The Instigator
TheBajanConnection
Pro (for)
Tied
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The Contender
discipulus_animae
Con (against)
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The American Colonies were not justified in rebelling from British rule.

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/26/2013 Category: Education
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 3,694 times Debate No: 41307
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (1)
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TheBajanConnection

Pro

Hello, in this debate, we will be arguing weather or not the American Colonies were justified in rebelling from the British rule. I hold the position that the colonies were NOT justified in revolting.
The layout for the debate will be:
Round 1 is acceptance
Round 2 is building your argument, NO refutes
Round 3 is refuting your opponent
Round 4 is defending your points, NO refuting your opponents defense
Round 5 is closing statement and final words to the voter.
I look forward to a good debate!
discipulus_animae

Con

I accept your challenge, and look forward to an engaging debate.
Debate Round No. 1
TheBajanConnection

Pro

Hello, I thank my adversary for accepting my debate! Let us begin.
First off, let us begin with the aftermath of the French and Indian war, fought mainly between France, Native American allies, and The Kingdom of Great Britain. This war was fought mainly on the North American continent for many reasons, one of the main reason for having colonial supremacy. After the war, the British had won, but had now doubled their previous debt and had a large and expanding North American empire to defend. In order to make up for lost revenue, the British Parliament began taxing it's citizens in Britain and her colonies. We must keep in mind that the colonists were, in fact, British citizens, and were expected to pay taxes just like the rest. Now regarding the taxes, the colonists should have to help pay for the war. The Americans did not really do anything groundbreaking to help the war efforts, and the British even kept and maintained an American army to protect it's citizens and borders, so the colonists should have helped pay for this. The British colonies payed a 1 shilling tax on paper compared to the mainland's 26. The colonies were a tax heaven compared to England, and the Parliament was not mistreating the colonists anymore than they were mistreating the citizens back in England.
I rest my case and look forward to my opponents response...
discipulus_animae

Con

Though my opponent has valid points that the colonies paid little to no taxes compared to their mother country. However the colonies were not represented within the British government like those in the home country, thus they had no representation to even speak out against a tax increase. Also by your definition of the colonies they were Englishmen as well, which logically directs us to the basic interpretation that since it was Englishmen against Englishmen that it was another civil war that could be added to the already long list of 12 civil wars that England has had throughout it"s history.
Debate Round No. 2
TheBajanConnection

Pro

I thank my adversary for his response and I will refute his point about no representation in Parliament.
At this time, the British Parliament had around 600 members, and the colonies would get about 20 representatives, so they would not really make a difference. We also must understand that these representatives would not be paid, and would have to constantly make a 3,000-4,000 mile trip, just to represent their colonies. Now, they could get messages from their colonies, but again, it would be delivered through a 3,000-4,000 mile trip, taking about two months, when the parliament met much more often than that, so the representatives would not know what to do for a while. I agree they should have gotten representation, but it would be much rather inquietude.
That is all I need to say for this round, back to my adversary.
discipulus_animae

Con

I thank my opponent for his rebuttal. I would first like to cede the point of representation to my opponent who is right on the grounds of the logistics of communication within colonial times. I would however like to point out that my opponent did not touch the ace in the hole within my argument which was that the revolutionary war was rather a civil war. I would now take this argument farther and say that the simple reason it is called a revolution is due to the fact that the English did not win the civil war. Point in case the American civil war; the north refers to this as the American civil war, but in the south they refer to it as the second American revolution. Point being that your argument is all based on the Americans won so it was called a revolution by the Americans ( The American War for independence happens to be its namesake in Britain). Here we can apply the principle of stare decisis; by saying that with the successful revolution of the colonies as congruent to the north in the civil war, that the winner may name the war as they choose. For example if the south had won the civil war it may very well have been named the second American revolution. I rest my case and hand the floor over to my opponent.
Debate Round No. 3
TheBajanConnection

Pro

M opponent is committing a red herring and is not sticking to the topic. His "Ace in the Hole" Arguement is weak and is inadquite for the subject. The war is in fact a revolution and a civil war. Here are the definitions
rev"o"lu"tion
G6;revəG2;loV2;oSHən/Submit
noun
1.
a forcible overthrow of a government or social order in favor of a new system.
synonyms:rebellion, revolt, insurrection, mutiny, uprising, riot, rioting, insurgence, seizure of power, coup (d'"tat) More

civ"il war
noun
1.
a war between citizens of the same country.
They are both technically correct terms, but what you are trying to say, is beyond the point. The debate is were the colonies justified in revolting from British, not if the war was civil or a revolution, when it was in fact both. The American civil war was a revolution in the south, and was a civil war in the north. I urge my opponent to stay on topic, and if he was getting at something to explain.
Sources: https://www.google.com...

https://www.google.com...
discipulus_animae

Con

What my opponent fails to realize that the majority of the revolutionary war skirmishes were between loyalists and patriots. These by very definition were both Englishmen. The only difference between loyalists and patriots is that loyalists saw the colonies as part of the crown, whereas the patriots did not. Therefore my opponents rebuttal is more of a red herring than my own, due to the fact that by very definition the revolutionary war was a civil war due to the fact that it was brother against brother father against son, and neighbor against neighbor.

Loyalist-a colonist of the American revolutionary period who supported the British cause.
https://www.google.com...

Patriot-a person who vigorously supports their country and is prepared to defend it against enemies or detractors.
https://www.google.com...
Debate Round No. 4
TheBajanConnection

Pro

I have explained time and time again that it was both a civil and revolution. Now I ask, how does this evidence justify the colonies revolting? How does this help your argument and reasoning because you are very off topic with the debate. I know how the revolutionary war was fought and like I have said, it is both a revolution and a civil war (see previous definitions) I now must tell the voters that con is off topic, and I have successfully refuted his on topic arguments.
I thank you for the debate and leave it with the voters.
discipulus_animae

Con

discipulus_animae forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
Posted by ab75 3 years ago
ab75
The colonies had every right granted to them by Natural Law to secede from the oppression of King George and the British Government. Read the Declaration of Independence, enough said there.
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