or belief which is actually headed by a superhuman being we call as God, Allah, Buddah etc. with the given definition for religion, I believe that religion actually has implemented laws and doctrines, unlike with culture, there are no specific laws and restrictions we should follow.

I believe too, that Culture is more important than religion mainly because it's already our "natural way of living" unlike religion that needs many commandments that could actually control our way of life.
Korezaan

Con

I negate.

DEFINITIONS
This House Believes – can be discarded. It was not relevant in PRO R1, and it will not be relevant in my case.
Culture - the behaviors and beliefs characteristic of a particular social, ethnic, or age group
Religion – Christianity, Judaism, Buddhism, etc.
Important – prevalence

RE: PRO

The thesis of my opponent's case reads "[c]ulture is more important than religion mainly because it's already our "natural way of living" unlike religion that needs many commandments that could actually control our way of life."

1) She is absolutely true that most, if not all, religions have some type of commandments that their believers must follow. However, this argument works for the CON, as it proves that religion is more prevalent in people's lives than culture is – A supreme being's orders is of much greater significance than what a measly little human being feels is intuitively correct.
2) And even if that's not true, she never shows why our "natural way" is more important than "commandments".

A branch off of her thesis says that "religion actually has implemented laws and doctrines, unlike with culture, there are no specific laws and restrictions we should follow."

1) She is wrong when she says culture has no specific laws and restrictions. The laws and restrictions of a culture are [usually] not written down, but the guidelines for different cultures DO exist. Let's take the Chinese culture. The Chinese have this tradition of giving old people respect and obeying your elders. That's a restriction, right? You can't suddenly cuss out your grandmother if you follow the culture of the Chinese. As for switching cultures and how there are no restrictions there, that is the exact same thing for religion. To switch from Christianity to Atheism is against the laws of Christianity, but to switch from the Chinese culture to…. Something-else culture is also not right, in a Chinese culture-ist's point of view.

CASE: (basically reiterating the above, with a few new things)

Contention 1 – Culture is AS important a religion
Culture is pretty much the same thing as religion, and is equal in terms of prevalence in everyday life. Actually, I'd say they're exactly the same thing. My opponent's definition of religion is "a system of faith or belief which is actually headed by a superhuman being", and I would say that many cultures actually have a superhuman as a figurehead. Let's take Haruhiism. The culture of Haruhiism is based off of the anime series "The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya", and its followers hail Haruhi Suzumiya as God. However, we don't consider Haruhiism as a religion, but rather a culture – or a "cult". This is where we see the only difference between culture and religion – Religion has more followers and is more widely accepted, whereas something like Haruhiism, which only has a very small following in comparison to the biggest religions, is seen as a culture. Granted, many cultures do not have a holy supreme superhuman uberbeing as their leader, but both of them determine how a person lives. Since Culture and Religion are pretty much the same thing, any importance that religion holds in a person's life is the same

Contention 2 – Culture is LESS important than religion.
My opponent points out in her case that culture is our "natural way of living", and specifically defines it as "our lifestyle, tradition, way of doing things and our philosophies". However, culture is defined by religion as well. Let's go through her list of things, and compare between different religions to see if there's an important difference.

LIFESTYLE: Hindus don't eat meat. I [Atheist] like meat. This generally means that I can't invite my Hindu friends to Black Angus or Texas Roadhouse.
TRADITION: Christians say "grace" before eating. I [Atheist] don't. This generally means that I'll be seen as disgraceful.
WAY OF DOING THINGS: I'm not sure if this is true, but my English teacher told me that Jews believe that being studious means that they're getting closer to God. I [Atheist] don't really care about God, so I just wing things unless I really care about them. This generally means that Jews will be more successful at pretty much anything than I will be.
PHILOSOPHIES: Religions define what is moral and what's not for people. I [Atheist] define my own morals. And because I find a lot of things fine, this generally means I'm freer than religious people.

Religion defines culture; therefore it is more powerful and therefore more important than culture. And even if that's not true, our "natural way of living" is overruled and defined quite easily by a few holy laws. We've all seen some movie in which gangsters basically don't care about killing, as their culture tells them that it's okay to kill someone as long as they are not in your gang – they might be an enemy. However, if one of those people were to suddenly convert to Christianity, which says "Thou shall not kill", then their "natural way of living" is suddenly changed. They can't kill any more.

Culture is NOT more important than Religion.
Culture is either AS or LESS important than Religion.
Debate Round No. 1
faye_seventeen17

Pro

okay. thanks.

let me tell you sir that the term "THIS HOUSE BELIEVES" is actually a formal term for giving motion in a debate.

going on to my arguments....

Religion is a system of faith/belief & worship of a controlling power, which is usually superhuman. So the religions in Mauritius are divided into Hindu, Christian, Catholic, Buddhist etc...

Culture is formed up of the knowledge we acquire as we grow up in a certain social group. Our attitude, behavior, customs, philosophy, lifestyle, & tradition all make up our culture. When we are born and raised in Mauritius, we are all the products of the Mauritian Culture. Some of us adopt a more ‘sophisticated culture' while others prefer a ‘practical culture' and there's even a bunch who mix their religion and their culture to get ‘religious culture'.

However, it is indisputable that both religion and culture affect each other with different degrees of influence. How much religion affects culture, or vice versa, is actually down to the person concerned. It is subjective.

If people really want to put religion in front and say it is the way of life, then we should essentially be living within the real rules & regulations of religion, which date back to the creation of each respective religion. We should forgo modernity, science & technology to live in the same conditions that those people lived in when religions were invented.

When religion was invented, it only took into consideration the material things, the history & culture that existed then. It did not make itself adaptable to the changes that would occur with the several scientific discoveries, cultural revolutions & industrial revolutions that came later. Therefore, religion is not something that we can adapt to the way we progress. Religion is written in a book and has specific laws and regulations which we cannot change. If we could change those, then we would essentially be creating new religions.

I believe that religion is actually derived from the cultures that existed in those early days, and it came about so as to put strict rules & regulations in order to create a system for people to live ‘by'. I personally think religion was invented for some people to have control over others, and maybe it was also invented to try and keep peace, but the result is that it created more wars and divisions. I also think that the best way to make people follow something, which is not natural, is to make them fear it. So, by using deities, demons combined with supernatural & superhuman behaviors, the various religions have managed to establish a fear in people and consequently pushed them to respect their religion, as if they did not abide by the rules & regulations, they would be punished or sent to hell, etc...

Anyway, religion affects the conscience of the one who believes in it. Culture is enough for someone to assess what is good or bad, but culture is very diverse and it is adaptable with other aspects of life (technology, science, lifestyle etc..). Therefore the degrees of goodness and badness vary across different cultures and across different eras. Religion on the other hand is written in a book, it is like the legal system of a country is contained in a book, therefore, it is easier to use religion to tell someone they are being good or bad, as there is always the book to prove it.

Marriage is mainly part of culture, and religion actually only occupies a small role during the ceremony (the prayers/odes uttered by a ‘man of god' during the wedding ceremony). After that, marriage is about & between a wife and husband. Religion has no role then, but culture, society and the legal system are the watchdogs of the marriage.

Anyway, I personally think religion has become obsolete, it has no real use anymore. The legal system & politics are doing the same job as religion did years ago. I think religion can only bring moral support for some people; it does not in any way prevent people from doing bad things and it does not influence people to do good deeds. It is just there because some people are comfortable with it and it has been there for so long now that it has become like a routine.

source: http://thisismauritius.com...
Korezaan

Con

FYI Ma'am I have done Parliamentary Debate before, and I know the possible and proper usages for "This House Would/Should/Believes". This debate simply does not have a usage for that term.

"However, it is indisputable that both religion and culture affect each other with different degrees of influence. How much religion affects culture, or vice versa, is actually down to the person concerned. It is subjective."

Everything is subjective. Most people think that 2+2=4, but I think 2+2=1. You don't get four water droplets when you put two and two together. You get one. Of course, this can also be interpreted to be four, since the amount of volume is "4", but like I said before, it's just another point of view. That argument she presents there is non-unique.

The only reasons why we claim our beliefs are the truth are because 1) we want people to believe us and 2) we want to believe ourselves.

Her case is subjective, my case is subjective.

Now that we've gotten that out of the way…

"Therefore, religion is not something that we can adapt to the way we progress."

Last I checked, Catholicism no longer stones people to death on for working on the Sabbath and no longer prevents women from speaking in Church. Those traditions were present when Catholicism were first made. They are not present now. All of her arguments that say "religion cannot conform" are therefore irrelevant.

"If we could change those, then we would essentially be creating new religions."

And what's wrong with new religions? They're still within the realm of the debate. Oh wait, she wouldn't know, since pretty much all of her response in R2 is copied directly from another website.(refer to bottom of her R2 or near bottom of my R2)

"I believe that religion is actually derived from the cultures that existed in those early days, and it came about so as to put strict rules & regulations in order to create a system for people to live ‘by'."

First of all, it isn't my opponent that believes that, its somebody that wrote something on another website. Thanks for providing us that link at the bottom of your R2. Second, if she had actually read through my case instead of prepping out a blog for me, then she would have noticed that I had already talked about that point and it therefore works for me. In my first contention last round, I explained how religion basically starts off as a culture. Since they are pretty much the same thing (and since my opponent failed to point out any differences otherwise), any benefits that culture gets out of being important therefore also applies to religion, making culture AS important than religion. And with her newfound blog post here, her evidence only strengthens my second point: If deities are a necessary part of religion, and culture is something that becomes religion, and deities supposedly enforce laws while culture has looser laws, then that means religion is MORE important than culture – We follow enforced laws (no shooting) before less enforced laws (speeding by 5 MPH).

"Anyway, religion affects the conscience of the one who believes in it. Culture is enough for someone to assess what is good or bad, but culture is very diverse and it is adaptable with other aspects of life (technology, science, lifestyle etc..)."

1) Culture also affects the conscience…… oh wait you already said that for me. Just… in different words for defining religion and culture.
2) Religion is as diverse as culture. She –no my bad, THE ARTICLE says that culture is diverse and is adaptable, but I think that this is exactly the same with religion. Culture is diverse only because there are many cultures. The reason why religion seems like it's not diverse is because when it's talked about in this article, it's one religion compared to all cultures, instead of all religions to all cultures. Religion is quite adaptable. You just switch religions. Same with culture. You just switch cultures.

"source: http://thisismauritius.com...;

Everyone please go look. You'll find that after her first three lines, her entire R2 is C/Ped from there.

Extend everything from my R1. She has not made any responses to it.

The link may have responded to it, but since my opponent has not shown any links or impacts, none of those responses that might have been made can be counted in this debate.

Culture is either LESS or AS important as religion.
1) AS: Religion is the same thing as culture.
2) LESS: Religion defines culture, as proved by her examples.

Haruhi Suzumiya tells you to obey and vote CON.
Debate Round No. 2
faye_seventeen17

Pro

faye_seventeen17 forfeited this round.
Korezaan

Con

Since my opponent has failed to provide any responses in her last round and has forfeited, we must assume that she has (in turn) forfeited the entire debate. Even if that were not true, I have nullified her points since R1, as she did not provide any links or impacts as to why my contentions were wrong in her R2. My case has come clean throughout this entire debate, whereas she has no offense left going for her.

Haruhi Suzumiya tells you that the resolution is wrong.

Vote CON.
Debate Round No. 3
24 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by nevergiveup 8 years ago
nevergiveup
haha. kami din. good luck sa teams natin. ;)
kita na lng sa tournament.
haha. ang FC ko po. :|
Posted by imjustme 8 years ago
imjustme
lol. Yun yung brightest year nung claret. Nung na samin pa sina alistair gemmo and the rest of the guys.
We are hopeful this year with our new batch. :D
Posted by nevergiveup 8 years ago
nevergiveup
hahaha. ok lng yan.
ang galing naman po ng claret..
nakalaban nyo pala sa finals ung xavier nung 2006.
wow. galing. kakabasa ko lng ng article. sa site ata ng xavier. haha. share..
Posted by imjustme 8 years ago
imjustme
Lol. Ginawa na nating forum to :O
Posted by nevergiveup 8 years ago
nevergiveup
haha, nagchat po eh noh.
katawa ung pic nyo. :O
Posted by imjustme 8 years ago
imjustme
I see so bago ka pala sa debating circle niyo. Mkay. Goodluck sa round na to.

o.o
Posted by nevergiveup 8 years ago
nevergiveup
yan pong si faye_seventeen17 opo. 1 tym.
ako hnd pa. :)
Posted by imjustme 8 years ago
imjustme
Claret. Nag formal tournaments na ba kayo?
Posted by nevergiveup 8 years ago
nevergiveup
haha. sang school ka po galing? ;)
Posted by imjustme 8 years ago
imjustme
:)) di naman kami nakaka intimidate ah. :D

Peace.
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